Tell Me :
Talk
Oh no, not Dirty Work again.
On the contrary, it tells us a great deal.
_______________________________________________________
I like and appreciate your insight on Tattoo you .. although we disagree as to how much was actually done to the songs and IMO it was not a compilation. Much of Jagger's vocals were re-dubbed.. and Sax and such.
If a song is not finished ... and still needs a bit of writing work, lyrics, and over-dubs it's simply not finished. They had unfinished material .. that was worked on (mostly by Jagger & Kimsey) and completed.
That's simply completing unfinished material that had potential for an upcoming release but was not ready or up to snuff .. not putting together a compilation. In order to have a compilation .. songs must be finished ..
Keith noted that they didn't complete many of the tracks for ER and there were ideas worked on that were previously snubbed. The only track that was mostly finished was Waiting On a Friend .. but even that had a piece or two added before the mix.
I agree that B&L tells us nothing of their current song writing chops. As for the new album ... not to worry ..I don't think a Tattoo You Part 2 is underway completely .. I'm sure they have ample '100% brand new' material to work on as well. They have been in the studio all together at least four solid times working on this .. possibly #5 as for right now. This album should be darn interesting and I have the feeling they are doing things right.. taking their time.. trying things out.. in order to have the best possible result.
Ian
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 00:21 by IanBillen.
Ha ha! Yep, another gnat in the language!
Let's see...
2002 FORTY LICKS
2005 A BIGGER BANG
2012 APE
It's amazing how your ignorance boat stays afloat.
Minor detail but, alas, wrong again.
Hilarious!
From all accounts published in various places, no bottoms (ie 100% new material, brand new songs) were recorded after the EMOTIONAL RESCUE sessions. Only overdubs (October-November 1980 and April-June overdubbing, mixing, 1981).
Brilliant overdubs and brilliant mixing, finishing the songs with new lyrics - possibly in some cases the only lyrics - for the brilliant new studio album TATTOO YOU.
____________________________________
Howdy Sir .. I agree with you .. all except for I must say there were indeed two brand new songs from scratch recorded for Tattoo you after ER was not only recorded.. but already out.
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
During that same time frame they (mostly Mick and Chris Kimsey) recorded and touched up all the others during October - December 1980. Mixing and overdubbing took place in April - Jul;y 1981. I looked in Time is On Our Side website and a few other reliable places.
Recording was in October .. November.. and December of 1980. Three months. It lists over dubs and mixing in May-July of 81.
See Here:
New recordings:
October 11-November 12, 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
November 25-mid-December 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
Overdubbed & mixed:
April-May 1981: Rolling Stones Mobile Unit, warehouse, Paris, France
May-July 1981: Atlantic Studios, Electric Ladyland, Hit Factory and Power Station, New York City
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 06:36 by IanBillen.
Heaven I (early version) is also a ER-leftover, recorded June-October 1979 according to www.nzentgraf.de
It seems they did new recordings for Worried About You in 1980 as well (not the entire track, though): Recording date: January-February 1975, October-December 1980 & April-July 1981
I don´t understand what you mean. You can´t ask too much of a kook.
GRRR came too soon after Forty Licks? GRRR isn´t a good compilation? Compilations should be only released after a couple of original albums?
GRRR was a release to celebrate their 50th anniversary, nothing wrong with that. Forty Licks was a release to celebrate their 40th anniversary. Their 60th anniversary will surely see another compilation not much different from the previous ones.
The four tracks from 1973-75 are the longest tracks on TY, if I´d pick up my stopwatch, maybe it wouldn´t be half of TY but more than half of TY
Thanks for checking, so that would leave Neighbors but isn't it the same story?
Anyway at the time I don't think there was any sense that TY wasn't a "valid" new album. The press did say when UC came out that the stash of 77/78 tunes had run out so they'd had to come up with new material...they made it sound like a good thing too. Not exactly true, especially with Too Tough on there!
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
Even Neighbors I (Foxes version) seems to be an ER-outtake from mid 1979. I think before the early version was known it was thought to origin from 1980. So: no really new song on TY, but it SOUNDS like 1981, not 1972 or 1975. I'd prefer an album with finished 1997-2005 outtakes any day instead of another boring blues album.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 15:55 by Monsoon Ragoon.
Yet... this says otherwise (and the 1980 sessions apparently were only overdubbing etc, no bottoms ie full band recording. No where have I ever read anything new was done. Kimsey has only talked about going through tapes.
790621A 10th June - 7th July & late July - 25th August & 12th September - 19th October:
Boulogne-Billancourt (near Paris), France, Pathé Marconi Studios. Producers:
The Glimmer Twins. Sound engineer: Chris Kimsey. Additional musicians:
Bobby Keys (sax)/Sugar Blue (harm)/Martin Gordon (bass; two days in
September)/Boz Scaggs (voc, gtr)
- Dance I (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics
- Dance II (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics, with `three, four..."-count-in
- Dance III (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics with `two, three, four"-count-in
- Dance IV (MJ/KR/RW) -first early version with original intro
- Down In The Hole I (MJ/KR) -early version with partly different lyrics
- Emotional Rescue II (MJ/KR) -long version
- Hang Fire III (MJ/KR) -with some falsetto vocals
- Hang Fire IV (MJ/KR) -first version with ‘doo doo doo’-chorus
- Heaven I (MJ/KR) -early version with guide vocals
- Indian Girl I (MJ/KR) -unverified early version without horns
- Instrumental ( ) -unverified
- It's A Lie I (MJ/KR) -with harmonica intro
- It's A Lie II (MJ/KR) -with drums intro
- Jah Is Not Dead (MJ/KR) -with Boz Scaggs sharing vocals and on guitar
- Jam ( ) -with Bobby Keys; unverified
- Let Me Go I (MJ/KR) -without sax
- Let Me Go II (MJ/KR) -’Emotional Rescue’-version
- Neighbours I (MJ/KR) -early version with guide vocals
- No Use In Crying I (MJ/KR/RW) -shorter early version
- No Use In Crying II (MJ/KR/RW) -longer early version
- No Use In Crying III (MJ/KR/RW) -similar to version II, but organ sets in earlier
- No Use In Crying IV (MJ/KR/RW) -edit of early version
- Send It To Me I (MJ/KR) -long version with vocals
- Summer Romance IV (MJ/KR) -more finished lyrics than III
- Summer Romance V (MJ/KR) -finished lyrics, but diff. vocal take, one guitar less
- Summer Romance VI (MJ/KR) -finished lyrics, plus bvoc; long version of VII
- “Time Flies” (MJ/KR) -unverified, title unsure; with Martin Gordon on bass
- Tones (MJ/KR?) -unverified
- We Had It All I (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -without harmonica
- We Had It All II (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -version I with harmonica
- We Had It All III (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -more finished version
- Where The Boys Go III (MJ/KR) -’Where The Boys All Go’-version, 1st version
with proper intro
- Where The Boys Go IV (MJ/KR) -different lead vocals, no girls choir, longer solo
- Where The Boys Go V (MJ/KR) -version used for thermo-promo
[www.nzentgraf.de]
ALL songs from Tattoo You were from previous sessions, there weren't any band sessions between the Emotional Rescue and the Undercover-sessions. Some databases still have Neighbours and Heaven incorrectly listed as tracks from Fall 1980 Tattoo You-sessions, but nzentgraf.de and also Dieter Hoffmann (in his new Recording Index-books) already corrected this. The "missing link" for a long time was Neighbors from the Emotional Rescue-sessions, until it finally surfaced on the excellent Foxes In The Boxes-release.
N
That's what I thought.
That's what I thought as well.
The 2016 'Hit the Wall' sessions....
Now 2017, wondering if they started from scratch as Ronnie suggested they would?!
_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......
...or the 2016 'Being prolific don't mean a shit' sessions!
>
<
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 21:15 by KRiffhard.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
KRiffhard
()
Date: February 22, 2017 21:25
Quote
Rocky Dijon
You know we could be discussing DIRTY WORK right about now...
Oh no, not Dirty Work again.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
mailexile67
()
Date: February 22, 2017 22:10
Does anybody here that has seen Keith in London last couple of days?!
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Olly
()
Date: February 22, 2017 22:15
Quote
HMS
Blue And Lonesome on the other hand is a genuine new album (and a very god one) and tells us the actual shape of the Stones as players, but it tells us nothing about the state of their actual songwriting skills.
On the contrary, it tells us a great deal.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
IanBillen
()
Date: February 23, 2017 00:19
Quote
HMS
As far as I know they haven´t recorded one single new song especially written and recorded for TY. Except Mick´s vocals/lyrics and a few overdubs everything was done in the past. An album containing vocal or instrumental tracks older than 2-3 years can never ever be called "a new studio album". TY is patchwork, stitched together from very different periods. Actually you hear two different line-ups on TY.
How could it have been a new album? It would have been new if they had re-recorded every vocal/instrumental older than 2-3 years. Doing a few overdubs and adding new vocals to old instrumental tracks does not make a new album, no matter how perfect the mix is.
If all albums would be made that way, you would completely lose track of the band´s musical/artistical development. And that is the most important point. A "new album" has to show the present shape of a band, exactly what TY does not. The band didn´t even gather in the studio working on TY, it´s mostly a Jagger/Kimsey/Clearmountain-affair, that´s not the way "new albums" should be created.
Had they laid down the instrumentals all anew, it would have sounded different from what we have got. Bill/Charlie/Keith/Ronnie would have brought new twists to each of the old songs. The way it is, TY is a Frankenstein´s production, a combination of bits from the past and bits from the present, namely Mick´s vocals/lyrics.
Re-recording the old tracks of course is better but is still not the way new albums should be made, but at least it shows where the band acutally stands as players. But re-recording old tracks/leftovers doesn´t show where the band stands artistically. How can you rate their present songwriting skills, when only material from the past is used. You can´t. That´s the point. So the best and most authentic way to create a "new album" is to enter the studio, create songs during jams, working on demos not older than 2 years brought in by Mick/Keith. Using old material (old instrumental tracks or vocal takes) is being very careless with the truth. It doesn´t show the present shape of the band as songwriters/artists/instrumentalists. And not telling the public how the album actually was created and making the public believe it´s all new is... cheating on fans.
Regarding Sticky Fingers - Knowing that most of it´s masterful core songs were actually recorded back in 1969 of course leaves a bad taste in my mouth. One´s rating of the Stones as artists has to be revisited, since most of the few new tracks on SF are definitely weaker than the songs from 1969. So it seems they haven´t reached their peak artistically with SF but were indeed already one step downhill when working on SF, greatly benefiting from former brilliance.
You can read and hear very often that the Stones reached their peak in the early 70s. But indeed it seems their most remarkable creative outburst happened in 1968/1969. And Tatto You with it´s Frankenstein´s productioin surely is not reflecting the actual shape the Stones were in in 1981, so it is not correct to say or think the Stones delivered their last studio-masterpiece in 1981. All of those details like when a song was written, recorded, overdubbed etc are very important when it comes to rating the Stones´s development as artists. It´s easy to say Dirty Work or Undercover is junk compared to Tatto You, if you don´t know the way these albums actually were created. Dirty Work is an authentic studio album whereas Tattoo You just combines the best bits of the past. Huge Difference.
Blue And Lonesome on the other hand is a genuine new album (and a very god one) and tells us the actual shape of the Stones as players, but it tells us nothing about the state of their actual songwriting skills.
_______________________________________________________
I like and appreciate your insight on Tattoo you .. although we disagree as to how much was actually done to the songs and IMO it was not a compilation. Much of Jagger's vocals were re-dubbed.. and Sax and such.
If a song is not finished ... and still needs a bit of writing work, lyrics, and over-dubs it's simply not finished. They had unfinished material .. that was worked on (mostly by Jagger & Kimsey) and completed.
That's simply completing unfinished material that had potential for an upcoming release but was not ready or up to snuff .. not putting together a compilation. In order to have a compilation .. songs must be finished ..
Keith noted that they didn't complete many of the tracks for ER and there were ideas worked on that were previously snubbed. The only track that was mostly finished was Waiting On a Friend .. but even that had a piece or two added before the mix.
I agree that B&L tells us nothing of their current song writing chops. As for the new album ... not to worry ..I don't think a Tattoo You Part 2 is underway completely .. I'm sure they have ample '100% brand new' material to work on as well. They have been in the studio all together at least four solid times working on this .. possibly #5 as for right now. This album should be darn interesting and I have the feeling they are doing things right.. taking their time.. trying things out.. in order to have the best possible result.
Ian
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 00:21 by IanBillen.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 03:00
Quote
Rocky Dijon
I see what you mean, GasLightStreet. You are technically correct, of course. I like to think you're an English teacher in Real Life. I suspect you'll groan when folks here announce they can't wait until they can pre-order the new album.
Ha ha! Yep, another gnat in the language!
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 03:02
Quote
HMSQuote
GasLightStreetQuote
HonkeyTonkFlash
Please not another Greatest Hits collection! They've done so many. Grrr seemed rather redundant so soon after 40 Licks, although it was nice have the newer tunes. Of course I already had virtually everything else on it!
It was redundant.
No it wasn´t. What could have been finer to celebrate their 50th anniversary than releasing a career-spanning deluxe package including two brandnew songs? GRRR is their best compilation ever, especially if you purchased the deluxe-edition. But even the two-disc-version is a good introduction. GRRR makes all other compilatons superfluous, except TY and Forty Licks (if only for the four new studio-tracks).
Let's see...
2002 FORTY LICKS
2005 A BIGGER BANG
2012 APE
It's amazing how your ignorance boat stays afloat.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 03:06
Quote
HMS
Everything not newly recorded within 2-3 years prior to release isn´t a "new studio album", half of TY consists of instrumental tracks from 1973-75.
Minor detail but, alas, wrong again.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
IanBillen
()
Date: February 23, 2017 04:11
HMS .. Sure.. Tattoo You was very much indeed a Frankenstein album. I agree and that is a great way to put it ..
However it was no compilation .. compilation means finished songs .. more over songs already released. As well .. Tattoo You's songs were not finished..
They worked on them in finishing or reworking them. As well .. lyrics were not even written for almost any of them. They were simply finishing material that showed promise and was forgotten about.
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs) = New Studio Album and it was a Premier Studio Album.
You're trying to say / imply TY songs were mostly all finished beforehand and they simply stitched it together from previously unreleased finished products (songs) ... that was not the case. The songs were not finished .. only Waiting On A Friend was almost in it's entirety when they got to working on Tattoo you. The rest of the songs needed lyrics.. some needed to complete their structure.. ...all of them needed overdubs ... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff). Big Difference.
They finished and completed material and added a few new songs for an album they felt was worthy .. That is not a compilation.. it is.. and it was a new studio album.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 04:15 by IanBillen.
However it was no compilation .. compilation means finished songs .. more over songs already released. As well .. Tattoo You's songs were not finished..
They worked on them in finishing or reworking them. As well .. lyrics were not even written for almost any of them. They were simply finishing material that showed promise and was forgotten about.
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs) = New Studio Album and it was a Premier Studio Album.
You're trying to say / imply TY songs were mostly all finished beforehand and they simply stitched it together from previously unreleased finished products (songs) ... that was not the case. The songs were not finished .. only Waiting On A Friend was almost in it's entirety when they got to working on Tattoo you. The rest of the songs needed lyrics.. some needed to complete their structure.. ...all of them needed overdubs ... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff). Big Difference.
They finished and completed material and added a few new songs for an album they felt was worthy .. That is not a compilation.. it is.. and it was a new studio album.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 04:15 by IanBillen.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 04:17
Quote
Rocky Dijon
It's sad that we do these things to make GasLight happy. I don't know about the rest of you, but setting a pedant among obsessive fans is simply brilliant.
Hilarious!
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 04:40
Quote
IanBillen
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs)... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff).
From all accounts published in various places, no bottoms (ie 100% new material, brand new songs) were recorded after the EMOTIONAL RESCUE sessions. Only overdubs (October-November 1980 and April-June overdubbing, mixing, 1981).
Brilliant overdubs and brilliant mixing, finishing the songs with new lyrics - possibly in some cases the only lyrics - for the brilliant new studio album TATTOO YOU.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
IanBillen
()
Date: February 23, 2017 06:16
Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
IanBillen
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs)... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff).
From all accounts published in various places, no bottoms (ie 100% new material, brand new songs) were recorded after the EMOTIONAL RESCUE sessions. Only overdubs (October-November 1980 and April-June overdubbing, mixing, 1981).
Brilliant overdubs and brilliant mixing, finishing the songs with new lyrics - possibly in some cases the only lyrics - for the brilliant new studio album TATTOO YOU.
____________________________________
Howdy Sir .. I agree with you .. all except for I must say there were indeed two brand new songs from scratch recorded for Tattoo you after ER was not only recorded.. but already out.
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
During that same time frame they (mostly Mick and Chris Kimsey) recorded and touched up all the others during October - December 1980. Mixing and overdubbing took place in April - Jul;y 1981. I looked in Time is On Our Side website and a few other reliable places.
Recording was in October .. November.. and December of 1980. Three months. It lists over dubs and mixing in May-July of 81.
See Here:
New recordings:
October 11-November 12, 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
November 25-mid-December 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
Overdubbed & mixed:
April-May 1981: Rolling Stones Mobile Unit, warehouse, Paris, France
May-July 1981: Atlantic Studios, Electric Ladyland, Hit Factory and Power Station, New York City
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 06:36 by IanBillen.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
gotdablouse
()
Date: February 23, 2017 11:07
Doesn't "Sheep Dip Blues" have an early version of Heaven ? Let's see...yes [dbboots.com] with a date shown as 11/10/1980 although the original OBR record states all the tracks came from 77/78.
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Monsoon Ragoon
()
Date: February 23, 2017 11:17
Quote
gotdablouse
Doesn't "Sheep Dip Blues" have an early version of Heaven ? Let's see...yes [dbboots.com] with a date shown as 11/10/1980 although the original OBR record states all the tracks came from 77/78.
Heaven I (early version) is also a ER-leftover, recorded June-October 1979 according to www.nzentgraf.de
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 23, 2017 11:27
Quote
IanBillenQuote
GasLightStreetQuote
IanBillen
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs)... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff).
From all accounts published in various places, no bottoms (ie 100% new material, brand new songs) were recorded after the EMOTIONAL RESCUE sessions. Only overdubs (October-November 1980 and April-June overdubbing, mixing, 1981).
Brilliant overdubs and brilliant mixing, finishing the songs with new lyrics - possibly in some cases the only lyrics - for the brilliant new studio album TATTOO YOU.
____________________________________
Howdy Sir .. I agree with you .. all except for I must say there were indeed two brand new songs from scratch recorded for Tattoo you after ER was not only recorded.. but already out.
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
During that same time frame they (mostly Mick and Chris Kimsey) recorded and touched up all the others during October - December 1980. Mixing and overdubbing took place in April - Jul;y 1981. I looked in Time is On Our Side website and a few other reliable places.
Recording was in October .. November.. and December of 1980. Three months. It lists over dubs and mixing in May-July of 81.
See Here:
New recordings:
October 11-November 12, 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
November 25-mid-December 1980: Pathé Marconi Studios, Paris, France
Overdubbed & mixed:
April-May 1981: Rolling Stones Mobile Unit, warehouse, Paris, France
May-July 1981: Atlantic Studios, Electric Ladyland, Hit Factory and Power Station, New York City
It seems they did new recordings for Worried About You in 1980 as well (not the entire track, though): Recording date: January-February 1975, October-December 1980 & April-July 1981
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: February 23, 2017 15:13
Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
HMSQuote
GasLightStreetQuote
HonkeyTonkFlash
Please not another Greatest Hits collection! They've done so many. Grrr seemed rather redundant so soon after 40 Licks, although it was nice have the newer tunes. Of course I already had virtually everything else on it!
It was redundant.
No it wasn´t. What could have been finer to celebrate their 50th anniversary than releasing a career-spanning deluxe package including two brandnew songs? GRRR is their best compilation ever, especially if you purchased the deluxe-edition. But even the two-disc-version is a good introduction. GRRR makes all other compilatons superfluous, except TY and Forty Licks (if only for the four new studio-tracks).
Let's see...
2002 FORTY LICKS
2005 A BIGGER BANG
2012 APE
It's amazing how your ignorance boat stays afloat.
I don´t understand what you mean. You can´t ask too much of a kook.
GRRR came too soon after Forty Licks? GRRR isn´t a good compilation? Compilations should be only released after a couple of original albums?
GRRR was a release to celebrate their 50th anniversary, nothing wrong with that. Forty Licks was a release to celebrate their 40th anniversary. Their 60th anniversary will surely see another compilation not much different from the previous ones.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: February 23, 2017 15:19
Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
HMS
Everything not newly recorded within 2-3 years prior to release isn´t a "new studio album", half of TY consists of instrumental tracks from 1973-75.
Minor detail but, alas, wrong again.
The four tracks from 1973-75 are the longest tracks on TY, if I´d pick up my stopwatch, maybe it wouldn´t be half of TY but more than half of TY
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: February 23, 2017 15:31
Had they re-recorded everything older than 2-3 years I would agree that TY is a new album. Not an album of completely new songs but still a new album...
I hope that the album on which they are working now will be a new album containing new songs. There´s rumour about Mick having 40(!) demos, it´s impossible that all this material could not be shaped into 10 songs worth to be released... should they "hit a wall" again, then we´ll get B&L 2 for Christmas. (That wouldn´t be a great misfortune, imo)
I hope that the album on which they are working now will be a new album containing new songs. There´s rumour about Mick having 40(!) demos, it´s impossible that all this material could not be shaped into 10 songs worth to be released... should they "hit a wall" again, then we´ll get B&L 2 for Christmas. (That wouldn´t be a great misfortune, imo)
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
gotdablouse
()
Date: February 23, 2017 15:38
Quote
Monsoon RagoonQuote
gotdablouse
Doesn't "Sheep Dip Blues" have an early version of Heaven ? Let's see...yes [dbboots.com] with a date shown as 11/10/1980 although the original OBR record states all the tracks came from 77/78.
Heaven I (early version) is also a ER-leftover, recorded June-October 1979 according to www.nzentgraf.de
Thanks for checking, so that would leave Neighbors but isn't it the same story?
Anyway at the time I don't think there was any sense that TY wasn't a "valid" new album. The press did say when UC came out that the stash of 77/78 tunes had run out so they'd had to come up with new material...they made it sound like a good thing too. Not exactly true, especially with Too Tough on there!
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Monsoon Ragoon
()
Date: February 23, 2017 15:51
Quote
gotdablouseQuote
Monsoon RagoonQuote
gotdablouse
Doesn't "Sheep Dip Blues" have an early version of Heaven ? Let's see...yes [dbboots.com] with a date shown as 11/10/1980 although the original OBR record states all the tracks came from 77/78.
Heaven I (early version) is also a ER-leftover, recorded June-October 1979 according to www.nzentgraf.de
Thanks for checking, so that would leave Neighbors but isn't it the same story?
Anyway at the time I don't think there was any sense that TY wasn't a "valid" new album. The press did say when UC came out that the stash of 77/78 tunes had run out so they'd had to come up with new material...they made it sound like a good thing too. Not exactly true, especially with Too Tough on there!
Even Neighbors I (Foxes version) seems to be an ER-outtake from mid 1979. I think before the early version was known it was thought to origin from 1980. So: no really new song on TY, but it SOUNDS like 1981, not 1972 or 1975. I'd prefer an album with finished 1997-2005 outtakes any day instead of another boring blues album.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 15:55 by Monsoon Ragoon.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 23, 2017 16:07
Quote
IanBillenQuote
GasLightStreetQuote
IanBillen
Finishing material .. recording onto it.. and finishing writing it even if the songs are years old isn't a compilation .. It's simply completing unfinished material and then releasing it (with a 100% new material in a couple songs)... (not to mention a couple brand new songs to add to the stuff).
From all accounts published in various places, no bottoms (ie 100% new material, brand new songs) were recorded after the EMOTIONAL RESCUE sessions. Only overdubs (October-November 1980 and April-June overdubbing, mixing, 1981).
Brilliant overdubs and brilliant mixing, finishing the songs with new lyrics - possibly in some cases the only lyrics - for the brilliant new studio album TATTOO YOU.
____________________________________
Howdy Sir .. I agree with you .. all except for I must say there were indeed two brand new songs from scratch recorded for Tattoo you after ER was not only recorded.. but already out.
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
Yet... this says otherwise (and the 1980 sessions apparently were only overdubbing etc, no bottoms ie full band recording. No where have I ever read anything new was done. Kimsey has only talked about going through tapes.
790621A 10th June - 7th July & late July - 25th August & 12th September - 19th October:
Boulogne-Billancourt (near Paris), France, Pathé Marconi Studios. Producers:
The Glimmer Twins. Sound engineer: Chris Kimsey. Additional musicians:
Bobby Keys (sax)/Sugar Blue (harm)/Martin Gordon (bass; two days in
September)/Boz Scaggs (voc, gtr)
- Dance I (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics
- Dance II (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics, with `three, four..."-count-in
- Dance III (MJ/KR/RW) -early lyrics with `two, three, four"-count-in
- Dance IV (MJ/KR/RW) -first early version with original intro
- Down In The Hole I (MJ/KR) -early version with partly different lyrics
- Emotional Rescue II (MJ/KR) -long version
- Hang Fire III (MJ/KR) -with some falsetto vocals
- Hang Fire IV (MJ/KR) -first version with ‘doo doo doo’-chorus
- Heaven I (MJ/KR) -early version with guide vocals
- Indian Girl I (MJ/KR) -unverified early version without horns
- Instrumental ( ) -unverified
- It's A Lie I (MJ/KR) -with harmonica intro
- It's A Lie II (MJ/KR) -with drums intro
- Jah Is Not Dead (MJ/KR) -with Boz Scaggs sharing vocals and on guitar
- Jam ( ) -with Bobby Keys; unverified
- Let Me Go I (MJ/KR) -without sax
- Let Me Go II (MJ/KR) -’Emotional Rescue’-version
- Neighbours I (MJ/KR) -early version with guide vocals
- No Use In Crying I (MJ/KR/RW) -shorter early version
- No Use In Crying II (MJ/KR/RW) -longer early version
- No Use In Crying III (MJ/KR/RW) -similar to version II, but organ sets in earlier
- No Use In Crying IV (MJ/KR/RW) -edit of early version
- Send It To Me I (MJ/KR) -long version with vocals
- Summer Romance IV (MJ/KR) -more finished lyrics than III
- Summer Romance V (MJ/KR) -finished lyrics, but diff. vocal take, one guitar less
- Summer Romance VI (MJ/KR) -finished lyrics, plus bvoc; long version of VII
- “Time Flies” (MJ/KR) -unverified, title unsure; with Martin Gordon on bass
- Tones (MJ/KR?) -unverified
- We Had It All I (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -without harmonica
- We Had It All II (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -version I with harmonica
- We Had It All III (Troy Seals/Donny Fritts) -more finished version
- Where The Boys Go III (MJ/KR) -’Where The Boys All Go’-version, 1st version
with proper intro
- Where The Boys Go IV (MJ/KR) -different lead vocals, no girls choir, longer solo
- Where The Boys Go V (MJ/KR) -version used for thermo-promo
[www.nzentgraf.de]
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
NeddieFlanders
()
Date: February 23, 2017 16:37
Quote
IanBillen
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
ALL songs from Tattoo You were from previous sessions, there weren't any band sessions between the Emotional Rescue and the Undercover-sessions. Some databases still have Neighbours and Heaven incorrectly listed as tracks from Fall 1980 Tattoo You-sessions, but nzentgraf.de and also Dieter Hoffmann (in his new Recording Index-books) already corrected this. The "missing link" for a long time was Neighbors from the Emotional Rescue-sessions, until it finally surfaced on the excellent Foxes In The Boxes-release.
N
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Monsoon Ragoon
()
Date: February 23, 2017 16:43
Quote
NeddieFlandersQuote
IanBillen
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
ALL songs from Tattoo You were from previous sessions, there weren't any band sessions between the Emotional Rescue and the Undercover-sessions. Some databases still have Neighbours and Heaven incorrectly listed as tracks from Fall 1980 Tattoo You-sessions, but nzentgraf.de and also Dieter Hoffmann (in his new Recording Index-books) already corrected this. The "missing link" for a long time was Neighbors from the Emotional Rescue-sessions, until it finally surfaced on the excellent Foxes In The Boxes-release.
N
That's what I thought.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 23, 2017 16:45
Quote
NeddieFlandersQuote
IanBillen
Actually ...*Heaven and *Neighbors... were conceived and recorded from scratch well after Emotional Rescue was out and they were recorded for the Tattoo You Album in October - December of 1980. Those two songs had no previous basis before October of 1980 as far as recording / Over Dubs / Mixing or any studio stuff goes. They were the 'brand new' songs during the recording sessions and they were 100% new and 100% recorded from scratch specifically for Tattoo You well after Emotional Rescue was already out.
ALL songs from Tattoo You were from previous sessions, there weren't any band sessions between the Emotional Rescue and the Undercover-sessions. Some databases still have Neighbours and Heaven incorrectly listed as tracks from Fall 1980 Tattoo You-sessions, but nzentgraf.de and also Dieter Hoffmann (in his new Recording Index-books) already corrected this. The "missing link" for a long time was Neighbors from the Emotional Rescue-sessions, until it finally surfaced on the excellent Foxes In The Boxes-release.
N
That's what I thought as well.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
mailexile67
()
Date: February 23, 2017 17:12
What an interesting chat...In the wrong topic...
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
mailexile67
()
Date: February 23, 2017 17:14
Nate, Heinz and all the Londoners...No news on the "Horizon"?!?
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
KRiffhard
()
Date: February 23, 2017 17:57
Quote
mailexile67
What an interesting chat...In the wrong topic...
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Woz
()
Date: February 23, 2017 20:01
I am more interested in 2016-2017 sessions than what may or may not happened between 1979 and 1984.....at least in this particular thread!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 20:02 by Woz.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 20:02 by Woz.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Hairball
()
Date: February 23, 2017 20:39
Quote
Woz
I am more interested in 2016-2017 sessions than what may or may not happened between 1979 and 1984.....at least in this particular thread!
The 2016 'Hit the Wall' sessions....
Now 2017, wondering if they started from scratch as Ronnie suggested they would?!
_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
KRiffhard
()
Date: February 23, 2017 21:14
Quote
HairballQuote
Woz
I am more interested in 2016-2017 sessions than what may or may not happened between 1979 and 1984.....at least in this particular thread!
The 2016 'Hit the Wall' sessions....
Now 2017, wondering if they started from scratch as Ronnie suggested they would?!
...or the 2016 'Being prolific don't mean a shit' sessions!
>
<Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-23 21:15 by KRiffhard.
Re: Another album in 2017 ?
Posted by:
Maindefender
()
Date: February 23, 2017 21:23
10-11 songs, 38-40 minutes please!! 
This Thread has been closed
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