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Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Stoneburst ()
Date: July 24, 2015 15:32

Quote
HMS
Mick Taylor's effect on the Stones is heavily over-rated. He is just the guy who almost by coincidence was hanging around when Keith and Mick reached their creative peak as a songwriting team.

The songwriting is not the point with MT: no-one denies it was Mick and Keith's zenith creatively. The point is MT's musicianship, the way he embellished their output during his tenure and the way his influence rubbed off on the band's playing as a whole.

Quote
HMS
Sticky Fingers and Exile (which of course should have been released as a single album) would be equally great without Mick Taylor

They seriously wouldn't.

Quote
HMS
IORR/GHS are two weak and very boring releases, although Taylor is playing on both albums. So if he were indeed the iconic figure in Stones history, these albums should have been far better than they are

IORR is a bit crap, but GHS is excellent. And if you think these albums suck with Taylor, try imagining them without him.

Quote
HMS
Mick Taylor was (maybe still is) a skillful guitar-player, but many others were/are equally/more gifted players.

Virtually everyone agrees that as bluesy lead players go, he's one of the all time best. You can count his equals on the fingers of two hands.

Quote
HMS
And don´t forget, the Stones took Taylor AFTER asking Ron Wood, who was unfortunately not available at that time.

No, they didn't. It says a lot about Wood's contributions to the Stones that he feels the need to come out with crap like this and stories about Taylor's 'stage fright'.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-10 10:56 by Stoneburst.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: July 24, 2015 17:54

Quote
Ket
Quote
Brstonesfan
It is not even debatable that the Taylor era was the best...
yes it is! I agree there was a golden period from beggars to exile but half of that was recorded without taylor. and i strongly disagree that ghs or iorr were better than some girls or tatoo you. for live? yeah i think 69 was their best ever but i would still rank 75-81 over 72 or 73, so yes it is very debatable

I would rank '72 and Pacific Tour '73 over anything the Stones have done live in part due to the inclusion of Nicky Hopkins. I mean talk about a virtuoso!

I'm not a fan of Jagger's vocals in '75 although the like the set list. '78 is cool because they are stripped down and Wood doesn't try and fail to play like Taylor. He plays like Wood, which actually sounds like Neil Young on electric and it works much better for him.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: July 24, 2015 18:01

Quote
HMS
On Live-recordings Taylor bores me to death with his flawless but life-less virtuosity.

If you think Love in Vain is lifeless you need to have your own pulse checked.

If you're talking about stage presence well, kind of hard to execute his playing style jumping around like a court jester!

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Naturalust ()
Date: July 24, 2015 18:27

Quote
HMS
Mick Taylors effect on the Stones is heavily over-rated. He is just the guy who almost by coincidence was hanging around when Keith and Mick reached their creative peak as a songwriting team.

It was no "almost coincidence" Taylor was hanging around the Stones at that time. Pretty sure the story of him being invited to play on the LIB sessions and doing so well that Keith and Mick asked him to join the band is pretty well known. After being highly recommended by John Mayall. Nothing coincidental about that. I agree about the creative peak of Mick and Keith but like to think their choice to bring Taylor on board was a part of that creativity. They knew it was just what the music needed and as usual at that time they hit the nail on the head.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Olly ()
Date: July 24, 2015 19:41

Quote
LuxuryStones
Quote
Olly
Quote
LuxuryStones
The most accomplished guitarist the Stones ever had.


Are you referring to technical accomplishment in particular?

There are many ways in which a guitar player can be accomplished.

In every way. Talent, I think that's the keyword. He could play anything, maybe lacked discipline though.


But discipline is an important part of guitar playing...

Who would you say is the best guitarist the Stones ever had?

.....

Olly.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: LuxuryStones ()
Date: July 24, 2015 21:00

Quote
Olly
Quote
LuxuryStones
Quote
Olly
Quote
LuxuryStones
The most accomplished guitarist the Stones ever had.


Are you referring to technical accomplishment in particular?

There are many ways in which a guitar player can be accomplished.

In every way. Talent, I think that's the keyword. He could play anything, maybe lacked discipline though.


But discipline is an important part of guitar playing...

Who would you say is the best guitarist the Stones ever had?


Since you ask.. My vote goes to Taylor, just because he could deliver the most versatile repertoire in a one hour concert. Rock, Blues, great slide, fusion influenced and some jazzy improvisations. And his tone and sound like back in the days. He really had it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-07-24 21:03 by LuxuryStones.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Redhotcarpet ()
Date: July 24, 2015 21:45

Are we allowed to ask or answer questions like that? If so I gotta go with Taylor. Keith too. Brian in 1964.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: LuxuryStones ()
Date: July 24, 2015 21:58

Quote
Redhotcarpet
Are we allowed to ask or answer questions like that? If so I gotta go with Taylor. Keith too. Brian in 1964.

If you imagine the Rolling Stones wouldn't exist, and let all of them do a solo concert, no Stones songs. At least that's the idea I based my answer on. Or even better, no songs at all. Just instrumental music/improvisation. A different discipline. Just like Larry Carlton or Jeff Beck. Then I put my cards on Taylor. smiling smiley

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Turner68 ()
Date: July 24, 2015 22:47

This thread has jumped the shark.

[en.wikipedia.org]





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-07-24 22:49 by Turner68.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Redhotcarpet ()
Date: July 25, 2015 23:14

Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Naturalust ()
Date: July 25, 2015 23:48

Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003

Nice quote carpet! This has been said in different ways so many times on this forum but coming from Charlie it is unimpeachable.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Olly ()
Date: July 26, 2015 00:45

Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003


Frank opinions regarding Ronnie. Frank enough to remind me of his comments regarding Jones aired on a BBC Top of the Pops 2 Stones Special in 2003.

.....

Olly.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: keefriffhards ()
Date: July 26, 2015 00:58

Quote
Olly
Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003


Frank opinions regarding Ronnie. Frank enough to remind me of his comments regarding Jones aired on a BBC Top of the Pops 2 Stones Special in 2003.

Strong words from Charlie indeed. "Musically Ronnie didn't bring anything."
Its very true. Well what he did bring was not worth bringing except for the weaving !!

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: palerider22 ()
Date: July 26, 2015 01:46

Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003

Keith wouldn't say it. Neither would Mick...but they both know it...It's still too bad they didn't take advantage of that fact on the last tour. We'd actually be still talking about it...

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Naturalust ()
Date: July 26, 2015 02:14

Quote
palerider22
Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003

Keith wouldn't say it. Neither would Mick...but they both know it...It's still too bad they didn't take advantage of that fact on the last tour. We'd actually be still talking about it...

Mick wouldn't say that directly about Ronnie but he has been quoted that the band with Mick Taylor produced their best music or something along those lines. I wish I could remember where that quote came from, maybe it was the Exile documentary or Crossfire Hurricane..

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Rocky Dijon ()
Date: July 26, 2015 03:41

It's in the Jagger Remembers cover story of Rolling Stone in 1995. Mick says that he's reluctant to say an earlier version of the band was better, but then says they did their best work with Mr. Taylor.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Testify ()
Date: July 26, 2015 05:31

Quote
HMS
Mick Taylors effect on the Stones is heavily over-rated. He is just the guy who almost by coincidence was hanging around when Keith and Mick reached their creative peak as a songwriting team. Sticky Fingers and Exile (which of course should have been released as a single album) would be equally great without Mick Taylor. IORR/GHS are two weak and very boring releases, although Taylor is playing on both albums. So if he were indeed the iconic figure in Stones history, these albums should have been far better than they are. Mick Taylor was (maybe still is) a skillful guitar-player, but many others were/are equally/more gifted players. And don´t forget, the Stones took Taylor AFTER asking Ron Wood, who was unfortunately not available at that time. On Live-recordings Taylor bores me to death with his flawless but life-less virtuosity.
thumbs upthumbs upsmileys with beer

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: TonyMo ()
Date: July 26, 2015 05:55

Quote
HMS
Sticky Fingers and Exile (which of course should have been released as a single album) would be equally great without Mick Taylor. On Live-recordings Taylor bores me to death with his flawless but life-less virtuosity.

Feel you on both opinion's. re. your last one...I loved his concert rhythm playing and considered him a perfect foil for Keith. For me, what he plays on the Brussels Rambler in that regard is particulary brilliant. Would also suggest MT rescued some rather dull (for me) content present in his last two albums with the band.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Witness ()
Date: July 26, 2015 06:20

Quote
keefriffhards
Quote
Olly
Quote
Redhotcarpet
Charlie Watts: "The Mick Taylor period was a creative peak for us. A tremendous jump in musical credibility. Now Keith won't say that; Keith, I think, would prefer to play with Ronnie as a partner. But Mick Taylor was an incredible virtuoso. Brian wasn't, he was a good all-round player, and Ronnie's the same. He'll play wonderful bottleneck guitar and pedal steel -- any instrument, like Brian -- but Mick gave our music terrific lyricism. Ronnie is a very likeable person, a great sense of humor. Musically, he didn't bring anything, but he has this facility to add to things." Mojo Magazine 2003


Frank opinions regarding Ronnie. Frank enough to remind me of his comments regarding Jones aired on a BBC Top of the Pops 2 Stones Special in 2003.

Strong words from Charlie indeed. "Musically Ronnie didn't bring anything."
Its very true. Well what he did bring was not worth bringing except for the weaving !!

To honour Charlie Watts for this most marvellous quote, be fair to Charlie and do not strip his outlook for its vital nuances. About Ronnie: "Musically, he didn't bring anything, ......." has, nonetheless, an important continuation, "....., but he has this facility to add to things".

If we want to, we may try to interprete that point of view. But towards the complete sentence, I think.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: 5strings ()
Date: July 26, 2015 07:57

Quote
HMS
Mick Taylors effect on the Stones is heavily over-rated. He is just the guy who almost by coincidence was hanging around when Keith and Mick reached their creative peak as a songwriting team. Sticky Fingers and Exile (which of course should have been released as a single album) would be equally great without Mick Taylor. IORR/GHS are two weak and very boring releases, although Taylor is playing on both albums. So if he were indeed the iconic figure in Stones history, these albums should have been far better than they are. Mick Taylor was (maybe still is) a skillful guitar-player, but many others were/are equally/more gifted players. And don´t forget, the Stones took Taylor AFTER asking Ron Wood, who was unfortunately not available at that time. On Live-recordings Taylor bores me to death with his flawless but life-less virtuosity.
You discover the Stones six months ago !! And you tell US about Taylor
How great you are man !!!!!
Your Rolling Stones are a merchandising band,mine were a rock n roll band.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-07-26 09:36 by 5strings.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: TeddyB1018 ()
Date: July 26, 2015 09:02

Larry Carlton? Give me Mick Jones. Or Johnny Thunders...

I downloaded a bunch of MT solo shows yesterday and today and was surprised to see how much his set lists for the past thirty years are stagnant. I guess it's not really the point, as he uses the songs to jam and improvise, but it's something I never noticed. I particularly liked the tour where he teamed with Blondie C.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: HMS ()
Date: July 26, 2015 11:36

Quote
5strings
You discover the Stones six months ago !! And you tell US about Taylor
How great you are man !!!!!
Your Rolling Stones are a merchandising band,mine were a rock n roll band.

I am a die hard fan of the Rolling Stones since 1982.
And I like every period in their career, including the Taylor-years. But I do think he is over-rated. That is my personal opinion, nobody is forced to share it. No band touches the stones, they are simply the best band in the world. But not everything that glitters is gold and so it is with the stones. They created great music, but some of their efforts are debateable. For me Ronnie fits better in the Stones-universe, as a person AND as a musician. Taylor´s virtuosity mellowed the Stones at times, Ron brought back sharpness & roughness to their music.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: stonesrule ()
Date: July 26, 2015 11:51

Thank God for 5 Strings! And Charlie Watts!

I thought I must be imagining things as I read HMS's opinions.

HMS, have you ever seen the Rolling Stones live in concert?

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: HMS ()
Date: July 26, 2015 12:36

Yes I did. From 1990 on every tour at least one concert and I had a good time at every concert, even without Taylor onstage.smiling smiley

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: 5strings ()
Date: July 26, 2015 12:42

Quote
HMS
Yes I did. From 1990 on every tour at least one concert and I had a good time at every concert, even without Taylor onstage.smiling smiley

Hard Fan from 1982 and first live in 1990, OMG i'm sorry for you eye popping smiley

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: HMS ()
Date: July 26, 2015 12:48

That´s the curse of my age. smoking smiley
Wish I had seen them around 1975/76 but was eight years of age back then.cool smiley

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Testify ()
Date: July 26, 2015 13:16

Quote
5strings
Quote
HMS
Mick Taylors effect on the Stones is heavily over-rated. He is just the guy who almost by coincidence was hanging around when Keith and Mick reached their creative peak as a songwriting team. Sticky Fingers and Exile (which of course should have been released as a single album) would be equally great without Mick Taylor. IORR/GHS are two weak and very boring releases, although Taylor is playing on both albums. So if he were indeed the iconic figure in Stones history, these albums should have been far better than they are. Mick Taylor was (maybe still is) a skillful guitar-player, but many others were/are equally/more gifted players. And don´t forget, the Stones took Taylor AFTER asking Ron Wood, who was unfortunately not available at that time. On Live-recordings Taylor bores me to death with his flawless but life-less virtuosity.
You discover the Stones six months ago !! And you tell US about Taylor
How great you are man !!!!!
Your Rolling Stones are a merchandising band,mine were a rock n roll band.
If the Rolling Stones are a merchandising group, because Mr. Taylor wanted to be in this last tour? Money? Why then criticize the band for its exclusion?

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Olly ()
Date: July 26, 2015 15:29

Quote
HMS
That´s the curse of my age. smoking smiley
Wish I had seen them around 1975/76 but was eight years of age back then.cool smiley


It's no curse. You have seen the band on their finest Tours: Voodoo Lounge through to Licks.

.....

Olly.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: keefriffhards ()
Date: July 26, 2015 15:50

Quote
5strings
Quote
HMS
Yes I did. From 1990 on every tour at least one concert and I had a good time at every concert, even without Taylor onstage.smiling smiley

Hard Fan from 1982 and first live in 1990, OMG i'm sorry for you eye popping smiley

Similar to me, hard fan since 82' first seen them 89' and a further 7 or 8 times after that spread out over 14 years.

Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by: Naturalust ()
Date: July 26, 2015 16:38

Quote
HMS
Yes I did. From 1990 on every tour at least one concert and I had a good time at every concert, even without Taylor onstage.smiling smiley

I guess you missed the tour(s) before this one when Taylor actually was on stage with the Stones again? I assure you it was a highlight of those shows.

Quote
Witness
To honour Charlie Watts for this most marvellous quote, be fair to Charlie and do not strip his outlook for its vital nuances. About Ronnie: "Musically, he didn't bring anything, ......." has, nonetheless, an important continuation, "....., but he has this facility to add to things".

If we want to, we may try to interprete that point of view. But towards the complete sentence, I think.

Well it can either be taken as somewhat contradictory or perhaps the things he adds that Charlie is referring to are not musical. Like he adds to the camaraderie of the band, which of course is well documented.

I take it more that he didn't bring any songs, heightened musicianship or guitar styles to the band but is able to add things like pedal steel, guitar solos and second guitar parts.

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