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Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: February 2, 2024 21:20

Quote
ukcal
Mick wanted it that way.

?

Jagger or Taylor?
Jagger of course.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: February 3, 2024 14:04

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Taylor1
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Mathijs
Quote
Taylor1
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Mathijs
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Doxa

A dream indeed, taken that the guitarist has retired years ago. But what goes for the three guitar concept, Keith also seemed to be initially thrilled about the idea, but afterwards came to the conclusion that it does not work. I take the latter mean that the arrangements, including the guitar parts and roles, of modern Stones shows are so carved in stone after so many tours that it asks too much for the old men to think about changing them. Keith and Ronnie know their roles and parts by heart, and, you know, let it be so. The use of Taylor back in 2012/14 was mostly limited to parts he could shine 'isolated' with his solos ("Rambler", "Can't You Hear Me Knocking"), but not being that integral to the over-all sound and band dynamics. When they sometimes tried that the result were not that promising. Thinking about, for example, "Silver Train" or "Sway" - a sort of mess like none really knowing who is doing and what, and none taking the whole thing in his shoulders or being determined to nail the thing. So my point is that to make that (beautiful in theory) three guitar concept work, would have asked too much rehearsal and work by them. The old dogs do not easily learn new tricks.

- Doxa

Unfortunately the truth is much less nice and romantic than your assumption here. By all means it was the intention, mostly Jagger's, to get Taylor on board, back as a band member. But he and his manager just completely ruined it by being completely under rehearsed, substance abuse, attacks and arguments over royalties and money, and finally being exported out of a venue by security and being banned for good on charges of theft of merchandize proceedings.

Mathijs
Under rehearsed? How much rehearsing was necessary for one or two songs he was allowed to play?Maybe the problem was giving him usually one song to play didn’t afford him the opportunity to warm up and get locked in.He still played better than Wood and Richards on those shows, although it wasn’t 1972-1973.But there were some nice moments like Glastonbury

The question is how much more he could have played on if he wasn't under-rehearsed.

They gave him spots to shine -Sway, Silver Train, CYHMK- and he just never delivered.

Mathijs
CYHMK was great at Glastonbury.There was never a Midnight Rambler that was bad, maybe not great, but better than the ones without him for the last 25 years.I doubt the reason he wasn’t given more songs to play on was because his playing was subpar.Wyman also was told he would only get 1or 2 songs to play on.It’s because Mick wanted it that way.He only got to play Silver Train a couple of times.So if they weren’t great you immediately say that’s it? Same with Sway, and all the other songs he played on other than Midnight Rambler..He only got the chance to play them a couple of times.How do you judge him on that small sample

Its lovely you disagree, but it is not my opinion, or something I made up myself, right....

Mathijs

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Meryl03 ()
Date: February 3, 2024 14:22

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Taylor1
Quote
Mathijs
Quote
Doxa

A dream indeed, taken that the guitarist has retired years ago. But what goes for the three guitar concept, Keith also seemed to be initially thrilled about the idea, but afterwards came to the conclusion that it does not work. I take the latter mean that the arrangements, including the guitar parts and roles, of modern Stones shows are so carved in stone after so many tours that it asks too much for the old men to think about changing them. Keith and Ronnie know their roles and parts by heart, and, you know, let it be so. The use of Taylor back in 2012/14 was mostly limited to parts he could shine 'isolated' with his solos ("Rambler", "Can't You Hear Me Knocking"), but not being that integral to the over-all sound and band dynamics. When they sometimes tried that the result were not that promising. Thinking about, for example, "Silver Train" or "Sway" - a sort of mess like none really knowing who is doing and what, and none taking the whole thing in his shoulders or being determined to nail the thing. So my point is that to make that (beautiful in theory) three guitar concept work, would have asked too much rehearsal and work by them. The old dogs do not easily learn new tricks.

- Doxa

Unfortunately the truth is much less nice and romantic than your assumption here. By all means it was the intention, mostly Jagger's, to get Taylor on board, back as a band member. But he and his manager just completely ruined it by being completely under rehearsed, substance abuse, attacks and arguments over royalties and money, and finally being exported out of a venue by security and being banned for good on charges of theft of merchandize proceedings.

Mathijs
Under rehearsed? How much rehearsing was necessary for one or two songs he was allowed to play?Maybe the problem was giving him usually one song to play didn’t afford him the opportunity to warm up and get locked in.He still played better than Wood and Richards on those shows, although it wasn’t 1972-1973.But there were some nice moments like Glastonbury

I remember Bill saying something like he was never given any proper rehearsal and was just told "you know the songs". It could have been the same for Mick?

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Date: February 3, 2024 20:22

Quote
Doxa
The old dogs do not easily learn new tricks.



- Doxa

Like Bill Wyman said: "Never go back to your ex. It doesn't work"

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: skytrench ()
Date: February 3, 2024 20:33

MickT was more in need and accepted the role assigned to him. If he was part of the band on all the tracks, he could have developed his parts much more. A gimmick it became.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: February 3, 2024 20:36

I remember when Clapton had a guest spot in 1989. No one can deny it was sheer brilliance on "Rooster". He was probably too good though because it became obvious
what the Stones don't have in their guitar section (solo brilliance). So I guess the three guitarists concept was dead from the beginning anyhow (not in recording though).

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: February 3, 2024 22:49

Quote
Stoneage
I remember when Clapton had a guest spot in 1989. No one can deny it was sheer brilliance on "Rooster". He was probably too good though because it became obvious
what the Stones don't have in their guitar section (solo brilliance). So I guess the three guitarists concept was dead from the beginning anyhow (not in recording though).
I think that Keith and Ron were still great on that 1989tour.By 2013 they were not.I think Clapton also can’t play today like when he was in Cream.With regards to Little Red Rooster , hissolo is good but so are Keith and Wood on that performance



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024-02-04 01:42 by Taylor1.

Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: exilestones ()
Date: February 14, 2024 19:29

Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones

Main St. And Far Beyond: The Lyrical Guitar Of Mick Taylor -
Celebrating a man who was part of a golden period for the Rolling Stones, and far more.

by Paul Sexton
Published on January 17, 2024


Photo: Gijsbert Hanekroot/Redferns

Mick Taylor, born in Welwyn Garden City, Hertfordshire, on January 17, 1949, became one of Britain’s finest guitarists. His return in 2012 as a guest at concerts in London and New York on 50 & Counting, the 50th anniversary tour by the Rolling Stones, won him the respect of a new generation. Here’s our custom playlist of some of his finest work.

During those performances with the group that made him world-famous, the softly-spoken virtuoso showed that he still had plenty of the dexterity that won him the job of replacing Brian Jones in the band in 1969. That was not, of course, the first time that Taylor had taken on a high-pressure role as a young musician.


[www.youtube.com]
"Snowy Wood" – CRUSADE John Mayall – 1967
Composer Lyricist: Mick Taylor & John Mayall

In 1967, he had basically talked and played his way into the ranks of John Mayall and the Bluesbreakers, of whom he was a fan. Here, he found himself replacing Peter Green in this famous training ground for great British guitar players.

Mayall was in a lighthearted mood about the Bluesbreakers’ line-ups, and Taylor’s new membership in the group, when he spoke to Melody Maker in 1967. “With all the changes, we are thinking of calling the band John Mayall and the Faceless Five,” he said. “And we’ll wear rubber masks of all the previous Bluesbreakers. Mick can put on an Eric Clapton mask and Keef [Hartley] can wear a Hughie Flint mask. Then perhaps people will recognize us.”

Taylor honed his reputation with Mayall for two years, before getting that fateful call from the Stones. He left the Bluesbreakers at the end of a long American tour and made his first appearance with the rock giants in the most public circumstances possible, at their free Hyde Park concert in the summer of 1969.

Many observers consider Taylor to be the most technically expert musician ever to play with the band, and regret that his tenure did not last longer than five years. But he was part of what was undoubtedly a golden period for the Stones as a recording and live force, especially with “Let It Bleed,” “Sticky Fingers,” “Exile on Main Street,” and he was also a key part of “Goats Head Soup” and 1974’s “It’s Only Rock and Roll,” before choosing to leave the Rolling Stones.

Taylor’s subsequent work included varied collaborations and contributions, both on disc and on stage, with Mike Oldfoeld, Jack Bruce and Bob Dylan, the Grateful Dead, Alvin Lee, Little Feat, and many others, as well as on records of his own.

Mick Taylor was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame with the Rolling Stones in 1989.



Charlie Watts, speaking in 2013, was hugely complimentary about what Taylor brought to the group.
“Mick Taylor was a good choice because he lifted the band tremendously,” he said. “He probably
didn’t know it at the time, but he did. He got lovely songs to play on from Mick and Keith.
It was a great writing period, the most musical period of ours, which I think was
down to Mick Taylor, the way he played. He was a very lyrical player.”

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: exilestones ()
Date: February 14, 2024 19:32

I author in the above article, Paul Sexton, highlighted "Snowy Wood," Mick Taylor with John Mayall (1967).

What favorite tracks do you think are particularly great that Mick Taylor plays on outside the Rolling Stones? Officially released of not, it doesn't matter.

Thanks for your input.

Also, do you have any favorite tracks, live Mick Taylor played on with the Stones in 2012, 2013, & 2014?

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Date: February 14, 2024 19:53

Quote
exilestones
I author in the above article, Paul Sexton, highlighted "Snowy Wood," Mick Taylor with John Mayall (1967).

What favorite tracks do you think are particularly great that Mick Taylor plays on outside the Rolling Stones? Officially released of not, it doesn't matter.

Thanks for your input.


Taylor did some great prog rock stuff in the eighties/early nineties sometimes even reminding me of Jeff Beck. Tracks like "Red Shoes". Some recordings with Dylan are outstanding -Masters of War, Wembley 1984, and his work with John Mayall 1983 was very good. There's a crazy concert floating on YouTube with Roger Troy on bass, 1986, where Taylor proved that he can carry a band, even being the only guitarist.

Trough his entire career he has proven to be an excellent blues/slide player, and always had very good melodic ideas.

His work with the Stones from 2012 and onwards -in my humble opinion- is as mediocre as the rest of the guitar section. Charlie Watts in 2013, praising Taylor, referred to the days when Taylor was still a member of the band. He must have noticed the difference. The rest is history. Uch.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: maidenlane ()
Date: February 14, 2024 20:33

Quote
exilestones

* * *
Also, do you have any favorite tracks, live Mick Taylor played on with the Stones in 2012, 2013, & 2014?

Shortcut: To save an enormous amount of time, consider the handful of performances of Sway and CYHMK, and also the version of Satisfaction from San Jose (2013) where he played a rare lead.

Then decide on the best of the 54 Midnight Ramblers (one way into that is the 40 that have been reviewed (so far) here: [gimmemt.com]). There are embedded links there to videos for most of the songs for easy reference.

For MR, a good start would be all four 2012 shows with MT, and also Glastonbury and the Hyde Parks.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: February 14, 2024 21:01

One of the weaker tracks from Reg King's 1971 LP, more like an extended jam, but plenty of Mick Taylor guitar, which is never a bad thing...Also playing slide on a BB Blunder track from around the same time.











Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024-02-14 21:33 by roryfaninva.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: The Worst. ()
Date: February 14, 2024 23:01

Mick's playing on Real Live with Bob Dylan is superb.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: February 14, 2024 23:13

Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones.I don’t think his playing suited Dylan at all. I do love his CYHMK at Glastonbury.There are also some excellent Midnight Ramblers from 2013-2014.But I’m satisfied with his work while a member of the Stones, which for me has never been topped by the band or anyother band

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: February 14, 2024 23:19

Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones

Yeah that pretty well sums it up ...



ROCKMAN

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: NICOS ()
Date: February 15, 2024 00:20

The solo on this track reminds me of Can't You Hear Me Knocking

[www.youtube.com]

"Snowy Wood" – CRUSADE John Mayall – 1967
Composer Lyricist: Mick Taylor & John Mayall

__________________________

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Date: February 15, 2024 00:31

Quote
NICOS
The solo on this track reminds me of Can't You Hear Me Knocking





"Snowy Wood" – CRUSADE John Mayall – 1967
Composer Lyricist: Mick Taylor & John Mayall

He could have joined the Stones in 1967. Almost everything in his playing is potentionally there already.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Iggyrichards ()
Date: February 15, 2024 00:54

I love his playing the Dylan album Infidels and "Real live". Infidels has some nice leads and fun interplay with Mark Knopfler and on real live his lead work is great.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: TravellinMan ()
Date: February 15, 2024 04:54

Stranger in Your Town is a nice live album.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: frenki09 ()
Date: February 15, 2024 08:47

All you need is (not love) but A Stone's Throw Japan edition. The rest in his brief recording carrier as a solo artist is rubbish, I am sorry to say.

I remember the excitement of picking up his first solo LP decades ago, and then right after the initial spin, listening to it once more in disbelief. A dull album without any memorable songs. Yes, fine guitar playing but this would not have been noticed by anyone, if it had been done by unknown artist.

He just seems like a lazy ass. Three proper solo LPs since leaving the Stones. I call that uninspired.

His replacement, our one and only Ronnie is the complete opposite, he recorded superb solo albums that to me often had better songs and sound than even some of his band's work. I enjoy going back to Ronnie's solo albums -- they are a whole lotta fun!

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Date: February 15, 2024 10:51

I've always liked this one. However, the production on this album is not up to par, imo.





[www.youtube.com]

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Date: February 15, 2024 12:23

The 1st solo album was promising. But, like many other great players, he showed himself as not much of a writer.
Some of his best, most lyrical playing is with Carla Olsen.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: February 15, 2024 14:26




Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: February 15, 2024 15:12

Quote
Rockman
Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones

Yeah that pretty well sums it up ...

Imo that is the problem all the band’s sidemen face : Nicky or Bobby Keys were there during the bands golden age, they added beautiful things to Mick and Keith’s songs.
But if you listen to their solo albums made during the same golden era (the early mid-70s), well there is very little to enjoy. Same goes for MT a bit later in 1979.

It is as if Mick and Keith gave their sidemen talent. Weird, huh...

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: February 15, 2024 16:27

I always liked his Stranger in This Town live album. And that is just about it, unfortunately.

Mathijs

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: February 15, 2024 17:13

Quote
dcba
Quote
Rockman
Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones

Yeah that pretty well sums it up ...

Imo that is the problem all the band’s sidemen face : Nicky or Bobby Keys were there during the bands golden age, they added beautiful things to Mick and Keith’s songs.
But if you listen to their solo albums made during the same golden era (the early mid-70s), well there is very little to enjoy. Same goes for MT a bit later in 1979.

It is as if Mick and Keith gave their sidemen talent. Weird, huh...
Mick and Keith’s solo albums aren’t as good as their top 15 studio albums either. And Mick Taylor was more than a sideman .He was a band member.Broken Hands,Giddy Up,Leather Jacket and Spanish A Minor are good songs



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2024-02-15 17:22 by Taylor1.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Date: February 15, 2024 21:24

Quote
Taylor1
Quote
dcba
Quote
Rockman
Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones

Yeah that pretty well sums it up ...

Imo that is the problem all the band’s sidemen face : Nicky or Bobby Keys were there during the bands golden age, they added beautiful things to Mick and Keith’s songs.
But if you listen to their solo albums made during the same golden era (the early mid-70s), well there is very little to enjoy. Same goes for MT a bit later in 1979.

It is as if Mick and Keith gave their sidemen talent. Weird, huh...
Mick and Keith’s solo albums aren’t as good as their top 15 studio albums either. And Mick Taylor was more than a sideman .He was a band member.Broken Hands,Giddy Up,Leather Jacket and Spanish A Minor are good songs

Those songs are not top 15 Stones album material, imo. Sweet Thing, Evening Gown, You Don't Move Me and Make No Mistake do have that quality.

Btw, I like the Stones's version of Leather Jacket.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: February 15, 2024 21:30

Spanish A Minor is certainly worthy of being on a top 15 album.Better than songs Short and Curlies, Indian Girl and Hey Negrita and much of the rest of the bands solo output.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024-02-15 21:45 by Taylor1.

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: February 16, 2024 04:45

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
Taylor1
Quote
dcba
Quote
Rockman
Unfortunately, nothing is on a par with his work with the Stones

Yeah that pretty well sums it up ...

Imo that is the problem all the band’s sidemen face : Nicky or Bobby Keys were there during the bands golden age, they added beautiful things to Mick and Keith’s songs.
But if you listen to their solo albums made during the same golden era (the early mid-70s), well there is very little to enjoy. Same goes for MT a bit later in 1979.

It is as if Mick and Keith gave their sidemen talent. Weird, huh...
Mick and Keith’s solo albums aren’t as good as their top 15 studio albums either. And Mick Taylor was more than a sideman .He was a band member.Broken Hands,Giddy Up,Leather Jacket and Spanish A Minor are good songs

Those songs are not top 15 Stones album material, imo. Sweet Thing, Evening Gown, You Don't Move Me and Make No Mistake do have that quality.

Btw, I like the Stones's version of Leather Jacket.

lol I don’t know any of those songs you referenced so they must not be that memorable to speak so authoritatively.

Let Jagger sing those songs and Charlie drum on them. A song is a song, I think you might be thinking about your preferred performance. Dylan wrote Watchtower, but it took Hendrix to make it a masterpiece. Ask FM radio

Re: Mick Taylor Best Recordings Outside the Rolling Stones
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: February 16, 2024 10:35

Quote
TravelinMan

...Let Jagger sing those songs and Charlie drum on them. A song is a song, I think you might be thinking about your preferred performance. Dylan wrote Watchtower, but it took Hendrix to make it a masterpiece. Ask FM radio

A very good point. For some folks its the sound of a band that we love above all else.

That's certainly the case for me with the Stones . I just love the noise they make, and the material becomes almost a secondary consideration.

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