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Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: straycatuk ()
Date: October 17, 2019 18:42

If they are currently working on ABB pt.2 ...........don't bother. Whatever songs were good doesn't matter. The production / mastering ruined it . Similar affect with Blue and Lonesome. Listen to the warmth of Cross eyed Heart for comparison.

sc uk

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Date: October 17, 2019 18:55

Like everyone else I think the album is much too long. And it doubles the glaring fault, that the album has no dynamics; absolutely no depth whatsoever. I think I could have handled the album better, if it had stopped for a minute or two; even if it was with a mediocre song.
That blaring mastering, the brick-walling; that same shouting of juvenile lyrics; those forced typical Mick Jagger bridges. There is something so rushed and desperate about that album. "Dirty Work" is a lousy album; but it is a Stones album, and it has it's place in their catalog, and their career.
ABB , I almost wish it hadn't happened; it is that superficial and disposable.

If pressed I'd go with

Side1
Under the Radar
Dangerous Beauty
Back of my Hand
Oh No Not You Again
Rain Fall Down

Side2
She Saw Me Coming
Laugh I Nearly Died
It Won't take long
Biggest Mistake
Rough Justice

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 19, 2019 06:13

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
Like everyone else I think the album is much too long. And it doubles the glaring fault, that the album has no dynamics; absolutely no depth whatsoever. I think I could have handled the album better, if it had stopped for a minute or two; even if it was with a mediocre song.
That blaring mastering, the brick-walling; that same shouting of juvenile lyrics; those forced typical Mick Jagger bridges. There is something so rushed and desperate about that album. "Dirty Work" is a lousy album; but it is a Stones album, and it has it's place in their catalog, and their career.
ABB , I almost wish it hadn't happened; it is that superficial and disposable.

If pressed I'd go with

Side1
Under the Radar
Dangerous Beauty
Back of my Hand
Oh No Not You Again
Rain Fall Down

Side2
She Saw Me Coming
Laugh I Nearly Died
It Won't take long
Biggest Mistake
Rough Justice

good song picks, that is what I'd go with as well. I'm not arguing about the 'sound' or the lyrics, but overall the album was pretty good, I just would have liked the editing of the material (and maybe fleshing out some of the songs a bit more, ie the great Under The Radar could have been even greater).

I don't care what anyone says, Dangerous Beauty is excellent, especially the lyrics.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: October 19, 2019 10:29

Quote
MadMax
For me the brickwalled mixing is the biggest flaw with the record...

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
Like everyone else I think the album is much too long. And it doubles the glaring fault, that the album has no dynamics; absolutely no depth whatsoever.


Yep...that's a big issue with it. [as with much recorded music in the digital era]

Vinyl fans who have the recent Abby Road re-mastered set will know how much better ABB sounds with less compression and a more natural dynamic.

It's like a different record !

[The results across the dozen and a half albums in that set are a mixed bag but ABB is the real eye opener.]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2019-10-19 10:47 by Spud.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: StonedAsiaExile ()
Date: October 19, 2019 15:10

I like the album, just don't like the name of the album like I don't like Grrrrrr......I'd like to see them think of a better name for their next album. Hard to beat Exile or Sticky Fingers but they can do better. Just my opinion.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: October 19, 2019 15:37

Yeah it's too long but more importantly it's not very well played, basically a Mick+Keith+Charlie effort and that's likely why Mick wanted to reçut it in the studio with some outside help like for B2B. That album has such nice guitar parts by Waddy, Hammond parts by Benmont Trench, percussion by Keltner, etc...They could have afforded it...

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Date: October 19, 2019 15:43

Quote
gotdablouse
Yeah it's too long but more importantly it's not very well played, basically a Mick+Keith+Charlie effort and that's likely why Mick wanted to reçut it in the studio with some outside help like for B2B. That album has such nice guitar parts by Waddy, Hammond parts by Benmont Trench, percussion by Keltner, etc...They could have afforded it...

As well as superior playing by Keith ( B2B ).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-10-22 09:43 by DandelionPowderman.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: 24FPS ()
Date: October 22, 2019 01:16

I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Date: October 22, 2019 09:44

Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

Both are too long.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 22, 2019 16:40

Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: 24FPS ()
Date: October 22, 2019 21:36

Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 23, 2019 16:13

Quote
24FPS
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

I would say 2 magnificent albums, or one fantastic double album.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: stickyfingers101 ()
Date: October 23, 2019 16:50

"It Won't Take Long" is a great song

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: October 24, 2019 01:30

Quote
Hairball
"There's some good stuff on there, but I don't know... There's something about the way it holds together, for me. I don't know if we got the tracks in the right order or something like that.
Sometimes, it can make the difference on a record, the way it flows. But I enjoyed making it very much". - Keith,2015

There's one or two tracks on it that are pretty good, but overall it's a mess. Haven't listened from start to finish since just after it was released.
Listened straight through maybe 10 times, but had to stop as it was so annoying. Infamy might just be Keith's worst song ever (with or without the Stones), and even when played live it was crap.
Streets of Love is the low point of the Stones entire career up to this point, but doubt it's possible to sink lower than that. Sweet Neo Con is a miserable/hilarious excuse for a political song.
So many things wrong with this album, it might just be impossible to improve it.

HA HA! Well, to take that last bit you said, it's why a severely edited form of it, for me, anyway, does improve it. If it helps you understand, I still, somehow, have DIRTY WORK in my library - but I improved it by turning it into an EP so...

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: retired_dog ()
Date: October 24, 2019 03:37

Quote
24FPS
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

Voodoo is not the album it could have been. It suffers severely from the fact that both songwriters used their best material for their then recent solo albums, Main Offender and Wandering Spirit.

For saving ABB, in my fantasy world a much more radical approach than what is proposed here by other posters is required:

Cut it down to a single album, include Under The Radar, Blue and replace Streets Of Love with Old Habits Die Hard to have a decent ballad. And turn the demo-like sounding, one-dimensional Back Of My Hand into something more interesting by adding the electric coda from the live version.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-10-24 03:39 by retired_dog.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 24, 2019 17:01

Quote
retired_dog
Quote
24FPS
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

Voodoo is not the album it could have been. It suffers severely from the fact that both songwriters used their best material for their then recent solo albums, Main Offender and Wandering Spirit.

For saving ABB, in my fantasy world a much more radical approach than what is proposed here by other posters is required:

Cut it down to a single album, include Under The Radar, Blue and replace Streets Of Love with Old Habits Die Hard to have a decent ballad. And turn the demo-like sounding, one-dimensional Back Of My Hand into something more interesting by adding the electric coda from the live version.

I like the cut of your jib son.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: tumbled ()
Date: October 24, 2019 18:19

I think its a great album and I love all of it. The name has arbitrary meaning, a bigger bang (for your buck) and a bigger bang meaning bigger than the Big Bang which is feeling you get sometimes if you are lucky.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: retired_dog ()
Date: October 24, 2019 20:14

Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
retired_dog
Quote
24FPS
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

Voodoo is not the album it could have been. It suffers severely from the fact that both songwriters used their best material for their then recent solo albums, Main Offender and Wandering Spirit.

For saving ABB, in my fantasy world a much more radical approach than what is proposed here by other posters is required:

Cut it down to a single album, include Under The Radar, Blue and replace Streets Of Love with Old Habits Die Hard to have a decent ballad. And turn the demo-like sounding, one-dimensional Back Of My Hand into something more interesting by adding the electric coda from the live version.

I like the cut of your jib son.

Yeah, maybe I should offer some to Don and Mick 'n Keef to get them into a bit more creative mindframe when producing Stones albums.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 27, 2019 21:21

Quote
retired_dog
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
retired_dog
Quote
24FPS
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
24FPS
I laugh when people say it's too long. Voodoo Lounge is what's too long. There are a couple standout cuts on ABB, but I still never have the itch to listen to it. The gall for Mick to think he could play bass. My biggest problem post Wyman is that Charlie's cymbals sound like trash can lids, and they have no idea what a proper bass should sound like on their records. Bill's playing ENHANCED the music. Darryl, or Mick, or whoever they've come up so far does NOTHING for the music. I know Bill ain't coming back. And I know they're too lazy to replace Darryl. So..............I don't have a lot of hope for a new album. Don't get me wrong, Blue and Lonesome was great. But that was down and dirty. I don't think they have it in them anymore to produce something that could stand alongside their studio work from 1962-1989.

if Voodoo Lounge is too long, Bridges to Babylon should have been an EP.

Voodoo has 15 cuts. Bridge 13. ABB 16. You could cut all three of them together and make one decent album.

Voodoo is not the album it could have been. It suffers severely from the fact that both songwriters used their best material for their then recent solo albums, Main Offender and Wandering Spirit.

For saving ABB, in my fantasy world a much more radical approach than what is proposed here by other posters is required:

Cut it down to a single album, include Under The Radar, Blue and replace Streets Of Love with Old Habits Die Hard to have a decent ballad. And turn the demo-like sounding, one-dimensional Back Of My Hand into something more interesting by adding the electric coda from the live version.

I like the cut of your jib son.

Yeah, maybe I should offer some to Don and Mick 'n Keef to get them into a bit more creative mindframe when producing Stones albums.

Invite them out for coffee, just to run past the high level idea. If they like it, you can probably co-produce the new album, in time for Christmas!

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: LazarusSmith ()
Date: October 27, 2019 23:39

Perhaps I’m oversimplifying but I’ve always thought ABB would have been a much better album had it included good songs.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: October 27, 2019 23:48

yep …. even better if they were great songs …..



ROCKMAN

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: black n blue ()
Date: October 28, 2019 02:49

An excellent cd.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: October 28, 2019 06:39

Quote
stickyfingers101
"It Won't Take Long" is a great song

Agree!

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: October 28, 2019 10:53

Mick mentioned in an interview that
It Wont Take Long started out as a soul style song …. …

Love the lyrics … kinda like a twin of When Your Gone


And it won't take long to forget you
You know I'm never wrong
It'll all be over in a minute
And it won't take long, ah ……………….




ROCKMAN

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Date: October 28, 2019 14:16

Quote
Rockman
Mick mentioned in an interview that
It Wont Take Long started out as a soul style song …. …

Love the lyrics … kinda like a twin of When Your Gone


And it won't take long to forget you
You know I'm never wrong
It'll all be over in a minute
And it won't take long, ah ……………….

And why not? Why did he not even allow a bit more time to develop this as a soul song? The album is so rushed. Even the songs with potential are not given any, ANY time to become something with depth or soul.
This is why at first I did not agree with retired dog's post re. "Blue" and "Habits". And I;m still not sure if I do, because those songs smack of the 90's. But RDog makes a point about depth. "back of Hand" is a very good song; reminds me of "Signifyin" off of 'Exile'. Yet it isn't allowed to be as good as it could be. The Stones have used the live stage for so many of their songs, to bring them fully to life, and properly showcase them.
This is also why 'Streets of Love' isn't all bad IMO becaUSE WHEN i SAW THEM DO IT live it was one of the best songs that night.
Another thing about ABB is - there are not enough acoustic guitars on the album.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: GetYerAngie ()
Date: October 28, 2019 14:16

Quote
Rockman
Mick mentioned in an interview that
It Wont Take Long started out as a soul style song …. …

Love the lyrics … kinda like a twin of When Your Gone


And it won't take long to forget you
You know I'm never wrong
It'll all be over in a minute
And it won't take long, ah ……………….

Yeah, the lyrics are superb - as are Mick's singing - and it is one of the best tracks on ABB

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Erik_Snow ()
Date: October 28, 2019 17:56

Quote
retired_dog
Voodoo is not the album it could have been. It suffers severely from the fact that both songwriters used their best material for their then recent solo albums, Main Offender and Wandering Spirit.

For saving ABB, in my fantasy world a much more radical approach than what is proposed here by other posters is required:

Cut it down to a single album, include Under The Radar, Blue and replace Streets Of Love with Old Habits Die Hard to have a decent ballad. And turn the demo-like sounding, one-dimensional Back Of My Hand into something more interesting by adding the electric coda from the live version.

I have always thought the only way to save ABB would be to make it a 7" ; Under The Radar being on the A-side and some kind of outtake being side B. Or perhaps a 12" 45RPM with 4 songs, if being more diplomatic.
But; I like your idea, at least if they didn't brickwall the sound as they did.
By including Blue and Old Habits Die Hard.....perfect 45 RPM, I do think that would be the most perfect option. But what could be the 4th song? Hmmmmmm.....I know; Careless Ethiopians !



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2019-10-28 18:04 by Erik_Snow.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: October 28, 2019 18:09

If you listen the entire album backwards there's a vast improvement.
Even Streets of Love becomes somewhat interesting, sounding like a demonic chant.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: micawber ()
Date: October 28, 2019 18:23

Best song on ABB is "Let Me Down Slow" imo.

Re: If A BIGGER BANG Had Been Handled Differently
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: October 28, 2019 19:22

Another thing about ABB is - there are not enough acoustic guitars on the album.

yep …..



ROCKMAN

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