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oldschool
Personally I mostly listen to live music and I am a bit of a purist in that I generally avoid official live albums as they usually have overdubs and other fixes done in the studio. This is why I prefer bootlegs warts and all.

For this reason I avoided listening GYYYO and only started warming up to it in recent years. I think the expanded Anniversary release was when I really started getting into it and while I still dislike Mick's redone vocals and the overdubs they didn't mess with the instrumentation too much so I still get that live feel from the MSG shows.

Sadly I am not sure they will ever release a pure complete show, or box set from MSG shows or the 1969 tour so we will have to be satisfied with what we have and the bootlegs from the tour.

Personally I have been listening to a No Label bootleg where someone took the official releases and put the songs in the correct setlist order and also filled in the cuts in SFTD and MR with snippets from a really clean Acetate that had the complete songs. Brilliant effort and it is now my go to disc for GYYO.

When you hear some of the songs on the Ya Yas bonus DVD, you'll know why they won't release complete shows without overdubs.

For instance, they had to stop Prodigal Son very early, because of Keith's guitar being horribly out of tune.

Stuff like that happen with live music, but isn't necessarily the kind of art the musicians want to present to their audience on an album..

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DandelionPowderman

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oldschool
Personally I mostly listen to live music and I am a bit of a purist in that I generally avoid official live albums as they usually have overdubs and other fixes done in the studio. This is why I prefer bootlegs warts and all.

For this reason I avoided listening GYYYO and only started warming up to it in recent years. I think the expanded Anniversary release was when I really started getting into it and while I still dislike Mick's redone vocals and the overdubs they didn't mess with the instrumentation too much so I still get that live feel from the MSG shows.

Sadly I am not sure they will ever release a pure complete show, or box set from MSG shows or the 1969 tour so we will have to be satisfied with what we have and the bootlegs from the tour.

Personally I have been listening to a No Label bootleg where someone took the official releases and put the songs in the correct setlist order and also filled in the cuts in SFTD and MR with snippets from a really clean Acetate that had the complete songs. Brilliant effort and it is now my go to disc for GYYO.

When you hear some of the songs on the Ya Yas bonus DVD, you'll know why they won't release complete shows without overdubs.

For instance, they had to stop Prodigal Son very early, because of Keith's guitar being horribly out of tune.

Stuff like that happen with live music, but isn't necessarily the kind of art the musicians want to present to their audience on an album..

I understand why musicians "fix" live recordings in the studio DP. But personally I prefer my live recordings warts and all. Some of my favorite official live recordings released recently, Allman Brothers Fillmore box set, Humble Pie Fillmore box set, Deep Purple Japan box set, Johnny Winter And complete Fillmore East concert etc., are warts and all releases and sound fantastic to me. If I wanted perfection I would listen to the studio albums. Just a personal preference but I do understand a musicians desire to release live stuff without warts and also the average fan wanting perfect recordings.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-02-08 17:24 by oldschool.

I have to say one thing about Ya-yas: 'Honky Tonk Women' has been mentioned a few times, and yes, the LYL version is excellent, but what Bill Wyman does in the verses on Ya-Ya's is just vicious.
He must've wanted to keep the boost going that he got from laying out in the verses, and only coming in for the chorus, on the studio version. But on Live stage I figured you don't want to be all that sensitive. So he plays high up on the neck for the verse, and comes rumbling in for the chorus.
I don't know which sections are better: the low walk into the chorus, or those twisted dills he plays in the verses.

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oldschool
Personally I mostly listen to live music and I am a bit of a purist in that I generally avoid official live albums as they usually have overdubs and other fixes done in the studio. This is why I prefer bootlegs warts and all.

I'm with you here oldschool.
However, if I do have guests over and chuck on The Stones, then I'd put Ya Ya's on before a distant aud recording of MSG

The holy grail is a box set of all the shows from MSG - soundboard, mixed, no overdubs. Throw in Altamont and I will die a happy man.

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Eleanor Rigby

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oldschool
Personally I mostly listen to live music and I am a bit of a purist in that I generally avoid official live albums as they usually have overdubs and other fixes done in the studio. This is why I prefer bootlegs warts and all.

I'm with you here oldschool.
However, if I do have guests over and chuck on The Stones, then I'd put Ya Ya's on before a distant aud recording of MSG

The holy grail is a box set of all the shows from MSG - soundboard, mixed, no overdubs. Throw in Altamont and I will die a happy man.

Lol, I hear you ER I would never subject civilians to having to listen to my audience bootlegs. Those are saved for when I am driving alone in my car or listening with headphones.

Don't get me wrong as I have overcome my prejudice of GYYO and listen to the NO Label MSG complete bootleg often. Nothing like the 1969 Stones firing on all cylinders.

An MSG box set is also my ultimate music holy grail and Altamont would be nice as well. The boys have surprised us with the vault releases so hopefully it will come while I am still young enough to appreciate it.

I listened to the entire album this evening on a ferry ride from Seattle. It still gives me chills it was so damn good. Each track is brilliant.

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DaveG
I listened to the entire album this evening on a ferry ride from Seattle. It still gives me chills it was so damn good. Each track is brilliant.

Which version?

Dave did you see the Stones in 1969?

My introduction to that year's tour was my first ever boot, Liver Than You'll Ever Be on vinyl,
which is one of the very few actual vinyl LP's I've kept thru all these years.
It stunned me and kept me listening over and over many times, so I was pretty primed by Ya Yas.

It never disappointed; It had tons of plays ALL the time with ALL my friends. It was like finding gold in the middle of the trail.

It ripped in a visceral way, sound-wise...it was so powerful....
...so well done. I went over every micro-meter of both sides of the cover a hundred times;
i really loved it. It was a doorway into a whole other kinda
dirty rockin' thing.
I wasn't there for any of the shows on that tour, sadly, but i'm still sorta proud it's mostly a NY LP;
probably just because i grew up there and have seen them there so many times in subsequent years.
New York LOVES The Stones and has ALWAYS been there for them from the start!

Others will review it, and have already reviewed more cogently than I can;
this is just to say it's a super great classic important album to me,
and was a very cheap purchase considering all the times it was played...

hell, we used to joke that we wanted to know their address so we could pay them MORE,
because this one was that good. One of us jokers came up with that
and we all laughed, but it was seriously mind-blowing.

same years as Tommy too; and a Lot of really compelling mega-imporant stuff. Zep was unleashed that year and etc....
...but this is true prime wonderful edgy, dirty, swinging, perfect rock and roll starring Bill Wyman!! with Mick, Keith, Charlie and Mick Taylor,
who, let's just drop pretenses and call him God during these years,
replacing dear Eric from the git Deity position;
at least until Derek and the domnioes.
Aha, but then Mick T, would sneak back to Top with EOMS.

This record stands so tall. Forever Power.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-02-14 21:05 by hopkins.

What I like about Ya-Yas' is that every song on the album is better than the studio version.

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ThePaleRider
What I like about Ya-Yas' is that every song on the album is better than the studio version.

Every cut on Ya Yas is great. It's a fantastic live album. But it's live music. Hard to compare to a different form of art, imo.

If I should compare, though, I'd say that JJF, LIV, SFM are superior on the their respective studio albums. The HTW studio-version is perfection, and the Ya Yas-version is not.

I agree with Dandelion. Love the album and love the variations of the live songs but the studio cuts of JJF, SFM and HTW are better than live versions. Might throw Live With Me on there as well; however, the livecuts of MR, Love in Vain, Chuck Berry cuts and Stray Cat Blues are all superior than the studio cuts. One might ask- what about SFTD? To me this live cut is a different song altogether than the studio. I like them both equally.

Stray Cat is better studio.
SFTD is just different...really hard to line up.
HTW is better studio.
JJF without vocal overdubs would be on par with studio.

I'll concede on HTW being better in the studio version...maybe even JJF...but the rest? I don't know. If I had a choice between any two songs on two separate turntables...I'd pick the live cuts on Ya-Ya's. Take SFM, for example. It takes that awesome song to a whole other level...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-02-09 16:31 by ThePaleRider.

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The Sicilian

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DaveG
I listened to the entire album this evening on a ferry ride from Seattle. It still gives me chills it was so damn good. Each track is brilliant.

Which version?

Dave did you see the Stones in 1969?

It was the original release on CD. Yes, I did see them, so I have a visual to go along with the audio

....we can certainly quibble about the overdubs, etc, but as a whole, Ya Yas is arguably one of the best rock albums out there.

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Sighunt
....we can certainly quibble about the overdubs, etc, but as a whole, Ya Yas is arguably one of the best rock albums out there.

..........

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ThePaleRider
I'll concede on HTW being better in the studio version...maybe even JJF...but the rest? I don't know. If I had a choice between any two songs on two separate turntables...I'd pick the live cuts on Ya-Ya's. Take SFM, for example. It takes that awesome song to a whole other level...

What's interesting about HTW on GYYYO! is the way that it lurches: it's a boat in a heavy ocean getting moved in ways while getting moved in different directions at the same time. The studio version speeds up - but this one lurches. It's loudly brilliant. The version on LOVE YOU LIVE is the best one I've ever heard. But the live 1969 one is full of noise and is excellent. It makes the studio version sound boring.

As for JJF and SFM, as great as the studio recordings are of those two, these versions (and especially the version of JJF in GIMME SHELTER) are superiour. Live With Me and Stray Cat Blues are excellently different - and better - than the studio versions. The 1969 tour was an exclamation point on the JJF/BB/LIB era. They had found a pinnacle and for part of the tour were at it. The way SFM ends, with the guitars tearing away and Charlie just being so not Charlie and POUNDING... it's the heaviest Charlie ever drummed. That tour, his drumming, the double kick before the snare while he boredly looked off somewhere or down at the floor - the beginning of his best drumming which, to my ears, although it changed in 1977, stopped after UNDERCOVER.

Midnight Rambler reveals the details between how a great song is in the studio and how a great song is even greater live - where the studio recording doesn't need the dynamics that the live version does, it's the dynamics that make the live version better.

The Chuck Berry tunes are simply awesome.

SFTD... this version ruined the studio version for me.

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GasLightStreet

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ThePaleRider
I'll concede on HTW being better in the studio version...maybe even JJF...but the rest? I don't know. If I had a choice between any two songs on two separate turntables...I'd pick the live cuts on Ya-Ya's. Take SFM, for example. It takes that awesome song to a whole other level...

What's interesting about HTW on GYYYO! is the way that it lurches: it's a boat in a heavy ocean getting moved in ways while getting moved in different directions at the same time. The studio version speeds up - but this one lurches. It's loudly brilliant. The version on LOVE YOU LIVE is the best one I've ever heard. But the live 1969 one is full of noise and is excellent. It makes the studio version sound boring.

As for JJF and SFM, as great as the studio recordings are of those two, these versions (and especially the version of JJF in GIMME SHELTER) are superiour. Live With Me and Stray Cat Blues are excellently different - and better - than the studio versions. The 1969 tour was an exclamation point on the JJF/BB/LIB era. They had found a pinnacle and for part of the tour were at it. The way SFM ends, with the guitars tearing away and Charlie just being so not Charlie and POUNDING... it's the heaviest Charlie ever drummed. That tour, his drumming, the double kick before the snare while he boredly looked off somewhere or down at the floor - the beginning of his best drumming which, to my ears, although it changed in 1977, stopped after UNDERCOVER.

Midnight Rambler reveals the details between how a great song is in the studio and how a great song is even greater live - where the studio recording doesn't need the dynamics that the live version does, it's the dynamics that make the live version better.

The Chuck Berry tunes are simply awesome.

SFTD... this version ruined the studio version for me.

Yes, Yes re HTW. I know you like the LYL version, and I got to say all 3 (studio, Yayas and LYL) are brilliant. I can not believe how Wyman jumped out at me when I heard it on Yayas two days ago.

I've often found myself preferring to hear the LYL version of HTW and, to a lesser extent, the GYYYO! version of HTW, over the studio version of HTW.

With FORM THE VAULT's releases of SOME GIRLS and HAMPTON there are even more live versions more interesting than the studio version. But that's just my perspective: it's along the line of how Midnight Rambler from GYYYO! and HOT ROCKS is hailed in comparison to the studio version. And there are plenty of live versions, official VAULT or bootleg, that are better than the studio version. Which is still pretty good.

The same with the studio HTW - live... it's even better.

I know.

YAWN.

I'll shut up about HTW. But I do like that lurch!

Eh, it's what gets yer rocks off or floats yer boat or whatever, right? After all, I didn't say I don't like the studio version. That one is still pretty damn good. It's just not... great.

Brown Sugar, on the other hand...

I was always bummed a great version of Gimmee Shelter was not on this album and when I bought the deluxe version a few years ago and added the tracks to my iTunes, I added Gimmee Shelter from Brussels as my own bonus track! The vibe fits right in. I know - blasphemy LOL

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oldschool
... Deep Purple Japan box set, ... warts and all releases and sound fantastic to me.

The Japan set is particularly entertaining because Blackmore botches the opening riff of Smoke On The Water twice out of three times, followed by ironic reactions from Gillan ... I love that!
So far as I know, Made In Japan had no overdubs but they chose the most usable versions out of the three shows (which had nearly identical set lists). One of my all-time favourite live albums.

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bigmac7895
I agree with Dandelion. Love the album and love the variations of the live songs but the studio cuts of JJF, SFM and HTW are better than live versions. Might throw Live With Me on there as well; however, the livecuts of MR, Love in Vain, Chuck Berry cuts and Stray Cat Blues are all superior than the studio cuts. One might ask- what about SFTD? To me this live cut is a different song altogether than the studio. I like them both equally.

WE have the exact same opinions on these. I can't believe that anyone thinks that JJF,HTW, or SFM are better on here then they are on in studio. That blows my mind. They are actually pretty weak on Ya-Ya's.

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stanlove

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bigmac7895
I agree with Dandelion. Love the album and love the variations of the live songs but the studio cuts of JJF, SFM and HTW are better than live versions. Might throw Live With Me on there as well; however, the livecuts of MR, Love in Vain, Chuck Berry cuts and Stray Cat Blues are all superior than the studio cuts. One might ask- what about SFTD? To me this live cut is a different song altogether than the studio. I like them both equally.

WE have the exact same opinions on these. I can't believe that anyone thinks that JJF,HTW, or SFM are better on here then they are on in studio. That blows my mind. They are actually pretty weak on Ya-Ya's.

How you hear JJF, HTW and SFM as "pretty weak o Ya-Ya's" says a lot.

JJF on LOVE YOU LIVE is weak - in fact it's pathetic. FLASHPOINT - hell, anything post 1971.

Street Fighting Man on the JJF FLASHPOINT single is weak. It's terrible.


Not GYYYO. That's ridiculous.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-02-11 18:23 by GasLightStreet.

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DandelionPowderman

If I should compare, though, I'd say that JJF, LIV, SFM are superior on the their respective studio albums.

What was JJF's studio album??? ;-)

Rod

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bitusa2012

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DandelionPowderman

If I should compare, though, I'd say that JJF, LIV, SFM are superior on the their respective studio albums.

What was JJF's studio album??? ;-)

Through The Past, Darkly?

Live Stray Cat Blues better than studio version? Super lolz.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-02-12 11:56 by His Majesty.

I remember hearing the Ya-Ya's version of Stray Cat Blues years ago and being a little disappointed at how slow it was, as I was expecting the fast and raunchy Banquet style. But I was intrigued by it, and now I love it. I think the old and slow live version is better than later and faster live versions of Stray Cat.
The one at Hyde Park '69 is pretty cool.

Yeah, the Hyde Park version is dwirty.

JJF was a single originally. Unbelievable to think my favorite song was not attached to an album. My opinion is usually I prefer live versions, except JJF, where I love almost anything but the studio version remains top. And the promo video is outstanding too. I love Mick's adlib vocals on this.

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GasLightStreet

What's interesting about HTW on GYYYO! is the way that it lurches: it's a boat in a heavy ocean...

Love that description! Yawing and swaying into a perfect storm...Street Fighting Man.