Tell Me :
Talk
I have an emotional attachment to his distinctive drum sound that I know since I was a little kid. I was shocked in Atlanta how different they sounded without him especially on the warhorses. His drumming is essential to the Stones sound. I hope He will be on as many songs as possible.
Well that I understand. Steve Jordan's style probably isn't entirely to my liking, either. It is quite different to Charlie's. Let's just wait and see.
I listened to live versions of many songs the Stones did last year in the USA. Off course Steve in not Charlie, but he did a great job considering the limited rehearsal time available.
Recording in a studio is a different story. Steve would be able to focus much more on Charlie’s unique style and make it his.
Keith Moon was in his own way also a unique drummer, but I heard some versions of other bands doing Won’t Get Fooled Again and the drummers (think of for instance Van Halen) did an amazing job. So a studio offers more options than a live concert.
I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town
ok playing devils advocate here for a moment
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
but not a single stone plays or sings on it or was involved in its production or the songwriting
how would you personally feel about that
any emotional attachments coming out
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 17:39 by ProfessorWolf.
OMG
I feel another 'Sons of Beatles/Stones' thread is just a shot away.
I wouldn’t emotionally scarred. I just wouldn’t buy it. I ‘get’ your point, though, although it’s taking what I said a bit too far!
I think it's reaching a bit to suggest now that Charlie's gone Keith songwriting is going to blossom.
ok i'll admit maybe a little to far
In Electronic Music there's the well known German Band Tangerine Dream (founded 1967). They consist now of zero (0) original members since their founder Edgar Froese (70) passed away early 2015. But they've released 2 Studio-Albums since then (Quantum Gate in 2017, Raum in 2022). The current members are still on Tour and they see their task in the fulfillment of Edgar Froese's legacy, which was his explicit wish.
Similar in Electronic Music with the German Band Kraftwerk (founded 1970) - second last Studio-Album in 1986, last Studio-Album in 2003, since 2009 only 1 original member (Ralf Hütter, 75). But they're still relevant and will play 40 concerts in 2022 in the US and Europe - [Kraftwerk.com] . Ralf Hütter says Kraftwerk is a concept - not a Band. Probably one day the Robots will play their music.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 23:15 by Irix.
Just Look at what Abba does
Virtual Robots - but they still have all 4 original members ....
Kraftwerk uses the replica mannequins of themselves (to perform on stage during the song The Robots ) already since 1981.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 23:15 by Irix.
Gong is pretty much the same story, after Daevid Allen passed away a few years back. They also released a new album a few years ago. Both Gong and the Dream are groups that went through many lineup changes with one mastermind staying on board all the time even in his old age. (OK, Allen's case is a bit more complicated...) A bit like they passed on their craft to the next (or next-after-next) generation, and now they can go on on their own. Almost like in oldtime handictaft businesses ...
Maybe not a huge part of the equation...but a very good point, with maybe more than a little something in it.
Did Keith have such a session (or such sessions) with Charlie somewhen in the past six or so years? We know that Mick had one (or more?) such session(s) with Charlie (that's where the 40 new songs thing comes from, details somewhere a few hundred pages ago in this thread) but I can't recall having read or heard about such sessions of Charlie and Keith.
LOL!
Maybe depends ... if Keith manages to sell his three dynamite riffs for more money than Mick got for his 100+ unreleased songs ...
As for Brian, Mick T., Stu or Bill being no longer in the band (and therefore missing in the overall sound) - of course I do miss Bill in the Stones' sound, and I will miss Charlie. But - trying to get a positive aspect out of it - it gives the band the chance to evolve. Suppose the band's studio albums sounded exactly the same for, say, 50 years, we (or at least some of us) would complain that they are static or inert and stopped develloping a lifetime ago.
Regarding the new album it remains to be seen if it will be 100% Charlie, or 70% Charlie, or whatever, but I wouldn't see 70% Charlie as an a priori criterion to say the songs aren't any good. If a song is no good, it would be no good even with Charlie (or Bill) on it. It will be different, for sure, but that doesn't say it couldn't be an enjoyable album.
I will certainly miss Bill as much, as I do for - oops, only three albums? - but in all likelyhood he'll never be back either. But despite his absence, Laugh is a great song. (OK, Bill is still alive but it doesn't look like he'll be invited to join them in the studio anytime soon.)
I've done that recently, listening to Slave on the 'new' Tattoo You. Also listened to Love You Live, but it has definitely not gone up in estimation. What may not have passed for super duper Stones cuts back in the day, might pass muster now when compared to what came after.
No I don't think Keith will have worked very much with Charlie in that way since a long time ago...
...but I think this point has more to do with Keith's historical way of working than with which individual musicians were involved.
He hasn't had the opportunity, in the context of the Stones at least, to create by spending ages kicking riffs and part songs around with the band.
They just haven't spent the time together in "modern times" to enable that evolutionary writing process which produced so much great material throughout the earlier years.
I agree every word you wrote. The Stones were very much about BOTH the chemistry AND the music. In fact the true Stones sound emerged from that very special chemistry.
Reading the various threads on this site it seems there are two main groups of fans. Those who yearn for the original sound and feel of the band. In effect people like me who have been fans since 1964. And then there are those who are totally about the music. As long as a group of decent performers - with a few original members - appear somewhere and belt out the big hits, they are happy.
I'm not disparaging this second group of fans at all. Very much the opposite in fact. Good luck to them. Their view is every bit as valid as my own. However I think it would be a pity if The Stones were ever to become a kind of glorified tribute band to themselves. Performances by any such aggregation of musicians really is not a performance by the Rolling Stones. Yes I know there are bands and groups out there who have no connection - other than a name - with the original performers in that band. Fair enough. But that does not mean The Stones should follow suit. Surely the band is bigger than that?
Fair point! And no one will care whether we argue with it or not anyway. While of significance to us, long-time fans, if he band continue calling themselves the Rolling Stones whilst increasingly comprising of non-original members, it hardly registers on the Richter scale of important world events while we have awful things like the Ukraine happening.
I do like your form of words - 'Change in band other personnel....do not register quite so seismically with other folks..' Spot on my friend. To many people I know, who usually go to see The Stones, the entire issue of who is, or is not, in the band gets nothing more than a massive shrug of the shoulders, and a great big 'who cares'...
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
hockenheim95
()
Date: February 26, 2022 10:26
Quote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
I have an emotional attachment to his distinctive drum sound that I know since I was a little kid. I was shocked in Atlanta how different they sounded without him especially on the warhorses. His drumming is essential to the Stones sound. I hope He will be on as many songs as possible.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Big Al
()
Date: February 26, 2022 13:07
Quote
hockenheim95
I have an emotional attachment to his distinctive drum sound that I know since I was a little kid. I was shocked in Atlanta how different they sounded without him especially on the warhorses. His drumming is essential to the Stones sound. I hope He will be on as many songs as possible.
Well that I understand. Steve Jordan's style probably isn't entirely to my liking, either. It is quite different to Charlie's. Let's just wait and see.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
georgie48
()
Date: February 26, 2022 13:19
Quote
hockenheim95Quote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
I have an emotional attachment to his distinctive drum sound that I know since I was a little kid. I was shocked in Atlanta how different they sounded without him especially on the warhorses. His drumming is essential to the Stones sound. I hope He will be on as many songs as possible.
I listened to live versions of many songs the Stones did last year in the USA. Off course Steve in not Charlie, but he did a great job considering the limited rehearsal time available.
Recording in a studio is a different story. Steve would be able to focus much more on Charlie’s unique style and make it his.
Keith Moon was in his own way also a unique drummer, but I heard some versions of other bands doing Won’t Get Fooled Again and the drummers (think of for instance Van Halen) did an amazing job. So a studio offers more options than a live concert.
I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Bashlets
()
Date: February 26, 2022 16:03
Didn’t I read somewhere that Mick, Ronnie, and Charlie worked together in the studio in April or May 2021? I don’t think Charlie would have been needed for the Tattoo You extended addition. Time to bring it on.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
ProfessorWolf
()
Date: February 26, 2022 17:36
Quote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
ok playing devils advocate here for a moment
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
but not a single stone plays or sings on it or was involved in its production or the songwriting
how would you personally feel about that
any emotional attachments coming out
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 17:39 by ProfessorWolf.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
treaclefingers
()
Date: February 26, 2022 17:44
Quote
ProfessorWolfQuote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
ok playing devils advocate here for a moment
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
but not a single stone plays or sings on it or was involved in its production or the songwriting
how would you personally feel about that
any emotional attachments coming out
OMG
I feel another 'Sons of Beatles/Stones' thread is just a shot away.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
StonedRambler
()
Date: February 26, 2022 18:44
While I would love to have tracks with Charlie on the album, I also would not have a problem with Steve playing on a few tracks. I also love You Can't Always Get What You Want, Happy, It's Only Rock'n'Roll or No Expectations even though Charlie doesn't play on any of those tunes. Keep in mind that Keith's favorite approach to Songwriting is to jam with a drummer. With Charlie extended Songwriting sessions weren't really possible during the last decade. So maybe with Steve who's willing to jam with Keith for days and weeks it will be possible to get a few last great songs.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Big Al
()
Date: February 26, 2022 18:45
Quote
ProfessorWolfQuote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
ok playing devils advocate here for a moment
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
but not a single stone plays or sings on it or was involved in its production or the songwriting
how would you personally feel about that
any emotional attachments coming out
I wouldn’t emotionally scarred. I just wouldn’t buy it. I ‘get’ your point, though, although it’s taking what I said a bit too far!
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
treaclefingers
()
Date: February 26, 2022 18:56
Quote
StonedRambler
While I would love to have tracks with Charlie on the album, I also would not have a problem with Steve playing on a few tracks. I also love You Can't Always Get What You Want, Happy, It's Only Rock'n'Roll or No Expectations even though Charlie doesn't play on any of those tunes. Keep in mind that Keith's favorite approach to Songwriting is to jam with a drummer. With Charlie extended Songwriting sessions weren't really possible during the last decade. So maybe with Steve who's willing to jam with Keith for days and weeks it will be possible to get a few last great songs.
I think it's reaching a bit to suggest now that Charlie's gone Keith songwriting is going to blossom.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
ProfessorWolf
()
Date: February 26, 2022 20:11
Quote
Big AlQuote
ProfessorWolfQuote
Big Al
Whilst it’d certainly be a nice touch if any new tracks feature Charlie, for me, it certainly isn’t essential. As long as the drumming is of a standard and the sound, appropriate, then it doesn’t matter as far as I’m concerned. I just hope the songwriting, musicianship and overall production is high.
I didn’t know Charlie Watts personally, and therefore have no emotional attachment. I’m unsure why some here do, quite honestly.
ok playing devils advocate here for a moment
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
but not a single stone plays or sings on it or was involved in its production or the songwriting
how would you personally feel about that
any emotional attachments coming out
I wouldn’t emotionally scarred. I just wouldn’t buy it. I ‘get’ your point, though, although it’s taking what I said a bit too far!
ok i'll admit maybe a little to far
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Irix
()
Date: February 26, 2022 22:15
Quote
ProfessorWolf
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
In Electronic Music there's the well known German Band Tangerine Dream (founded 1967). They consist now of zero (0) original members since their founder Edgar Froese (70) passed away early 2015. But they've released 2 Studio-Albums since then (Quantum Gate in 2017, Raum in 2022). The current members are still on Tour and they see their task in the fulfillment of Edgar Froese's legacy, which was his explicit wish.
Similar in Electronic Music with the German Band Kraftwerk (founded 1970) - second last Studio-Album in 1986, last Studio-Album in 2003, since 2009 only 1 original member (Ralf Hütter, 75). But they're still relevant and will play 40 concerts in 2022 in the US and Europe - [Kraftwerk.com] . Ralf Hütter says Kraftwerk is a concept - not a Band. Probably one day the Robots will play their music.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 23:15 by Irix.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
hockenheim95
()
Date: February 26, 2022 22:43
Quote
IrixQuote
ProfessorWolf
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
In Electronic Music there's the well known German Band Tangerine Dream (founded 1967). They consist now of zero (0) original members since their founder Edgar Froese (70) passed away early 2015. But they've released 2 Studio-Albums since then (Quantum Gate in 2017, Raum in 2022). The current members are still on Tour and they see their task in the fulfillment of Edgar Froese's legacy, which was his explicit wish.
Similar in Electronic Music with the German Band Kraftwerk (1970) - second last Studio-Album in 1986, last Studio-Album in 2003, now only 1 original member (Ralf Hütter, 75). But they're still relevant and will play 40 concerts in 2022 in the US and Europe - [Kraftwerk.com] . Ralf Hütter says Kraftwerk is a concept - not a Band. Probably one day the Roboters will play their music.
Just Look at what Abba does
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Irix
()
Date: February 26, 2022 22:55
Quote
hockenheim95
Just Look at what Abba does
Virtual Robots - but they still have all 4 original members ....
Kraftwerk uses the replica mannequins of themselves (to perform on stage during the song The Robots ) already since 1981.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-02-26 23:15 by Irix.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
StonedRambler
()
Date: February 26, 2022 23:18
I think Crosseyed Heart shows that through jamming with a drummer he is still able to create good stuff. A lot of great Stones songs just evolved though jamming. And though playing the stuff over and over and over again. Then Keith starts to mumble a few words on top of that and a song starts to evolve. Charlie simply wasn't available for that anymore. I can't blame him, it's a nerve-wracking and time consuming approach for anyone else involved. But it's the best way to get something good outta Keith. He won't sit down with a pen and a paperQuote
treaclefingersQuote
StonedRambler
While I would love to have tracks with Charlie on the album, I also would not have a problem with Steve playing on a few tracks. I also love You Can't Always Get What You Want, Happy, It's Only Rock'n'Roll or No Expectations even though Charlie doesn't play on any of those tunes. Keep in mind that Keith's favorite approach to Songwriting is to jam with a drummer. With Charlie extended Songwriting sessions weren't really possible during the last decade. So maybe with Steve who's willing to jam with Keith for days and weeks it will be possible to get a few last great songs.
I think it's reaching a bit to suggest now that Charlie's gone Keith songwriting is going to blossom.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
doitywoik
()
Date: February 27, 2022 07:57
Quote
IrixQuote
ProfessorWolf
how would you feel as a stones fan if after all the stones are gone one of mick's kids decided to put together a group of young musicians and record an album and release it as the rolling stones
now the album itself is great well made and to a very high standard
In Electronic Music there's the well known German Band Tangerine Dream (founded 1967). They consist now of zero (0) original members since their founder Edgar Froese (70) passed away early 2015. But they've released 2 Studio-Albums since then (Quantum Gate in 2017, Raum in 2022). The current members are still on Tour and they see their task in the fulfillment of Edgar Froese's legacy, which was his explicit wish.
Gong is pretty much the same story, after Daevid Allen passed away a few years back. They also released a new album a few years ago. Both Gong and the Dream are groups that went through many lineup changes with one mastermind staying on board all the time even in his old age. (OK, Allen's case is a bit more complicated...) A bit like they passed on their craft to the next (or next-after-next) generation, and now they can go on on their own. Almost like in oldtime handictaft businesses ...
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: February 28, 2022 13:38
Quote
StonedRambler
...I think Crosseyed Heart shows that through jamming with a drummer he [Keith] is still able to create good stuff. A lot of great Stones songs just evolved though jamming. And though playing the stuff over and over and over again. Then Keith starts to mumble a few words on top of that and a song starts to evolve. Charlie simply wasn't available for that anymore. I can't blame him, it's a nerve-wracking and time consuming approach for anyone else involved. But it's the best way to get something good outta Keith. He won't sit down with a pen and a paper
Maybe not a huge part of the equation...but a very good point, with maybe more than a little something in it.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
doitywoik
()
Date: February 28, 2022 19:12
Quote
SpudQuote
StonedRambler
...I think Crosseyed Heart shows that through jamming with a drummer he [Keith] is still able to create good stuff. A lot of great Stones songs just evolved though jamming. And though playing the stuff over and over and over again. Then Keith starts to mumble a few words on top of that and a song starts to evolve. Charlie simply wasn't available for that anymore. I can't blame him, it's a nerve-wracking and time consuming approach for anyone else involved. But it's the best way to get something good outta Keith. He won't sit down with a pen and a paper
Maybe not a huge part of the equation...but a very good point, with maybe more than a little something in it.
Did Keith have such a session (or such sessions) with Charlie somewhen in the past six or so years? We know that Mick had one (or more?) such session(s) with Charlie (that's where the 40 new songs thing comes from, details somewhere a few hundred pages ago in this thread) but I can't recall having read or heard about such sessions of Charlie and Keith.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
gotdablouse
()
Date: February 28, 2022 22:38
Maybe Mick should do like Neil Diamond, sell his 100+ unreleased songs to UMG [www.rollingstone.com] - that would annoy Keith and his 3 dynamite riffs to no end !
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: February 28, 2022 23:16
A Stones album without Charlie. Why bother? You think the average fan buys new Stones albums? The ones paying $200 and up for nosebleed seats in a 60,000 seat stadium? No, it's geeks like us, hoping against hope the sound will be as good as it was. It won't. The Stones were never about getting hotshots to play the hits note perfect. (Or they would have gotten better ones).
No band is/was more about chemistry than the Rolling Stones. It was the unique sound we're after, and that pretty much petered out with Bill leaving, and what the hell would be left of it now that Charlie's gone? The casual ear can't tell the difference. We can.
No band is/was more about chemistry than the Rolling Stones. It was the unique sound we're after, and that pretty much petered out with Bill leaving, and what the hell would be left of it now that Charlie's gone? The casual ear can't tell the difference. We can.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
doitywoik
()
Date: March 1, 2022 03:12
Quote
gotdablouse
Maybe Mick should do like Neil Diamond, sell his 100+ unreleased songs to UMG [www.rollingstone.com] - that would annoy Keith and his 3 dynamite riffs to no end !
LOL!
Maybe depends ... if Keith manages to sell his three dynamite riffs for more money than Mick got for his 100+ unreleased songs ...
As for Brian, Mick T., Stu or Bill being no longer in the band (and therefore missing in the overall sound) - of course I do miss Bill in the Stones' sound, and I will miss Charlie. But - trying to get a positive aspect out of it - it gives the band the chance to evolve. Suppose the band's studio albums sounded exactly the same for, say, 50 years, we (or at least some of us) would complain that they are static or inert and stopped develloping a lifetime ago.
Regarding the new album it remains to be seen if it will be 100% Charlie, or 70% Charlie, or whatever, but I wouldn't see 70% Charlie as an a priori criterion to say the songs aren't any good. If a song is no good, it would be no good even with Charlie (or Bill) on it. It will be different, for sure, but that doesn't say it couldn't be an enjoyable album.
I will certainly miss Bill as much, as I do for - oops, only three albums? - but in all likelyhood he'll never be back either. But despite his absence, Laugh is a great song. (OK, Bill is still alive but it doesn't look like he'll be invited to join them in the studio anytime soon.)
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: March 1, 2022 03:23
Keith, solo, is essentially an indie artist: only so many people will buy his records.
What he's done has been extremely interesting, more so than Jagger's solo career, even without the differences in artistry, in regard to his love of music, not career.
That aside, what Keith has done as a solo artist has obviously been different than the Stones. To think that what he did with CROSSEYED HEART would or could apply to any new Stones recordings is a good point.
The fact remains, it will or won't. It may. It could. Those last two imply the opposite. There's no way to tell unless a new album comes out. And even then there's no way to tell because of some strawman kind of thing.
Seems people are a bit more hung up on Will it? than maybe should be, because it will be what it will be, regardless of our fandom/criticism.
After how many Stones albums? Aren't there enough Stones albums? No other band has so many (that I can think of). Hence is maybe why they probably haven't been moved enough to do one or two or three since 2005 - why bother.
Go dig into Stones albums you don't like and find new things. GOATS HEAD SOUP, BLACK AND BLUE, EMOTIONAL RESCUE and UNDERCOVER have fantastic things going on in them but they're not critically hailed or popular.
What he's done has been extremely interesting, more so than Jagger's solo career, even without the differences in artistry, in regard to his love of music, not career.
That aside, what Keith has done as a solo artist has obviously been different than the Stones. To think that what he did with CROSSEYED HEART would or could apply to any new Stones recordings is a good point.
The fact remains, it will or won't. It may. It could. Those last two imply the opposite. There's no way to tell unless a new album comes out. And even then there's no way to tell because of some strawman kind of thing.
Seems people are a bit more hung up on Will it? than maybe should be, because it will be what it will be, regardless of our fandom/criticism.
After how many Stones albums? Aren't there enough Stones albums? No other band has so many (that I can think of). Hence is maybe why they probably haven't been moved enough to do one or two or three since 2005 - why bother.
Go dig into Stones albums you don't like and find new things. GOATS HEAD SOUP, BLACK AND BLUE, EMOTIONAL RESCUE and UNDERCOVER have fantastic things going on in them but they're not critically hailed or popular.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: March 1, 2022 10:06
Quote
GasLightStreet
Go dig into Stones albums you don't like and find new things. GOATS HEAD SOUP, BLACK AND BLUE, EMOTIONAL RESCUE and UNDERCOVER have fantastic things going on in them but they're not critically hailed or popular.
I've done that recently, listening to Slave on the 'new' Tattoo You. Also listened to Love You Live, but it has definitely not gone up in estimation. What may not have passed for super duper Stones cuts back in the day, might pass muster now when compared to what came after.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: March 1, 2022 11:45
Quote
doitywoikQuote
SpudQuote
StonedRambler
...I think Crosseyed Heart shows that through jamming with a drummer he [Keith] is still able to create good stuff. A lot of great Stones songs just evolved though jamming. And though playing the stuff over and over and over again. Then Keith starts to mumble a few words on top of that and a song starts to evolve. Charlie simply wasn't available for that anymore. I can't blame him, it's a nerve-wracking and time consuming approach for anyone else involved. But it's the best way to get something good outta Keith. He won't sit down with a pen and a paper
Maybe not a huge part of the equation...but a very good point, with maybe more than a little something in it.
Did Keith have such a session (or such sessions) with Charlie somewhen in the past six or so years? We know that Mick had one (or more?) such session(s) with Charlie (that's where the 40 new songs thing comes from, details somewhere a few hundred pages ago in this thread) but I can't recall having read or heard about such sessions of Charlie and Keith.
No I don't think Keith will have worked very much with Charlie in that way since a long time ago...
...but I think this point has more to do with Keith's historical way of working than with which individual musicians were involved.
He hasn't had the opportunity, in the context of the Stones at least, to create by spending ages kicking riffs and part songs around with the band.
They just haven't spent the time together in "modern times" to enable that evolutionary writing process which produced so much great material throughout the earlier years.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
GerardHennessy
()
Date: March 1, 2022 13:14
Quote
24FPS
A Stones album without Charlie. Why bother? You think the average fan buys new Stones albums? The ones paying $200 and up for nosebleed seats in a 60,000 seat stadium? No, it's geeks like us, hoping against hope the sound will be as good as it was. It won't. The Stones were never about getting hotshots to play the hits note perfect. (Or they would have gotten better ones).
No band is/was more about chemistry than the Rolling Stones. It was the unique sound we're after, and that pretty much petered out with Bill leaving, and what the hell would be left of it now that Charlie's gone? The casual ear can't tell the difference. We can.
I agree every word you wrote. The Stones were very much about BOTH the chemistry AND the music. In fact the true Stones sound emerged from that very special chemistry.
Reading the various threads on this site it seems there are two main groups of fans. Those who yearn for the original sound and feel of the band. In effect people like me who have been fans since 1964. And then there are those who are totally about the music. As long as a group of decent performers - with a few original members - appear somewhere and belt out the big hits, they are happy.
I'm not disparaging this second group of fans at all. Very much the opposite in fact. Good luck to them. Their view is every bit as valid as my own. However I think it would be a pity if The Stones were ever to become a kind of glorified tribute band to themselves. Performances by any such aggregation of musicians really is not a performance by the Rolling Stones. Yes I know there are bands and groups out there who have no connection - other than a name - with the original performers in that band. Fair enough. But that does not mean The Stones should follow suit. Surely the band is bigger than that?
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: March 1, 2022 13:43
The bottom line for most casual fans I suppose is whilst ever you have Mick and Keith, you have perhaps the most obvious and recognisable elements of the Stones image and indeed "sound" .
Changes in other band personnel, whilst fundamental to many of we around here, do not register quite so seismically with other folks.
And whilst ever Mick and Keith want to be in the same band and call themselves the Rolling Stones, I don't think we can really argue with that.
Changes in other band personnel, whilst fundamental to many of we around here, do not register quite so seismically with other folks.
And whilst ever Mick and Keith want to be in the same band and call themselves the Rolling Stones, I don't think we can really argue with that.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: March 1, 2022 14:15
Quote
GasLightStreet
Keith, solo, is essentially an indie artist: only so many people will buy his records.
What he's done has been extremely interesting, more so than Jagger's solo career, even without the differences in artistry, in regard to his love of music, not career.
That aside, what Keith has done as a solo artist has obviously been different than the Stones. To think that what he did with CROSSEYED HEART would or could apply to any new Stones recordings is a good point.
The fact remains, it will or won't. It may. It could. Those last two imply the opposite. There's no way to tell unless a new album comes out. And even then there's no way to tell because of some strawman kind of thing.
Seems people are a bit more hung up on Will it? than maybe should be, because it will be what it will be, regardless of our fandom/criticism.
After how many Stones albums? Aren't there enough Stones albums? No other band has so many (that I can think of). Hence is maybe why they probably haven't been moved enough to do one or two or three since 2005 - why bother.
Go dig into Stones albums you don't like and find new things. GOATS HEAD SOUP, BLACK AND BLUE, EMOTIONAL RESCUE and UNDERCOVER have fantastic things going on in them but they're not critically hailed or popular.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
GerardHennessy
()
Date: March 1, 2022 15:31
Quote
Spud
The bottom line for most casual fans I suppose is whilst ever you have Mick and Keith, you have perhaps the most obvious and recognisable elements of the Stones image and indeed "sound" .
Changes in other band personnel, whilst fundamental to many of we around here, do not register quite so seismically with other folks.
And whilst ever Mick and Keith want to be in the same band and call themselves the Rolling Stones, I don't think we can really argue with that.
Fair point! And no one will care whether we argue with it or not anyway. While of significance to us, long-time fans, if he band continue calling themselves the Rolling Stones whilst increasingly comprising of non-original members, it hardly registers on the Richter scale of important world events while we have awful things like the Ukraine happening.
I do like your form of words - 'Change in band other personnel....do not register quite so seismically with other folks..' Spot on my friend. To many people I know, who usually go to see The Stones, the entire issue of who is, or is not, in the band gets nothing more than a massive shrug of the shoulders, and a great big 'who cares'...
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
VoodooLounge13
()
Date: March 1, 2022 21:51
Let's make it a double CD then. Have Disc 1 be all new original songs, with Jordan on drums, and have Disc 2 be leftovers/new songs with Charlie, and have the back photo on the album be the closed drumkit photo that Keef had posted on his account. IDK. I don't know how to manage the effects of this. At the time I came into the band, losing Bill was going on, and it just didn't hit me the same as Charlie, mainly because there wasn't the decades of built up attachment yet. The Stones are down to just two now, same as The Who, though arguably still a much better live spectacle.
Re: New Stones album for 2022?
Posted by:
jahisnotdead
()
Date: March 2, 2022 03:47
There aren't enough Stones albums, in my humble opinion. What hardcore Stones fan rejects new music by their favorite band? In my opinion, artists create. Active bands put out new albums. Active painters paint new paintings. I'm just old fashioned like that. To me it's weird to go on world tours year after year for the fans, but not put out new albums of original material. We know from the bootlegs that they got the stuff, but somehow there's some "performance anxiety" behind the scenes that prevents it from being finished and released.
I truly thought the new album had been put to bed long ago and this year was going to go according to a careful marketing plan. In this day and age what is a brick and mortar store for if not for an active "brand" offering something big to market? It just seems to me the Stones are more interested in selling tongue logo tee shirts than finishing and releasing any albums of new music.
Maybe I'm wrong and it still will come out before the middle of July, or by Christmas, and this recent recording stuff is really just the fine details on one or two tracks or simply them recording a promotional video. I sure hope so. But honestly, I'm beginning to give up hope.
I truly thought the new album had been put to bed long ago and this year was going to go according to a careful marketing plan. In this day and age what is a brick and mortar store for if not for an active "brand" offering something big to market? It just seems to me the Stones are more interested in selling tongue logo tee shirts than finishing and releasing any albums of new music.
Maybe I'm wrong and it still will come out before the middle of July, or by Christmas, and this recent recording stuff is really just the fine details on one or two tracks or simply them recording a promotional video. I sure hope so. But honestly, I'm beginning to give up hope.
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