It wasn't a good gig

Nothing new with this audio quality?

EDIT: However, I had my weekly listen to kleerie-channel this morning, and was enjoying a real 1971-show, with their real equipment. Despite the mediocre sound quality, the Roundhouse-show rocks big time compared to the lazy and clean Leeds-show, imo



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2015-01-15 22:03 by DandelionPowderman.

Good grief what was Taylor doing during the choruses of Honky Tonk Women? It's funny how Charlie turned the beat around in after the first line in the first verse.

Quote
DandelionPowderman
It wasn't a good gig

How dare you!

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Despite the mediocre sound quality, the Roundhouse-show rocks big time compared to the lazy and clean Leeds-show, imo

Yeah I agree! If there is a Stones God, back then he made Glyn Jones tape this gig with the Mobile Unit...

I got 2 versions of Roundhouse."Good quality" in old terms only.
Which is the best version around?

Quote
dcba

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Despite the mediocre sound quality, the Roundhouse-show rocks big time compared to the lazy and clean Leeds-show, imo

Yeah I agree! If there is a Stones God, back then he made Glyn Jones tape this gig with the Mobile Unit...

Doubt even the God johns could fix this one.
Never understood why the band went from the ampeg full force guitar sound to the lifeless tinny sound of 1971..
The difference between the 1969/70 tour versus the farewell tour is incredible.

Quote
Eleanor Rigby

Quote
dcba

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Despite the mediocre sound quality, the Roundhouse-show rocks big time compared to the lazy and clean Leeds-show, imo

Yeah I agree! If there is a Stones God, back then he made Glyn Jones tape this gig with the Mobile Unit...

Doubt even the God johns could fix this one.
Never understood why the band went from the ampeg full force guitar sound to the lifeless tinny sound of 1971..
The difference between the 1969/70 tour versus the farewell tour is incredible.

Roundhouse IS all Ampeg. For Leeds and the Marquee-show they used Fenders. Especially Keith sounded awful on Fender, imo.

Compare, say, his Live With Me-sound on Ya Yas and on Leeds...

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
Eleanor Rigby

Quote
dcba

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Despite the mediocre sound quality, the Roundhouse-show rocks big time compared to the lazy and clean Leeds-show, imo

Yeah I agree! If there is a Stones God, back then he made Glyn Jones tape this gig with the Mobile Unit...

Doubt even the God johns could fix this one.
Never understood why the band went from the ampeg full force guitar sound to the lifeless tinny sound of 1971..
The difference between the 1969/70 tour versus the farewell tour is incredible.

Roundhouse IS all Ampeg. For Leeds and the Marquee-show they used Fenders. Especially Keith sounded awful on Fender, imo.

Compare, say, his Live With Me-sound on Ya Yas and on Leeds...

Really?
Ill trust u on that one.
The Roundhouse is still not that strong a show.
Is it Coventry that sounds "strong"? Id have to revisit my bootlegs!
Alternatively. ..video james can organise us all a soundboard brighton :-)

We know through the Glyn Johns book that Richards was going to play Wild Horses on his 12 string at the Marquee, but he fell asleep. So I imagine Taylor played electric and had a beautiful solo, no doubt.

Quote
Erik_Snow
Thanks

One can argue with Zentgraf - but one can't argue with the news-articles of March 1971.....how would they come up with the titles "Can't You Hear Me Knockin" and "Wild Horses" before the record was released, unless the reporter heard the words with his/her own ears....

IOW....Zentgraf forgot to list CYHMK in his setlist

Midnight Rambler, too...

Because of the other two 1971 threads I felt obliged to go over the 5 pages of this one. To start with, ErikSnow and several others did an admirable lot of reading/analyzing about a difficult subject, the 1971 setlists, that I need to tell Erik that in 1971 also promotional material was "leaked" to journalists before the actual release of SF. And journalists have proven in my almost 70 years long life to "sometimes" have an amazing imagination. So much, that I've learned not to trust them until I'm proven wrong.
I was so fortunate to get to know Mick Taylor as an open minded, clear and no nonsence person, and I will try to contact him on the 1971 CYHMK issue. Talking about reliable resources, I think that Ian Stewart's (registered) data are a far more reliable resource than newspaper/music magazine resources. One could fill encyclopedia full of wrong/misleading information of the latter. So sad.
But our joint goal is to achieve the real 1971 tour complete setlist and we aren't far away

Quote
georgie48
Because of the other two 1971 threads I felt obliged to go over the 5 pages of this one. To start with, ErikSnow and several others did an admirable lot of reading/analyzing about a difficult subject, the 1971 setlists, that I need to tell Erik that in 1971 also promotional material was "leaked" to journalists before the actual release of SF. And journalists have proven in my almost 70 years long life to "sometimes" have an amazing imagination. So much, that I've learned not to trust them until I'm proven wrong.
I was so fortunate to get to know Mick Taylor as an open minded, clear and no nonsence person, and I will try to contact him on the 1971 CYHMK issue. Talking about reliable resources, I think that Ian Stewart's (registered) data are a far more reliable resource than newspaper/music magazine resources. One could fill encyclopedia full of wrong/misleading information of the latter. So sad.
But our joint goal is to achieve the real 1971 tour complete setlist and we aren't far away

Great post!

Quote
Erik_Snow

Also funny to read the Leeds 1971 article/review, which says this about the Leeds show, concerning the song following "Live With Me" :
" [....] An obscure track from the "Flowers" collection was next, prior to a change of pace and their ode to young groupies "Stray Cat Blues" [....]"

So Dead Flowers is an obscure track from the Flowers collection? Funny!

It was a review from the Manchester concert, not Leeds.

So guys I have made note of how jacked up the 1971 UK Tour shows are at setlist.fm and i'm trying to get them corrected.

Last night I reread a portion of Greenfield's book where he lists the following songs played at these two shows..

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

Why do we believe CYHMK was played at the early show? Because Keith and Bobby Keys said so? Does Bill Wyman document this anywhere? I have most of the books so just point me in the right direction.

I want your help to get the Stones portion of setlist.fm as accurate as possible. The bottom line is that it appears first in most google searches so it's important for it to be correct.

childofthemoon
moderator
setlist.fm



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2018-01-26 17:13 by mnewman505.

Quote
mnewman505
So guys I have made note of how jacked up the 1971 UK Tour shows are at setlist.fm and i'm trying to get them corrected.

Last night I reread a portion of Greenfield's book where he lists the following songs played at these two shows..

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

Why do we believe CYHMK was played at the early show? Because Keith and Bobby Keys said so? Does Bill Wyman document this anywhere? I have most of the books so just point me in the right direction.

I want your help to get the Stones portion of setlist.fm as accurate as possible. The bottom line is that it appears first in most google searches so it's important for it to be correct.

childofthemoon
moderator
setlist.fm

Maybe it's because it was discussed on this thread, which might have some useful infos for you: [iorr.org]

Quote
mnewman505
So guys I have made note of how jacked up the 1971 UK Tour shows are at setlist.fm and i'm trying to get them corrected.

Last night I reread a portion of Greenfield's book where he lists the following songs played at these two shows..

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

Why do we believe CYHMK was played at the early show? Because Keith and Bobby Keys said so? Does Bill Wyman document this anywhere? I have most of the books so just point me in the right direction.

I want your help to get the Stones portion of setlist.fm as accurate as possible. The bottom line is that it appears first in most google searches so it's important for it to be correct.

childofthemoon
moderator
setlist.fm

«[....] The rest of the set is built on the emotional platform created by that number ["Midnight Rambler"] A new song follows, "Can't You Hear Me Knocking", fast and jumpy in the same vein as "Jumpin Jack Flash" marred only by some flat picking by Keith on his plexiglass model. His gutty tone makes way for Taylor's more refined approach. Jagger retires for a moment to the sidelines, puts on his cap, and then turns to Jim Price, as if to say "going all right ennit". Another very melodic, new cut called "Wild Horses"- "they couldn't drag me away" sweeps melodically in. [....]"
(from Melody Maker 03/71)»

«Thanks to Jean Marie's 1971/1973 books, I've finally found it black on white (once again) that both Wild Horses and Can't You Hear Me Knockin was performed.....at least in Newcastle 1971
(it's also mentioned in David Dalton's book which was published in 1971.....allthough not with the same words as these press reports compiled by Jean Marie)»

[iorr.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-01-26 17:19 by DandelionPowderman.

LOL, Cristiano - you beat me to it

Quote
DandelionPowderman
LOL, Cristiano - you beat me to it

Great minds think alike!

Ok, what show was it played at? The early show or the late show? I don't see where that is made clear. Greenfield says no encore was played at the first show and that Sympathy and Let it Rock were encores for the last show.

How does this look?

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Can't You Hear Me Knocking
Wild Horses
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-01-26 17:47 by mnewman505.

Quote
mnewman505
Ok, what show was it played at? The early show or the late show? I don't see where that is made clear. Greenfield says no encore was played at the first show and that Sympathy and Let it Rock were encores for the last show.

How does this look?

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Can't You Hear Me Knocking
Wild Horses
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

NME seems to suggest that CYHMK follows MR, and that WH was up next after CYHMK.

Quote
mnewman505
So guys I have made note of how jacked up the 1971 UK Tour shows are at setlist.fm and i'm trying to get them corrected.

Last night I reread a portion of Greenfield's book where he lists the following songs played at these two shows..

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

Why do we believe CYHMK was played at the early show? Because Keith and Bobby Keys said so? Does Bill Wyman document this anywhere? I have most of the books so just point me in the right direction.

I want your help to get the Stones portion of setlist.fm as accurate as possible. The bottom line is that it appears first in most google searches so it's important for it to be correct.

childofthemoon
moderator
setlist.fm

just to compare:

Newcastle March 4, 1971 1st show (14 songs):

Jumping Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love In Vain
I Got The Blues
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man
Let It Rock

2nd show (15 songs):

Jumping Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man
Sympathy For The Devil
Let It Rock

Bill Wyman's CYHMK is only mentioned in his book (great book but not 100% reliable) and some refer to that ...
Satisfaction wasn't skipped anywhere, not even at the 8 songs short setlist of March 26.

Quote
georgie48

Quote
mnewman505
So guys I have made note of how jacked up the 1971 UK Tour shows are at setlist.fm and i'm trying to get them corrected.

Last night I reread a portion of Greenfield's book where he lists the following songs played at these two shows..

The Rolling Stones
Newcastle City Hall
Newcastle England
4 March 1971

[Early show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Love in Vain @Cover
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

[Late show]
Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man

E: Sympathy for the Devil
E: Let It Rock

Why do we believe CYHMK was played at the early show? Because Keith and Bobby Keys said so? Does Bill Wyman document this anywhere? I have most of the books so just point me in the right direction.

I want your help to get the Stones portion of setlist.fm as accurate as possible. The bottom line is that it appears first in most google searches so it's important for it to be correct.

childofthemoon
moderator
setlist.fm

just to compare:

Newcastle March 4, 1971 1st show (14 songs):

Jumping Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love In Vain
I Got The Blues
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man
Let It Rock

2nd show (15 songs):

Jumping Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Bitch
Honky Tonk Women
Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Brown Sugar
Street Fighting Man
Sympathy For The Devil
Let It Rock

Bill Wyman's CYHMK is only mentioned in his book (great book but not 100% reliable) and some refer to that ...
Satisfaction wasn't skipped anywhere, not even at the 8 songs short setlist of March 26.

I don't think NME referred to that

It sounds to me like there are conflicting sources here.

Quote
mnewman505
It sounds to me like there are conflicting sources here.

There's little info, but Wyman, NME and Jean-Marie all claim in their books/magazines that the songs were played.

So, I don't think there are conflicting sources (if there are more sources at all?).

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
mnewman505
It sounds to me like there are conflicting sources here.

There's little info, but Wyman, NME and Jean-Marie all claim in their books/magazines that the songs were played.

So, I don't think there are conflicting sources (if there are more sources at all?).

Really? Robert Greenfield says exactly 12 songs were played at the early show and CYHMK wasn't one of them. I"m not saying he's correct but that's a conflicting source.

Quote
mnewman505

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
mnewman505
It sounds to me like there are conflicting sources here.

There's little info, but Wyman, NME and Jean-Marie all claim in their books/magazines that the songs were played.

So, I don't think there are conflicting sources (if there are more sources at all?).

Really? Robert Greenfield says exactly 12 songs were played at the early show and CYHMK wasn't one of them. I"m not saying he's correct but that's a conflicting source.

I missed the word «early» (early show) in your post!

Then, there are conflicting sources indeed.

Quote
mnewman505
It sounds to me like there are conflicting sources here.

That's what it looks like.

From Record Mirror, 13 March 1971:

Jumpin' Jack Flash
Live With Me
Dead Flowers
Stray Cat Blues
Love in Vain
Prodigal Son
Midnight Rambler
Wild Horses
Honky Tonk Women
Satisfaction
Little Queenie
Street Fighting Man

Don't you guys think that MM maybe got it wrong? The song they are talking about seems to be after "Rambler". That could very well be "Bitch". It was played there, and it was a new track from Sticky Fingers. Has the horns, and it wold be understandable for MM to get it wrong.
Jean Marie can't be called a 'source'. JM put great books together, but they are compilations of other people's articles.

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
Don't you guys think that MM maybe got it wrong? The song they are talking about seems to be after "Rambler". That could very well be "Bitch". It was played there, and it was a new track from Sticky Fingers. Has the horns, and it wold be understandable for MM to get it wrong.
Jean Marie can't be called a 'source'. JM put great books together, but they are compilations of other people's articles.

Could be, but what about the description of Taylor's playing - on what NME named as CYHMK?

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
Don't you guys think that MM maybe got it wrong? The song they are talking about seems to be after "Rambler". That could very well be "Bitch". It was played there, and it was a new track from Sticky Fingers. Has the horns, and it wold be understandable for MM to get it wrong.
Jean Marie can't be called a 'source'. JM put great books together, but they are compilations of other people's articles.

Could be, but what about the description of Taylor's playing - on what NME named as CYHMK?

Where is a quote by NME mentioning CYHMK?