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Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 15:14

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The Greek
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Mathijs
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Amsterdamned
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71Tele
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Mathijs
Mathijs
Ps If not being able to hear Keith on PMS is like stating Keith isn't very prominent on Honky Tonk Women.

Yes, except Mr. Jagger has been known to do a fairly credible 5-string open G Keith imitation.

How important is it to know if Taylor's overdubs are recent or not..it are overdubs btw.
Most important fact is that it is Taylor,both lead and rythm. I wouln't be surprsed if the 3th guitar isn't Taylor too, BTW It's not that difficult to sound like Keith with open G if you are a bit of a guitar player. With all respect for Keith btw,he made the sound popular.mainly by creating great songs..

You continue to post this crap. Why?

The open G rythm guitar on this track is signature Keith. It has the exact phrasing of keith, it has the same sound as various other tracks from the sessions (Tops for example), he's credited for playing it (and the Stones always have been fairly honest in their credits, see Sway and Moonlight Mile on SF), Taylor hasn't played anything in over 40 years that remotely resembles the playing and sound on this track, and he sure wouldn't be capable to pull that off these days.

It's just utter nonsense.

Mathijs
proof in the pudding . Mathijs is right .that rhythm guitar is pure keith .you just have to listen to keith's signature sound which he is world famous for ,as for the lead that's vintage taylor just like Mathijs says like the stones tune tops.

Well, the pudding seems to have a different taste to different people. This kind of 'arguments' don't help to answer the question.

For me the most important fact is Taylor's statement, heard and mentioned by a member up up up here, that he did overdubs on PMS. I see no reason to doubt that statement, with all due respect for the skilled ears of all Stones 'scholars'. It's obvious that Taylor didn't hint to overdubs from about 40 years ago.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: CousinC ()
Date: May 7, 2010 15:29

But, - on the other hand as far as I know we don't have an official comment from Taylor.
So till now it is only people writing it in the net. And a lot has been written so far . .

But, my god, it's only a few chords anyway. We will know about it . .

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 15:46

Quote
CousinC
But, - on the other hand as far as I know we don't have an official comment from Taylor.
So till now it is only people writing it in the net. And a lot has been written so far . .

But, my god, it's only a few chords anyway. We will know about it . .

You're right, it's no big deal after all.

But the discussion about Taylor in the studio and live during 69-74 remains! Keith saying (no official comment from Keith, btw) to Taylor that he's useless in the studio and then later inviting him to play on his own studio album. Does that make sense?

Edit: BTW: Still waiting for any explanation from HM concerning the "bad vibe" issue.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-05-07 15:47 by kleermaker.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: May 7, 2010 15:53

Quote
kleermaker
Quote
The Greek
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Mathijs
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Amsterdamned
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71Tele
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Mathijs
Mathijs
Ps If not being able to hear Keith on PMS is like stating Keith isn't very prominent on Honky Tonk Women.

Yes, except Mr. Jagger has been known to do a fairly credible 5-string open G Keith imitation.

How important is it to know if Taylor's overdubs are recent or not..it are overdubs btw.
Most important fact is that it is Taylor,both lead and rythm. I wouln't be surprsed if the 3th guitar isn't Taylor too, BTW It's not that difficult to sound like Keith with open G if you are a bit of a guitar player. With all respect for Keith btw,he made the sound popular.mainly by creating great songs..

You continue to post this crap. Why?

The open G rythm guitar on this track is signature Keith. It has the exact phrasing of keith, it has the same sound as various other tracks from the sessions (Tops for example), he's credited for playing it (and the Stones always have been fairly honest in their credits, see Sway and Moonlight Mile on SF), Taylor hasn't played anything in over 40 years that remotely resembles the playing and sound on this track, and he sure wouldn't be capable to pull that off these days.

It's just utter nonsense.

Mathijs
proof in the pudding . Mathijs is right .that rhythm guitar is pure keith .you just have to listen to keith's signature sound which he is world famous for ,as for the lead that's vintage taylor just like Mathijs says like the stones tune tops.

Well, the pudding seems to have a different taste to different people. This kind of 'arguments' don't help to answer the question.

For me the most important fact is Taylor's statement, heard and mentioned by a member up up up here, that he did overdubs on PMS. I see no reason to doubt that statement, with all due respect for the skilled ears of all Stones 'scholars'. It's obvious that Taylor didn't hint to overdubs from about 40 years ago.

If Taylor ever made a statement that he did some overdubs it is impossible he is talking about the rhythm track, as that is Keith.

Or, of course, Taylor is stating the same crap as he stated when talking about Can't You Hear Me Knocking, that he did the intro with Keith...

Mathijs

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:01

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Mathijs
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kleermaker
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The Greek
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Mathijs
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Amsterdamned
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71Tele
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Mathijs
Mathijs
Ps If not being able to hear Keith on PMS is like stating Keith isn't very prominent on Honky Tonk Women.

Yes, except Mr. Jagger has been known to do a fairly credible 5-string open G Keith imitation.

How important is it to know if Taylor's overdubs are recent or not..it are overdubs btw.
Most important fact is that it is Taylor,both lead and rythm. I wouln't be surprsed if the 3th guitar isn't Taylor too, BTW It's not that difficult to sound like Keith with open G if you are a bit of a guitar player. With all respect for Keith btw,he made the sound popular.mainly by creating great songs..

You continue to post this crap. Why?

The open G rythm guitar on this track is signature Keith. It has the exact phrasing of keith, it has the same sound as various other tracks from the sessions (Tops for example), he's credited for playing it (and the Stones always have been fairly honest in their credits, see Sway and Moonlight Mile on SF), Taylor hasn't played anything in over 40 years that remotely resembles the playing and sound on this track, and he sure wouldn't be capable to pull that off these days.

It's just utter nonsense.

Mathijs
proof in the pudding . Mathijs is right .that rhythm guitar is pure keith .you just have to listen to keith's signature sound which he is world famous for ,as for the lead that's vintage taylor just like Mathijs says like the stones tune tops.

Well, the pudding seems to have a different taste to different people. This kind of 'arguments' don't help to answer the question.

For me the most important fact is Taylor's statement, heard and mentioned by a member up up up here, that he did overdubs on PMS. I see no reason to doubt that statement, with all due respect for the skilled ears of all Stones 'scholars'. It's obvious that Taylor didn't hint to overdubs from about 40 years ago.

If Taylor ever made a statement that he did some overdubs it is impossible he is talking about the rhythm track, as that is Keith.

Or, of course, Taylor is stating the same crap as he stated when talking about Can't You Hear Me Knocking, that he did the intro with Keith...

Mathijs

grinning smileygrinning smiley

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:01

By the way, do I now understand that the only statement we have that Taylor did some overdubs is the claim that a poster on this board heard him say that?

So, there actually is not any indication at all that Taylor did overdubs? It doesn't sound like overdubs, Keith, Mick and Don Was all deny it, it must have happened about a month before PMS was released, and still we are discussing it like it is true?

Am I getting this right?

I heard from a reliable source that the lyrics where actually from an old poem by Brian Jones. Please discuss.

Mathijs

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Date: May 7, 2010 16:12

<For me the most important fact is Taylor's statement, heard and mentioned by a member up up up here, that he did overdubs on PMS. I see no reason to doubt that statement, with all due respect for the skilled ears of all Stones 'scholars'. It's obvious that Taylor didn't hint to overdubs from about 40 years ago.>

Who doubts that Taylor played on PMS? It's the rhythm track we're talking about here. The track that Amsterdammned claims he/she has proof Taylor did...

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:18

Quote
DandelionPowderman
<For me the most important fact is Taylor's statement, heard and mentioned by a member up up up here, that he did overdubs on PMS. I see no reason to doubt that statement, with all due respect for the skilled ears of all Stones 'scholars'. It's obvious that Taylor didn't hint to overdubs from about 40 years ago.>

Who doubts that Taylor played on PMS? It's the rhythm track we're talking about here. The track that Amsterdammned claims he/she has proof Taylor did...

Read the title of this topic, DP. Keith denies it. Some say MT's overdubs are vintage only. Some deny any MT overdubs. Amsterdamned has stated that he has a reliable source that says that Taylor did also the rhythm part. He said that days ago.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Date: May 7, 2010 16:27

If I should guess, neither Keith's rhythm part or Taylor's lead part are new overdubs. If should be the case, I take back everything I've said about Don Was. Then he's done a fantastic job, making that 70s sound (that nobody manage to get these days) come to live again.

We shouldn't really take everything Taylor says in a hallway after a show for granted, imo.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: His Majesty ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:37

Quote
kleermaker
Edit: BTW: Still waiting for any explanation from HM concerning the "bad vibe" issue.

There will be no explanation.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:40

Quote
DandelionPowderman
If I should guess, neither Keith's rhythm part or Taylor's lead part are new overdubs. If should be the case, I take back everything I've said about Don Was. Then he's done a fantastic job, making that 70s sound (that nobody manage to get these days) come to live again.

We shouldn't really take everything Taylor says in a hallway after a show for granted, imo.

If we don't believe anyone we will never know the truth, except Mathijs of course, because he knows everything concerning the (ex) Rolling Stones. Well, I can live with that. I want to memorize the 'fact' that Keith has said to Taylor that he's useless in the studio and the hard fact that he later invited Taylor to play on his own solo studio album (which also has happened). That seems contradictory to me and makes Keith's 'statement' not credible.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: 1cdog ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:43

I have doubted all along that MT did any over dubs even on PMS.

All of the wishful thinking on the part of MT fans and the Stones, officially, are not going to acknowledge nor deny.

It's free publicity and hype..........and ultimately helps to move CD's/merchandise.

12 separate threads on IORR (a joke within itself) regarding MT's contribution to PMS dissecting every little detail.............Keith says it never even happened........

I like MT and love his live playing with the Stones. That said the rage over 1 track, PMS, was kinda like junkies needing some sort of any kind of a fix.......

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Date: May 7, 2010 16:47

Quote
kleermaker
Quote
DandelionPowderman
If I should guess, neither Keith's rhythm part or Taylor's lead part are new overdubs. If should be the case, I take back everything I've said about Don Was. Then he's done a fantastic job, making that 70s sound (that nobody manage to get these days) come to live again.

We shouldn't really take everything Taylor says in a hallway after a show for granted, imo.

If we don't believe anyone we will never know the truth, except Mathijs of course, because he knows everything concerning the (ex) Rolling Stones. Well, I can live with that. I want to memorize the 'fact' that Keith has said to Taylor that he's useless in the studio and the hard fact that he later invited Taylor to play on his own solo studio album (which also has happened). That seems contradictory to me and makes Keith's 'statement' not credible.

Do you really believe that Keith doesn't appreciate Taylor as the excellent player he is?? Who sent the letter with "thanks for all the turn-ons" to Taylor after he chose to quit? As a stones fan, you should be familiar with Keith's ways and his sense of humour, and don't take that "useless in the studio-story" too seriously. LOL! It amazes me everytime someone takes that bait. Priceless! grinning smiley

BTW, Taylor and Keith also shared the stage in 1986 in NYC at Taylor's show. I have the boot smiling smiley They are friends, collegues and appreciate eachother's work.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Eleanor Rigby ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:49

don't think he said "useless".

I think almost all guitarists have egos. Keith definately has one, and if he was trying to find something that he thought he was better at than Mick Taylor then it would be in the studio....it was just another Keith Richards throw-away line...which he'll bring up every now and then just to let people know not to worship MT as much...as Keith knows what a brilliant player he was...but still hates the fact that MT quit the band.

Probably in the same way that he won't ever admit to saying Mick T contributed to Plundered My Soul....stubborn, ego maniac....

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:51

Quote
Mathijs
By the way, do I now understand that the only statement we have that Taylor did some overdubs is the claim that a poster on this board heard him say that?


Mathijs

As far as I have noticed there'd been three different sources. One poster said that Taylor said that himself in his MySpace, then there is the 'insider story' by one poster, and then the testimony of one postter of hearing it from Taylor's mouth in some recent concert.

- Doxa

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Date: May 7, 2010 16:52

<and then the testimony of one poster of hearing it from Taylor's mouth in some recent concert.>

But he didn't hear Taylor saying Plundered My Soul...

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: hot stuff ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:52

D.P. Well put...Thanks.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Thommie ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:54

So much energy on a non-existing subject?cool smiley

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Anonymous User ()
Date: May 7, 2010 16:58

Quote
Mathijs

Or, of course, Taylor is stating the same crap as he stated when talking about Can't You Hear Me Knocking, that he did the intro with Keith...

Mathijs

Go and ask or tell him. confused smiley

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:00

Quote
DandelionPowderman
<and then the testimony of one poster of hearing it from Taylor's mouth in some recent concert.>

But he didn't hear Taylor saying Plundered My Soul...

Actually he did:

<Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kensbro ()
Date: May 6, 2010 16:51

At Northampton MA, one week ago, MT was asked directly what he had recently overdubbed for the new EOMS release.

I heard him say, simply: "Plundered My Soul".

Luckily, cinnamon girl and I were at the first three shows: Iron Horse, Northampton; Bearsville Theater; Bull Run, Shirley.>

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:03

Quote
His Majesty
Quote
kleermaker
Edit: BTW: Still waiting for any explanation from HM concerning the "bad vibe" issue.

There will be no explanation.

Pity you keep your insight in this matter for yourself.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:08

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
kleermaker
Quote
DandelionPowderman
If I should guess, neither Keith's rhythm part or Taylor's lead part are new overdubs. If should be the case, I take back everything I've said about Don Was. Then he's done a fantastic job, making that 70s sound (that nobody manage to get these days) come to live again.

We shouldn't really take everything Taylor says in a hallway after a show for granted, imo.

If we don't believe anyone we will never know the truth, except Mathijs of course, because he knows everything concerning the (ex) Rolling Stones. Well, I can live with that. I want to memorize the 'fact' that Keith has said to Taylor that he's useless in the studio and the hard fact that he later invited Taylor to play on his own solo studio album (which also has happened). That seems contradictory to me and makes Keith's 'statement' not credible.

Do you really believe that Keith doesn't appreciate Taylor as the excellent player he is?? Who sent the letter with "thanks for all the turn-ons" to Taylor after he chose to quit? As a stones fan, you should be familiar with Keith's ways and his sense of humour, and don't take that "useless in the studio-story" too seriously. LOL! It amazes me everytime someone takes that bait. Priceless! grinning smiley

BTW, Taylor and Keith also shared the stage in 1986 in NYC at Taylor's show. I have the boot smiling smiley They are friends, collegues and appreciate eachother's work.

I don't take that seriously. Mathijs does. Of course I agree with you here.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:11

Quote
Mathijs
Quote
Amsterdamned
Quote
71Tele
Quote
Mathijs
Mathijs
Ps If not being able to hear Keith on PMS is like stating Keith isn't very prominent on Honky Tonk Women.

Yes, except Mr. Jagger has been known to do a fairly credible 5-string open G Keith imitation.

How important is it to know if Taylor's overdubs are recent or not..it are overdubs btw.
Most important fact is that it is Taylor,both lead and rythm. I wouln't be surprsed if the 3th guitar isn't Taylor too, BTW It's not that difficult to sound like Keith with open G if you are a bit of a guitar player. With all respect for Keith btw,he made the sound popular.mainly by creating great songs..

You continue to post this crap. Why?

The open G rythm guitar on this track is signature Keith. It has the exact phrasing of keith, it has the same sound as various other tracks from the sessions (Tops for example), he's credited for playing it (and the Stones always have been fairly honest in their credits, see Sway and Moonlight Mile on SF), Taylor hasn't played anything in over 40 years that remotely resembles the playing and sound on this track, and he sure wouldn't be capable to pull that off these days.

It's just utter nonsense.

Mathijs

Agree with Mathjis here that there is no compelling reason not to believe the credits.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:16

Quote
Eleanor Rigby
don't think he said "useless".

I think almost all guitarists have egos. Keith definately has one, and if he was trying to find something that he thought he was better at than Mick Taylor then it would be in the studio....it was just another Keith Richards throw-away line...which he'll bring up every now and then just to let people know not to worship MT as much...as Keith knows what a brilliant player he was...but still hates the fact that MT quit the band.

Probably in the same way that he won't ever admit to saying Mick T contributed to Plundered My Soul....stubborn, ego maniac....

I guess you're very near the truth, though "ego maniac" is a bit strongly put. I surmise that Keith in fact is the biggest Taylorite of us allcool smiley

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:17

Quote
Mathijs
By the way, do I now understand that the only statement we have that Taylor did some overdubs is the claim that a poster on this board heard him say that?

So, there actually is not any indication at all that Taylor did overdubs? It doesn't sound like overdubs, Keith, Mick and Don Was all deny it, it must have happened about a month before PMS was released, and still we are discussing it like it is true?

Am I getting this right?

I heard from a reliable source that the lyrics where actually from an old poem by Brian Jones. Please discuss.

Mathijs

Now you're going too far. Actually Jagger and Was did not deny it, they did not confirm it either explicitly. A posted here with claimed inside knowledge state that Taylor had gone into the studio with Matt Clifford. That was the first indication here that anything was happening.

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: His Majesty ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:30

Quote
Mathijs
Again a perfect example of a good thread being wasted by the likes of Kleermaker c.s.

[www.iorr.org]


Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Anonymous User ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:30

If someone states Taylor is telling poppycock,than it's the end of the discussion for me. Utterly ignorant,and the height of arrogance.thumbs down

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:41

Quote
His Majesty
Quote
Mathijs
Again a perfect example of a good thread being wasted by the likes of Kleermaker c.s.

[www.iorr.org]


A very enigmatic 'explanation' to me, HM

BTW: Is that you? In any case, no wig (I guess) winking smiley thumbs up

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: Anonymous User ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:45

i think jagger will "play the game with the truth " to drum up record sales .think of it what better way to make some extra sales then to float rumours of new mick taylor overdubs .masters of deception ,just like the non exisent track credits on tattoo you !

Re: Keith says No new MT overdubs!
Posted by: StonesTod ()
Date: May 7, 2010 17:48

Quote
The Greek
.think of what better way to make some extra sales then to float rumours of new mick taylor overdubs .

ok - i will:

lady gaga does 10 duets on all the new numbers

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