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Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: micha063 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 09:50

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
micha063
I have decided to buy the old CBS mix from the 80s. I don't like the new mixes at all. The other stuff is available as MP3. So I'm happy.
I'll try to get more of the CBS mixes. Tatto You sounds great and I guess the others do.too.

This is starting to creep in with some people and it makes zero sense:

TATTOO YOU 2021 is not a new mix. It's not a remix. It's not a different mix.

That one accolade belongs to GOATS HEAD SOUP 2020.

Remix and remaster are just as different as a turtle and a cotton rug.

So, it's about the remastering and there is of course a difference, which you like or not.
And for sure it is not about creeping.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: October 29, 2021 11:03

Quote
Zindy
Quote
Mathijs
Quote
Zindy
Quote
Mathijs
Quote
Zindy
Quote
Mathijs
...The backing track of this new 2021 release of SMU is available in tape traders circles...

Stop pretending you don't have it. When have you ever shared anything here, you can do it now. Or tell your friend Remco to share it.

Remco hasn't taken any orders from me in 25 years.

Mathijs


Quote
GasLightStreet
...
Here.
...

GasLightStreet, not that well-known one. Two more reggae versions exist, one of them turned into the 2021 Early Version. Mathijs elegantly avoided the subject (he has both versions). Maybe you can ask Mathijs if he would like to share, obviously I didn't succeed.

Who are you anyway, and how do you know Remco?

Mathijs

I'm your new friend, please share the other two reggae versions of SMU, I know you've got them. Everybody knows Remco, a true legend.

At least you haven't denied yet.

Nah, I am not into making new friends.

Mathijs

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: ironbelly ()
Date: October 29, 2021 11:21

Ok, let’s do it old fashion way. Anyway, this is Friday.

Blind listening test for different CDs Tattoo You, song is Start Me Up.
I dig six CDs

1. Toshiba-EMI CP35-3032, Japanese only CD from 1983. Matrix: CP35-3032 11. Hub imprint: [CSR COMPACT DISC CSR COMPACT DISC CSR COMPACT DISC].
2. CDCBS 450 198 2, Japan for Europe from 1986. Matrix: DIDP-10580 11A1 +++++
3. Virgin Collectors edition 7243-8-39502-2-5, 1994. Matrix: 39502 01# 03-11-94 SP 1-1-13 EMI JAX
4. UM remaster 2009 2701569. Matrix: 33777-2 2701569/00 INDUSTRIA ARGENTINA (This is cheap Argentinian pressing but digitally it is a clone to any other 2009 re-issue)
5. Japan only ‘flat transfer from original master tapes’, HR cutting 2013, SHM-platinum CD UICY-40002. Matrix: UICY-40002-2 H1T [4xUniversal logo]
6. 2021 remaster from 2CD deluxe edition, 383 494-1. Matrix: [Universal logo] 00602438349425 A0103329982-0101 26 A00

Tracks were ripped by EAC from original CDs in secure mode, no normalization. Rips were converted to FLAC and 1 min samples were prepared.

Afterwards I took a dice and shuffle the samples around, so the number of the sample does not correspond to the number from the list above.

SMU01
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU02
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU03
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU04
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU05
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU06
[www.dropbox.com]


Now you decide which sample sounds the best. Like SMU01 sounds great, SMU02 sounds awful, SMU03 needs more bass etc.

Do not hesitate to express yourself. Play it loud!

Last time I offered a similar test on a song from Sticky Fingers that has a name that should not be mentioned here no one participated. Please, do not tell that you are shy winking smiley. And no audio-analysis tool to be used winking smiley

I’ll post ‘sample number to mastering’ correlation next Monday.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: rebelhipi ()
Date: October 29, 2021 13:30

Ok.

So the Best ones are:
SMU2 (theres that clipping at the start but otherwise great)
SMU5 and SMU3 (similiar sounding maybe SMU5 bit better)
SMU1 (abit louder but still sounds great)

Not good:
SMU6
SMU4 (the worst)

2, 5, 3 and 1 are all acceptable. Matter of preference.

6 and 4 not good at all.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-29 13:33 by rebelhipi.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: mailexile67 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 13:59

What about worldwide charts...Got it reached high position in UK and Us?!

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: bitusa2012 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 14:17

I liked 3 and 2.

1,4,5 and 6 all sounded practically the same to me. Though in truth, 3 and 2 sound pretty damn close to them as well. Maybe it’s just everyone’s ears …

Rod

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: glimmertwin1 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 14:19

OK -

I take # 3 it sounds best to me today.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: October 29, 2021 14:22

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
micha063
I have decided to buy the old CBS mix from the 80s. I don't like the new mixes at all. The other stuff is available as MP3. So I'm happy.
I'll try to get more of the CBS mixes. Tatto You sounds great and I guess the others do.too.

This is starting to creep in with some people and it makes zero sense:

TATTOO YOU 2021 is not a new mix. It's not a remix. It's not a different mix.

That one accolade belongs to GOATS HEAD SOUP 2020.

Remix and remaster are just as different as a turtle and a cotton rug.


The mastering for the commercial release is arguably more important to the listener than the mix itself . [The Mix is to large degree a matter of taste in production.]

Mastering on the other hand [especially with regard to levels and dynamic range] can make the same recording sound absolutely wonderful or totally horrible.

The problem today is simply that commercially released music is mastered primarily to sound impressive on portable devices or smart speakers.
Neither of which can be regarded as remotely "HiFi".

Play that same commercial recording on a decent HiFi and it will just sound hard and relentless, with no natural dynamics or air between the instruments and voices .

I still can't resist buying the new deluxe editions and remasters ...but I've long since stopped hoping that they'll have anything near the musicality of the original vinyl releases .

[I did quite like the Abbey Road half speed mastered BB and the remixed GHS is a good alternative listen .

The Abbey Road boxed set is also quite good in that it's not as compressed and overly loud as other digital remasters.
The set is on the whole very listenable and proves that a decent job can be done with the available flat digital transfers ...if the right decisions are made.

Edited for dyslexic fingers



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-29 14:39 by Spud.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: bitusa2012 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 15:00

Quote
Spud
that a decent job can be done with the available flat digital transfers ...if the right decisions are made.

Edited for dyslexic fingers

So…it should have been LEFT decisions then? :-)

Rod

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: October 29, 2021 15:45

...You're right, I'm left, She's gone ...

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: MisterDDDD ()
Date: October 29, 2021 15:45

The Rolling Stones:

The Rolling Stones x @BostonDynamics
– “Start Me Up” from Tattoo You 2021. Watch the full video at: [the-rolling-stones.lnk.to]…

Thank you to the Boston Dynamics team for making this happen.
[twitter.com]





Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:08

Quote
ironbelly
Quote
TheGreek
Quote
ironbelly
Quote
TheGreek
I just got mine yesterday in the mail , and on the shelf it goes along with the previous Bigger Bang Box set . Unopened , some day maybe ?
Mine already went back for replacement. The outer box was damaged upon arrival. Very poor packaging by amazon and, apparently, reckless delivery by post office. Not to mention a bit stupid construction of the box itself.

Sorry to hear that . Mine came from Walmart who I purchase most of my media from . Never Amazon for the reason you described as I have heard many others with the same concern .
Unfortunately, amazon in many cases is the only cheap option in EU. Most of local retailers had the box priced 135-150€ vs. 109€ on amazon. So, you know...
That makes perfect sense and I take Wally world for granted as I find them to be the cheapest and fastest at getting product to my door . Today I am getting The Wizard of Oz and Grease ,and I just ordered them on Wednesday , talk about fast .

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:13

Quote
MisterDDDD
The Rolling Stones:

The Rolling Stones x @BostonDynamics
– “Start Me Up” from Tattoo You 2021. Watch the full video at: [the-rolling-stones.lnk.to]…

Thank you to the Boston Dynamics team for making this happen.
[twitter.com]




This is my absolute favourite thing today, and it absolutely deserves its own thread. Thank you for sharing.

*Just noticed, they seem to have air brushed Bill Wyman out of the video.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-29 17:15 by treaclefingers.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:13

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: gimme_shelter ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:18

Quote
Zindy
Quote
Mathijs
...The backing track of this new 2021 release of SMU is available in tape traders circles...

Stop pretending you don't have it. When have you ever shared anything here, you can do it now. Or tell your friend Remco to share it.

Ik luister niet naar Zindy's met een z. Dat zijn vaak oplichters.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:34

Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Well if that's how you're listening to it good for you. But that doesn't make everyone else wrong. When I was 14, I remember listening to music that I taped by putting the portable cassette deck next to the FM radio speaker and recording all the top 10 hits onto a 'mixed tape'. I loved the hell out of it, until I put it in a friends ULTRA high end tape deck in his car. It sounded like garbage.

Everything's relative.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: October 29, 2021 17:57

Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Well if that's how you're listening to it good for you. But that doesn't make everyone else wrong. When I was 14, I remember listening to music that I taped by putting the portable cassette deck next to the FM radio speaker and recording all the top 10 hits onto a 'mixed tape'. I loved the hell out of it, until I put it in a friends ULTRA high end tape deck in his car. It sounded like garbage.

Everything's relative.

Obviously that's not how I listen to it today. Point is, enjoy w/out over-analyzing. That can easily be done, it might take some great jedi mind bending to do so, but i think there is hope.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 29, 2021 18:46

Quote
LeonidP
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Well if that's how you're listening to it good for you. But that doesn't make everyone else wrong. When I was 14, I remember listening to music that I taped by putting the portable cassette deck next to the FM radio speaker and recording all the top 10 hits onto a 'mixed tape'. I loved the hell out of it, until I put it in a friends ULTRA high end tape deck in his car. It sounded like garbage.

Everything's relative.

Obviously that's not how I listen to it today. Point is, enjoy w/out over-analyzing. That can easily be done, it might take some great jedi mind bending to do so, but i think there is hope.

LOL

I might point out that you're on a fan message board where every single minutia of this band is pulled aparted, prodded, examined, reassembled, and then 'rinse repeated' over innumerable threads...so many that there's even DUPLICATE and TRIPLICATE threads that have to be merged by the moderator.

So, in that environment even a great jedi warrior can't hope to resist coming to dark side. Keep trying though and may the schwartz be with you!

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: frenki09 ()
Date: October 29, 2021 18:53

I wonder if there's a studio version of Going to a Go-Go. If so, it should have been included here on the this Deluxe Ed.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: georgelicks ()
Date: October 29, 2021 20:31

Tattoo You enters at #7 in the UK ALBUMS CHART.

[www.officialcharts.com]

Sales:
01 30,814 Elton John - The Lockdown Sessions [25,770 physical sales]
02 18,395 Lana Del Rey - Blue Banisters
03 18,381 Duran Duran - FUTURE PAST
04 16,156 Biffy Clyro - The Myth of the Happily Ever After
05 13,667 Coldplay - Music of the Spheres
06 6,962 Adele - 25
07 6,201 The Rolling Stones - Tattoo You
08 5,605 Olivia Rodrigo - SOUR
09 5,587 Mimi Webb - Seven Shades of Heartbreak
10 5,318 Drake - Certified Lover Boy

11 5,292 Self Esteem - Prioritise Pleasure
20 3,543 Queen - Greatest Hits
21 3,526 Dream Theater - A View from the Top of the World
27 2,915 Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds - B-Sides & Rarities: Pt II

42 2,266 Parquet Courts - Sympathy for Life
47 2,135 Sonny Fodera - Wide Awake
68 1,685 Cradle of Filth - Existence Is Futile
73 1,602 Every Time I Die - Radical

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: retired_dog ()
Date: October 29, 2021 20:38

Quote
frenki09
I wonder if there's a studio version of Going to a Go-Go. If so, it should have been included here on the this Deluxe Ed.

As far as I know, not studio version Of Go-Go exists. Just like up until now, no trace of studio versions of other covers they did live ever appeared (Sweet Little 16, Hound Dog, Twenty Flight Rock, Chantilly Lace - to name a few). Some decades ago, rumours claimed that a studio version of Let It Rock from the early 70's exists, but again, so far no trace has ever appeared.

However, I would not totally rule this out. But maybe good soundboards from tour rehearsals is the closest thing we could ever get to a full-blown studio recording.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: October 29, 2021 21:17

Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Well if that's how you're listening to it good for you. But that doesn't make everyone else wrong. When I was 14, I remember listening to music that I taped by putting the portable cassette deck next to the FM radio speaker and recording all the top 10 hits onto a 'mixed tape'. I loved the hell out of it, until I put it in a friends ULTRA high end tape deck in his car. It sounded like garbage.

Everything's relative.

Obviously that's not how I listen to it today. Point is, enjoy w/out over-analyzing. That can easily be done, it might take some great jedi mind bending to do so, but i think there is hope.

LOL

I might point out that you're on a fan message board where every single minutia of this band is pulled aparted, prodded, examined, reassembled, and then 'rinse repeated' over innumerable threads...so many that there's even DUPLICATE and TRIPLICATE threads that have to be merged by the moderator.

So, in that environment even a great jedi warrior can't hope to resist coming to dark side. Keep trying though and may the schwartz be with you!
I feel a shift in the force [www.youtube.com]

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Irix ()
Date: October 29, 2021 21:25

Quote
georgelicks

Tattoo You enters at #7 in the UK ALBUMS CHART.

Germany: #3 - [www.OffizielleCharts.de] .

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Testify ()
Date: October 29, 2021 21:43

... but how awesome is the new version of Start me Up!hot smiley

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: October 29, 2021 23:33

From the crazy lockdown world we've all
been staggerin thru the nine bonus tracks
come rockin out of the dark like a total shot of happiness ....



ROCKMAN

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: retired_dog ()
Date: October 29, 2021 23:42

Quote
Rockman
From the crazy lockdown world we've all
been staggerin thru the nine bonus tracks
come rockin out of the dark like a total shot of happiness ....

Pure poetry in the truest sense of the word...

...and so f***in' true!

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: padre69 ()
Date: October 30, 2021 00:34

Got the double vinyl today.
I love the L&F album! The vinyl sound is a bit too compressed for my taste but I can live with that since the songs are dynamite.

But isn’t Drift Away running way too slow? I think it’s very evident when you listen to Mick’s vocals. I sped up the vinyl by a good notch and I think the vocals started to sound much more natural.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-30 14:43 by padre69.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: micha063 ()
Date: October 30, 2021 00:49

Quote
Spud
...You're right, I'm left, She's gone ...

>grinning smiley<smileys with beersmiling smiley

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: micha063 ()
Date: October 30, 2021 01:07

Quote
ironbelly
Ok, let’s do it old fashion way. Anyway, this is Friday.

Blind listening test for different CDs Tattoo You, song is Start Me Up.
I dig six CDs

1. Toshiba-EMI CP35-3032, Japanese only CD from 1983. Matrix: CP35-3032 11. Hub imprint: [CSR COMPACT DISC CSR COMPACT DISC CSR COMPACT DISC].
2. CDCBS 450 198 2, Japan for Europe from 1986. Matrix: DIDP-10580 11A1 +++++
3. Virgin Collectors edition 7243-8-39502-2-5, 1994. Matrix: 39502 01# 03-11-94 SP 1-1-13 EMI JAX
4. UM remaster 2009 2701569. Matrix: 33777-2 2701569/00 INDUSTRIA ARGENTINA (This is cheap Argentinian pressing but digitally it is a clone to any other 2009 re-issue)
5. Japan only ‘flat transfer from original master tapes’, HR cutting 2013, SHM-platinum CD UICY-40002. Matrix: UICY-40002-2 H1T [4xUniversal logo]
6. 2021 remaster from 2CD deluxe edition, 383 494-1. Matrix: [Universal logo] 00602438349425 A0103329982-0101 26 A00

Tracks were ripped by EAC from original CDs in secure mode, no normalization. Rips were converted to FLAC and 1 min samples were prepared.

Afterwards I took a dice and shuffle the samples around, so the number of the sample does not correspond to the number from the list above.

SMU01
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU02
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU03
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU04
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU05
[www.dropbox.com]

SMU06
[www.dropbox.com]


Now you decide which sample sounds the best. Like SMU01 sounds great, SMU02 sounds awful, SMU03 needs more bass etc.

Do not hesitate to express yourself. Play it loud!

Last time I offered a similar test on a song from Sticky Fingers that has a name that should not be mentioned here no one participated. Please, do not tell that you are shy winking smiley. And no audio-analysis tool to be used winking smiley

I’ll post ‘sample number to mastering’ correlation next Monday.

Great idea!
For me 1 and 2 are great, 3 is ok, 5 is interesting and also very good.
4 is the is boosted and the worst. 6 is also very pushed or boosted but still better than 4.
But I think that most people listen to music on bluetooth speakers or equal gear and for them the boosted masterings are probably ok.

Re: Tattoo You deluxe version
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 30, 2021 01:52

Quote
TheGreek
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
gonzalo76
I wish I could get a vinyl rip, because Stephen Marcussen went too far this time with his "remaster". CDs and digital downloads are briclwalled, compressed, with dynamic range of 5 and 8 for Wembley. People are not listening to music anymore, they are listening to noise.

Nah, people aren't listening to music anymore, instead they are viewing it in these audio-analysis tools.

You're lost about that critique. The ears don't lie about brickwalled remasters.

Which the entire point you seem to have missed: LISTENING.

You seem a little ... blind. How many times are we getting screenshots from someone's wave analyzing tool? I've mentioned it many times - when i started listening to the Stones, I had a small single speaker record player, with crackles and pops, and enjoyed it to no end. 100% people can't get past the 'view' on the audio tools and use that to judge music, I see it with EVERY release. Open your eyes.

Well if that's how you're listening to it good for you. But that doesn't make everyone else wrong. When I was 14, I remember listening to music that I taped by putting the portable cassette deck next to the FM radio speaker and recording all the top 10 hits onto a 'mixed tape'. I loved the hell out of it, until I put it in a friends ULTRA high end tape deck in his car. It sounded like garbage.

Everything's relative.

Obviously that's not how I listen to it today. Point is, enjoy w/out over-analyzing. That can easily be done, it might take some great jedi mind bending to do so, but i think there is hope.

LOL

I might point out that you're on a fan message board where every single minutia of this band is pulled aparted, prodded, examined, reassembled, and then 'rinse repeated' over innumerable threads...so many that there's even DUPLICATE and TRIPLICATE threads that have to be merged by the moderator.

So, in that environment even a great jedi warrior can't hope to resist coming to dark side. Keep trying though and may the schwartz be with you!
I feel a shift in the force [www.youtube.com]

NICE!

Sounded a little compressed though for my taste, however, if you like it please do enjoy!

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