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OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:18

It was mentioned in the "Most Overrated Song Ever" thread that he often did this. There was even a YouTube video of him doing it on stage. I'm sure the majority of Lennon fans, especially in an age when things are more politically correct than they were in 1964, find his odd behavior more than a little embarrassing. But I wonder if anyone has any theories on WHY he did this.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: stones78 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:26





I'm not one for political correctness. Lennon always seemed to have this sense of humour.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:30

That's what I mean. In 1964 there was no political correctness. You could make fun of "cripples" and "retards" and it wasn't considered taboo. It was considered funny. NOW this clip seems offensive, insensitive, and mean. Or does it?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-01 01:31 by tatters.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:35

Does anyone think he may be making fun of the Beatles AUDIENCE? It's been said that Lennon was greatly disappointed by what the Beatles audiences LOOKED LIKE, that he couldn't believe how uncool they were, and that he called them "an ugly race".

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: ROLLINGSTONE ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:36

Partly Dave
There once upon a time was a man who was partly Dave-he had a mission in life. 'I'm partly Dave' he would growm in the morning which was half the battle. Over breakfast he would again say 'I am partly Dave' which always unnerved Betty. 'Your in a rut Dave' a voice would say on his way to work, which turned out to be a coloured conductor! 'It's alright for you.' Dave used to think, little realising the coloured problem.

Partly Dave was a raving salesman with the gift of the gob, which always unnerved Mary. 'I seem to have forgotten my bus fare, Cobber,' said Dave not realising it. 'Gerroff the bus then' said Basubooo in a voice that bode not boot, not realising the coloured problem himself really. 'O.K.' said partly Dave, humbly not wishing to offend. 'But would you like your daughter to marry one ?' a voice seem to say as Dave lept off the bus like a burning spastic.

In His Own Write.

Who knows? We'll never know.
Suspect he'd have had a field day with Heather Mills tho!!!tongue sticking out smiley

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:42

Quote
ROLLINGSTONE

Who knows? We'll never know.
Suspect he'd have had a field day with Heather Mills tho!!!tongue sticking out smiley

Maybe he would have matured a little by then. Or maybe not. Not that I know much about it, but wasn't it said he was a big fan of, and heavily influenced by, "The Goons"?

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: NICOS ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:42

I'm not one for political correctness. Lennon always seemed to have this sense of humour.

It's not Lennon alone, it was was just the sixties making fun about anything that wasn't common, I think me and my buddies back then made the same jokes.
But as famous JLennon was I think he shouldn't do this.

__________________________

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 01:51

The Beatles often complained that during the Beatlemania years, they were constantly having SEVERLY ill handicapped people in wheelchairs shoved at them, people whose dying wish was to meet the Beatles. Could it be that Lennon's acting out was some kind of reaction to his having to be put in that uncomfortable situation on a daily basis?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-01 01:52 by tatters.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:04

Or could it be that Lennon IDENTIFIED with "cripples", and that his 1971 song, "Crippled Inside" is AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL?

You can shine your shoes and wear a suit
You can comb your hair and look quite cute
You can hide your face behind a smile
One thing you can't hide
Is when you're crippled inside

You can wear a mask and paint your face
You can call yourself the human race
You can wear a collar and a tie
One thing you can't hide
Is when you're crippled inside

Well now you know that your
Cat has nine lives
Nine lives to itself
You only got one
And a dog's life ain't fun
Momma take a look outside

You can go to church and sing a hymn
You can judge me by the colour of my skin
You can live a lie until you die
One thing you can't hide
Is when you're crippled inside



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-01 02:19 by tatters.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Milan ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:09

Always loved this one - Australia '64:




Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tatters ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:16

Quote
Milan
Always loved this one - Australia '64:



Holy shit. I've never seen that before. It helps to remember that they were just kids in '64, all between the ages of 21 and 24. Kids can be silly. Kids who are the most famous people in the world .... well .... it's a wonder they didn't all go completely insane. Somehow, they managed to stay sane while letting the rest of the world go insane.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Jah Paul ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:17

Quote
tatters
The Beatles often complained that during the Beatlemania years, they were constantly having SEVERLY ill handicapped people in wheelchairs shoved at them, people whose dying wish was to meet the Beatles. Could it be that Lennon's acting out was some kind of reaction to his having to be put in that uncomfortable situation on a daily basis?

That's pretty much it.

In the YouTube comments for the video, someone quotes Lennon from his 1971 Rolling Stone interview:

"...we were very sort of callous about it. It was just dreadful: you would open up every night, and instead of seeing kids there, you would just see a row full of cripples along the front. It seemed that we were just surrounded by cripples and blind people all the time, and when we would go through corridors, they would be all touching us and things like that. It was horrifying."

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: tomk ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:24

Insecurity. Perhaps he was afraid of them. It goes back to his earliest days in Liverpool. Either Pete Best or Klaus Voorman tells a story of when they were in Hamburg and a real WW II crippled veteran came and sat by them in a cafe, Lennon bolted right out the door and didn't finish his meal.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Sleepy City ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:26

Check out the opening sequence of the Rolling Stones "Gather No Moss" Pathe colour film & you'll see Brian doing a "spastic" walk...




Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: whitem8 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:27

Lennon also would get very nervous on stage and do comedic things to loosen up and loosen up the other Beatles. He also was very sickened by being petitioned by the handicapped to be healed...and there is also what tatters described as his dissapointment with the fans and how they reacted. Another great loony moment is when Lennon loses it during I'm Down on the Shea concert.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Title5Take1 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:27

I love the Beatles and think John was very talented and had a generous streak, but he also had a mean streak. In Cynthia Lennon's 2005 book titled JOHN she comments how, when Julian once visited his dad in America Julian laughed and John turned and yelled, "You have a horrible laugh! Never let me hear you laugh again!" (which Cynthia called "monstrously cruel." ) So Julian has tried to avoid laughing ever since. Julian once said to Cynthia, "Dad tells the world to love each other. How come he doesn't love me?"

In the recent ROLLING STONE MAGAZINE cover story on John (below) that included new interview comments by John, John himself said he wrote the song BEAUTIFUL BOY for Sean, but that he didn't really like to play with Sean, although he was good at watching TV with Sean. (!!) John himself said writing BEAUTIFUL BOY was like Gauguin painting for his daughter (who was in Paris) while Guaguin himself was far from his daughter in Tahiti. John admitted rather than write a song about Sean he should have spent more time with him.

As far as his preaching peace and love, John was a hypocrite.


Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:43

My guess is nerves. McCartney cracked himself up talking about this in Anthology. It's not very nice, but you have to admit it's funny.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Sleepy City ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:46

Quote
71Tele
My guess is nerves. McCartney cracked himself up talking about this in Anthology. It's not very nice, but you have to admit it's funny.

My guess is that (like Brian) he was simply a cruel b*stard at times. But I don't need my musical heroes to be nice guys (heck, I still listen to Gary Glitter occasionally)...

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: akgameboy ()
Date: March 1, 2011 02:52

Quote
71Tele
My guess is nerves. McCartney cracked himself up talking about this in Anthology. It's not very nice, but you have to admit it's funny.

Sorry, but it's not funny. It's pretty shameful.

This is just another reason why I HATE Lennon and the Beatles.
I wish Lennon would have gotten in a car wreck and been crippled in a wheelchair, so he would have known how it feels to be handicapped.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: whitem8 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 04:03

akgameboy,
so you hate Lennon and The Beatles for what you say is shameful, yet then you go onto wish that Lennon was in a car crash to be crippled. I am glad you aren't a practicing psychologist. Your ridicule therapy methods would cause a stirr.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-01 07:43 by whitem8.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: March 1, 2011 04:44

Quote
akgameboy
Quote
71Tele
My guess is nerves. McCartney cracked himself up talking about this in Anthology. It's not very nice, but you have to admit it's funny.

Sorry, but it's not funny. It's pretty shameful.

This is just another reason why I HATE Lennon and the Beatles.
I wish Lennon would have gotten in a car wreck and been crippled in a wheelchair, so he would have known how it feels to be handicapped.

Sometimes letting off steam with inappropriate humor is healthy. You have to consider the whole person in context. Lennon clearly was not a hateful individual...You seem awful sure of your judgments. And you "wish" someone would get in car wreck? How are you better than the behavior you condemn?

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: stupidguy2 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 05:24

Unlike Mick making fat jokes about Aretha Franklin a few years ago. Or Keith making derogatory comments about "blind people" during the Toronto gig, or was that Mick? I mean, these guys are great artists, not always perfect people.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: akgameboy ()
Date: March 1, 2011 06:55

Hey over-analyzers, I'm joking about the car wreck, duh. I'm just saying he wouldn't be doing that crap if he knew what it was like. You think I'm really wishing upon a star or something?

Defend Lennon all day if you want, but what he did was pretty jacked up. I'm sure if he did some other rude and offensive stereotypical character, you'd all make up excuses like you are doing in this thread (audience? loosen up????) because you claim the Beatles and Lennon are Gods, greatest band ever, blah blah blah blah blah who cares.

If Charlie Watts ever did something like this, he would lose his status of being the coolest person to ever live.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Wry Cooter ()
Date: March 1, 2011 07:23

Anyone remember Frank Fontaine on the Jackie Gleason Show as Crazy Guggenheim? His whole act was mocking the developmentally delayed (not referred to as that then of course). At the end the bit he'd go into a song -- his hearty baritone not missing a step. Very weird. My old man would get extremely pissed off as he worked with the disabled and mentally challenged. Those were different times for certain!




Crazy Guggenheim.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: ghostryder13 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 07:30

been giving this some though since i was the one who posted that handicapped video in the other thread.i posted it because some tend to see john lennon as some kind of saint. but i'm also going to play devil's advocate here.lennon was an a**hole a hypocrite and a poor excuse for a father but he was human we all have done or said things that were not cool but average people like us do not have our short comings displayed in the media.i'm 43 yrs old and i know for a fact that 20 yrs ago i said and did things that i'm now ashamed of. i've had a chance to grow and learn from my mistakes. i don't think lennon got that chance



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-01 07:32 by ghostryder13.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: deadegad ()
Date: March 1, 2011 07:31

What Lennon did was harmless clowning not automatically making fun of the handicapped yet I am critical of his relationship with Julian.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: whitem8 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 07:46

Quote
ghostryder13
been giving this some though since i was the one who posted that handicapped video in the other thread.i posted it because some tend to see john lennon as some kind of saint. but i'm also going to play devil's advocate here.lennon was an a**hole a hypocrite and a poor excuse for a father but he was human we all have done or said things that were not cool but average people like us do not have our short comings displayed in the media.i'm 43 yrs old and i know for a fact that 20 yrs ago i said and did things that i'm now ashamed of. i've had a chance to grow and learn from my mistakes. i don't think lennon got that chance
Very good post ghostryder. Of course no one is perfect and yes we all do things in our youth that we would be ashamed of now. And lennon certainly apologized many times for the things he did. And yes he wasn't perfect, yet very introspective and willing to learn.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: March 1, 2011 07:59

Quote
deadegad
What Lennon did was harmless clowning not automatically making fun of the handicapped yet I am critical of his relationship with Julian.

Personally, I have plenty to deal with regarding my own faults that it leaves little time for judging the parenting or drug habits of musicians. A young man in his 20s is handed the world - literally - and doesn't conduct himself as a perfect father or husband? Not making excuses, just seems it's pretty easy to view it from the comfort of our living rooms and laptops and make judgments.

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: ghostryder13 ()
Date: March 1, 2011 08:20

plus we a judging someone from the past by today's standards and that's not really fair

Re: OT: Lennon Making Fun Of The Handicapped
Posted by: Bärs ()
Date: March 1, 2011 08:34

I wonder how it felt for these poor crippled children and their parents when they were mocked by their idol for being crippled. The excitement before they show, the expectations of finally having some joy in their lives. And that was what they got.

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