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Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: keithsman ()
Date: February 21, 2019 00:46

Quote
Witness
Quote
keithsman
Quote
Hairball
"we have Mick mixes and Keith mixes of many of the new tunes"

Pretty sure which versions I'd prefer, but will keep an open mind.
Maybe they should release two albums at once - a Keith version and a Mick version - make everybody happy!

Keep an open mind, yes, but it's beginning to look obvious that Mick has problems delivering decent goods that are fit for distribution.
I honestly don't understand why Mick and Keith don't finish off the volumes of tracks that must be left over from previous albums over the decades.
There are many circulating on youtube too, it's a pity these unfinished tracks will never be released. I just don't understand why Mick keeps writing demos that are not acceptable for a Stones album. I know he says he is writing all the time, but what is he writing ?, England Lost part 2, 3, and 4 perhaps confused smiley

That judgement of quality not completely isolated from the poster's own preferences, one will gather. winking smiley

Acceptability for a Stones album as well, it is obviously Keith's judgement once again which is the reference. If for some or even many posters and readers that would be a good measuring stick, it will not be the case for some others.

At least for these others, a lacking ability on Mick's part to come up with musical ideas is not a relevant proposal then. That explanation is contested.

I for one will rather assume that a difficult Keith is a much more relevant explanation. Mentionned in another post. . That is, "the stumbling block" hypothesis is quite interesting.

Fair enough, Keith has been known to be difficult,( not sure he's particularly difficult towards Mick in the studio ) but am i right in thinking the last few Stones albums have been dominated by Mick. I think that most agree the Stones albums of late have been Mick solo albums with a few tracks from Keith on them.

The 14 year absence of a Stones album isn't the only problem regarding Mick, but for a few collaborations it's 27 years since Mick wrote a solo album, it doesn't make sense for Mick to say he is continually writing without any product.
I don't think Keith is the only awkward Glimmer twin either, Mick has a reputation of being hard to work with also, Jeff Beck and others have expressed difficulty in working with Mick.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Witness ()
Date: February 21, 2019 01:06

Quote
keithsman
Quote
Witness
Quote
keithsman
Quote
Hairball
"we have Mick mixes and Keith mixes of many of the new tunes"

Pretty sure which versions I'd prefer, but will keep an open mind.
Maybe they should release two albums at once - a Keith version and a Mick version - make everybody happy!

Keep an open mind, yes, but it's beginning to look obvious that Mick has problems delivering decent goods that are fit for distribution.
I honestly don't understand why Mick and Keith don't finish off the volumes of tracks that must be left over from previous albums over the decades.
There are many circulating on youtube too, it's a pity these unfinished tracks will never be released. I just don't understand why Mick keeps writing demos that are not acceptable for a Stones album. I know he says he is writing all the time, but what is he writing ?, England Lost part 2, 3, and 4 perhaps confused smiley

That judgement of quality not completely isolated from the poster's own preferences, one will gather. winking smiley

Acceptability for a Stones album as well, it is obviously Keith's judgement once again which is the reference. If for some or even many posters and readers that would be a good measuring stick, it will not be the case for some others.

At least for these others, a lacking ability on Mick's part to come up with musical ideas is not a relevant proposal then. That explanation is contested.

I for one will rather assume that a difficult Keith is a much more relevant explanation. Mentionned in another post. . That is, "the stumbling block" hypothesis is quite interesting.

Fair enough, Keith has been known to be difficult,( not sure he's particularly difficult towards Mick in the studio ) but am i right in thinking the last few Stones albums have been dominated by Mick. I think that most agree the Stones albums of late have been Mick solo albums with a few tracks from Keith on them.

The 14 year absence of a Stones album isn't the only problem regarding Mick, but for a few collaborations it's 27 years since Mick wrote a solo album, it doesn't make sense for Mick to say he is continually writing without any product.
I don't think Keith is the only awkward Glimmer twin either, Mick has a reputation of being hard to work with also, Jeff Beck and others have expressed difficulty in working with Mick.

One vital difficulty about Keith obviously concerns his veto policy towards musical ideas, which Mick comes up with. That simply makes a major delaying obstacle for recording a studio album by the band

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: February 21, 2019 01:17

What goes for trolling I think much worse case than of someone defending DIRTY WORK a bit way too much is that of someone spoiling about every thread by turning it into another episode in Glimmer Twins soap opera. Makes me wonder if there is any other way to view or dig the Stones than matching it by the lenghts of Mick or Keith's dicks? Everything always needs to be someone's "fault" or "achievement" by the expense of the other. That of personally liking or appreciating more, say, a singer or a guitarist, or solo music by either of them, has long ago left the realm of common sense (and that of normal discussion in changing varying opinions based on different tastes), and having turned into some sort of ideology through which to evaluate and see and moralize everything. Grown up men! About music!

I curse Jane Rose what she has done to the Rolling Stones fans.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-21 01:23 by Doxa.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: February 21, 2019 01:32

Mick mixes and Keith mixes...

We've already got a few things finished and mixed, because the ten tracks on Some Girls comprise the bare minimum. In actual fact we recorded something like 42 tracks in Paris, and although some of it isn't finished it all has the same basic feel... There's also a really good finished track called Everything's Turning to Gold and both Hang Fire and So Young are mixed and ready.
- Keith Richards, July 1978

(T)he tracks were too similar! That's why I screamed. I was the maniac on that album, always complaining, always going to battle. It's more difficult to get people to go along with certain ideas now because it's become such a @#$%& organization. If you're the odd one out who speaks out and says, Look, I know we can do that song better, they they turn around and say, Everybody loves it. And you end up being the agitator, the paranoiac, you know... What's HE on?
- Keith Richards, 1981

[timeisonourside.com]

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: February 21, 2019 01:35

Quote
Doxa
What goes for trolling I think much worse case than of someone defending DIRTY WORK a bit way too much is that of someone spoiling about every thread by turning it into another episode in Glimmer Twins soap opera. Makes me wonder if there is any other way to view or dig the Stones than matching it by the lenghts of Mick or Keith's dicks? Everything always needs to be someone's "fault" or "achievement" by the expense of the other. That of personally liking or appreciating more, say, a singer or a guitarist, or solo music by either of them, has long ago left the realm of common sense (and that of normal discussion in changing varying opinions based on different tastes), and having turned into some sort of ideology through which to evaluate and see and moralize everything. Grown up men! About music!

I curse Jane Rose what she has done to the Rolling Stones fans.

- Doxa

Don't you know that Mick's singing on Streets Of Love is better than Keith's playing on Memory Motel?

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: nonfilter ()
Date: February 21, 2019 04:33

Haven’t Mick mixes and Keith mixes been standard operating procedure for decades? I’ve been consumed with this band since I was 12 years old, and everything I’ve ever read about the making of their albums from the early 70s forward has mentioned Mick and Keith doing mixes separately and then getting together to decide whose to use. They don’t hate each other. They’re both rich as f***. They don’t have to work together. I’d hate to see the mick mixes vs Keith mixes get as out of hand as Mick using the word “meeting”. I would assume when a band that generates as much revenue as The Rolling Stones releases a new album, several meetings take place.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-21 04:34 by nonfilter.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: February 21, 2019 05:34

Interesting article from Vanity Fair in 2016 that covers alot of territory written by Rich Cohen who covered the Stones in the '90's, and worked with Mick on 'Vinyl'.

Inside Mick Jagger and Keith Richards’s Five-Decade Bromance

Keith and Mick

"In the end, there is sentiment, then there is business. In other words, when you see Mick and Keith onstage, leaning together like Butch and Sundance, you’re seeing actors. Many of us fell in love with the band because they were a gang. At the center of that gang were the blood brothers, Mick and Keith. Their friendship was rock ‘n’ roll. The songs being written together only amplified that point, for what is more intimate than co-writing?
But what happens when that friendship dies? What does it do to the music"?


_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-21 05:35 by Hairball.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: MisterDDDD ()
Date: February 21, 2019 06:00

Good lawd..
Thread is a dumpster fire.

Just when you think the adolescent suppositions regarding their personal relationship has been beaten to death, an article gets dug up to beat the horse some more. Good times.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: February 21, 2019 07:09

I was trying to find the quote from Mick saying Keith can be difficult in the studio, and stumbled upon that article which is less than three years old and one which I've never read. Seems relevant to some of the preceding posts, and the writer does have some firsthand knowledge working with the Stones - especially with Mick. Bottom line, it's his personal perspective and it does provide some food for thought, though for some it's intolerable and unjustified criticism bordering on blasphemy against their band. God forbid he (or anyone else) says something unfavorable about the Stones! Burn him at the stake!

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: 24FPS ()
Date: February 21, 2019 07:49

Quote
GasLightStreet
Mick mixes and Keith mixes...

We've already got a few things finished and mixed, because the ten tracks on Some Girls comprise the bare minimum. In actual fact we recorded something like 42 tracks in Paris, and although some of it isn't finished it all has the same basic feel... There's also a really good finished track called Everything's Turning to Gold and both Hang Fire and So Young are mixed and ready.
- Keith Richards, July 1978

(T)he tracks were too similar! That's why I screamed. I was the maniac on that album, always complaining, always going to battle. It's more difficult to get people to go along with certain ideas now because it's become such a @#$%& organization. If you're the odd one out who speaks out and says, Look, I know we can do that song better, they they turn around and say, Everybody loves it. And you end up being the agitator, the paranoiac, you know... What's HE on?
- Keith Richards, 1981

[timeisonourside.com]

Uh, looks like the rest of the group was right. Some Girls was their last great, coherent album. Every song fits together somehow. (Even if Lies was replaced by what should have been there, 'Claudine'. Which was a stronger cut)
Hang Fire doesn't sound right for the album. It's really not that good to begin with. And So Young is absolutely fantastic. A Primo Stones cut, sleazy, so louche. But it doesn't fit on Some Girls.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: IanBillen ()
Date: February 21, 2019 08:13

Quote
Hairball
"we have Mick mixes and Keith mixes of many of the new tunes"

Pretty sure which versions I'd prefer, but will keep an open mind.
Maybe they should release two albums at once - a Keith version and a Mick version - make everybody happy!



____________________________



Hahahahahah!!! That's good (though I don't think it will happen .. that's good ..and almost something that intrigues me).

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: runrudolph ()
Date: February 21, 2019 08:24

Quote
Hairball
"we have Mick mixes and Keith mixes of many of the new tunes"

Pretty sure which versions I'd prefer, but will keep an open mind.
Maybe they should release two albums at once - a Keith version and a Mick version - make everybody happy!

Yeah..that should be quite interesting.
Jeroen

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: February 21, 2019 13:24

It took FOREVER. I started writing a ton of songs last summer, then Charlie and I did a few demos. Some of them came out of that. Some had been written before. Then we recorded a whole lot of newer things, which weren't really complete. THEN, we went back and more or less chose the ones we started with. I mean, it was just so haphazard and slapdash. Too much work was made out of it. I think Parkinson's disease or whatever sets in if you've got no real cutoff date, 'cause you just keep going until you've done EVERYTHING you can possibly think of. And then you say, well, great, but now we've got 40 songs, some of which are good and some of which COULD be good if only they were, you know, DIFFERENT. At the end, you think, Jesus, WHERE am I? It's STUPID. That's a DUMB way of doing it. We DO have a lot of material, admittedly, but that's NOT the point. The point is that it took 2 years to get it. You could've easily made it in nine months. Nobody had any proper vision of it. NOBODY @#$%& knew where they were going. That includes me. You get bored with things very quickly. My attention span is so limited. You know, I just love to make up songs and I don't even like to finish the words. I just like to sing ooooh all the way through. And then I'm happy after that. I don't want to do anymore. That's IT. I don't even want to hear it again.
- Mick Jagger, 1980

That was of creating EMOTIONAL RESCUE, and I think what Mick said about it, is not far from what he might say of the upcoming album...grinning smiley

The quote derives from the same site GasLightStreet picked up the two Keith quotes above, [www.timeisonourside.com]. (Actually there is a plenty of interesting quotes about creating albums. Especially for those interested in the tension between Mick and Keith, the ones about EMOTIONAL RESCUE, UNDERCOVER and DIRTY WORK are highly recommended.)


- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-21 13:32 by Doxa.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: jlowe ()
Date: February 21, 2019 13:42

Well, nothing much has changed then!
Shame they haven't got a record label pressurising them to get the job done.
It's odd really, most Stones tracks sound as though very little time has been spent on them. That's part of their charm. Didn't Keith once say 'its music from the groin, not the head'......or something similar.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: runrudolph ()
Date: February 21, 2019 14:45

Its a shame the Stones obviously dont have the intention to deliver really good albums anymore like they did in the 60s and 70s.
Sad ..really
Jeroen

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: rollmops ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:07

I love that the discussion is at 303 pages; lot of interesting ideas, interviews' excepts extracted, lot of passion about the stones. I hope they never release the new record and we keep talking about it for ever (twilightZone soundtrack needed)

Rockandroll,
Mops

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:17

This thread is a procrastinator's wet dream. Or the synopsis to "Seinfeld". Is it true it was once started by a Russian troll plant?

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: matxil ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:34

Quote
jlowe
Well, nothing much has changed then!
Shame they haven't got a record label pressurising them to get the job done.
It's odd really, most Stones tracks sound as though very little time has been spent on them. That's part of their charm. Didn't Keith once say 'its music from the groin, not the head'......or something similar.

Why would any record company pressure them? Records don't make money. Concerts make money. And all kinds of by-products make money. T-shirts with the Stones logo are everywhere but I bet most of the people wearing them don't have a single album of the Stones.

Mick bringing out those two songs a year ago made more sense than going through the whole messy business of making an entire album that nobody buys anyway. It's an out-dated concept.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: matxil ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:38

Quote
rollmops
I love that the discussion is at 303 pages; lot of interesting ideas, interviews' excepts extracted, lot of passion about the stones. I hope they never release the new record and we keep talking about it for ever (twilightZone soundtrack needed)

Rockandroll,
Mops

Maybe they did bring out a new album already but they didn't do any publicity about it, so this thread could go on.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:40

Quote
matxil

Quote
jlowe
Mick bringing out those two songs a year ago made more sense than going through the whole messy business of making an entire album that nobody buys anyway. It's an out-dated concept.[/[/b]quote]

That's probably true...but how very sad.sad smiley

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Maindefender ()
Date: February 21, 2019 15:41

(From Georgelicks)The people at Universal are not even asking about the new album anymore, they know that the Stones are working on it and no one is expecting anything during the next 6-8 months at least, the expectations were high earlier last year but the band was not happy with the results so they are working on it again and they'll work again after the tour.

This is the best news IMO. The new album should be called Pot Of Gold

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: keithsman ()
Date: February 21, 2019 16:41

Quote
jlowe
Well, nothing much has changed then!
Shame they haven't got a record label pressurising them to get the job done.
It's odd really, most Stones tracks sound as though very little time has been spent on them. That's part of their charm. Didn't Keith once say 'its music from the groin, not the head'......or something similar.

Yes Keith said this music is about the neck down,

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: jlowe ()
Date: February 21, 2019 16:52

Quote
matxil
Quote
jlowe
Well, nothing much has changed then!
Shame they haven't got a record label pressurising them to get the job done.
It's odd really, most Stones tracks sound as though very little time has been spent on them. That's part of their charm. Didn't Keith once say 'its music from the groin, not the head'......or something similar.

Why would any record company pressure them? Records don't make money. Concerts make money. And all kinds of by-products make money. T-shirts with the Stones logo are everywhere but I bet most of the people wearing them don't have a single album of the Stones.

Mick bringing out those two songs a year ago made more sense than going through the whole messy business of making an entire album that nobody buys anyway. It's an out-dated concept.

I think Adele's 3 albums to date have sold over 60 million.
Somebody out there is buying.
And lots of people still making a lot of dosh.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: doitywoik ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:05

Quote
georgelicks
... they have over 20 new ones, I've been told about 2 new songs recorded first on 2015 with now 5 different versions at least, each version mixed and ready to release. They are holding the stuff and working on different versions of each new song, we have Mick mixes and Keith mixes of many of the new tunes.

So at least they are not just fooling around (although, nobody would have assumed so seriously anyway, I guess) and quite anumber of songs got done indeed. I could think of worse news.

Given there will be singles, and eventually another Best Of/Outtakes/Rarities album, we will eventually also get to hear the various mixes, I guess. Just going by the number, there must be enough stuff for a double CD. Whether they all make sense on a single album is certainly another question, I'm thinking of Ian Anderson explaining why the songs on Nightcap didn't make in onto the various albums. He said it was not because they were bad songs but because some were too similar to the rest of the bunch, and some were too different from it.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: wupperstein ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:15

I wish to listen to eye popping smiley"Pot Of Gold"

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:23

Adele I don't get. She's compared with The Beatles now (chart success). To me it's middle of the road muzak.
Of course, Beatles did simple music in the beginning. But at least it was something new.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:33

The album is not dead but it's certainly lost a lot of weight.

The format - that's something else. Look at the formats albums were in for quite a while - vinyl, cassette tape, 8 track tape and compact disc. DAT never took off commercially.

Enter Napster... and Kazaa and Morpheus and then, eventually, iTunes.

It's now ordinary to buy a record, in whatever format, via Google Music, Amazon Music, iTunes or to just listen with whatever streaming site or app.

IF it's been put on those music and streaming sites - because it costs money to do that.


It seems to be a big misunderstanding that you can just "get it online". You can't - the artist (label) is responsible for making it available.


As vinyl continues to be hip and CDs go away, the album dies slowly, even though artists are still releasing them. It will be quite a while yet until the album is completely dead.

Until then, it's still hung on to as a thing to do.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: Cristiano Radtke ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:48

From Uncut magazine, april 2019:


Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: bye bye johnny ()
Date: February 21, 2019 17:49

Thanks, Cristiano.

Re: New Stones album for 2019?
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: February 21, 2019 18:03

More comments about them mixing. Ian's stance on Mick's vocals on UNDERCOVER crack me up, because I think he did a superb job on that album.

(On Undercover) the songs are much stronger. I think Mick's come up with some good sort of lyrics and his VOICE sounds great on it. And there's also - there's a good feel to it. I think Mick and Keith have done really well on this album. The only fault I've got against it is again they've spent MUCH too long mixing the bloody thing. And, as a result, the actual sound of the instruments is a little bit harder and cold, whereas when they're still in the early stages, when they're just basic tracks, to me a lot of those things sound better.
- Ian Stewart, 1984


[timeisonourside.com]

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