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Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: drbryant ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:02

Someone said that the sound in their section on the floor was good. As a dedicated audiophile, I can tell you that this is possible, even if the sound is echoing all over the place. The odds are good that you were in a "sweet spot" -- the apex of an equilateral triangle with the two main speakers. From this position, with two main speakers blasting the same music, you should get a solid monoblock of sound that seems to come from the center of the stage. Consider yourself lucky, everyone else was awash in echo.

We went through the "brain damage" panic last year. It clearly isn't that. If you see him at the RnR Hall of Fame Introduction he did of the Ronettes, he's clear and lucid. I suspect that it is substances of some kind. Perhaps "naughty" substances, perhaps flu medication, perhaps pain killers for his arthritis or for the injury he suffered. I do not think that it is a permanent disability. He clearly wasn't "right" in Frankfurt, and we are all worried for him. Let's see how he does in Paris.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: FoolToCry ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:03

the longest rambler & the lowest keith
...but step by step...

1. start me up - great opener, good solo by ronnie, solid version
2. you got me rocking - keith missed his solo spot, ronnie was great on slide
3. rough justice - again ronnie did a very long solo, much longer than on the studio version.
4. bitch - very muddy sound, the brass, the guitars, the drums; like "shit dolby surround sound" - but nice to hear.
5. monkey man - one highlight. everybody in the band was on fire. long than usual slide solo by ronnie, chuck wanted to go to the refrain, but they did another solo verse
6. sweet virginia - mick tried to sing along with the audience, but nobody knew the words....
7. midnight rambler - THE highlight of the evening. 1st time this summer, very long (i looked at my watch - ca 14 min. !!!), the audience loved it!!
8. i´ll go crazy - tough!!! lisa was great!!! ronnie & charlie played very exactly and mick sung fanatastic.
9. tumblin´ dice - good version, keith did a solo in the outro (this was a good one)!!
10. introduction - charlie played a "little drum solo" with a smile on his face.
11. wanna hold you - comparing to the berlin `98 version it was very weak. keith only played intro & outro and tried something in the bridge.
12. before they make me run - keith f+++ed up the intro - ronnie helped. not a very good version.
13. iorr - keith did a great solo for the first time of the show.
14. respectable - ok version
15. satisfaction - the crowd went nuts...rough & good version
16. honky tonk women - well, i don´t like this "blues brothers brass live version"
17. sympathy for the devil - during the 1st keith solo charlie left his drums - only the backing & chuck rolled on. don´t know what happenend. then keith did a second solo, this one was really great. like the 68´s studio version.
18. paint it, black - very good intro by keith, the crowd loved it
19. brown sugar - just rocking
20. jjf - great encore, long version - keith thought "how can i stop":-)

small audience - but very loud
for a stadium show a great setlist - "let it bleed" theme
horrible sound
mick & ronnie very strong
charlie good as usual
...and keith...i think it was all said & (not to much) done....

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: Baboon Bro ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:07

Thank ya, FoolToCry... But did ya notice this [marked ***** by me ]:

"9. tumblin´ dice - good version, keith did a solo in the outro (this was a good one ***** )!!
10. introduction - charlie played a "little drum solo" with a smile on his face.
11. wanna hold you - comparing to the berlin `98 version it was very weak. keith only played intro & outro and tried something in the bridge.
12. before they make me run - keith f+++ed up the intro - ronnie helped. not a very good version.
13. iorr - keith did a great solo for the first time ***** of the show. "

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: phd ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:08

drbryant Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We went through the "brain damage" panic last
> year. It clearly isn't that. If you see him at
> the RnR Hall of Fame Introduction he did of the
> Ronettes, he's clear and lucid. I suspect that it
> is substances of some kind. Perhaps "naughty"
> substances, perhaps flu medication, perhaps pain
> killers for his arthritis or for the injury he
> suffered. I do not think that it is a permanent
> disability. He clearly wasn't "right" in
> Frankfurt, and we are all worried for him. Let's
> see how he does in Paris.

I hope you are right. But as from reports, Keith seems to be in 1 show out of 2, he should be good in Paris and absent in Lyon. As I attend both shows I will see by myself and give here my opinion.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: firebird ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:08

>>Someone said that the sound in their section on the floor was good.

That was me. I was a few meters behind the B-Stage for most of the show, sound was good there. I forgot to mention that during the B-stage set i went directly to the B-stage and the sound there was horrible. I thought it was because of the B-stage monitors but after reading all the things here about the sound I'm not longer sure about this.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Date: June 14, 2007 19:16

firebird Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>Someone said that the sound in their section on
> the floor was good.
>
> That was me. I was a few meters behind the B-Stage
> for most of the show, sound was good there.

and I second that! At least in B2, the sound was clear and well-mixed sounding. I was to Charlie's direct left on the B-stage and no problems with the sound quality there either.

I must've been in the "sweet spot"
smiling smiley
I feel bad for anyone who spent all that time & money on the show and didn't enjoy it. I felt I got my money's worth, no complaints at all!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-14 19:21 by NumberOneStonesFan.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: drbryant ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:17

firebird Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>Someone said that the sound in their section on
> the floor was good.
>
> That was me. I was a few meters behind the B-Stage
> for most of the show, sound was good there. I
> forgot to mention that during the B-stage set i
> went directly to the B-stage and the sound there
> was horrible. I thought it was because of the
> B-stage monitors but after reading all the things
> here about the sound I'm not longer sure about
> this.

The B-Stage sounds about right, since Frankfurt was a short field. Let me ask you this -- did the sound appear to come from the center of the stage, as opposed to from the speakers. If so, that's the sweet spot. Just like listening to a mono record on a good set of stereo speakers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-14 19:20 by drbryant.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: drbryant ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:23

FoolToCry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the longest rambler & the lowest keith
> ...but step by step...

> > 10. introduction - charlie played a "little drum
> solo" with a smile on his face.
> 17. sympathy for the devil - during the 1st keith
> solo charlie left his drums - only the backing &
> chuck rolled on. don´t know what happenend. then
> keith did a second solo, this one was really
> great. like the 68´s studio version.
> 18. paint it, black - very good intro by keith,
> the crowd loved it
> 19. brown sugar - just rocking
> 20. jjf - great encore, long version - keith
> thought "how can i stop":-)
>
Thanks for this message. It is easy to remember the negatives, but you are right, Keith picked it up considerably during the second solo of SFTD, and was strong for the remainder of the show even tho he still looked dazed.

And that drum solo from Charlie was a very special moment, indeed. Loved that.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: micwer ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:31

I heard that JJF was phenomenal. You guys confirm?

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: firebird ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:32

drbryant Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> firebird Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >>Someone said that the sound in their section
> on
> > the floor was good.
> >
> > That was me. I was a few meters behind the
> B-Stage
> > for most of the show, sound was good there. I
> > forgot to mention that during the B-stage set i
> > went directly to the B-stage and the sound
> there
> > was horrible. I thought it was because of the
> > B-stage monitors but after reading all the
> things
> > here about the sound I'm not longer sure about
> > this.
>
> The B-Stage sounds about right, since Frankfurt
> was a short field. Let me ask you this -- did the
> sound appear to come from the center of the stage,
> as opposed to from the speakers. If so, that's
> the sweet spot. Just like listening to a mono
> record on a good set of stereo speakers.

Well i know those effect like sweet spot you are talking about, i am an active musician and i'm also into mixing and mastering. I went straight there after entering the venue since i knew the sweet spot would be somewhere around there. As i said, that was a few meters behind the b-stage and since i could see very good there and the sound was also good i stayed there most of the time. Directly at the b-stage the sound was a mess. now that im thinking more about it, it must have been PA sound i heard since it had a big delay between the band doing something and me hearing the sound. i think i would have noticed the the b-stage monitors becase of the delay, so my concluson is, the main PA sound was horrible at the b-stage.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: rknuth ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:40

drbryant Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Someone said that the sound in their section on
> the floor was good. As a dedicated audiophile, I
> can tell you that this is possible, even if the
> sound is echoing all over the place. The odds are
> good that you were in a "sweet spot" -- the apex

I'm also an dedicated audiophile but the one telling
the sound was great in their section isn't for sure!

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: rknuth ()
Date: June 14, 2007 19:51

> the main PA sound was horrible at the b-stage.

That's just school physics!

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: stoneswashed77 ()
Date: June 14, 2007 20:04

it is true that a few songs were played longer and especially midnight rambler.
but not because the stones intented to or felt inspired to, they simply had problems to all change at the same time to another part of a song, and then someone played another solo to try again to go to the bridge afterwards.

especially with midnight rambler with all that tempo changes they looked a lot at each other and had a hard fight with that song to finish it.
keith had problems to slow it down and then to speed it up again in the end.
if there wasn´t charlie it wouldn´t have worked, but actually it would have been keith´s job do do that.

i can confirm that jjf was good. keith was good with his intro and very good at the outro.

what someone else said about some good solos from keith i can´t confirm.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: bumbum ()
Date: June 14, 2007 20:35

25.000 people at the consert:

[www.fr-online.de]

[www.rhein-main.net]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-14 20:36 by bumbum.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: svendborg ()
Date: June 14, 2007 20:51

bumbum Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 25.000 people at the consert:


Well that's a bit of failure then if there were 50.000 tickets on sale :-(

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: stickydion ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:00

Babylon wrote:

(1) Ôhey shouldn't have announced a stadium tour like this but a tour in smaller arenas. They would have been sold out, people are happy about a smaller venue and it's not that stressy for the Stones."

Sorry, i cannot understand this "judging from a gig" method, as if the situation will be the same in Scandinavia, France, Spain, Budapest, Bucharest... If the Stones are to playing in front of one million (+) people this summer, how on earth could they do it in arenas? Doing ...85 arena shows? Frankfurt had probably the smaller stadium crowd of this european leg, but even this crowd is 2 arenas.


(2) "If you have to give away free tickets (someone said 7.000?!) to fill a stadium half - isn't that a shame?"

IMO, no. Actually, prices is a shame. Giving away tickets is the counterbalance to the highest, silly prices. That's not a fair method, of course, because other people have paid a lot, much earlier. But that's another story.

Who knows, maybe this "7,000 free tickets" story is as true, as the audience's photo taken in seven o' clock...

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: erikjjf ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:00

svendborg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bumbum Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> > 25.000 people at the consert:
>
>
> Well that's a bit of failure then if there were 50.000 tickets on sale :-(

There were never 50,000 tickets on sale for this show.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: svendborg ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:13

erikjjf Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> svendborg Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > bumbum Wrote:

>
> There were never 50,000 tickets on sale for this
> show.

I presumed there were, as it says so in tour guide on IORR :-)

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: erikjjf ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:14

The IORR tour guide lists the capacity of the venue. Not specifically for the Stones.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: Ludwig8745 ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:24

micwer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I heard that JJF was phenomenal. You guys
> confirm?


Yes, just as the whole evening.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: drbryant ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:42

rknuth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > the main PA sound was horrible at the b-stage.
>
> That's just school physics!


The B-Stage has other problems. Unless you are about 10 inches taller than the people around you, people are packed so tight, that there is no way you are going to hear the audio clean from the front speakers -- you should notice that there are no highs and that the sound is muffled -- similar to sitting in the middle of a standing crowd. The other problem, of course is that you hear both the sound at the B-Stage and the sound coming from the main speakers (which is slightly delayed in the large venue) -- consider that you can hear charlie's drums live and ouch -- what a mess. But damn, the view is great from there.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: Kobyis ()
Date: June 14, 2007 21:54

And why has B stage bad sound?? Why are not the same quality?
I think, it is very hard to play for drummer, if he hear the sound from main PA later than he plays, isnt it?

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: Stoneswolf ()
Date: June 14, 2007 22:11

micwer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I heard that JJF was phenomenal. You guys
> confirm?

it was just normal (or slightly under average) whereas most other songs were far from acceptable. (Besides Sweet Viginia as luckily Mick was leading here with his accoustic guitar. Perhaps he should do more guitar work on days where keith needs some rest)

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: stoneswashed77 ()
Date: June 14, 2007 22:38

micwer Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------
> I heard that JJF was phenomenal. You guys
> confirm?

-------------------------------------------------
stoneswolf wrote:

it was just normal (or slightly under average) whereas most other songs were far from acceptable. (Besides Sweet Viginia as luckily Mick was leading here with his accoustic guitar. Perhaps he should do more guitar work on days where keith needs some rest)

--------------

couldn´t have said it better!

i also hoped for the whole show that ronnie would try to lead a little more.
for example when keith stopped playing during TD, i mean that da da da, da da da
but of course his guitar was standard tuning.
very often when there was trouble during songs mick went to charlie or chuck with the singers, not to one of the guitarists.
this is a guitar band isn´t it, not much guitar playing last night.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: LA FORUM ()
Date: June 14, 2007 23:07

The Stones Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Baboon Bro Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Dont forget he is
> > a drug addict: a junkie will always be a
> junkie.
>
> Do we know this for sure. Is it a fact or just
> mere speculation.
> Shouldn't we rather say (or maybe wish) he used to
> be a junkie and now he's only into smoking and
> drinking?


He sais himself he did coke when he snorted his father. And Disney forced him to pretend it was a joke. Dunno bout other drugs but he smokes weed and he did use heroin n the late 90s. He probably uses different drugs now and then and smoke weed. But not like in the old days of course.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: with sssoul ()
Date: June 14, 2007 23:31

>> he did coke when he snorted his father. <<

which was five years ago, and he never said it was a joke. (his PR people did, but he didn't.)
what he said is that he doesn't use coke *now*.

>> he did use heroin n the late 90s <<

i reckon you mean the interview where he said he tried it once early in the B2B tour and didn't get off on it.
(saying he "used heroin" sounds like you mean "regularly", so i'm just finetuning.)

meanwhile DrBryant's point (posted somewhere here) seems worth keeping in mind:
the erraticism could well be caused by medication rather than "naughty substances".

in any case: all kinds of blessings & well-being on Keith and all the Stones



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-14 23:57 by with sssoul.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: stoneswashed77 ()
Date: June 15, 2007 00:01

sorry, but which medication are you thinking of that sets him into this condition?
i doubt that completely!
propably he gets medication, but then it would be worse without it.
not the medication causing the problem.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: windmelody ()
Date: June 15, 2007 00:04

Well, well! It was great to be at the show, there was a ridiculous ticketchaos, but we managed to get good seats. It was fine to meet some very gentle people who are writing on this board, really a pleasure. The sound in the stadium is horrible indeed, but Mick and Charlie were impressing. Ronnie was not great, I am sorry to say that Keith was in a very, very bad condition. I was really shocked to hear him perform that way. Yet it was a Stonesshow, the charisma of this band catches you over and over again. Keith could hardly talk, but somehow I had to cheer for him a lot. Till yesterday I have been a confessing setlistmoaner, but last night I realized that it is pointlest to expect special songs if Ronnie and Keith do not even bother to play the right chords. I do not expect any technical guitarplaying by the Stones, but playing the wrong chords for two hours is almost funny. The best guitareplayer was Blondie Chaplin.Once again, my deepest respect goes to Charlie and Mick. I wonder what Charlie thought during the show. I wish the Stones a lot of pleasure on this tour, and to all the fans that travel with them I wish even more!

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: Four Stone Walls ()
Date: June 15, 2007 00:15

No matter how good Mick and Charlie are - and I can totally believe that they were very good - Mick and Charlie are not a R&R band.

R&R music - it's a BAND thing.

Stating the obvious really.

Two cylinders firing perfectly do not a synchronised engine make.

IOW Start Me Up has great Keith and Ronnie, however, so it can still be done - but not consistently every two to three days perhaps.

Re: Frankfurt reports here please
Posted by: stoneswashed77 ()
Date: June 15, 2007 00:16

i could have written that windmelody, so thank you,

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