For information about how to use this forum please check out forum help and policies.
Quote
Big Al
Listening to Metal Machine Music is akin to suffering from tinnitus. Reed was angry with the record company, had to release something, so produced this. I'm sure he didn't intend for anyone to actually enjoy it. Reading the 'positive' reviews on Amazon and how they 'get' it, is, quite frankly, disturbing.
Quote
Big Al
Listening to Metal Machine Music is akin to suffering from tinnitus. Reed was angry with the record company, had to release something, so produced this. I'm sure he didn't intend for anyone to actually enjoy it. Reading the 'positive' reviews on Amazon and how they 'get' it, is, quite frankly, disturbing.
Quote
loog droogQuote
Big Al
Listening to Metal Machine Music is akin to suffering from tinnitus. Reed was angry with the record company, had to release something, so produced this. I'm sure he didn't intend for anyone to actually enjoy it. Reading the 'positive' reviews on Amazon and how they 'get' it, is, quite frankly, disturbing.
Saying you "like" Metal Machine Music--as a concept, which is Lou's f**k-off to RCA--is one thing.
Actually listening to the whole thing--and maintaining that it is "good" or even "music" is a sad self-delusion. It's the Emperor's New Clothes.
Quote
tatters
This was posted today on Lou's Facebook page ....
[anearful.blogspot.co.uk]
[...]
As a thought to end this, I urge you to follow Lou's example and find your own points of reference in his remarkable body of work. Don't believe the obituaries with their lazy shibboleths and bits of received wisdom. Transformer is not perfect (in fact, it's quite uneven), The Bells is not the great lost album (that might be Rock And Roll Heart), Take No Prisoners is not just a comedy album (stunning versions of Berlin and Pale Blue Eyes put the lie to that view), Lulu, his collaboration with Metallica, does not suck (it's a brave and bloody album, worth it for Iced Honey and Junior Dad alone). Listen for yourself. Do it for Lou.
Quote
tattersQuote
loog droogQuote
Big Al
Listening to Metal Machine Music is akin to suffering from tinnitus. Reed was angry with the record company, had to release something, so produced this. I'm sure he didn't intend for anyone to actually enjoy it. Reading the 'positive' reviews on Amazon and how they 'get' it, is, quite frankly, disturbing.
Saying you "like" Metal Machine Music--as a concept, which is Lou's f**k-off to RCA--is one thing.
Actually listening to the whole thing--and maintaining that it is "good" or even "music" is a sad self-delusion. It's the Emperor's New Clothes.
I'm pretty sure that anyone who claims to like MMM is just taking the piss. You'd have to be completely deranged to listen to all sixty-four minutes of it. With the exception of Bob Ludwig, who mastered it and obviously had to listen to the entire thing, probably no one has.
Quote
kowalskiQuote
tatters
This was posted today on Lou's Facebook page ....
[anearful.blogspot.co.uk]
[...]
As a thought to end this, I urge you to follow Lou's example and find your own points of reference in his remarkable body of work. Don't believe the obituaries with their lazy shibboleths and bits of received wisdom. Transformer is not perfect (in fact, it's quite uneven), The Bells is not the great lost album (that might be Rock And Roll Heart), Take No Prisoners is not just a comedy album (stunning versions of Berlin and Pale Blue Eyes put the lie to that view), Lulu, his collaboration with Metallica, does not suck (it's a brave and bloody album, worth it for Iced Honey and Junior Dad alone). Listen for yourself. Do it for Lou.
Totally agree on this. Transformer might one of his weakest album in term of ambition, while his most ambitious works seem to have always been shot down in flame, from Berlin to Lulu. Just use your own ears and don't believe what others say. I bet that by the end of the decade Lulu will be rehabilited by the critic and will be seen as Lou Reed's ultimate classic.
Quote
kowalskiQuote
tatters
This was posted today on Lou's Facebook page ....
[anearful.blogspot.co.uk]
[...]
As a thought to end this, I urge you to follow Lou's example and find your own points of reference in his remarkable body of work. Don't believe the obituaries with their lazy shibboleths and bits of received wisdom. Transformer is not perfect (in fact, it's quite uneven), The Bells is not the great lost album (that might be Rock And Roll Heart), Take No Prisoners is not just a comedy album (stunning versions of Berlin and Pale Blue Eyes put the lie to that view), Lulu, his collaboration with Metallica, does not suck (it's a brave and bloody album, worth it for Iced Honey and Junior Dad alone). Listen for yourself. Do it for Lou.
Totally agree on this. Transformer might one of his weakest album in term of ambition, while his most ambitious works seem to have always been shot down in flame, from Berlin to Lulu. Just use your own ears and don't believe what others say. I bet that by the end of the decade Lulu will be rehabilited by the critic and will be seen as Lou Reed's ultimate classic.
Quote
RollingFreak
Berlin is Lou's greatest album. It has all the best elements, at least of his 70s stuff. Its still got the hard rock nature of Animal (I know it came after Berlin) and Transformer. It has the classic Lou Reed honesty that is absolutely brutal on that album. It has fantastic songs with amazing lyrics. Its ambitious. Thats kind of the pinnacle. His other albums are great, and we can have our personal favorites, but that has all the best stuff. It is also accessible in a way that The Bells, and most of his albums aren't. All his albums are great, but many feel dated. Transformer and Berlin aren't. The newer ones like New York and Ecstasy aren't dated, but they are also older Reed which you have to factor in. Berlin has something that older Reed can't touch on. I don't know if you can be a Lou fan and not like Berlin. You may not like it at first but to be a Lou fan it'll eventually grow on you.
Quote
Edward TwiningQuote
RollingFreak
Berlin is Lou's greatest album. It has all the best elements, at least of his 70s stuff. Its still got the hard rock nature of Animal (I know it came after Berlin) and Transformer. It has the classic Lou Reed honesty that is absolutely brutal on that album. It has fantastic songs with amazing lyrics. Its ambitious. Thats kind of the pinnacle. His other albums are great, and we can have our personal favorites, but that has all the best stuff. It is also accessible in a way that The Bells, and most of his albums aren't. All his albums are great, but many feel dated. Transformer and Berlin aren't. The newer ones like New York and Ecstasy aren't dated, but they are also older Reed which you have to factor in. Berlin has something that older Reed can't touch on. I don't know if you can be a Lou fan and not like Berlin. You may not like it at first but to be a Lou fan it'll eventually grow on you.
Yes, Lou's vocals in the seventies have a real edge. When Lou performed BERLIN live a few years back, he just didn't have that certain 'tone' he had in his youth, that could cut right through you. I always liked his earlier monotone with the slight quiver the best. It has a real harshness, which all the gruff shouting etc. in later years just can't quite make up for. I liked his singing on THE BLUE MASK, and parts of LEGENDARY HEARTS too. Really i like his early vocals through the late seventies more improvised jazz influences, through to the more mature (and deeper) LEGENDARY HEARTS voice the best. The trouble i find with NEW YORK, SONGS FOR DRELLA, and MAGIC AND LOSS is it all sounds a little too clinical for my taste musically, and Reed's voice sounds a little too much like he's reciting, as in speaking, instead of putting in a little more energy/vitality. Things improve a little with SET THE TWILIGHT REELING and ECSTASY, where Lou sounds considerably more enthusiastic. However, as far as live shows are concerned, it is always his seventies concerts, that show Lou vocally in the best light (that being said, i rather like 1983s A NIGHT WITH LOU REED DVD too).
Quote
RollingFreak
100% absolutely agree. New York is a great album, but I've always had the same problem as you. Songs like Halloween Parade and Last Great American Whale are very good, but the problem is that the way he speaks makes them all sound the same. It IS very boring! In the best way possible, but I'm just saying there's definitely a thing thats hard to get past. He definitely did get better later on. But in the early years, even when you criticize that he sounds so monotone, all his songs DID sound different. There was feeling there, whereas later on he was essentially just reading. Its not meant to diminish him, because we've all talked about how great his entire career was. But I don't think his best album can come from any decade other than the 70s. The 80s, 90s, and 2000s all had a similarity that the 70s was totally different from. His tone in the 70s is something so specific to that era that he never had again, and that tone is the reason he became so big. Without the 70s he wouldn't have had the success he did. Its easy to belittle those albums because they are more popular, but they are still probably his best in terms of actually having every part of the great Lou Reed.
Quote
Pietro
I know this is a minority opinion, but he was a hack. His best album, "Transformer," owed more to its producer, David Bowie, than it did to him.
What really bothers me about him is that he was the American baby boomers alter ego. He wrote about taking drugs, going uptown in NYC to buy heroin, etc., which amounted to a cheap thrill ride for all the boomers to get their second-hand chill-thrills.
"A mainer to my vein leads to a center in my head/And I'm better off dead."
Whenever I see one of those wan heroin junkies on the street I want to ask her if it's as romantic as Lou Reed made it out to be.
Quote
seitanQuote
Pietro
I know this is a minority opinion, but he was a hack. His best album, "Transformer," owed more to its producer, David Bowie, than it did to him.
What really bothers me about him is that he was the American baby boomers alter ego. He wrote about taking drugs, going uptown in NYC to buy heroin, etc., which amounted to a cheap thrill ride for all the boomers to get their second-hand chill-thrills.
"A mainer to my vein leads to a center in my head/And I'm better off dead."
Whenever I see one of those wan heroin junkies on the street I want to ask her if it's as romantic as Lou Reed made it out to be.
David Bowie didnt write the songs on Transformer and Lou Reed's best album is Velvet Underground With Nico. - Lou's best albums are the Velvet
Underground recordings.
As for baby boomers - songs about heroin are far more interesting than utopian songs about being useless lazy bum on the beach, like all the Beach Boys songs.
When ever I hear someone saying that Elvis is great - I want to ask them why do you think its great that Peanut butter and fast food restaurant Icon is exploiting black music and racism and stealing all the great black blues and rock songs without having any talent to write a song ?
Quote
PietroQuote
seitanQuote
Pietro
I know this is a minority opinion, but he was a hack. His best album, "Transformer," owed more to its producer, David Bowie, than it did to him.
What really bothers me about him is that he was the American baby boomers alter ego. He wrote about taking drugs, going uptown in NYC to buy heroin, etc., which amounted to a cheap thrill ride for all the boomers to get their second-hand chill-thrills.
"A mainer to my vein leads to a center in my head/And I'm better off dead."
Whenever I see one of those wan heroin junkies on the street I want to ask her if it's as romantic as Lou Reed made it out to be.
David Bowie didnt write the songs on Transformer and Lou Reed's best album is Velvet Underground With Nico. - Lou's best albums are the Velvet
Underground recordings.
As for baby boomers - songs about heroin are far more interesting than utopian songs about being useless lazy bum on the beach, like all the Beach Boys songs.
When ever I hear someone saying that Elvis is great - I want to ask them why do you think its great that Peanut butter and fast food restaurant Icon is exploiting black music and racism and stealing all the great black blues and rock songs without having any talent to write a song ?
Elvis was great. No doubt about it. There would be no rock and roll without him.
Reed was essentially a bourgeois. He was middle-class. Those songs about the underground were like B horror movies for all the boomer kiddies. And it shows you how unsophisticated we are that Lou and his New York schtick is considered sophisticated.
Quote
Pietro
Reed was essentially a bourgeois. He was middle-class. Those songs about the underground were like B horror movies for all the boomer kiddies. And it shows you how unsophisticated we are that Lou and his New York schtick is considered sophisticated.