Quote
DoughboyUK
I tend not to compare to much as my mindset will never alter.
Im a Big fan of both...

More a dreamer and what if person...

3) if elvis had found a stones somg to cover...
Dough

...It would have been Mixed Emotions, IMO....

Quote
BluzDude

Quote
DoughboyUK
I tend not to compare to much as my mindset will never alter.
Im a Big fan of both...

More a dreamer and what if person...

3) if elvis had found a stones somg to cover...
Dough

...It would have been Mixed Emotions, IMO....

..although quite disillusioned by the Stones, if big E had demo'd a Song I have to think it would have been Shine A Light or Dance Little Sister as both fit quite nicely with the TCB band...

Let's correct the thread title to "Elvis Presley & Mick Jagger, the two greatest frontmen ever"!

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Let's correct the thread title to "Elvis Presley & Mick Jagger, the two greatest frontmen ever"!

Someone mentioned Freddy Mercury as the greatest, so you have to add him too, at least.

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Let's correct the thread title to "Elvis Presley & Mick Jagger, the two greatest frontmen ever"!

Someone mentioned Freddy Mercury as the greatest, so you have to add him too, at least.

If you added, greatest frontman wearing tights, ever, then I think you'd be on to something.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-21 00:04 by treaclefingers.

Is it better to be the singer of the world's greatest rock 'n' roll band, or to be the king?

did you hear what they talking about Mr. Elvis?...you against Mick! you against Mick!

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Let's correct the thread title to "Elvis Presley & Mick Jagger, the two greatest frontmen ever"!

Someone mentioned Freddy Mercury as the greatest, so you have to add him too, at least.

Freddie who? He's nothing without his short micstand, and he never growled

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
Aquamarine

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
Aquamarine

Quote
guitarbastard
elvis had a great voice and of course was important somehow. but he could hardly play the guitar and didnt write a song on his own. how can anyone call him the KING of rock n roll?? this title goes to chuck berry. when i travelled down the mississippi last year i was shocked how little attention the old (black) blues and rock and roll masters get. no street is named after them, no museum, nothing. but elvis is @#$%& everywhere. it's just so wrong!

You should have called me before you came! You obviously missed the Mississippi Blues Trail, the Delta Blues Museum in Clarksdale (and all the other Clarksdale sites), the guitar monument at the crossroads on Highway 61 where Robert Johnson supposedly met the devil, all the birth sites and grave sites, such as Sonny Boy Williamson's . . . And that's just in one small area of Mississippi!

But why no street names?? I wonder why.

Not many, admittedly, but there are some--John Lee Hooker Lane, McKinley St., plus Muddy waters has a Chicago street named after him.

Not many is an euphemism here. I guess it has something to do with the colour of their skin. A white man was needed to bring the black music to the attention of the mass of white people.

The second part of your statement is certainly true--though of course "black music" isn't monolithic, and a lot of music made by black musicians, such as blues singers, wasn't popular in the black community itself by the time Elvis came along.

The first part, about street names, is partly correct with regard to race, but also these folks weren't famous, unlike Elvis. And thanks to bands like the Stones, they gained a wider audience and became (more) famous, but it's only now that that they have the kind of widespread respect that results in getting streets named after you, etc. And they still don't have the kind of high profile that we'd probably all like them to have.

Having said which, there are a lot of changes being made, and the street names I mentioned were the ones I could remember off the top of my head, but there are more all the time.

Jagger is the best rock singer and easily the best frontman ever but Elvis and Sinatra are in a league of their own. Elvis is probably the most famous celebrity ever. His voice is the most copied without a doubt. Oh and it was John Lennon who said "BEFORE ELVIS THERE WAS NOTHING." Presley changed the world. Beatles fans believe Lennon and McCartney invented air,water,fire,water and every other f#@%ing thing. FACT: WITHOUT ELVIS THERE WOULD BE NO BEATLES!

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Let's correct the thread title to "Elvis Presley & Mick Jagger, the two greatest frontmen ever"!

Someone mentioned Freddy Mercury as the greatest, so you have to add him too, at least.

Freddie who? He's nothing without his short micstand, and he never growled

If I had a plumber,
I'd plumber in the morning
I'd plumber in the evening,
All over this land

I'd plumber out the drains,
I'd plumber out a toilet,
I'd plumber out crud between my bathrooms and my sewers,
All over this land.

Quote
Youngie

Quote
JuanTCB
But yeah, the only person that could give Mick a run for his money was Elvis at his prime ('56-'58, '68-'70).

How about Little Richard (who Jagger "borrowed" from) and a few rock gods - Plant, Daltry, Morrison, Hendrix and Mercury?

Nope. James Brown and Otis are the only other ones that could come close. The guys you mentioned don't move crowds like the Mick/Elvis/Otis/JB crew. They don't have the right amounts of balls, heart, humor, and sheer talent.

Quote
Aquamarine

Quote
guitarbastard
elvis had a great voice and of course was important somehow. but he could hardly play the guitar and didnt write a song on his own. how can anyone call him the KING of rock n roll?? this title goes to chuck berry. when i travelled down the mississippi last year i was shocked how little attention the old (black) blues and rock and roll masters get. no street is named after them, no museum, nothing. but elvis is @#$%& everywhere. it's just so wrong!

You should have called me before you came! You obviously missed the Mississippi Blues Trail, the Delta Blues Museum in Clarksdale (and all the other Clarksdale sites), the guitar monument at the crossroads on Highway 61 where Robert Johnson supposedly met the devil, all the birth sites and grave sites, such as Sonny Boy Williamson's . . . And that's just in one small area of Mississippi!

i saw the crossroads on highway 61 and we drove thru clarksdale (but didnt find anything like birth sites). even if we missed some things, the attention elvis gets is just still so much bigger!

Oh, sure--but then, rightly or wrongly, he was humongously famous and they weren't. But there has been a lot of attention given to commemorating the old blues guys in recent years, even down to competing blues trails and suchlike.

It is true, so many of the 60's rock superstars might not have been created had it not been for Elvis. He opened the door to many musicians and exposed the music scene to blues, rockabilly, and rock n' roll. Elvis was a vital bridge between the deep passion and beauty of black music and the mainstream music business. This created a whole new paradigm of rock n' roll as a vital and poignant expression of youth, anger, and pure joy.

Quote
JuanTCB

Quote
Youngie

Quote
JuanTCB
But yeah, the only person that could give Mick a run for his money was Elvis at his prime ('56-'58, '68-'70).

How about Little Richard (who Jagger "borrowed" from) and a few rock gods - Plant, Daltry, Morrison, Hendrix and Mercury?

Nope. James Brown and Otis are the only other ones that could come close. The guys you mentioned don't move crowds like the Mick/Elvis/Otis/JB crew. They don't have the right amounts of balls, heart, humor, and sheer talent.

Ever see Queen at Live Aid?

Elvis was great, no doubt about it, but we need to boil down the various eras of Elvis somewhat differently to previous postings:

I'd go:

1954 - 1955: The Rockabilly Era - Sun Records, touring the south, about to make it big.

1956 - 1958: RCA and Rock'n'Roll, plus early movies. Bad song choices are starting to creep in, too, i.e. Teddy Bear.

1959: Army

1960 - 1962: Nashville Sound recordings. Albeit not country, nor primal rockabilly, or the 1956-58 era rock'n'roll. The likes of Floyd Cramer and Bob Moore played on these tracks.

1960 - 1966: Generic movie soundtrack era. The odd non-soundtrack tune crops up of quality, i.e. It Hurts Me, Indescribably Blue, Tomorrow Is Such A Long Time, Down In The Alley.

1967-1968: The Jerry Reed era: an extra dimension to the sound of Guitar Man, US Male, and Big Boss Man, with Jerry Reed sitting in. NB: Reed wrote Guitar Man and US Male.

1968-1970: The Comeback Special, Elvis at American Studios in Memphis, the 1969 rockin' Vegas concerts, the 1970 return to touring at the Houston Astrodome, the Nashville Sessions that yielded Elvis Country, and Thats The Way It Is tour movie.

1971: Nashville sessions, but the quality is starting to drop a little compared to previous years.

1972: Separation from Priscilla, but two great songs in Burning Love and Always On My Mind. Elvis On Tour, and the Madison Square Garden Gigs.

1973-1974: Aloha From Hawaii (Not my favourite live album), the Stax Sessions, recently anthologised to show what a great change in direction these were, and the 1974 Memphis Concert. The 1974 concert is outstanding, and has just been reissued on Legacy, with a gig in Virginia from two days prior.

Mid 1974 - 1977: The true decline kicks in. Elvis' drug issues take precedent to the music. The live shows are intermittently good, and studio-wise there's a decline in quality.

Elvis had an aura that appealed to several generations at the same time, both men and women. People loved him for everything he was, not just on stage. And moms and daughters and grandmothers loved his voice, an incredible one. He was handsome, had lots of humor and with a daring, funny and flirting attitude.

Once in a while I like to whatch "Elvis that's the way it is" film in Vegas and it strikes me everytime his gigantic presence on stage. It's a wonderful film. He was the biggest frontman and one of the biggest stars ever,hands down.

I think there's no sense in comparisons. For a second place I wouldn't even pick Mick. He is a very hard working man, that's for sure. But one can tell when it comes from permanent hard work and when there's an natural aura that shines naturally, almost divine - that people love and worship like a religion. Elvis had it all and there is no other one like him.

They are both kings, Mick's the king of rock'n'roll and Elvis is the Burgerking........

Quote
JuanTCB
Justin nailed it, but to pile on... I think Elvis' greatest impact was that he was the catalyst that made it all happen. Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, and Little Richard weren't getting into white living rooms without something happening first - and that something was Elvis.

Plus, the guy was a master interpreter, an original, visceral arranger, he had a hell of a voice, great moves, a sense of humor, and was one of the best-looking examples of humanity the world has ever seen.

It's kind of like what I think Keith said about the Beatles, regarding the British Invasion - "They opened up the door, we kicked it down."

But yeah, the only person that could give Mick a run for his money was Elvis at his prime ('56-'58, '68-'70). It really is apples and oranges, though.

Only sensible post in this thread...sums it all up..


Vilhelm
Nordic Stones Vikings

to bv (the king of the forum),
it's quite strange to change the title of the thread. I must admit that I don't understand.
was there an offense to someone ?

Quote
jpasc95
to bv (the king of the forum),
it's quite strange to change the title of the thread. I must admit that I don't understand.
was there an offense to someone ?

I'm guessing it's just for clarity--this new title makes it clear what the thread is (or has become) about. If you're just browsing the forum, it wouldn't be clear from the original title what the topic was. That's just my guess, anyway!

Who’s to say whether Elvis or Jagger is the best front man? It’s like comparing apples and oranges in terms of the music and band. In terms of pure singing, you have to go with Elvis. As a black friend of mine put it regarding Elvis, when we were discussing music one day, “D, that @#$%& could sing.” Now, this surprised me, because I had never before in my life heard any black person I know say squat about Elvis. So, Mac’s comment took me aback. Mac then asked me what I thought about Elvis. I told him I loved Elvis’ singing and had some stuff that I put together that showed Elvis in fine form and wasn’t the shit most people associated with Elvis. (Mac, as I also discovered, loved listening to Merle Haggard, among others, but that’s a thread for another day.) Anyway, I had put together this compilation of Elvis I called “The Voice” (long before the dumbass t.v. show) and gave a copy to Mac. He loved it. Here’s the set list of my compilation in order:

Blueberry Hill, One Night (of Sin), Blue Christmas, Santa Claus is Back in Town, Fever, Like A Baby, Reconsider Baby, Only the Strong Survive, Any Day Now, Long Black Limousine, I’ll Hold You In My Heart, True Love Travels On A Gravel Road, It Keeps Right On A-hurtin’, Heartbreak Hotel, Don’t Be Cruel, Too Much, Crying In The Chapel, Suspicious Minds (long version), That’s Alright Mama, Blue Moon, Tomorrow Night, Good Rockin” Tonight, Mystery Train, Money Honey, Lawdy Miss Clawdy, Love Me

Grab these off of YouTube, your disks-albums-whatever and play ‘em in the order listed, loud, and rock out. I know this has nothing to do with settling the question of who was/is the best front man, but, you’ll hear what Keith, the Beatles, Jimmy Page and so many others did. “Good Rockin’ Tonight” is licks you can hear in George Harrison’s work with The Beatles. And, if you wanna treat yourself to some other Elvis that’s really good, check out his versions of “Funny, How Time Slips Away” and “Good Time Charlie’s Got the Blues”.

Agree with DMay's post. Elvis has done some amazing cuts, and, to be honest, Mick couldn't scratch the surface of Elvis' vocals on Long Black Limousine. I'm sorry, but he was that good. Likewise, his versions of How Great Thou Art, be they 1966,1974, and 1977, show what a great singer he was.

Quote
tomcasagranda
Agree with DMay's post. Elvis has done some amazing cuts, and, to be honest, Mick couldn't scratch the surface of Elvis' vocals on Long Black Limousine. I'm sorry, but he was that good. Likewise, his versions of How Great Thou Art, be they 1966,1974, and 1977, show what a great singer he was.

Stop. You're not sorry...you're proud!

Damn right he should be proud. Give a listen to the tunes I listed in the order I listed and add on the add ons I added (how's that for alliteration?) and crank them suckers up. You'll get the idea. Mick was/is right for the Stones and he sounded good behind Carly on "You're So Vain" and with Peter Tosh on "Don't Look Back", but....

I certainly admire Elvis at his best on numerous tracks and in live performances where I saw him tape the NBC "Comeback" TV Special' a couple of years later at the Long Beach Arena and in Las Vegas several times. I didn't want to see him after 1972 because he was clearly on drugs and I found it sad to see him being almost a parody of "Elvis Presley."

Elvis was groomed to be a solo performer with a "back-up band."

It wouldn't occur to me to contrast Elvis with anyone else. He was great when he was great. But the last years were full of inconsistent performances.

Jagger started out as a singer with the band and he still is. Don't know of a a better "frontman" around.

Quote
guitarbastard
elvis had a great voice and of course was important somehow. but he could hardly play the guitar and didnt write a song on his own. how can anyone call him the KING of rock n roll?? this title goes to chuck berry. when i travelled down the mississippi last year i was shocked how little attention the old (black) blues and rock and roll masters get. no street is named after them, no museum, nothing. but elvis is @#$%& everywhere. it's just so wrong!

First the guitar playing - watch the two sit-down shows that were filmed for the 68 Comeback Special. Elvis plays guitar really well. In fact I think he could pull off those shows without the other musicians, just himself with the guitar (but their one off reunion was absolutely great of course).

As for Chuck Berry and all other old blues and rock'n'roll masters - if it wasn't for Elvis, maybe they would be pretty much forgotten by now. I am not saying it would have to be necessarily that way, it is impossible to judge, but the clear fact is that Elvis was the very first one who made music as such so popular among youngsters. And that moment was more important than anything else in the whole history of rock'n'roll music (and blues and...well, all popular music) And Elvis did it in a great way, it was not that he would take great black music and f..k it up the way it would be accessible to screaming little girls. No. He made absolutely immortal music.

The Beatles took it one step further I would say (I mean the thing that music became absolutely essential part of life of young people), but clearly on the basis what Elvis had already achieved. The Rolling Stones and others rode on that weave then. I don't mean to undermine The Stones or anybody else in any way - what The Stones (and others) did for spreading the blues music among teenagers was a heroic work, but I seriously doubt it could have been done without Elvis doing his job some 8 or so years earlier.

Anyway, it is quite difficult for me as a non-English speaker to express these things properly. Justin's post just says it all.

I love Elvis and The Rolling Stones. I appreciate their uniqueness. I also loved Justin's post. You said it! Now I just want to add a couple more things.

Elvis is called the King for a reason. He had the incredible voice, the looks, and the charisma. He was the epitome of cool. His coolness is the essence of rock and roll and it's spawned everything that came after him.

He changed the world and his initial influence in the 50's inspired musicians to branch off into several directions based on his work. Blues music was unappreciated until Elvis came about. He arguably kick started the blues revival, the folk revival, and the emergence of support for the civil rights movement. People make a lot of fuss about Woody Guthrie's influence on Bob Dylan, but Elvis is the one that truly inspired Dylan to begin with. Every musician wanted to be Elvis. His accomplishments changed the music industry. He was the first artist that I know of that was doing rock and roll, gospel, ballads, folk, country and blues and mixing it all together. He is the one who opened that door for the Beatles and the Stones to doing all kinds of song styles. Chuck Berry and Little Richard may have been Kings Of Rock and Roll, but they were not near as versatile as Elvis.

If only he had started to do more artistic pursuits and had a producer who could steer him in the right direction. That being said, I really enjoy a lot of his 70's output. Especially if I am in a down mood about a relationship, there is nothing better than listening to the Jungle Room Sessions and hearing Elvis put all that pain to tape. It's highly underrated stuff. After the Comeback Special success, he promised not to ever sing a song he never believed in ever again. But honestly, a lot of the movie songs are not that bad. There are tons of beautiful love songs that he knocked out of the ballpark with his ability to sincerely emote such sentiments.

Elvis to the best of my knowledge, was one of the first singers I have heard who also never sang the same way twice. Hearing his studio outtakes and concert recordings is a lesson in creativity. He's far more than the run of the mill singers today. Elvis made it up as he went along. He may not have written songs, but he was one of the greatest creative singers of all time. This is so often overlooked. I like a lot of his concert recordings because when he was on, he was unbeatable with the creativity for melody, vocal ability, and emotion invested in the moment. He sang like Jimi Hendrix played guitar. Nowadays, I don't hear anyone doing this except for Bob Dylan, who never sings the same way twice.

Mick used to be awesome at never singing the same way twice as well, but now he's gotten rather pedestrian so that he can appeal to the mindset of people who want to see them perform a song exactly how they heard it on the record. A lot of people mistake that creativity found in concerts for incompetence because their minds can't hear a song sung any differently than they heard it on the record. They expect you to perform it exactly the same every time.

But back to Elvis, how can one man also look so damned good at every angle? He barely ever took a bad photo especially when he was younger. He was practically the perfect looking man. He did the best he could in uncharted territory of his own devise. Sadly, the deals the Colonel made to make Elvis one of the richest men in America, ruined his artistic integrity. Movie soundtracks like Blue Hawaii and GI Blues outsold his seriously overlooked masterpieces of serious work like Elvis Is Back, Something For Everyone, and Pot Luck. So they went where the money was.

Anyway, I had to write a bit about Elvis. He's important but a lot of people forget why. Not you guys though, most of you here are very knowledgeable and know your stuff.

Quote
treaclefingers
I think they are/were both formidable.

And even though Mick is quite wiry and physically fit, I think in his prime, let's say 1968, Elvis would have kicked Mick's ass in the ring.

Elvis was a black belt after all. All Mick had was some James Brown moves.

yeah EP was also packing and i don't mean banana sandwiches.