There was a certain tune that was left off ABB that was pretty good if memory serves.
The name of it escapes me and I haven't heard it in years, but I think it had a Child of the Moon type intro/riff?
I recall it sounded better than anything that made the official album (which might not be saying much), and at the time was puzzled why it wasn't included.
Anyone know which one it is?

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Could it be Under The Radar? I love that song, one of my favorites from ABB and oddly enough not part of the regular album.

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frankotero
Could it be Under The Radar? I love that song, one of my favorites from ABB and oddly enough not part of the regular album.

Yep thanks frankotero!

My memory served well...a bit Child of the Moon-esque, and easily better than anything on the official album.
The bridge is a bit weak though, and Mick's vocals are a bit oddball in parts, but great guitars and vocal harmonies - could be my favorite Stones tune of the modern era.
Don't know why it was left off, but it was a bad decision imo.

The Rolling Stones ''Under the Radar''




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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

While we are waiting to be fed the next tasty bit.

"I haven't a clue"

proceed to minute 6:04 of Episode 5. [www.bbc.co.uk]

Most of above mentioned outtakes or jams or whatever are horrible trash, imo.

It would take less time to write completely new material than trying to make this wrecks rolling...

A few ABB-type-rockers, a Keith-ballad, a Keith reggae, a modern sounding track like Winning Ugly, a conventional blues, a Mick-ballad, one or two radio-friendly popish tunes and a funky track like Sexdrive and off we go!

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Doxa

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Hairball

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TornAndFried
They are currently playing at a good level for their age. However, Mick nor Keith hadn't written a really great song in decades. Maybe they can pull it together one last time and surprise everyone. I doubt it, but I suppose it's possible.

Well Keith has written some great material very recently!

That's good to know. So I guess for his loyalty to the Stones he decided to release those mediocre and forgettable ones in his solo album, and saved the gems for an upcoming Stones project...

- Doxa

Ha, I think you nailed it, Doxa! But seriously, I think there's nothing on Crosseyed Heart that's in Stones league, maybe some stuff is in A Bigger Bang league, but that's not we really need after all these years, right?

If anything, Crosseyed Heart is an album I listen to for the general mood, but not for any songs that stand out. None of them have the potential for stand-out songs - songs that simply cry for going back to them for repeated listening.

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HMS
Most of above mentioned outtakes or jams or whatever are horrible trash, imo.

It would take less time to write completely new material than trying to make this wrecks rolling...

A few ABB-type-rockers, a Keith-ballad, a Keith reggae, a modern sounding track like Winning Ugly, a conventional blues, a Mick-ballad, one or two radio-friendly popish tunes and a funky track like Sexdrive and off we go!

The perfect ingredients for a crappy album.

Freshly written Mick and Keith songs for the new album please, like they did with Undercover.

I'd really enjoy hearing Mick and Keith singing together.. I love when they harmonize together. I hope we get some of that in this next album.

Hopefully Keith will be allowed to show his guidance, leadership, expertise, and master songwriting skills.
Might be difficult with Mick's demos already prepared, but if Keith has any say in the matter (damage control) we might end up with a real winner.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Are they all still in London ...A good indication of what is still going on ..or is going to take place in the first half of January may be the location of Keith's guitar tech .. Pierre de Beauport.. Is he still in London?

If all The Stones are still in London (including Pierre de Beauport) .. then it is fairly safe to assume they are going to record a bit in January or may be continuing recording off and on as we speak about it ..

Does anyone know their where-abouts? They may be working on it off and on through-out the holidays and may record a bit in January (couple weeks) .. before The South american rehearsals if they are all still in London.

Any clue?

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frankotero
Could it be Under The Radar? I love that song, one of my favorites from ABB and oddly enough not part of the regular album.

Maybe it's me, but I don't get all the love for Under the Radar in fan circles. It's a solid B side/album filler, but that's about it as far as I'm concerned.

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alimente

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Doxa

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Hairball

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TornAndFried
They are currently playing at a good level for their age. However, Mick nor Keith hadn't written a really great song in decades. Maybe they can pull it together one last time and surprise everyone. I doubt it, but I suppose it's possible.

Well Keith has written some great material very recently!

That's good to know. So I guess for his loyalty to the Stones he decided to release those mediocre and forgettable ones in his solo album, and saved the gems for an upcoming Stones project...

- Doxa

Ha, I think you nailed it, Doxa! But seriously, I think there's nothing on Crosseyed Heart that's in Stones league, maybe some stuff is in A Bigger Bang league, but that's not we really need after all these years, right?

If anything, Crosseyed Heart is an album I listen to for the general mood, but not for any songs that stand out. None of them have the potential for stand-out songs - songs that simply cry for going back to them for repeated listening.

Although I think the songs on Crosseyed Heart are much better than you say, I agree that the album is especially noteworthy for it's general mood. Hmm, a bit like Exile On Main Street, coming to think of it.

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Tate
I'd really enjoy hearing Mick and Keith singing together.. I love when they harmonize together. I hope we get some of that in this next album.

Yes, I agree.

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HMS
Most of above mentioned outtakes or jams or whatever are horrible trash, imo.

It would take less time to write completely new material than trying to make this wrecks rolling...

If I recall right this is exactly the thing Ronnie has said a couple of (ten/fifteen?) years ago - that it is easier for them to start from a scratch than try to rewarm some old song project.

- Doxa

Songs like Robbed Blind, Suspicious, Heartstopper, Amnesia, Nothing On Me, Something For Nothing, Illusion and Lover's Plea are «in A Bigger Bang-league» quality-wise?

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Doxa

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HMS
Most of above mentioned outtakes or jams or whatever are horrible trash, imo.

It would take less time to write completely new material than trying to make this wrecks rolling...

If I recall right this is exactly the thing Ronnie has said a couple of (ten/fifteen?) years ago - that it is easier for them to start from a scratch than try to rewarm some old song project.

- Doxa

Possibly, the way it should probably work though for the songs and playing to gather depth and momentum is writing and playing together over time, like say since they got back together in late 2012. Instead of that it's the same "rush job" of adding half cooked parts to Mick's pretty much final demos and fleshing out of some of Keith's rough sketches. Guess their heart is just not into it and it's hard to hide that in the final "product"...Let's face it, even though we'll all be excited upon the first few listens, in light of this approach (as if it's not hard enough for guys in their 70s to replicate the fire of their heydays) it would take a small miracle for that "product" to have a chance of standing up to their legacy or of having any sort of importance (to loosely quote a recent post by Rocky Dijon ).

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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2015-12-30 14:29 by gotdablouse.

It will be interesting to see if Ronnie will play more on this album. On B2B and ABB he's just filling in here and there, more or less. I hope he will play a lot, and that Mick will concentrate more on his singing and harp playing.

I think Ringo said it best upon release of one of his later albums "it's just another record, don't take it too serious" something like that, don't remember exactly. The point is there will be music that some people will like and some won't. Same could and is being said about every record since Steel Wheels? or was it even earlier. But we still love 'em don't we.

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DandelionPowderman

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Redhotcarpet

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KRiffhard
They could have done a project similar to 'Tattoo You' with the best 10/12 outtakes.
There is great stuff to work and Chris Kimsey knows how to do!

yes but are there any good outtakes? They could of course find some Möre gems from 70-75

That is a good question indeed.

There probably are, but probably only unfinished ones from 1977 and later.

A good question indeed. But I think a few things need to be considered if the miracle of TATTOO YOU could be repeated.

The first is, of course, the question arised above - are there such stunning out-takes, as was for TATTOO YOU, in the can? I don't know.

Secondly, TATTOO YOU was nothing but Jagger finishing up the out-takes. This is something Jagger 'just' did with EXILE and SOME GIRLS projects. So theoretically, if we pick up the best cuts from those two projects, there you already had it: TATTOO YOU VOL. 2. Funnily, if we count a couple of years out, these recordings funnily co-incides by date with the TATTOO YOU material.

I think, thirdly, this rules out any idea that they could pick up some unused out-takes from the golden years, and release it as a 'new' product. The material from, say, 1969 to 1983, is 'archives' material. It belongs to a different era, and should be treated with a kind of "archealogist" approach, appreciating the context, as they did with EXILE and SOME GIRLS - they, as us, realize that the Stones sounded different back then as they do these days, decades later. By the time of TATTOO YOU they didn't have that problem yet, the material was only seven/eight years old at most. (Besides, how stupid it would not only sound, but look like if they actually would use some 30-40 yaers old backing tracks and call it 'new'. Of course, anyone would notice the 'truth'.)

So, fourthly, if they would use the TATTOO YOU method, I think it should be applied to a material that suits to the way the band sounds these days. My assumption that the 'recent' sound starts by the time of making VOODOO LOUNGE (that is, the band hasn't really changed or evolved ever since). I guess the out-takes from that on would be something we can't really say if it is from 1993, 1997, 2001, 2005 or 2015. Jagger could easily fit 'there, without the fear of anomalies he sometimes seem to have with EXILE and SOME GITRS era out-takes (one can distinguish too easily the old and new component there). The result should sound 'cohesive'.

Which brings us to the original question: is there that good out-takes from that era (1993 on) that deserves to be released? Another forgotten "Start Me Up" or "Waitin' On A Friend"? I yet dont know, but my guess is that they are more willing to start from a scratch... Besides, the initial idea of TATTOO YOU was just having a release quickly and easily out to go with the tour (and Mick and Keith didn't need to face each other...). Now they seemingly want to do it as a whole band effort, Mick and Keith co-operating, so there is no need for any kind of TATTOO YOU method...

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-12-30 15:02 by Doxa.

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman

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Redhotcarpet

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KRiffhard
They could have done a project similar to 'Tattoo You' with the best 10/12 outtakes.
There is great stuff to work and Chris Kimsey knows how to do!

yes but are there any good outtakes? They could of course find some Möre gems from 70-75

That is a good question indeed.

There probably are, but probably only unfinished ones from 1977 and later.

A good question indeed. But I think a few things need to be considered if the miracle of TATTOO YOU could be repeated.

The first is, of course, the question arised above - are there such stunning out-takes, as was for TATTOO YOU, in the can? I don't know.

Secondly, TATTOO YOU was nothing but Jagger finishing up the out-takes. This is something Jagger 'just' did with EXILE and SOME GIRLS projects. So theoretically, if we pick up the best cuts from those two projects, there you already had it: TATTOO YOU VOL. 2. Funnily, if we count a couple of years out, these recordings funnily co-incides by date with the TATTOO YOU material.

I think, thirdly, this rules out any idea that they could pick up some unused out-takes from the golden years, and release it as a 'new' product. The material from, say, 1969 to 1983, is 'archives' material. It belongs to a different era, and should be treated with a kind of "archealogist" approach, appreciating the context, as they did with EXILE and SOME GIRLS - they, as us, realize that the Stones sounded different back then as they do these days, decades later. By the time of TATTOO YOU they didn't have that problem yet, the material was only seven/eight years old at most. (Besides, how stupid it would not only sound, but look like if they actually would use some 30-40 yaers old backing tracks and call it 'new'. Of course, anyone would notice the 'truth'.)

So, fourthly, if they would use the TATTOO YOU method, I think it should be applied to a material that suits to the way the band sounds these days. My assumption that the 'recent' sound starts by the time of making VOODOO LOUNGE (that is, the band hasn't really changed or evolved ever since). I guess the out-takes from that on would be something we can't really say if it is from 1993, 1997, 2001, 2005 or 2015. Jagger could easily fit 'there, without the fear of anomalies he sometimes seem to have with EXILE and SOME GITRS era out-takes (one can distinguish too easily the old and new component there). The result should sound 'cohesive'.

Which brings us to the original question: is there that good out-takes from that era (1993 on) that deserves to be released? Another forgotten "Start Me Up" or "Waitin' On A Friend"? I yet dont know, but my guess is that they are more willing to start from a scratch... Besides, the initial idea of TATTOO YOU was just having a release quickly and easily out to go with the tour (and Mick and Keith didn't need to face each other...). Now they seemingly want to do it as a whole band effort, Mick and Keith co-operating, so there is no need for any kind of TATTOO YOU method...

- Doxa

Sounds reasonable that the Tattoo-method isn't used this time.

About the question wether there is stunning stuff from the 70's still left in the can, I can't help thinking of the rumoured "Scarlett", which still hasn't been released (but maybe will be a part a GHS-deluxe or what?).

They have lots of good stuff from the 90s they could dust off, of course, but I hope they're making new music and will write new stuff.

This one is pretty interesting, imo (apart from the awful vocals).

[www.youtube.com]

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DandelionPowderman
It will be interesting to see if Ronnie will play more on this album. On B2B and ABB he's just filling in here and there, more or less.

I have a positive feeling on this one. Probably Ronnie had his own faults why he wasn't used as much in ABB and B2B, but he is a different man today; he has shown that during the tour(s). They would be idiots if they don't use his capacity some more.

- Doxa

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman
It will be interesting to see if Ronnie will play more on this album. On B2B and ABB he's just filling in here and there, more or less.

I have a positive feeling on this one. Probably Ronnie had his own faults why he wasn't used as much in ABB and B2B, but he is a different man today; he has shown that during the tour(s). They would be idiots if they don't use his capacity some more.

- Doxa

Yeah, I hope you're right. On the other hand, if Mick uses his demos where he already has laid down guitar tracks, it will probably be business as usual..

I don't understand why people want an album with around 11 tracks, not 16 like on A bigger Bang.

People like me just want as much music from them as possible, including anything left over, from other albums sooooo.....why not have 16 or 17 tracks, to me its a bonus not a negative!!

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gotdablouse

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Doxa

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HMS
Most of above mentioned outtakes or jams or whatever are horrible trash, imo.

It would take less time to write completely new material than trying to make this wrecks rolling...

If I recall right this is exactly the thing Ronnie has said a couple of (ten/fifteen?) years ago - that it is easier for them to start from a scratch than try to rewarm some old song project.

- Doxa

Possibly, the way it should probably work though for the songs and playing to gather depth and momentum is writing and playing together over time, like say since they got back together in late 2012. Instead of that it's the same "rush job" of adding half cooked parts to Mick's pretty much final demos and fleshing out of some of Keith's rough sketches. Guess their heart is just not into it and it's hard to hide that in the final "product"...Let's face it, even though we'll all be excited upon the first few listens, in light of this approach (as if it's not hard enough for guys in their 70s to replicate the fire of their heydays) it would take a small miracle for that "product" to have a chance of standing up to their legacy or of having any sort of importance (to loosely quote a recent post by Rocky Dijon ).

Well, one cannot much disagree with that reasoning... I think teh best we can expect is that Mick's demos and Keith's sketches are good ones to start with it. With that approach teh band really can't do any miracles in the studio - in developing the songs - so the songs or initial ideas need to be good ones if the album is going to be a good one. I keep my fingers crossed...

Yeah, due to age, disinterest, personal relationship or whatever, I agree that the days of spending weeks in the studio in catching the right feel and take are long gone. It could be as they themselves realized that that method simply doesn't work anymore (the results just won't be any better no matter how much effort and energy they put on that), so as pragmatic men, they don't waste energy on that any longer (my picture is that VOODOO LOUNGE was the last time they for the last time tried something to that effect). I don't think it is only Jagger's decision. If we look at CROSSEYED HEART, despite it having not 'deadlines', it is not done with the dedication and hunger Keith and the guys once did their old masterpieces. CROSSEYED HEART is a result of contingent lazy Sunday afternoon recording sessions, Keith occasionally inviting some to paals to play with him, instead of endless Saturday night sessions the guys almost living in the studio, one goal - a great record - in mind. Even maestro's work ethics are not like what they used to be...

Funnily, the way they record these days reminds me of the days before their "studio excellence" days, which would produce masterpieces like LET IT BLEED and EXILE ON MAIN STREET. Think of the days they would record many songs in one session. At that time if the question was of originals, it was Mick and Keith's songs that would be introduced to the band and then quickly arranged and recorded. Now it would be Mick's demos and Keith's sketches... But even with that method they could produce incredible results back then ... "Satisfaction", AFTERMATH... probably because the songs just were so damn good and you know what you do... I mean, there is nothing wrong with that method if you have the goods and means... (that is, you don't need necessarily to spend your whole life jamming in the studio in order to get great results...)

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-12-30 16:31 by Doxa.

It's not difficult, Chris Kimsey knows how to do!
"I spent 3 months going through like the last 4, 5 albums finding stuff that had been either forgotten about or at the time rejected. And then I presented it to the band and I said, 'Hey, look guys, you've got all this great stuff sitting in the can and it's great material, do something with it'.
Chris Kimsey, 1981

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pgarof
I don't understand why people want an album with around 11 tracks, not 16 like on A bigger Bang.

People like me just want as much music from them as possible, including anything left over, from other albums sooooo.....why not have 16 or 17 tracks, to me its a bonus not a negative!!

I guess the idea is that if they would release a lesser amount of tracks, they would put more concentration and energy on those, each having more weight and point. The wholeness would be more stronger and cohesive, at least in a theory.

But I agree with you that if we, say, take three or for tracks out of A BIGGER BANG, the album wouldn't be any better. Since I think the material is rather mediocre, the principle 'quantity over quality' holds there. So if we don't get good songs, we at least get many songs...

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-12-30 16:28 by Doxa.

I'd prefer an album with 10 songs + some b-sides for the singles.

I'm all for quality over quantity. There have been some good records recently using this 10-11 song limit.