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DandelionPowdermanQuote
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Jesse
Great to see how many of you now realize that MT is inconsistant and shouldn't be playing on more than 3 songs. He can't be trusted not to screw up. If Jagger seems to be zeroed in on him, it's because he's watching for his f-ups or for him trying to change what audiences want. With the exception of one particular MR in Chicago, MT drags these concerts down. If KR looks a little bored, it's because he has to pretend to love what MT is doing. Poor Ronnie, he's just being polite.
Dawg, don't go crazy 'cause I speak the truth.
Dawg, you lost this thread argument. No -- MT's playing lost it for you!
I think Taylor's current level suits the Stones perfectly well.
And everybody is happy he is back on stage with the Stones.
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sonomastoneQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
svt22Quote
Jesse
Great to see how many of you now realize that MT is inconsistant and shouldn't be playing on more than 3 songs. He can't be trusted not to screw up. If Jagger seems to be zeroed in on him, it's because he's watching for his f-ups or for him trying to change what audiences want. With the exception of one particular MR in Chicago, MT drags these concerts down. If KR looks a little bored, it's because he has to pretend to love what MT is doing. Poor Ronnie, he's just being polite.
Dawg, don't go crazy 'cause I speak the truth.
Dawg, you lost this thread argument. No -- MT's playing lost it for you!
I think Taylor's current level suits the Stones perfectly well.
And everybody is happy he is back on stage with the Stones.
Yup. Once you accept that the whole thing is a nostalgia tour it becomes much easier to enjoy it for what it is or ignore it and still be a Stones fan.
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svt22Quote
sonomastoneQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
svt22Quote
Jesse
Great to see how many of you now realize that MT is inconsistant and shouldn't be playing on more than 3 songs. He can't be trusted not to screw up. If Jagger seems to be zeroed in on him, it's because he's watching for his f-ups or for him trying to change what audiences want. With the exception of one particular MR in Chicago, MT drags these concerts down. If KR looks a little bored, it's because he has to pretend to love what MT is doing. Poor Ronnie, he's just being polite.
Dawg, don't go crazy 'cause I speak the truth.
Dawg, you lost this thread argument. No -- MT's playing lost it for you!
I think Taylor's current level suits the Stones perfectly well.
And everybody is happy he is back on stage with the Stones.
Yup. Once you accept that the whole thing is a nostalgia tour it becomes much easier to enjoy it for what it is or ignore it and still be a Stones fan.
There's always this bit of hope things change for the better, certainly in Taylor's case.
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sonomastoneQuote
svt22Quote
sonomastoneQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
svt22Quote
Jesse
Great to see how many of you now realize that MT is inconsistant and shouldn't be playing on more than 3 songs. He can't be trusted not to screw up. If Jagger seems to be zeroed in on him, it's because he's watching for his f-ups or for him trying to change what audiences want. With the exception of one particular MR in Chicago, MT drags these concerts down. If KR looks a little bored, it's because he has to pretend to love what MT is doing. Poor Ronnie, he's just being polite.
Dawg, don't go crazy 'cause I speak the truth.
Dawg, you lost this thread argument. No -- MT's playing lost it for you!
I think Taylor's current level suits the Stones perfectly well.
And everybody is happy he is back on stage with the Stones.
Yup. Once you accept that the whole thing is a nostalgia tour it becomes much easier to enjoy it for what it is or ignore it and still be a Stones fan.
There's always this bit of hope things change for the better, certainly in Taylor's case.
I'd love to see him play again on a Keith solo album! What those two do is so complementary.
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DandelionPowderman
Now you do...
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Jesse
Edward, you make some good points. My way of looking at it is thru a lens of loyalty and who's been playing together for the past 38 yrs. That might smack of a farewell tour but that's how I see it -- but I hope they all play for 50 more years!! But I give the nod to Ronnie and Keefe playing together, I think that's what most fans want to see. Not all obviously, but most.
It's nice that they brought in MT and I hope he's going to do well for himself. But it's hard to have someone come in and try to prove something after 38 yrs. which is what I think he's trying to do. I keep thinking: HE left THEM. What I don't want is for MT to mess up the remainder of this tour so that people who don't really know and love the fans think they're not "on" any more. I think they've been playing great -- not like they used to but great. I see MT as a loose cannon and these shows are not the place to experiement if you ask me. Folks who pay $800 don't want to see MT throw off the pace.
I like your style Edward Twining. You write with brains and passion for the Stones. Peace.
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DandelionPowderman
Now you do...
Well Dandelion, i rather like Taylor's performance here, even if he isn't quite in tune at times, simply because he's still doing what the Stones collectively used to do so well when they were at their peak, and when they were still living up to their name as 'the greatest rock 'n' roll band in the world'. There is a rawness and spontaneity here which has been severely lacking for several decades within the safe predictability of the Stones live sound, which i think Taylor deserves full credit for, whether he's fully successful or not, for at least attempting to break the mould, and going against the grain of those strict (non rock 'n' roll) principles with which the Stones have set in stone for so very very long. I don't understand those fans who just want the Stones to forever play it safe, where they go through the motions from show to show, where those shows have so little distinction to separate them, or seeing the Stones never playing with any true freshness or spontaneity. Taylor has brought the Stones back to life, so to speak.
The true question really is whether the other Stones are up for the challenge, and ready to take a few risks along the way. At the moment i'd say they are not, and are distinctly uncomfortable with Taylor's involvement.
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Jesse
Edward, you make some good points. My way of looking at it is thru a lens of loyalty and who's been playing together for the past 38 yrs. That might smack of a farewell tour but that's how I see it -- but I hope they all play for 50 more years!! But I give the nod to Ronnie and Keefe playing together, I think that's what most fans want to see. Not all obviously, but most.
It's nice that they brought in MT and I hope he's going to do well for himself. But it's hard to have someone come in and try to prove something after 38 yrs. which is what I think he's trying to do. I keep thinking: HE left THEM. What I don't want is for MT to mess up the remainder of this tour so that people who don't really know and love the fans think they're not "on" any more. I think they've been playing great -- not like they used to but great. I see MT as a loose cannon and these shows are not the place to experiement if you ask me. Folks who pay $800 don't want to see MT throw off the pace.
I like your style Edward Twining. You write with brains and passion for the Stones. Peace.
Rock 'n roll like the Stones used to create with Taylor, and before with Jones, isn't a safe game, it's "no rock 'n roll show" (MR-lyrics) intended to please folks who pay those 800 dollars or euros. It's meant to be adventurous, daring and dangerous. That's the way the Taylor Stones always have played: on the edge and sometimes over it. But always interesting and exciting. Those who want to keep it clean can eternally play their studio albums. Anyway, when I see and hear the crowd's (and YT-watchers') reaction to Knocking, MR and Sway I know I'm not the only one who loves to see new musical blood pumped into this somewhat stale and stiff band.
Making such a fuss about some miss and hit notes by Taylor during the Satisfaction, the last, festive number, doesn't make any difference at all. But oh well, it's grist to the mill for those who have a hidden agenda: to bring Taylor down, even by praising him to the skies sometimes.
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StonesCat
The Satisfaction nonsense is kind of like singling out a guitar during the RnR Hall of Fame jam at the end of the show, where they have everybody and their brother on stage. There's one or two guitars that are meant to be heard, most of the players are just going thru the motions. There's probably a handful of people that believe MT even knew he was audible, and they all post here.
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Jesse
It's nice that they brought in MT and I hope he's going to do well for himself. But it's hard to have someone come in and try to prove something after 38 yrs. which is what I think he's trying to do. I keep thinking: HE left THEM. What I don't want is for MT to mess up the remainder of this tour so that people who don't really know and love the fans think they're not "on" any more. I think they've been playing great -- not like they used to but great. I see MT as a loose cannon and these shows are not the place to experiement if you ask me. Folks who pay $800 don't want to see MT throw off the pace.
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Edward Twining
Well Dandelion, i rather like Taylor's performance here, even if he isn't quite in tune at times, simply because he's still doing what the Stones collectively used to do so well when they were at their peak, and when they were still living up to their name as 'the greatest rock 'n' roll band in the world'. There is a rawness and spontaneity here which has been severely lacking for several decades within the safe predictability of the Stones live sound, which i think Taylor deserves full credit for, whether he's fully successful or not, for at least attempting to break the mould, and going against the grain of those strict (non rock 'n' roll) principles with which the Stones have set in stone for so very very long. I don't understand those fans who just want the Stones to forever play it safe, where they go through the motions from show to show, where those shows have so little distinction to separate them, or seeing the Stones never playing with any true freshness or spontaneity. Taylor has brought the Stones back to life, so to speak.
The true question really is whether the other Stones are up for the challenge, and ready to take a few risks along the way. At the moment i'd say they are not, and are distinctly uncomfortable with Taylor's involvement.
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
StonesCat
The Satisfaction nonsense is kind of like singling out a guitar during the RnR Hall of Fame jam at the end of the show, where they have everybody and their brother on stage. There's one or two guitars that are meant to be heard, most of the players are just going thru the motions. There's probably a handful of people that believe MT even knew he was audible, and they all post here.
True. Then again, now I expect you to be the first to point this out the next time Keith is criticised for doing the same widdling
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duffydawg
I know 20 other long-time Stones fans and everyone of them want more Mick Taylor. Only Ass Clowns on the Board seem to claim to be Stones fans but don't like Taylor....LOL
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duffydawg
I know 20 other long-time Stones fans and everyone of them want more Mick Taylor. Only Ass Clowns on the Board seem to claim to be Stones fans but don't like Taylor....LOL
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
StonesCat
The Satisfaction nonsense is kind of like singling out a guitar during the RnR Hall of Fame jam at the end of the show, where they have everybody and their brother on stage. There's one or two guitars that are meant to be heard, most of the players are just going thru the motions. There's probably a handful of people that believe MT even knew he was audible, and they all post here.
True. Then again, now I expect you to be the first to point this out the next time Keith is criticised for doing the same widdling
I thought the Chicago 2 show was great from all involved. The only time I thought any guitarist was a little shaky was during Shine A Light w/Ronnie, and that's just going off my memory. I purposely didn't watch any tour clips beforehand, besides the MT and guest spots, and the warhorses sounded great to me.
I've gone from excitement before the tour at MT being majorly involved, to disappointment w/just Rambler, to contentment with Rambler/Satisfaction and one other MT showcase (especially since my one show had CYHMK). I've accepted the way he's being used now and I think two showcases a night is about right. The way that the others have accepted him and let him stand with them for the final core group bow is majorly cool. Ronnie especially has been incredibly gracious, so I vowed not to criticize him, and he's playing well overall anyway.
My only hopes now are for a couple different tunes for Taylor. Knocking is a great song for the group, but Sway is not that good aside from Taylor's soloing. It's pretty clear he's either always on a tune, or never on it, so I'm hoping for a Love in Vain spot, or Moonlight Mile, which wouldn't be right to play without him. It was on the fan vote, and was rehearsed, so there's a chance.
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Jesse
--The Stones have nothing to prove. They fill arena after arena -- and MT isn't the drawing card.
--It's a matter of taste isn't it? You either like the two guitar sound of Ronnie and Keefe or you like longer guitar solos in which somebody is declared "best" guitarist. One can't argue taste. I like red, you like blue.
--Places like Chicago's United Center aren't the right venues for "experimenting" and taking risks; musicians do that in small clubs w/small audiences.
--MT didn't give the Stones new life -- no way. THEY gave HIM new life.
--If any of the Stones or even MT (he's not a Stone, sorry) read the comments on this thread, they'd probably laugh and tell each of us to get a life!
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Jesse
--The Stones have nothing to prove. They fill arena after arena -- and MT isn't the drawing card.
--It's a matter of taste isn't it? You either like the two guitar sound of Ronnie and Keefe or you like longer guitar solos in which somebody is declared "best" guitarist. One can't argue taste. I like red, you like blue.
--Places like Chicago's United Center aren't the right venues for "experimenting" and taking risks; musicians do that in small clubs w/small audiences.
--MT didn't give the Stones new life -- no way. THEY gave HIM new life.
--If any of the Stones or even MT (he's not a Stone, sorry) read the comments on this thread, they'd probably laugh and tell each of us to get a life!
The thing is Jessie, people go to see the Stones mainly because of nostalgia, and it's a testament to the Stones that when they were in their prime they were so utterly brilliant, that today people are still in awe of just getting a whiff of them and their old magic, even if it's now largely diluted. It's not necessarily a competition between Mick Taylor and Ronnie Wood, either, but more about their own previous rock 'n' roll sensibilities v the more conservative approach of the last three decades, where the rock 'n' roll spontaneity has been taken out of the equation, and replaced by professionalism. Mick Taylor to a point still represents an element of what they once were. I'm not saying he hasn't aged as well, and within his musical capabilities, too, but his approach is still with a greater degree of spontaneity and edge. Years ago the Stones would have revelled in this approach, but sadly not any more. This early approach is what made them what they are today, with regards to fans still wanting to see them, and not what the safe approach entails which they have acquired in more recent decades. Many fans have hesitantly accepted their more recent shows because at least they have the option to still see them, but many of them really long for those earlier times - with Brian Jones, Mick Taylor AND the younger Ronnie Wood.
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MarkSchneider
CYHMK Toronto June 6th 2013