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Rocky Dijon
After BRIDGES, there was a great deal of speculation, some allegedly confirmed, that Keith was suffering writer's block. It certainly fit. When Mick turned out GODDESS IN THE DOORWAY, Keith was busy cutting covers. I thought the two that surfaced were amazing, but they were covers. Friends who were fortunate enough to hear other tracks Keith cut (including a duet with Al Green) thought the material was equally terrific, but when pressed acknowledged they were cover versions. Keith seemingly supported Mick (in the same fashion as Matt Clifford or Dave Stewart) in crafting A BIGGER BANG. Apart from interpreting the lyrics of "Infamy" to imply Keith was creatively stifled with Mick calling the shots or refusing to work together, there seemed to be supporting evidence that Keith's creative juices were shot. Another source claimed Keith's arthritis had progressed to the point that playing guitar was challenging and his head injury coupled with years of abuse seemed to suggest this was also reliable.

When LIFE was published, we learned Keith had tore Studio L out of his house after Patti was diagnosed with cancer. He also stopped playing guitar. Now we had a different story, but it still amounted to the same. Keith wasn't playing and wasn't creative. He was a spent force. For the better part of a decade, Steve Jordan tried regularly to get Keith to work. In late 2007, he suggested they record a few tracks and put them out online. Recordings took place with the Winos and other musicians, but it was confirmed they were merely re-recording Stones songs Keith originally sang and some songs from his two solo albums. Again, he was creatively spent.

Then CROSSEYED HEART comes along and we learn most of the songs had their origins during the very period Keith was allegedly dried up and not writing songs. Reliable sources even identified some of the tracks as being material they heard over the years. During promotion, Keith and Steve Jordan made it clear that Steve got Keith writing again and that Keith was essentially retired during these years apart from a few guest sessions for friends.

So now we come to Mick. Following A BIGGER BANG, we saw Mick heading for the vaults to unearth tracks, rework unfinished tracks, and anthologize material first for his solo career and then the Stones. Those who recall seeing unreleased Stones tracks being digitized as early as 2001 in BEING MICK were hardly surprised. Keith later said he believed this was all they had left. Consider their ages. They were in their mid-sixties. It was hardly surprising that they slowed down. The end of the Virgin contract seemed appropriate. The next contract would be about exploiting the past, not exploring new territory. Mick had film and television projects to keep him occupied as a producer.

Over the course of several years, Dave Stewart managed to get Mick to finish SUPERHEAVY. Dave's original plan was ambitious. Corporate support from Nokia who would sell downloads of the album with every phone. The aim was to make a splash and have the band play the London Olympics in 2012. The media thought otherwise. They were only interested in the 50th anniversary of the Stones. There were issues there. Keith, in particular, was pretty rusty when he played live. Ronnie had been on his own battling his demons. Then there was the endless copy over the "tiny todger" remark. It was something Keith had said to the press long before LIFE was published, but the book gave it new mileage. Mick was a laughing stock and Keith was a hero for most. Others sympathized with Mick for having to work with an alcoholic jerk who behaves as alcoholics do in saying hurtful things. Most imagined a few celebratory shows for the anniversary were the best you could hope for.

Then it happened again. Once they played live after finally proving they could click again, there was a new muse for Mick (a ballerina straight out of "Rocks Off"), the ever-present blues album was becoming a real possibility, and there were all these songs of varying quality (some dance tracks, some experimental, some bluesy, some sounding like vintage Stones) that Mick was amassing. Since 2011, he's been stockpiling these songs. Dave Stewart encouraged him to release his demos on a cloud calling it GET OFF ON MY CLOUD. Mick said his preference was an eventual Stones album and a possible solo album. The trick was getting them back in the studio. Both Mick and Keith wanted to do it, but seemed to have schedule problems with themselves or Charlie or Ronnie. Charlie is said to only want to work (or be able to work) in short periods each year so as not to tax himself physically. There have been medical scares for all of them as is common for people their age.

Anticipation for the new album ran high. The internet making it harder than ever for fans to wait. The label wanted the release. The band were far more cautious this time. Starting things over. Mick consulted outside producers. Keith allegedly railed against some of Mick's material, preferring his own but really wanting to collaborate with Mick from scratch one last time. Some have said the album is shaping up over the sessions this year, but it is still short of expectations. Some good tracks, some tracks that seem risky, some tracks that seem perhaps substandard. Out of the blue we have a Mick solo single with videos for both sides and learn Ronnie and Charlie are backing him and they are part of the current contract.

Some days I think the songs are growing on me (learning Ronnie and Charlie are on them helps). Mostly, I feel like an old fart who thinks it is noise and not music. And now we have the inevitable speculation that Mick is suffering writer's block. We've come full circle from Keith to Mick. Why? Because they haven't died or retired, but they won't give us what we demand -- a new album and world tour every three years like when they were in their prime. Anything else must mean they lost their spark and can't cut it any more. What fools they must be. Lock those two 74 year old kids up in the kitchen and make them deliver the classic we're so sure they can muster. After all, if they can't do it, we might have to accept that we're not kids any more either.

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duke richardson
David Bowie..a good example of successful creative achievement, late in his career..versus Mick, who would like to have that creative success, going in new directions ..

My question is, did Bowie have a band together, in recent years, before his death?

its kind of not fair to compare Bowie and Jagger, imo , because of the aspect of a band, together so long in the Stones' case.

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stone4ever
Damn it keith can read a bloody story book to me and ill be happy lol ( we got that with his bio Life, albeit Johnny Depp

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kowalski
Anyone else who has noticed the songs credits?

According to Qobuz : [www.qobuz.com]

1 Gotta Get A Grip 00:04:05
Stephen Marcussen, Mastering Engineer - MICK JAGGER, Composer, Author, Guitar, Co-Producer, Vocals, MainArtist - Copyright Control, MusicPublisher - Tom Elmhirst, Mixer - Robbie Nelson, Recording Engineer, Programming - Ronnie Wood, Electric Guitar - Matt Clifford, Composer, Author, Keyboards, Co-Producer, Recording Engineer, Programming - Charlie Watts, Drums - Promopub, MusicPublisher - Brandon Bost, Assistant Mixer - Pia Squillino, Participant, AssociatedPerformer

2 England Lost 00:03:53
Stephen Marcussen, Mastering Engineer - MICK JAGGER, Composer, Author, Guitar, Co-Producer, Vocals, MainArtist - Copyright Control, MusicPublisher - Tom Elmhirst, Mixer - Robbie Nelson, Recording Engineer, Programming - Ronnie Wood, Electric Guitar - Matt Clifford, Composer, Author, Keyboards, Co-Producer, Recording Engineer, Programming - Charlie Watts, Drums - Promopub, MusicPublisher - Brandon Bost, Assistant Mixer - Pia Squillino, Participant, AssociatedPerformer



A taste (test?) for what's coming for the Stones album?

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hopkins
I can't keep up with anything this week and it's only Tuesday. I'm waay behind here and not even catching up and got to go; I just want to say how much I appreciate stones4ever here; it's really good and resonates so much; want to read thru the first one on this page again and others. Really incisive and helpful; really perceptive, thanks.

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Maindefender

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duke richardson
David Bowie..a good example of successful creative achievement, late in his career..versus Mick, who would like to have that creative success, going in new directions ..

My question is, did Bowie have a band together, in recent years, before his death?

its kind of not fair to compare Bowie and Jagger, imo , because of the aspect of a band, together so long in the Stones' case.

Bowie had full autonomy. Did he have a set band per se? I would say not but definitely the usual suspects Slick, Alomar and of course Visconti. But he knew how to get great session and side musicians he had his pulse on the music scene for sure.

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Hairball
Other than this quobuz link, has there been any other confirmation regarding these credits?
Still can't hear anything in the drumming that screams "Charlie", just as the guitar playing sounds like it could be anybody.
Before these credits were posted, not one person would have guessed Charlie and Ronnie were playing, but now it seems to be a given.
If they are on there (which might be true), they've been over-produced to the point of making them unrecognizable, which begs the question - why are they on there?

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stone4ever

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latebloomer
Been away for a week, I'm trying to get caught up here, but keep losing the plot line to the imaginative fan fiction, that, while riveting at times, is also confusing and makes my head hurt a little. From what I gather, Mick put out a few songs of his own, with the obvious blessing of the rest of the band, including Keith. The Stones still plan to release a new album next year which they all want to be as good as possible. Am I on the right track?

Good God no, its far far more complex than that, its a Mick Jagger release, this gets looked into so deeply. Mick doesn't just right a track, its so deep with hidden meaning, its so thought out, its beyond our wildest imaginations, its genius, its so far ahead of our time that we are not worthy to imagine its depth of creativeness. All we are capable of is noticing music through generic numbers, it takes a real Mick devote to understand the nuances and intricacies of these MattClifford megamixe remixed seeb. Stones music is just so last year dude

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Rocky Dijon

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Hairball
Other than this quobuz link, has there been any other confirmation regarding these credits?
Still can't hear anything in the drumming that screams "Charlie", just as the guitar playing sounds like it could be anybody.
Before these credits were posted, not one person would have guessed Charlie and Ronnie were playing, but now it seems to be a given.
If they are on there (which might be true), they've been over-produced to the point of making them unrecognizable, which begs the question - why are they on there?

Nico Zentgraf lists them as being on there as well. Quobuz has copyright and publishing listings so this was likely supplied by Universal/Polydor. Now that I'm told it's Charlie, I can imagine that's his drumming at the start. Ronnie, I don't detect to my ears, but to be fair, not much of BLUE AND LONESOME sounded like Keith and Ronnie to me. It sounded, much of the time, like it could have been any competent guitarist playing the blues. I didn't feel that way about CROSSEYED HEART or I FEEL LIKE PLAYING. I could tell it was Keith and Ronnie throughout both discs. In the case of BLUE AND LONESOME, I imagine it was because they were trying so hard to capture the original. In the case of this single, I imagine the production (or should I say "deconstruction") of the tracks makes it difficult to judge since it feels like we're hearing slivers of what was played in the studio. Arranged artfully, perhaps, but still just pieces of the puzzle.

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Rocky Dijon
The weird thing is the more I play the songs, the more they fit the fabric of what has come out from the band, together or apart, during the past 23 years. At first I felt like it was culture shock, but after a few plays, it sounds like bits and pieces of VOODOO LOUNGE or its remixes, BRIDGES, and even (as others have said) a bit of "Rain Fall Down." I think I prefer Kevin Parker's remix of "Gotta Get a Grip" and wish he had done a version of "England Falls."

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Rocky Dijon
The weird thing is the more I play the songs, the more they fit the fabric of what has come out from the band, together or apart, during the past 23 years. At first I felt like it was culture shock, but after a few plays, it sounds like bits and pieces of VOODOO LOUNGE or its remixes, BRIDGES, and even (as others have said) a bit of "Rain Fall Down." I think I prefer Kevin Parker's remix of "Gotta Get a Grip" and wish he had done a version of "England's Lost."

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georgelicks
I can tell from my source that both songs were from the Stones' sessions for the new album, both Ronnie and Charlie are on it but Keith refused to play, just like he did not play on Saint Of Me.

Both songs were re-worked as Mick Jagger solo songs, Universal wanted something out to test the market and keep the hype about the new album and Mick was happy to put something out.

There are more songs like these from the 15 or so new songs recorded so far, but it looks like Keith wants a classic Rolling Stones sounding album, no dance or experimental stuff on it so there's the fight for the final cut of the new album.

A Bridges To Babylon situation again, but 20 years later.

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georgelicks
I can tell from my source that both songs were from the Stones' sessions for the new album, both Ronnie and Charlie are on it but Keith refused to play, just like he did not play on Saint Of Me.

Both songs were re-worked as Mick Jagger solo songs, Universal wanted something out to test the market and keep the hype about the new album and Mick was happy to put something out.

There are more songs like these from the 15 or so new songs recorded so far, but it looks like Keith wants a classic Rolling Stones sounding album, no dance or experimental stuff on it so there's the fight for the final cut of the new album.

A Bridges To Babylon situation again, but 20 years later.

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Maindefender

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georgelicks
I can tell from my source that both songs were from the Stones' sessions for the new album, both Ronnie and Charlie are on it but Keith refused to play, just like he did not play on Saint Of Me.

Both songs were re-worked as Mick Jagger solo songs, Universal wanted something out to test the market and keep the hype about the new album and Mick was happy to put something out.

There are more songs like these from the 15 or so new songs recorded so far, but it looks like Keith wants a classic Rolling Stones sounding album, no dance or experimental stuff on it so there's the fight for the final cut of the new album.

A Bridges To Babylon situation again, but 20 years later.

Woof.......Thanks George

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georgelicks
I can tell from my source that both songs were from the Stones' sessions for the new album, both Ronnie and Charlie are on it but Keith refused to play, just like he did not play on Saint Of Me.

Both songs were re-worked as Mick Jagger solo songs, Universal wanted something out to test the market and keep the hype about the new album and Mick was happy to put something out.

There are more songs like these from the 15 or so new songs recorded so far, but it looks like Keith wants a classic Rolling Stones sounding album, no dance or experimental stuff on it so there's the fight for the final cut of the new album.

A Bridges To Babylon situation again, but 20 years later.

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35love
no CDs nor LP's nor official hard product has been released.