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Bliss
I think a brutal beating in which a woman was blinded and left for dead must be pretty rare in that small village. She was known to have been a driver for the Stones and was saying she had information.

I don't really know the story, I am just pointing out that it hardly proves anything. Women get beat up by a jealous, controlling ex-boyfriend ... or I assume she was into drugs ... or it could have been revenge of a previous incident.... or some other reason.

Furthermore, if the implication is that she was targeted because she had info, then why didn't they kill her? Or if they thought they did and she lived, they didn't try again. And did she name her attackers? Or see them? Were they identified? Seems a stretch to think she was beaten to cover up info about Brian.

Personally, I'm less concerned with the burden of proof than being entertained. If Paul tells me a load of stories about Brian and suggests that the band or those around them behaved like The Corleone Family, I'm interested because it's entertaining. It's the last chance for a shadowy mystique of darkness and danger for a band that most here deride as a Vegas act.

If Mathijs or anyone else cares to debunk the stories, I'm equally interested. Using Mathijs or Doxa as examples, I don't have to agree with their opinions so much as I love reading their passion when stating them. I might think a certain keyboard part is Billy Preston, but someone here is convinced it is Nicky playing clavinet. It makes for interesting reading. I don't distinguish much between conspiracies over Brian or who plays what instrument on a particular track. It's all worthwhile reading because it makes me re-evaluate what I previously thought I knew as fact. It's how the viewpoints are expressed that differ from mine that make visiting here worthwhile.

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

Valid observation. But covered up by whom - the police, the courts? How was the decision made that his death was from misadventure? Frank running back to the house to grab a towel while Brian is at the bottom of the pool doesn't look too good. Not sure if any photos (for evidence) were taken of the (possible) crime scene?

Didnt someone sell off all the pool tiles for big $$$ bucks ???



ROCKMAN

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

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Doxa
Funny though, I am looking at the moment documentary "Nothing Like A Dame" about British actresses Maggie Smith, Judi Dench, Eileen Etkins and Joan Plowright, based on pretty much on the 60's, and they use there Stones tunes - "Not Fade Away" and YA-YA'S "Honky Tonk Women" - as a soundtrack. But with Brian Jones documentary that is not possible... I know the reasons (I think), but still it is a bit silly...

- Doxa

The producers of the Brian Jones documentary couldn't afford the licensing of Stones tracks. Simple.

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His Majesty

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Doxa
Funny though, I am looking at the moment documentary "Nothing Like A Dame" about British actresses Maggie Smith, Judi Dench, Eileen Etkins and Joan Plowright, based on pretty much on the 60's, and they use there Stones tunes - "Not Fade Away" and YA-YA'S "Honky Tonk Women" - as a soundtrack. But with Brian Jones documentary that is not possible... I know the reasons (I think), but still it is a bit silly...

- Doxa

The producers of the Brian Jones documentary couldn't afford the licensing of Stones tracks. Simple.

Why did they play I'm Not Signifying, then?

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DandelionPowderman


Why did they play I'm Not Signifying, then?

You sure it's the Stones?

If so, I would assume licensing ABKCO Stones costs a lot more than Polydor Stones.

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His Majesty

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Doxa
Funny though, I am looking at the moment documentary "Nothing Like A Dame" about British actresses Maggie Smith, Judi Dench, Eileen Etkins and Joan Plowright, based on pretty much on the 60's, and they use there Stones tunes - "Not Fade Away" and YA-YA'S "Honky Tonk Women" - as a soundtrack. But with Brian Jones documentary that is not possible... I know the reasons (I think), but still it is a bit silly...

- Doxa

The producers of the Brian Jones documentary couldn't afford the licensing of Stones tracks. Simple.

Or the licensing was denied by the holders.

Mathijs



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-04 18:13 by Mathijs.

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Mathijs


Or the licensing was denied by the holders.

Mathijs

I asked awhile ago, it was costs.

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His Majesty

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DandelionPowderman


Why did they play I'm Not Signifying, then?

You sure it's the Stones?

If so, I would assume licensing ABKCO Stones costs a lot more than Polydor Stones.

Yep, Exile version.

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DandelionPowderman

Yep, Exile version.

According to end credits it's Greg Prevost.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-05 00:43 by His Majesty.

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

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LeonidP

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

But you would be amazed how many people shut up (for good) by just a verbal threat or getting beat up! The Mafia sometimes just breaks your legs and if there is a second time then the cement mixer is bought in...

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2000 LYFH

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LeonidP

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

But you would be amazed how many people shut up (for good) by just a verbal threat or getting beat up! The Mafia sometimes just breaks your legs and if there is a second time then the cement mixer is bought in...

Sounds like nonsense, sorry. For one, its not the mafia. And for two, supposedly it was an attempt to kill. Now the person has multiple reasons to get this person locked up, info on a previous death, and now attempted murder. The mafia is not going to count on a person being now too scared to talk and leave it to chance.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-04 21:17 by LeonidP.

ROCKMAN

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2000 LYFH

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LeonidP

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

But you would be amazed how many people shut up (for good) by just a verbal threat or getting beat up! The Mafia sometimes just breaks your legs and if there is a second time then the cement mixer is bought in...

That happens a lot in movies, yes.

Mathijs

.... relax ....
due to Covid theres a shortage of cement-mixer drivers ....



ROCKMAN

I read an old story that after Brian left the band, he still could have owned the name "Rolling Stones", was paid pretty much big money but refused to let them use the name. Mick and Keith came up to offer him more but he still would not let them use it because it was his band, he owned the right to it and stuff like this. Keith got angered and pull a knife on him. Then they left and the days after that, Brian was dead.

By 1969, it'd been clear for years that he was not interested in playing with the band anymore. He would barely show up. His part in recording process had gotten so minor it's hard to distinguish sometimes. Why would he want to do that to his former bandmates especially when given money and offered more. He knew how much it meant to them. They weren't close any longer and there were lot of fights between them but I don't believe Brian was such an ass to put a stop to them being "The Rolling Stones".

And where did you read that?

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Mathijs

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2000 LYFH

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LeonidP

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

But you would be amazed how many people shut up (for good) by just a verbal threat or getting beat up! The Mafia sometimes just breaks your legs and if there is a second time then the cement mixer is bought in...

That happens a lot in movies, yes.

Mathijs

You spelled Documentaries wrong.... But we all know that organization really doesn't exist...

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2000 LYFH

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Mathijs

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2000 LYFH

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LeonidP

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Mathijs

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Bliss
The brutal beating of Joan Fitzsimons indicates that Brian was murdered and it was covered up.

But where did she came up from? A total unknown for 50 years, and now suddenly she was a 'taxi driver' and 'known to drive the Stones around' and 'knows more about the killing of Brian Jones' and 'partner of Frank Thorogood'. I find this amazing. Internet knows only one thing: she was a taxi driver from the Chichester area who was assaulted by her jealous partner, who was then convicted to 4 years jail and after serving his sentence extradited from the UK to his original country.

Mathijs

And to those convinced they attempted to kill her because she "knew something" ... well she didn't die then, and lived until 2001, so she still "knew something" for all those remaining 30+ years, and they didn't try to kill her again?

Sorry, I don't buy it.

But you would be amazed how many people shut up (for good) by just a verbal threat or getting beat up! The Mafia sometimes just breaks your legs and if there is a second time then the cement mixer is bought in...

That happens a lot in movies, yes.

Mathijs

You spelled Documentaries wrong.... But we all know that organization really doesn't exist...

I don't want to be a fly in the ointment here, but we're talking about England in the 60s.

I reckon the UK mafia was on par with the UK Angels, compared to what was going on in the US and in Italy

Well the Kray twins were no slouches when it came to the old ultra violence. Not sure if they had any connection to the music industry but David Bailey photographed the wedding of one of them.

Yep. That's them - Ronnie and Reggie. One of them was diagnosed as paranoid schizophrenic. James Fox also got tips/advice from one of them when preparing for his role in Performance.

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Mariuana
I read an old story that after Brian left the band, he still could have owned the name "Rolling Stones", was paid pretty much big money but refused to let them use the name. Mick and Keith came up to offer him more but he still would not let them use it because it was his band, he owned the right to it and stuff like this. Keith got angered and pull a knife on him. Then they left and the days after that, Brian was dead.

'I read an old story'....which is utter bullshit.

The band's name was owned by all 5 until Jones was sacked from the band in agreement of a fixed amount of income for as long as the Stones would exist. In 1970 they registered it as a trade mark with the four original members as owners. After Wyman left they rearranged the ownership of Promopub completely so that Jagger, Richards and Watts are directors of the company, owning the rights to all matter Stones.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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Mariuana
I read an old story that after Brian left the band, he still could have owned the name "Rolling Stones", was paid pretty much big money but refused to let them use the name. Mick and Keith came up to offer him more but he still would not let them use it because it was his band, he owned the right to it and stuff like this. Keith got angered and pull a knife on him. Then they left and the days after that, Brian was dead.

'I read an old story'....which is utter bullshit.

The band's name was owned by all 5 until Jones was sacked from the band in agreement of a fixed amount of income for as long as the Stones would exist. In 1970 they registered it as a trade mark with the four original members as owners. After Wyman left they rearranged the ownership of Promopub completely so that Jagger, Richards and Watts are directors of the company, owning the rights to all matter Stones.

Mathijs

I thought Ronnie around 1990 became a full member? Is there a difference between being a full member and a full member/owner?

What happened to Charlie's ownership piece? Stay in his family or are Mick and Keith the only owners now?

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Mariuana
I read an old story that after Brian left the band, he still could have owned the name "Rolling Stones", was paid pretty much big money but refused to let them use the name. Mick and Keith came up to offer him more but he still would not let them use it because it was his band, he owned the right to it and stuff like this. Keith got angered and pull a knife on him. Then they left and the days after that, Brian was dead.

By 1969, it'd been clear for years that he was not interested in playing with the band anymore. He would barely show up. His part in recording process had gotten so minor it's hard to distinguish sometimes. Why would he want to do that to his former bandmates especially when given money and offered more. He knew how much it meant to them. They weren't close any longer and there were lot of fights between them but I don't believe Brian was such an ass to put a stop to them being "The Rolling Stones".

That story you mention is 100% crap. Brian first of all didn't own the name Rolling Stones any way legally. He only came up with the name (even still without the "g"!) and the others (maybe apart from Ian Stewart) agreed. Brian was the unwritten leader of the band, which basically meant that he was the spokesman for a while. He did some things together with Oldham, who was accepted by all as their manager. Nothing official additionally that would allow for any legal action of any kind.
Off course the whole history is a sad one, that any Stones fan in those days good badly do without. The possitive tone it that after almost 60 years the Rolling Stones are still alive and kicking and ... no real Rolling Stones fan has forgotten Brian. He is just as "alive" as the band itself



I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town

Brian Jones' House
The 15th Century farmhouse at Hartfield, Sussex,
owned by Brian Jones of the Rolling Stones, the morning
after the musician was found dead in the swimming pool, 3rd July 1969.



ROCKMAN

1969, Hartfield, Ashdown Forest, Sussex

An aerial view of the farmhouse and pool, where
Ex-Rolling Stones guitarist Brian Jones died
mysteriously while having a midnight swim on 3rd July1969



ROCKMAN