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That's kind of how I look at it. Saying LIB is the weakest of the four, it's like a 9.91 instead of 9.98 or 9.99. When you're talking these albums, though, it's like the Champions League of music, best of the best.
ok now I see..
corny country pastiche lyrics about putting back my heart in its hole are great..
lyrics about getting blown out like a parachute somehow are great, and heavy itchy throbbers..( and I frkin love that song!)
lyrics meant to out-Dylan Dylan are great, when singing about mentholated sandwiches grannies waving their hankies in the air...
and of course lyrics about sex with thirteen year old girls are great...
well who's counting..
it got revised downward later..!
No, not quite, duke. Just that BEGGARS BANQUET is long before the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity. In a sense, because the album is less heavy, listening from the perspective of today, and knowing the Stones later, more formulaic approach, one can appreciate all the more the subtle little touches of the acoustic and slide playing, which add so greatly to the freshness and effectiveness of the songs. One could argue that a more formulaic approach may have started a little with 'Monkey Man', from LET IT BLEED, although i admit that may seem a little unfair. However, if there is a case to be put forward with regard to the pre 1969 output, having an edge over what came after, it is that the music was perhaps a little less predictable. The true recycling of riffs didn't really come into play until perhaps 73-74, although a certain style of riffing was becoming pretty much the norm by 71-72. I just think with BEGGARS BANQUET it is nice to hear the group approach the songs from a slightly different angle. Even the iconic 'Street Fighting Man' is played primarily using an acoustic, rather than an electric guitar.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-23 19:48 by Edward Twining.
Yes, well i'd rather follow what my ears tell me>
<
Very nice to see AFTERMATH recognised though !!
otherwise good post but I don't agree with : " the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity"
if you're talking about songs they rock on, I'd say those riffs belong to them, Keith in particular, especially after Beggars Banquet and Let It Bleed.
I mean, they set the gold standard and weren't following, they were leading. inventing the template that everybody would use for rock and roll, and it did later become kind of mannered..
but they didn't 'fall into it'..they were creating it..
well its a different band on the live versions of the songs you mentioned..
and no no no , 'Live With Me' the original certainly isn't weaker than the Ya Yas version...please...
yes yes the original Street Fighting Man has not been surpassed live..they're different live, but the original is perfection..same for Sympathy..
Yes I agree. I understand what you mean. It is a perfect album despite some minor flaws (Salt, Doctor, and though I really love it, objectively speaking Jig Saw is not up to par despite Brians mellotron).
Tracks like Parachute Woman and NE are fillers but they are perfect golden fillers and some of the greatest songs ever recorded. That is greatness. I love Let it bleed more and hear greatness up until 1981. Despite the debut album (still one of their best albums ever), Aftermath (which has some weak songs), Bleed (my choice), Exile, Fingers, GHS songs on SG, ER and B&B and another fab of mine despite the partly bad mix (iorr) - Beggars is their masterpiece.
So yes I agree.
Who said that?! Let it bleed? No f-ing way! Sticky is the weakest! ><
I agree. BB is my no.1 too, although LIB and SF are pretty close. I rank Exile
below these three. My main complaint about the RS list,though, is the omission of GHS.
I don't think any of them are fillers, though, Redhotcarpet.
Yeah, on second thought you're right. The studio Gimme Shelter is probably the definitive version. The combination of Keith's guitar intro, Mick's overdriven harmonica and Mary Clayton's incredible vocals is right there in rock 'n' roll history. I just happen to love the best '72 performances because of Mick Taylor's lead and the overall live feel.
Had JJF been recorded today or even in 1971, the Stones would not have hesitated to put it on a studio album. But the sixties was a different time, when singles mattered and great songs were saved for 45s and not always put on albums. 1968 was right at the time when albums really started to be a popular and serious artform, and yeah, Jumpin' Jack would have fit on Beggars, IMHO. But it's also a perfectly sequenced album without it. And Exile would have been 99.9% Exile without Tumbling Dice, in my opinion.
Yeah... I suppose that's what the people over at London/Abkco in America figured long before '68.
Me neither. They are songs on an album. You are right. Short and curlies is a filler. PArachute Woman is a classic blues rock shuffle.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
StonesCat
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:04
Quote
Spud
Are some things a bit more perfect than others then ?...and some things just a bit perfect
That's kind of how I look at it. Saying LIB is the weakest of the four, it's like a 9.91 instead of 9.98 or 9.99. When you're talking these albums, though, it's like the Champions League of music, best of the best.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
BJPortugal
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:09
Beggars Banquet its way better than Let it Bleed 
Let it bleed had some great highlights like You Cant Always Get What You Want, Midnight Rambler, You Got the Silver and Gimmie Shelter. Others are beyond average and had no history at all.
IMO, Beggar's is a more consisted album. Can we pick a average song? Prodigal Son? Salt of the Earth? Dear Doctor? I dont think so.
So, Beggars is the highlight of the called "big four". Sticky Fingers runs next.
BTW, my favorite Rolling Stones record are Aftermath-American Version- I cannot pick any average song on that one. Well, maybe Stupid Girl?
And in a exercise of imagination.. can we imagine what it would be if have Sittin on a Fence instead of Stupid Girl? or maybe Ride on Baby..
Let it bleed had some great highlights like You Cant Always Get What You Want, Midnight Rambler, You Got the Silver and Gimmie Shelter. Others are beyond average and had no history at all.
IMO, Beggar's is a more consisted album. Can we pick a average song? Prodigal Son? Salt of the Earth? Dear Doctor? I dont think so.
So, Beggars is the highlight of the called "big four". Sticky Fingers runs next.
BTW, my favorite Rolling Stones record are Aftermath-American Version- I cannot pick any average song on that one. Well, maybe Stupid Girl?
And in a exercise of imagination.. can we imagine what it would be if have Sittin on a Fence instead of Stupid Girl? or maybe Ride on Baby..
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:11
There's too much filler and crap lyrics on LIB.
Sounds a bit empty, overly contrived and clinical too. Shelter and rambler are ace, as is the music of Monkey Man, but it's really let down by the stupid lyrics.
Beggars just has a more natural flow and ease about it.
Sounds a bit empty, overly contrived and clinical too. Shelter and rambler are ace, as is the music of Monkey Man, but it's really let down by the stupid lyrics.
Beggars just has a more natural flow and ease about it.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
duke richardson
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:19
Quote
His Majesty
There's too much filler and crap lyrics on LIB.
Sounds a bit empty, overly contrived and clinical too. Shelter and rambler are ace, as is the music of Monkey Man, but it's really let down by the stupid lyrics.
Beggars just has a more natural flow and ease about it.
ok now I see..
corny country pastiche lyrics about putting back my heart in its hole are great..
lyrics about getting blown out like a parachute somehow are great, and heavy itchy throbbers..( and I frkin love that song!)
lyrics meant to out-Dylan Dylan are great, when singing about mentholated sandwiches grannies waving their hankies in the air...
and of course lyrics about sex with thirteen year old girls are great...
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:19
15
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
duke richardson
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:34
Quote
His Majesty
15
well who's counting..
it got revised downward later..!
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Edward Twining
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:45
Quote
duke richardson
it sort of sounds like because Beggar's Banquet is so rootsy and not so rock and roll, that's better somehow...?
No, not quite, duke. Just that BEGGARS BANQUET is long before the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity. In a sense, because the album is less heavy, listening from the perspective of today, and knowing the Stones later, more formulaic approach, one can appreciate all the more the subtle little touches of the acoustic and slide playing, which add so greatly to the freshness and effectiveness of the songs. One could argue that a more formulaic approach may have started a little with 'Monkey Man', from LET IT BLEED, although i admit that may seem a little unfair. However, if there is a case to be put forward with regard to the pre 1969 output, having an edge over what came after, it is that the music was perhaps a little less predictable. The true recycling of riffs didn't really come into play until perhaps 73-74, although a certain style of riffing was becoming pretty much the norm by 71-72. I just think with BEGGARS BANQUET it is nice to hear the group approach the songs from a slightly different angle. Even the iconic 'Street Fighting Man' is played primarily using an acoustic, rather than an electric guitar.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-23 19:48 by Edward Twining.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
muffie
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:57
Rolling Stone Magazine's 500 Greatest Albums of All Time
The RS 500 was assembled by the editors of Rolling Stone, based on the results of two extensive polls. In 2003, Rolling Stone asked a panel of 271 artists, producers, industry executives and journalists to pick the greatest albums of all time. In 2009, we asked a similar group of 100 experts to pick the best albums of the 2000s. From those results, Rolling Stone created this new list of the greatest albums of all time.
The Rolling Stones band has these entries:
7: Exile On Main Street
32: Let It Bleed
58: Beggar's Banquet
64: Sticky Fingers
109: Aftermath
116: Out Of Our Heads
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
213: Tattoo You
270: Some Girls
357: Between The Buttons
7: Exile On Main Street
A dirty whirl of blues and boogie, the Rolling Stones' 1972 double LP "was the first grunge record," guitarist Keith Richards crowed proudly in a 2002 interview. But inside the deliberately dense squall – Richards' and Mick Taylor's dogfight riffing, the lusty jump of the Bill Wyman-Charlie Watts rhythm engine, Mick Jagger's caged-animal bark and burned-soul croon – is the Stones' greatest album and Jagger and Richards' definitive songwriting statement of outlaw pride and dedication to grit. In the existential shuffle "Tumbling Dice," the exhausted country beauty "Torn and Frayed" and the whiskey-soaked uplift of "Shine a Light," you literally hear the Stones in exile: working at Richards' villa in the South of France, and on the run from media censure, British drug police (Jagger and Richards already knew the view from behind bars) and the country's onerous tax code. Exile is rife with allusions to their outsider status: The album's cover is a collage of freakish American characters, and on "Sweet Black Angel" they toast imprisoned activist Angela Davis – one set of renegades to another. The music rattles like battle but also swings with clear purpose on songs like "Rocks Off" and "All Down the Line." As Richards explained, "The Stones don't have a home anymore – hence the Exile – but they can still keep it together. Whatever people throw at us, we can still duck, improvise, overcome." Great example: Richards recorded his jubilant romp "Happy" with just producer Jimmy Miller on drums and saxman Bobby Keys – while waiting for the other Stones to turn up for work. Exile on Main Street is the Stones at their fighting best, armed with the blues, playing to win.
32: Let It Bleed
The Rolling Stones' final record of the Sixties kicks off with the terrifying "Gimme Shelter," the song that came to symbolize not only the catastrophe of the Stones' free show at Altamont but the death of the decade's utopian spirit. And the entire album burns with apocalyptic cohesion: the sex-mad desperation of "Live With Me"; the murderous blues of "Midnight Rambler"; Keith Richards' lethal, biting guitar on "Monkey Man"; the epic moralism, with honky-tonk piano and massed vocal chorus, of "You Can't Always Get What You Want," which Mick Jagger wrote on acoustic guitar in his bedroom. "Somebody said that we could get the London Bach Choir," Jagger recalled years later, "and we said, 'That will be a laugh.'"
58: Beggar's Banquet
"When we had been in the States between 1964 and '66, I had gathered together this enormous collection of records, but I never had any time to listen to them," Keith Richards recalled. "In late 1966 and '67, I unwrapped them and actually played them." After the wayward psychedelia of 1967's Their Satanic Majesties Request, and with guitarist Brian Jones largely AWOL, Richards' record collection led the Rolling Stones back to their version of America: country music on "Dear Doctor," the blues on "Prodigal Son" and urban riots on "Street Fighting Man." And "Sympathy for the Devil" is an anthem for the darkness in every human heart – in other words, just one more example of the Stones getting back to basics.
64: Sticky Fingers
Drummer Charlie Watts remembered the origin of Sticky Fingers as the songs Mick Jagger wrote while filming the movie Ned Kelly in Australia. "Mick started playing the guitar a lot," Watts said. "He plays very strange rhythm guitar... very much how Brazilian guitarists play, on the upbeat. It is very much like the guitar on a James Brown track – for a drummer, it's great to play with." New guitarist Mick Taylor stretched out the Stones' sound in "Sway," "Can't You Hear Me Knocking" and "Moonlight Mile." But "Brown Sugar" is a classic Stones stomp, and two of the best cuts are country songs: one forlorn ("Wild Horses") and one funny ("Dead Flowers").
109: Aftermath
The first Stones album completely written by Jagger-Richards was full of bad-boy songs about Swinging London's overnight stars, groupies, hustlers and parasites. It's got tough riffs ("It's Not Easy"), girls seeking kicks ("Under My Thumb"), zooming psychedelia ("Paint It Black") and baroque-folk gallantry ("I Am Waiting").
116: Out Of Our Heads
Here's where the Stones started to leave the R&B and blues covers behind. Their fourth album in America featured three defining Jagger-Richards originals, each a masterpiece of libidinal menace: "The Last Time," the gently vicious "Play With Fire" and "(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction," a song that is the very definition of riff.
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
A charming exuberance pervades the Stones' third U.S. release, with its hot-rod takes on Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Willie Dixon and Muddy Waters. And their "Heart of Stone" introduces a crucial Stones element into the mix: menace.
213: Tattoo You
Tattoo You was lean, tough and bluesy – the Stones relying on their strengths, as if they'd matured into the kind of surefire bluesmen they'd idolized as kids. It spent nine weeks at Number One on the strength of "Start Me Up," in which Mick Jagger snuck the line "You make a dead man come" onto the radio.
270: Some Girls
"Keith @#$%&' gets busted every year," Mick Jagger fumed. Keith Richards was in drug hell, and the Stones were verging on destruction, but they bounced back with "Miss You," the sleazy "Shattered" and "When the Whip Comes Down." Richards does his best song, "Before They Make Me Run."
357: Between The Buttons
Andrew Loog Oldham called it their "most English" album. Music-hall piano abuts the psych-soul of "Ruby Tuesday"; the lovely "She Smiled Sweetly" offsets the great Chuck Berry rip, "Miss Amanda Jones."
The RS 500 was assembled by the editors of Rolling Stone, based on the results of two extensive polls. In 2003, Rolling Stone asked a panel of 271 artists, producers, industry executives and journalists to pick the greatest albums of all time. In 2009, we asked a similar group of 100 experts to pick the best albums of the 2000s. From those results, Rolling Stone created this new list of the greatest albums of all time.
The Rolling Stones band has these entries:
7: Exile On Main Street
32: Let It Bleed
58: Beggar's Banquet
64: Sticky Fingers
109: Aftermath
116: Out Of Our Heads
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
213: Tattoo You
270: Some Girls
357: Between The Buttons
7: Exile On Main Street
A dirty whirl of blues and boogie, the Rolling Stones' 1972 double LP "was the first grunge record," guitarist Keith Richards crowed proudly in a 2002 interview. But inside the deliberately dense squall – Richards' and Mick Taylor's dogfight riffing, the lusty jump of the Bill Wyman-Charlie Watts rhythm engine, Mick Jagger's caged-animal bark and burned-soul croon – is the Stones' greatest album and Jagger and Richards' definitive songwriting statement of outlaw pride and dedication to grit. In the existential shuffle "Tumbling Dice," the exhausted country beauty "Torn and Frayed" and the whiskey-soaked uplift of "Shine a Light," you literally hear the Stones in exile: working at Richards' villa in the South of France, and on the run from media censure, British drug police (Jagger and Richards already knew the view from behind bars) and the country's onerous tax code. Exile is rife with allusions to their outsider status: The album's cover is a collage of freakish American characters, and on "Sweet Black Angel" they toast imprisoned activist Angela Davis – one set of renegades to another. The music rattles like battle but also swings with clear purpose on songs like "Rocks Off" and "All Down the Line." As Richards explained, "The Stones don't have a home anymore – hence the Exile – but they can still keep it together. Whatever people throw at us, we can still duck, improvise, overcome." Great example: Richards recorded his jubilant romp "Happy" with just producer Jimmy Miller on drums and saxman Bobby Keys – while waiting for the other Stones to turn up for work. Exile on Main Street is the Stones at their fighting best, armed with the blues, playing to win.
32: Let It Bleed
The Rolling Stones' final record of the Sixties kicks off with the terrifying "Gimme Shelter," the song that came to symbolize not only the catastrophe of the Stones' free show at Altamont but the death of the decade's utopian spirit. And the entire album burns with apocalyptic cohesion: the sex-mad desperation of "Live With Me"; the murderous blues of "Midnight Rambler"; Keith Richards' lethal, biting guitar on "Monkey Man"; the epic moralism, with honky-tonk piano and massed vocal chorus, of "You Can't Always Get What You Want," which Mick Jagger wrote on acoustic guitar in his bedroom. "Somebody said that we could get the London Bach Choir," Jagger recalled years later, "and we said, 'That will be a laugh.'"
58: Beggar's Banquet
"When we had been in the States between 1964 and '66, I had gathered together this enormous collection of records, but I never had any time to listen to them," Keith Richards recalled. "In late 1966 and '67, I unwrapped them and actually played them." After the wayward psychedelia of 1967's Their Satanic Majesties Request, and with guitarist Brian Jones largely AWOL, Richards' record collection led the Rolling Stones back to their version of America: country music on "Dear Doctor," the blues on "Prodigal Son" and urban riots on "Street Fighting Man." And "Sympathy for the Devil" is an anthem for the darkness in every human heart – in other words, just one more example of the Stones getting back to basics.
64: Sticky Fingers
Drummer Charlie Watts remembered the origin of Sticky Fingers as the songs Mick Jagger wrote while filming the movie Ned Kelly in Australia. "Mick started playing the guitar a lot," Watts said. "He plays very strange rhythm guitar... very much how Brazilian guitarists play, on the upbeat. It is very much like the guitar on a James Brown track – for a drummer, it's great to play with." New guitarist Mick Taylor stretched out the Stones' sound in "Sway," "Can't You Hear Me Knocking" and "Moonlight Mile." But "Brown Sugar" is a classic Stones stomp, and two of the best cuts are country songs: one forlorn ("Wild Horses") and one funny ("Dead Flowers").
109: Aftermath
The first Stones album completely written by Jagger-Richards was full of bad-boy songs about Swinging London's overnight stars, groupies, hustlers and parasites. It's got tough riffs ("It's Not Easy"), girls seeking kicks ("Under My Thumb"), zooming psychedelia ("Paint It Black") and baroque-folk gallantry ("I Am Waiting").
116: Out Of Our Heads
Here's where the Stones started to leave the R&B and blues covers behind. Their fourth album in America featured three defining Jagger-Richards originals, each a masterpiece of libidinal menace: "The Last Time," the gently vicious "Play With Fire" and "(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction," a song that is the very definition of riff.
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
A charming exuberance pervades the Stones' third U.S. release, with its hot-rod takes on Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Willie Dixon and Muddy Waters. And their "Heart of Stone" introduces a crucial Stones element into the mix: menace.
213: Tattoo You
Tattoo You was lean, tough and bluesy – the Stones relying on their strengths, as if they'd matured into the kind of surefire bluesmen they'd idolized as kids. It spent nine weeks at Number One on the strength of "Start Me Up," in which Mick Jagger snuck the line "You make a dead man come" onto the radio.
270: Some Girls
"Keith @#$%&' gets busted every year," Mick Jagger fumed. Keith Richards was in drug hell, and the Stones were verging on destruction, but they bounced back with "Miss You," the sleazy "Shattered" and "When the Whip Comes Down." Richards does his best song, "Before They Make Me Run."
357: Between The Buttons
Andrew Loog Oldham called it their "most English" album. Music-hall piano abuts the psych-soul of "Ruby Tuesday"; the lovely "She Smiled Sweetly" offsets the great Chuck Berry rip, "Miss Amanda Jones."
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: September 23, 2013 19:59
The two best takes on SFM are both mostly acoustic (the studio version and the Stripped version) imo.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Edward Twining
()
Date: September 23, 2013 20:14
Quote
muffie
Rolling Stone Magazine's 500 Greatest Albums of All Time
The RS 500 was assembled by the editors of Rolling Stone, based on the results of two extensive polls. In 2003, Rolling Stone asked a panel of 271 artists, producers, industry executives and journalists to pick the greatest albums of all time. In 2009, we asked a similar group of 100 experts to pick the best albums of the 2000s. From those results, Rolling Stone created this new list of the greatest albums of all time.
The Rolling Stones band has these entries:
7: Exile On Main Street
32: Let It Bleed
58: Beggar's Banquet
64: Sticky Fingers
109: Aftermath
116: Out Of Our Heads
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
213: Tattoo You
270: Some Girls
357: Between The Buttons
Yes, well i'd rather follow what my ears tell me>
<Very nice to see AFTERMATH recognised though !!
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: September 23, 2013 20:15
Quote
Edward Twining
BEGGARS BANQUET is long before the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity. In a sense, because the album is less heavy, listening from the perspective of today, and knowing the Stones later, more formulaic approach, one can appreciate all the more the subtle little touches of the acoustic and slide playing, which add so greatly to the freshness and effectiveness of the songs...
...if there is a case to be put forward with regard to the pre 1969 output, having an edge over what came after, it is that the music was perhaps a little less predictable.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
duke richardson
()
Date: September 23, 2013 20:57
Quote
Edward TwiningQuote
duke richardson
it sort of sounds like because Beggar's Banquet is so rootsy and not so rock and roll, that's better somehow...?
No, not quite, duke. Just that BEGGARS BANQUET is long before the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity. In a sense, because the album is less heavy, listening from the perspective of today, and knowing the Stones later, more formulaic approach, one can appreciate all the more the subtle little touches of the acoustic and slide playing, which add so greatly to the freshness and effectiveness of the songs. One could argue that a more formulaic approach may have started a little with 'Monkey Man', from LET IT BLEED, although i admit that may seem a little unfair. However, if there is a case to be put forward with regard to the pre 1969 output, having an edge over what came after, it is that the music was perhaps a little less predictable. The true recycling of riffs didn't really come into play until perhaps 73-74, although a certain style of riffing was becoming pretty much the norm by 71-72. I just think with BEGGARS BANQUET it is nice to hear the group approach the songs from a slightly different angle. Even the iconic 'Street Fighting Man' is played primarily using an acoustic, rather than an electric guitar.
otherwise good post but I don't agree with : " the Stones fell into the rock 'n' roll type cliche, where riffs are simply there by habit, rather than because of some true artistic necessity"
if you're talking about songs they rock on, I'd say those riffs belong to them, Keith in particular, especially after Beggars Banquet and Let It Bleed.
I mean, they set the gold standard and weren't following, they were leading. inventing the template that everybody would use for rock and roll, and it did later become kind of mannered..
but they didn't 'fall into it'..they were creating it..
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: September 23, 2013 21:00
A bit of both.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
gimmelittledrink
()
Date: September 23, 2013 21:10
I would rank BB as fourth best of the big four. Still great, though! The one that has risen in my estimation is SF. Hard to find a better group of songs by anyone at anytime. Every song on it has aged extremely well. I still love Exile the most, but I could easily see someone making the case for SF as the best Stones album. I consider BB and LIB to be a tad below the other two only because they don't consistently have the same level of song writing maturity and emotional depth that make Exile and SF so great. For me, each of the big four albums build and slightly improves on the previous albums.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
LieB
()
Date: September 23, 2013 21:17
I agree that Beggars Banquet is better than Let It Bleed, very much because it's more even, unique and inventive in its sound and production. The recordings stand very tall on their own, whereas many of the tracks on Let It Bleed would develop into better songs live.
Like this:
- Sympathy for the Devil -- studio version is the best version ever, with Keith surpassing himself, even though I love the heavy Ya-Ya's version with Keith's and Taylor's solos
- No Expectations -- studio version definite version and BJ's best ever moment
- Dear Doctor -- never done live
- Parachute Woman -- studio version best version
- Jig-Saw Puzzle -- never done live
- Street Fighting Man -- studio version best version, very classic tape-recorder rock 'n' roll
- Prodigal Son -- unique version as well. Great fingerpickin' Keith, fantastic Mick vocal
- Stray Cat Blues -- definitive version
- Factory Girl -- also best version, although rarely played live
- Salt of the Earth -- same as above
- Gimme Shelter -- classic but more powerful live with Mick T. Also many good 90s versions
- Love In Vain -- Ya-Ya's version is better; many great live performances
- Country Honk -- great track but obviously derived from HTW
- Live With Me -- weaker than the great Ya-Ya's version
- Let It Bleed -- never surpassed (no live version even close)
- Midnight Rambler -- live version is more classic for good reason
- You Got the Silver -- definitive version here (could have fit on Beggars)
- Monkey Man -- definitive version here
- YCAGWYW -- better live; my favourites are from '72-73
In the end, I think Sticky Fingers is the Stones most "perfect" album (as someone said) in the "classic rock" sense and as the archetypical Stones album, whereas Exile is their crowning achievement as a wide-spanning masterpiece of different styles glued together with the ultimate Stones sound.
Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-23 21:20 by LieB.
Like this:
- Sympathy for the Devil -- studio version is the best version ever, with Keith surpassing himself, even though I love the heavy Ya-Ya's version with Keith's and Taylor's solos
- No Expectations -- studio version definite version and BJ's best ever moment
- Dear Doctor -- never done live
- Parachute Woman -- studio version best version
- Jig-Saw Puzzle -- never done live
- Street Fighting Man -- studio version best version, very classic tape-recorder rock 'n' roll
- Prodigal Son -- unique version as well. Great fingerpickin' Keith, fantastic Mick vocal
- Stray Cat Blues -- definitive version
- Factory Girl -- also best version, although rarely played live
- Salt of the Earth -- same as above
- Gimme Shelter -- classic but more powerful live with Mick T. Also many good 90s versions
- Love In Vain -- Ya-Ya's version is better; many great live performances
- Country Honk -- great track but obviously derived from HTW
- Live With Me -- weaker than the great Ya-Ya's version
- Let It Bleed -- never surpassed (no live version even close)
- Midnight Rambler -- live version is more classic for good reason
- You Got the Silver -- definitive version here (could have fit on Beggars)
- Monkey Man -- definitive version here
- YCAGWYW -- better live; my favourites are from '72-73
In the end, I think Sticky Fingers is the Stones most "perfect" album (as someone said) in the "classic rock" sense and as the archetypical Stones album, whereas Exile is their crowning achievement as a wide-spanning masterpiece of different styles glued together with the ultimate Stones sound.
Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-23 21:20 by LieB.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: September 23, 2013 21:40
Nice thoughts, LieB, but I strongly oppose your take on "Gimme Shelter". Nothing recorded or played ever by anyone is more 'powerful' than that magical original studio version. Shrives everytime I heard it. Everytime.
- Doxa
- Doxa
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
duke richardson
()
Date: September 23, 2013 21:44
Quote
LieB
I agree that Beggars Banquet is better than Let It Bleed, very much because it's more even, unique and inventive in its sound and production. The recordings stand very tall on their own, whereas many of the tracks on Let It Bleed would develop into better songs live.
Like this:
- Sympathy for the Devil -- studio version is the best version ever, with Keith surpassing himself, even though I love the heavy Ya-Ya's version with Keith's and Taylor's solos
- No Expectations -- studio version definite version and BJ's best ever moment
- Dear Doctor -- never done live
- Parachute Woman -- studio version best version
- Jig-Saw Puzzle -- never done live
- Street Fighting Man -- studio version best version, very classic tape-recorder rock 'n' roll
- Prodigal Son -- unique version as well. Great fingerpickin' Keith, fantastic Mick vocal
- Stray Cat Blues -- definitive version
- Factory Girl -- also best version, although rarely played live
- Salt of the Earth -- same as above
- Gimme Shelter -- classic but more powerful live with Mick T. Also many good 90s versions
- Love In Vain -- Ya-Ya's version is better; many great live performances
- Country Honk -- great track but obviously derived from HTW
- Live With Me -- weaker than the great Ya-Ya's version
- Let It Bleed -- never surpassed (no live version even close)
- Midnight Rambler -- live version is more classic for good reason
- You Got the Silver -- definitive version here (could have fit on Beggars)
- Monkey Man -- definitive version here
- YCAGWYW -- better live; my favourites are from '72-73
In the end, I think Sticky Fingers is the Stones most "perfect" album (as someone said) in the "classic rock" sense and as the archetypical Stones album, whereas Exile is their crowning achievement as a wide-spanning masterpiece of different styles glued together with the ultimate Stones sound.
well its a different band on the live versions of the songs you mentioned..
and no no no , 'Live With Me' the original certainly isn't weaker than the Ya Yas version...please...
yes yes the original Street Fighting Man has not been surpassed live..they're different live, but the original is perfection..same for Sympathy..
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:15
Quote
Edward Twining
I love many of the Stones albums, of course, and especially the big four. However, after reacquainting myself with them once again, i believe BEGGARS BANQUET to be the only one, where i wouldn't choose to change a thing (however small). Whether that's relating to the quality of the songs, the length of the songs, the instrumentation, the sequencing etc. i think with BEGGARS BANQUET the Stones released their most perfect album (or as close to perfection you can possibly get).
Anyone else agree with me?
Yes I agree. I understand what you mean. It is a perfect album despite some minor flaws (Salt, Doctor, and though I really love it, objectively speaking Jig Saw is not up to par despite Brians mellotron).
Tracks like Parachute Woman and NE are fillers but they are perfect golden fillers and some of the greatest songs ever recorded. That is greatness. I love Let it bleed more and hear greatness up until 1981. Despite the debut album (still one of their best albums ever), Aftermath (which has some weak songs), Bleed (my choice), Exile, Fingers, GHS songs on SG, ER and B&B and another fab of mine despite the partly bad mix (iorr) - Beggars is their masterpiece.
So yes I agree.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
buttons67
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:15
beggars banquet is a classic, and i prefer it to let it bleed, but its a matter of opinion, both these albums are great.
love jigsaw puzzle and no expectations, they should have put jj flash and child of the moon in to make it even better.
love jigsaw puzzle and no expectations, they should have put jj flash and child of the moon in to make it even better.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:15
Quote
StonesCatQuote
Spud
Are some things a bit more perfect than others then ?...and some things just a bit perfect
That's kind of how I look at it. Saying LIB is the weakest of the four, it's like a 9.91 instead of 9.98 or 9.99. When you're talking these albums, though, it's like the Champions League of music, best of the best.
Who said that?! Let it bleed? No f-ing way! Sticky is the weakest! >
<Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:18
Yes. Everytime. It does not age one minute. It will never ever grow old. Sympathy? Please. I cant stand it and it's ridicolous and childish. Love the 1975 version.Quote
Doxa
Nice thoughts, LieB, but I strongly oppose your take on "Gimme Shelter". Nothing recorded or played ever by anyone is more 'powerful' than that magical original studio version. Shrives everytime I heard it. Everytime.
- Doxa
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
walkingthedog
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:26
Quote
Edward TwiningQuote
muffie
Rolling Stone Magazine's 500 Greatest Albums of All Time
The RS 500 was assembled by the editors of Rolling Stone, based on the results of two extensive polls. In 2003, Rolling Stone asked a panel of 271 artists, producers, industry executives and journalists to pick the greatest albums of all time. In 2009, we asked a similar group of 100 experts to pick the best albums of the 2000s. From those results, Rolling Stone created this new list of the greatest albums of all time.
The Rolling Stones band has these entries:
7: Exile On Main Street
32: Let It Bleed
58: Beggar's Banquet
64: Sticky Fingers
109: Aftermath
116: Out Of Our Heads
180: The Rolling Stones Now!
213: Tattoo You
270: Some Girls
357: Between The Buttons
Yes, well i'd rather follow what my ears tell me>
Very nice to see AFTERMATH recognised though !!
I agree. BB is my no.1 too, although LIB and SF are pretty close. I rank Exile
below these three. My main complaint about the RS list,though, is the omission of GHS.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Edward Twining
()
Date: September 23, 2013 22:36
Quote
Redhotcarpet
Yes I agree. I understand what you mean. It is a perfect album despite some minor flaws (Salt, Doctor, and though I really love it, objectively speaking Jig Saw is not up to par despite Brians mellotron).
Tracks like Parachute Woman and NE are fillers but they are perfect golden fillers and some of the greatest songs ever recorded.
So yes I agree.
I don't think any of them are fillers, though, Redhotcarpet.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
LieB
()
Date: September 23, 2013 23:17
Quote
Doxa
Nice thoughts, LieB, but I strongly oppose your take on "Gimme Shelter". Nothing recorded or played ever by anyone is more 'powerful' than that magical original studio version. Shrives everytime I heard it. Everytime.
- Doxa
Yeah, on second thought you're right. The studio Gimme Shelter is probably the definitive version. The combination of Keith's guitar intro, Mick's overdriven harmonica and Mary Clayton's incredible vocals is right there in rock 'n' roll history. I just happen to love the best '72 performances because of Mick Taylor's lead and the overall live feel.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
camper88
()
Date: September 23, 2013 23:44
.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-03-28 16:58 by camper88.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-03-28 16:58 by camper88.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
LieB
()
Date: September 23, 2013 23:50
Quote
camper88
As others have noted, if you have the opportunity to release an album with a new song called Jumping Jack Flash on it but choose not to, have you made your album more or less perfect?
Had JJF been recorded today or even in 1971, the Stones would not have hesitated to put it on a studio album. But the sixties was a different time, when singles mattered and great songs were saved for 45s and not always put on albums. 1968 was right at the time when albums really started to be a popular and serious artform, and yeah, Jumpin' Jack would have fit on Beggars, IMHO. But it's also a perfectly sequenced album without it. And Exile would have been 99.9% Exile without Tumbling Dice, in my opinion.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
camper88
()
Date: September 24, 2013 00:00
.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-03-28 16:57 by camper88.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-03-28 16:57 by camper88.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
LieB
()
Date: September 24, 2013 00:04
Quote
camper88Quote
LieB
Jumpin' Jack would have fit on Beggars, IMHO. But it's also a perfectly sequenced album without it.
I understand how songs were sold and marketed in the 60's by some folks (not all)
But let's imagine it's 1968 and you walk into a record store to see a display of the new Stones album, Beggar's Banquet, except there are two versions: one includes JJF and the other doesn't. You've only got enough money to buy one copy of one album. Which one do you buy?
Yeah... I suppose that's what the people over at London/Abkco in America figured long before '68.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: September 24, 2013 00:25
Quote
Edward TwiningQuote
Redhotcarpet
Yes I agree. I understand what you mean. It is a perfect album despite some minor flaws (Salt, Doctor, and though I really love it, objectively speaking Jig Saw is not up to par despite Brians mellotron).
Tracks like Parachute Woman and NE are fillers but they are perfect golden fillers and some of the greatest songs ever recorded.
So yes I agree.
I don't think any of them are fillers, though, Redhotcarpet.
Me neither. They are songs on an album. You are right. Short and curlies is a filler. PArachute Woman is a classic blues rock shuffle.
Re: 'Beggars Banquet' - the most perfect Stones album.
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: September 24, 2013 00:54
Tracks like Parachute Woman and NE are fillers....
HECK!! wait till ya hear Tempest ... they coulda used that thing ta stop the decay in King Kong's cavities ....
ROCKMAN
HECK!! wait till ya hear Tempest ... they coulda used that thing ta stop the decay in King Kong's cavities ....
ROCKMAN
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