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BN78

I did want to point out that your 1% stat (US population) is off, would be closer to 3.3M or 3.4M people, but nonetheless, 1 life perishing due to this disease is 1 too many.

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Can you cite the source of that data?

TIA.

[www.dailywire.com]

As i said above the Dailywire along with 90% of MSM have done their best to cover up the facts shown by the CDC, the fact remains that the figures we receive are a scam, the CDC found that out of 235000 covid deaths only 15000 were actually covid deaths. The others were already very very sick dying people or people that suffered some sort of accident.

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Can you cite the source of that data?

TIA.

[www.dailywire.com]

As i said above the Dailywire along with 90% of MSM have done their best to cover up the facts shown by the CDC, the fact remains that the figures we receive are a scam, the CDC found that out of 235000 covid deaths only 15000 were actually covid deaths. The others were already very very sick dying people or people that suffered some sort of accident.

Thanks for the reply.

As far as I can tell the reference(s) you point to do not, do not make reference to any figures in 'Britain' that you mention in your original post.

To the best of my understanding the CDC is a USA based organisation and does not primarily deal with data from the UK.

So, again, can you put substance on your claim that "According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Thanks

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Beast
Thanks to BV and DandelionP for giving a Scandi view of the Swedish situation.

The jury is still out for now, but I am sure there will be a few fascinating books published in the years to come on the different approaches to handling the situation and which of them ultimately achieved the best outcomes.

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Can you cite the source of that data?

TIA.

[www.dailywire.com]

As i said above the Dailywire along with 90% of MSM have done their best to cover up the facts shown by the CDC, the fact remains that the figures we receive are a scam, the CDC found that out of 235000 covid deaths only 15000 were actually covid deaths. The others were already very very sick dying people or people that suffered some sort of accident.

Thanks for the reply.

As far as I can tell the reference(s) you point to do not, do not make reference to any figures in 'Britain' that you mention in your original post.

To the best of my understanding the CDC is a USA based organisation and does not primarily deal with data from the UK.

So, again, can you put substance on your claim that "According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Thanks

Yes sorry i got my wires crossed there, USA not Britain, my bad.

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Can you cite the source of that data?

TIA.

[www.dailywire.com]

As i said above the Dailywire along with 90% of MSM have done their best to cover up the facts shown by the CDC, the fact remains that the figures we receive are a scam, the CDC found that out of 235000 covid deaths only 15000 were actually covid deaths. The others were already very very sick dying people or people that suffered some sort of accident.

Thanks for the reply.

As far as I can tell the reference(s) you point to do not, do not make reference to any figures in 'Britain' that you mention in your original post.

To the best of my understanding the CDC is a USA based organisation and does not primarily deal with data from the UK.

So, again, can you put substance on your claim that "According to the government figures in Britain only 6% of covid deaths have been a direct result of covid.

Thanks

Yes sorry i got my wires crossed there, USA not Britain, my bad.

I had to call you out twice on that before you conceded a mistake. "Wires crossed" or disinformation? I wonder which?

Being caught out like that obviously has an impact on the credibility of everything you post.

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IrelandCalling4
The incomprehensible part, at least in Ireland, is the unquestioned, seemingly infallible nature of how cases are collated. No questions, analysis, or debate, is allowed and altering viewpoints are not aired on RTE/TV3. The case numbers are collated purely as a result of the RT-PCR test. Our Deputy Leader, Leo Varadkar (a doctor), tweeted (in his capacity as a doctor) that restrictions cannot be based upon the PCR tests - retrictive measures should only be based upon ICU admittances and deaths. This has been completely disregarded, is not brought up by the press or the Government, as the latest restrictions come when ICU admittances and deaths are miniscule.

This is the aspect I do not understand, why analysing or questioning is discouraged. One of our leading medics, Dr. Martin Feeley, former Clinical Head of Dublin/Monaghan Hospital Group, was sacked from his position after going on TV (the only guest in 6 months on the flagship investigative new show Prime Time to offer a differing view). Among other points, he asked for those in society losing their jobs, their business's, their livelihoods, and their lives (as secondary deaths in this country are thought to be a multiple of the deaths attributed to covid 19), do they also not deserve the respect of having these figures properly analysed? This is a first in our country, and possibly internationally - figures utilised to shut down society, which will have devastating effects, are not debated or analysed. They are accepted as an absolute with no chance at all that they may be incorrect, whether partially or substantially.

The British Medical Journal of the 21st Dec (this is a highly respected publication not given to sensationalism or unconsidered writing) calls into question, or at least points to analysis required, on the validity of the RT-PCR test. That report is worth reading in full, Part IV in full:

"It’s also unclear to what extent people with no symptoms transmit SARS-CoV-2. The only test for live virus is viral culture. PCR and lateral flow tests do not distinguish live virus. No test of infection or infectiousness is currently available for routine use. As things stand, a person who tests positive with any kind of test may or may not have an active infection with live virus, and may or may not be infectious"

- Again, I am simply stating why, if there is doubt on the validity of this test, is it deemed off-limits and its results accepted without question.

I cannot speak for other countries, as I do not know the level of cases 'diagnosed' from this RT-PCR test, I can only speak for this country. I agree with social distancing, I wear the mask, we take additional care around the members of my family in the most at-risk category. But universal lockdows, in this country anyway, is wrong.

ICU admittances, 155 in March when Ireland was not ready for covid 19. Deaths and admittances plumetted to almost zero in late April, and from May to December have not risen in any proportion. This is why so many doctors on twitter are asking how continual lockdown (following a short period of re-opening) can be justified as those policies are not based upon ICU or deaths, they are based entitrely and wholly upon test results from a test that may or may not be correct. Surely analysing this is a fair question when the result is universal.

NPHET (Public Health advisory board) have risen to policy makers in effect, even subverting the Government by leaking information. They admitted to the Cabinet Committee in September that of the 1,700 listed as covid deaths, all had co-morbities, and crucially, that covid may or may not be a predominant or even influencing factor in death. That of course is a crucial difference. But that difference was not reported nor discussed on mainstream TV or print media.

The Central Stats Office figures prove that Ireland had a virtual zero covid from May-September. Average weekly death rate in Ireland is 650 per week (30,000 per year). Average death rate from people with covid 19 was 1.2 per week. ICU admittances fell dramatically in April, and have fluctuated between 15-45 every month since, with most months being 25-35. It was 155 in March. Total ICU capacity is 297, with an additional 100 ICU beds available if needs be. With 1.2 deaths on average, the CSO figures show that suicide rate in every month May-September was approximately 4 times that of covid 19 related deaths. Yet we had daily apocalyptic news briefings, lockdowns..etc. One of the doctors who spoke out with these facts, was sacked from his position as Head of ShannonDoc facility here in the West.

My neighbour is a Manager at the largest hospital in this region, and has said the hospital has been at full capacity every year except for2020. The 99k cancelled Cervical checks, the tens of thousands of cancelled cancer checks, the tens of thousands of postponed treatments for cancer, lung/heart/liver and respiratory diseases, will lead to secondary deaths far in excess of covid 19.

The CSO figures in black and white display covid 19 as minimal since May, but this has not or will not be discussed or detailed on any mainstream platform. The RT-PCR test, declared by the Lisbon Court of Appeal on 11/11 as illegal to order someone to quarantine if it has a cycle threshold (CT) value of above 30. To my knowledge the only European Court to do so.

Is it not worth asking the question; as Dr. Feeley did here and as NPHET were asked by the Cabinet Committee - why are we not mandating CT results with these positive results, as the higher the CT the more arguable, ambiguous, and potentially incorrect the result is. Our best friends here lost their business last month, and are probably going to lose their home, they submitted an FOI request to the HSE to declare what the CT value is for all tests, and why the CT value is not being made known. IF a large enough percentage of 'cases' positive have a CT of 40-45 those results are possibly meaningless and they are not infectious nor carrying active, replicating virus.

Family members are in the at-risk category, but they feel the suppression of any questioning, or any meaningful analysis of these figures, which are being used wholly to implements lockdown's, is wrong. We take the additional care measures, social distance, wear masks, but what is happening here - universal lockdown, censorship, supression of altering views or thoughts - even they feel is wrong. Questioning surely will add more understanding to the actual figures, and whether they are right, or whether they are wrong, and to what degree.

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bleedingman
@IrelandCalling4, your post was very well-written but you will never change anyone's mind regarding this. Everyone's opinion is set in stone. I've been exposed to people who tested positive several times and I'm fine (and so are they). Anyway, thanks for a great post.

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stone4ever
You have to be kidding, I've pointed out so many things and you point out something that was a fact but was based on the USA not Britain, it's the same virus. Go on mate play your games, believe that the WHO and the CDC give you all the facts, don't question Wikki, base reality on your fact checkers, see where that gets you, good luck with that, they couldn't possibly be lying to you, these good people are above all that.

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stone4ever
A lot of really sick old people in hospitals were sent into care homes to make room for expected covid patients, was it any wonder why so many elderly very sick people died earlier this year, add to that being confined to their rooms and also being unable to receive visits from love ones.
This was an cruel decision to move these patient's and was the policy of multiple governments across the world.

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daspyknows
^ That is absurd. Old people kicked out of hospitals to care homes/jails? Where did you hear that?

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Big Al

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daspyknows
^ That is absurd. Old people kicked out of hospitals to care homes/jails? Where did you hear that?

This is happening. I suspect it is because the National Health Service fears it’ll become overwhelmed once more.

[www.google.co.uk]

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CaptainCorella

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Big Al

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daspyknows
^ That is absurd. Old people kicked out of hospitals to care homes/jails? Where did you hear that?

This is happening. I suspect it is because the National Health Service fears it’ll become overwhelmed once more.

[www.google.co.uk]

Did you actually read the article?

No-one's getting "kicked out" of anywhere. It's a report about patients who are recovering/have recovered from COVID needing somewhere very (my emphasis) appropriate to be sent to for what used to be called convalescence.

Readers of the article should be pleased at the advanced planning and not alarmed at the prospect.

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yorkshirestone
Fantastic news re Oxford vaccine - [www.bbc.co.uk]

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yorkshirestone
Fantastic news re Oxford vaccine - [www.bbc.co.uk]

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CaptainCorella

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yorkshirestone
Fantastic news re Oxford vaccine - [www.bbc.co.uk]

Not wanting to rain too much on the parade...

The big criticisms of the two prior vaccines (Pfizer and Moderna) are that they need to be stored at "problematic" low temperatures and that 2 doses are needed.

Whilst this vaccine emphatically is more practical - storage in a bog standard fridge - it still needs two doses.

Second dose about 3 months after the first, and that in practice will be quite hard to happen in the real world.

Mind you there's a third advantage.... it's (genuinely) being manufactured in Melbourne. Rumours that it's being made in Rockman's attic have been denied at the highest levels of Government.

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Chris Fountain
This truly a sad story. And this is why I take this pandemic very, very seriously.

[www.foxnews.com]

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
A lot of really sick old people in hospitals were sent into care homes to make room for expected covid patients, was it any wonder why so many elderly very sick people died earlier this year, add to that being confined to their rooms and also being unable to receive visits from love ones.
This was an cruel decision to move these patient's and was the policy of multiple governments across the world.

Please cite actual verifiable source(s).

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Beast

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CaptainCorella

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stone4ever
A lot of really sick old people in hospitals were sent into care homes to make room for expected covid patients, was it any wonder why so many elderly very sick people died earlier this year, add to that being confined to their rooms and also being unable to receive visits from love ones.
This was an cruel decision to move these patient's and was the policy of multiple governments across the world.

Please cite actual verifiable source(s).

The unfortunate truth is that stone4ever is correct about what happened earlier on in the UK. Back in March/April, older hospital patients were discharged into care homes without first being tested for Covid, which is why the virus spread and killed so many people living and working in those settings, especially as PPE at the time was either not provided at all or was inadequate.

[www.theguardian.com]

[www.theguardian.com]

[www.theguardian.com]

[www.independent.co.uk]

[www.telegraph.co.uk]