whitem8, perfectly said. I think whats perfect about it, which you already mentioned, was they were older by this point and finally able to bask a bit. It wasn't the 70s and 80s when they had to conform. People already knew at this point how great they were and they were able to just relax and play their great songs as they should be played.

Ray and Dave are both excellent. Dave playing amazing electric guitar and Ray's voice is out of this world. I remember hearing the version of I'm Not Like Everybody Else from here on the Sopranos and not thinking it was Ray because it sounded so unlike him at the chorus. I agree I don't think they'll ever reunite, but boy they sure were amazing, and if this is the last thing they release as the Kinks, its a great late retrospective for them. Honestly, its one of my favorite live albums ever. Definitely from the post 70s/80s era when live albums were king. Few do it right nowadays, and the Kinks passed the test with this one.

A few copies right now on ebay ...

[www.ebay.nl]

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whitem8
To the Bone is an amazing collection. Oh to have been at that show. Done at Konk for their fan club. Mixed in are some live arena songs added to the double disc set to try to sell it. And two fantastic studio songs better than most their stuff from Think Visual on (Hatred and Scattered, two great songs). They are playing with a laid back passion that just shines, and extols the beauty of Ray and Dave together. Ray's in fantastic vocal shape, plays some great rhythm guitar. Dave plays tasteful beautiful fills. Several songs rival their originals. In fact Do You Remember Walter I like far better than the original! The slowed pace makes it so sad and longing. The version of Ape Man is stunning. So energetic and urgent. But man, Animal and especially To the Bone give a glimpse of what could of and should have been. To the Bone is chillingly sublime. Ray has so much venom and angst in his voice. The poor Kinks always seem to get ignored, and this went totally under the radar. I remember seeing Ray at Wolftrap in Virginia and he was selling this disc in the lobby area. Seeing Ray a second time at the same venue, after having listened to Too the Bone over and over I was saddened that he wasn't with Dave. It is a shame their relationship is so pathological, and always thought it would have been beautiful if just the two of them toured together. . . alas never to happen, and I would be surprised if they do get back together. Slim chance there. But I hope.

i thought PHOBIA was a stellar album

I've got both the LP and 2 CD set- both fantastic. The unplugged/live in the studio stuff is the best thing they've done in years. Somehow, after a string of lackluster commercial stiffs (Think Visual, UK Jive, etc) and dwindling concert audiences, on the verge of splitting up, they released a classic on a small label and almost no one bought it. A real shame.
Similar to the "Did Ya" EP from 1991- the best studio material in many years, released to zero fanfare and vanished with even die-hard Kinks fans unaware of it. These guys cant get out of their own way!

Good point bringing up the Did Ya EP! I totally forgot about that release, and it was a great one! Another one that is really hard to find and expensive. Keefriffhard4life, Phobia is ok. It has some really great moments, but the production and playing sounds a bit formulaic and brash. And after the dreadful UK Jive it seemed to meld into that release in someways. While the songs and writing are way better, again the production and feel seems to be a lot like UK Jive. I don't often come back to it, which might not be fair, but I think Animal and To the Bone really gave a glimpse of what could have been.

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RollingFreak
So many standouts from Do It Again to a phenomenal electric version of Set Me Free, as well as killer versions of Don't Forget To Dance and Come Dancing.

Completely agree. The version of "Do It Again" (including Ray's acoustic/spoken/countdown intro) is like wildfire. This and a few others (I'd add "See My Friends" ) are definitive versions to my mind. And as mentioned, Ray and Dave are at the peak of their game chops-wise. I'm not so big on the two originals but they are worthy. Those latter day Kinks LPs usually had a couple of good to great tracks.

Yeah, the Kinks not getting out of their own way -- to an an extent like the Beach Boys but even worse. They should be rewarded in the same pantheon as Beatles/Stones/Who/Zep etc.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-10-14 19:59 by Wry Cooter.

I have been listening to the recently released Muswell Hillbillies deluxe edition. I gotta say, I'm a big Kinks fan but I never really paid close attention to this album outside of a couple songs. Its really a good album with standouts like 20th Century Man, Alcohol (done in a more New Orleans-jazz style than the more famous live version), Skin and Bone (a great boogie woogie track about a false doctor), the beautiful Oklahoma USA and of course the title track. On the bonus disc are some great cuts, like the Waterloo Sunset follow up Lavender Lane and the wonderful Nobody's Fool. Rounding it out are three BBC tracks that show a band in their live prime.
Its unfortunate that this album didn't get its just due when it was released as its really a unique album with a great variety of music. Even some of the lesser tracks are still good. Pick it UP! (for Americans its cheaper to order it from Amazon UK than Amazon, even with shipping).

The sound/mix on Phobia is appalling- the most brittle shiny reverbed giant snare drum 90's LA studio sheen cliché imaginable. Grating. Sounds (deservedly) dated now. Made me thankful they went out on "To the Bone", a real high note.

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roryfaninva
The sound/mix on Phobia is appalling- the most brittle shiny reverbed giant snare drum 90's LA studio sheen cliché imaginable. Grating. Sounds (deservedly) dated now. Made me thankful they went out on "To the Bone", a real high note.

"only in a dream" though is a killer track

Yes the mix on Phobia is horrendous. I even went back this morning and listened to it. And there are some great songs, good writing, and wonderful lyrics, yet the production is so harsh and overbearing it just ruins it. And yes, it sounds very dated in the worse way.

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whitem8
Yes the mix on Phobia is horrendous. I even went back this morning and listened to it. And there are some great songs, good writing, and wonderful lyrics, yet the production is so harsh and overbearing it just ruins it. And yes, it sounds very dated in the worse way.

i guess i'm alone then that its one of my favorite kinks albums lol

Really? Well I could be catty and say that doesn't surprise me after reading the Meat Loaf thread. Oops there I said it. Sorry. Wow, I can automatically list so many albums by them I love far better than Phobia. Even most their 80's stuff.
Lets try the dreaded top five lists.

1. Muswell Hillbillies
2. Arther
3. Face to Face
4. Something Else
5. Village Green Preservation Society

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whitem8
Really? Well I could be catty and say that doesn't surprise me after reading the Meat Loaf thread. Oops there I said it. Sorry. Wow, I can automatically list so many albums by them I love far better than Phobia. Even most their 80's stuff.
Lets try the dreaded top five lists.

1. Muswell Hillbillies
2. Arther
3. Face to Face
4. Something Else
5. Village Green Preservation Society

my top 10:
1 village green
2 something else
3 misfits
4 phobia
5 sleepwalker
6 face to face
7 muswell hillbillies
8 1st album
9 low budget
10 lola



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-10-14 22:55 by keefriffhard4life.

Whew! You put Phobia above Muswell Hillbillies? And Face to Face?? Wow! I guess we have very different tastes...but neither one of us put either of the Preservation Acts on our lists.

The Reprise 2 LP "Kink Kronikles" compilation from 1972 pretty much says it all. If you could only have one, that's the one to get.

Most overlooked/underrated IMO -- "Schoolboys in Disgrace." Agree on "Kinks Kronikles" as the place to go if you have only one LP by them (granted a double), but as for proper albums I'll go with "Village Green" edging out "Arthur" as their best work. "Something Else", "Face to Face", "Lola vs the Powerman" are all in the top tier. Half of "Everybody's in Showbiz" (where I prefer the live versions of the "Muswell Hillbillies" songs, though that LP has a cool vibe) and "Preservation Act I" are also in that realm, maybe "Sleepwalker". After that albums can be spotty but with a number of classic cuts. Worth checking out is Ray's "Return to Waterloo".

School Boys in Disgrace is a fantastic album! And would probably make my top ten as well. I mean Education and Headmaster are worth the price of the album. Lola and Everybody's in Showbiz also are stunning. I love all of Everybody's in Showbiz. It is a weird fun album. Supersonic Rocketship is a classic, as is Celluloid Heros. Motorway is their country rock ala Dead Flowers with a very similar lead by Dave. And Sitting in My Hotel is a quintessential Ray sad song. Light hearted arrangement and singing with cut quick to the bone lyrics of fear and depression. Classic Ray. Low Budget is another one, their Some Girls where they got popular again with several amazing singles and a full on punk like tour. Great album with great writing and performances.

my bad guys. i have the 1st album listed as 8 and 10. 10 was supposed to be lola

I like Phobia too, but wouldn´t list it in my top ten.

1. Soap Opera
2. Arthur
3. Village Green
4. Muswell Hillbillies
5. Sleepwalker
6. Schoolboys In Disgrace
7. Misfits
8. Low Budget
9. Everybody´s In Show Business
10. Lola

PS: No love for Soap Opera??



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-10-14 23:47 by DandelionPowderman.

Soap Opera is excellent. @#$%& weird but great nonetheless. IMO its right before he started to go full on crazy. Luckily he pulled back after that.

And to what was said before, Schoolsboys is amazing. Maybe my favorite underground Kinks album!

My top 10:

1. Something Else By The Kinks - personal fave. Fell in love with it when I was a kid (my brother and I screaming David Watts and Harry Rag!) and the album still holds up. I understand its not their best, but its definitely up there, and nothing can top that for me. Similar to Let It Bleed never quite being better than Sticky Fingers to me.


2. Schoolboys In Disgrace - Not one bad song and possibly the best concept album ever. Doesn't ever get full of itself and short enough that its just fun all the way through. Education, I'm In Disgrace, Schooldays, The Hard Way, its all amazing. And AMAZING album cover.

3. Village Green Preservation Society - Stunning. Aged very very well and everyone should relisten to this. I feel its too often forgotten.

4. Lola Vs. Powerman - continuing the run of amazing albums one after another.

5. A Soap Opera - as I said before, I think of that as Schoolboys as the same thing (even though I think this was first). But again, a great "concept" album and weird in only the way a Kinks album can be.

6. Face To Face - their first "great" album. Excellent stuff front to Back.

7. Sleepwalker - rare late album that I just recently discovered about a year ago from someone on here. Boy, its too bad this isn't more well known. A sneaky underground personal favorite that you probably won't see in many lists but should be there.

8. To The Bone - its a live album but doesn't really count, but I think its good enough to actually stand with their best albums. One of the well put together live albums that is part of their discography. Like how you'd consider Ya Yas as a part of the Stones "studio" discography but not the other live albums (at least thats how I see it).

9. Arthur - same with Face To Face and Lola, just part of that run of nonstop amazing albums. Another overlooked.

10. Everybody's in Show-Biz - another overlooked album that really shines throughout.

Its sad how forgotten they are in terms of American albums. They are up there with some of the best runs ever, and I guess thats why they are always listed so highly of top bands ever.

PS: I've never heard Phobia before. Just has never been readily available to me like most later Kinks albums. Also, they are certainly a band that people can have vastly different lists. Without a doubt, my dad would have at least one of the Preservation Acts on there, so just shows how versatile they are.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-10-15 02:08 by RollingFreak.

the 2 best songs from phobia imo

this song seems to be about just how a stranger giving you a smile can change your entire outlook on things






this song seems to be about some circle of life

Think Visual is one of my favorite later albums--which is also notable because in the Dave song Rock n Roll Cities we have the final recording that Mick Avory made with The Kinks. It's ironic, because Dave, who forced Avory out of the band, asked him personally to play on it. Dave was in Konk one day developing his idea and there was no one else around save for good ol' Mick, who had taken on an office job at Konk just upstairs. So Mick agreed to play on it and what we hear on that record is essentially the demo as it was laid down. At the beginning of the video is a bit of a play on the perpetual brotherly fued, with a news-related skit detailing the sudden disappearance of The Kinks lead singer just ahead of a U.S. tour.

There are lots of great underrated songs on there, like Working At The Factory and Welcome To Sleazy Town and my favorites, Natural Gift and Killing Time.





















Sadly, due to their lack of success, Think and Visual and Phobia seem now to be out of print. It's always a disappointing experience going back to Phobia--it seems overly long and drawn out and the sound is a bit flat. But the two stand-out tracks, Hatred and Scattered, always keep you going back to listen again for what you may have missed.

Yeah Stonehearted we liked the same two songs from Phobia. I also loved Sleazy Town. I saw them on that tour in a small university gym in Northern Michigan. I was a freshman at college and talked a few of my buddies to drive over to see the show, and it was strange. All college kids. Most not knowing a lot of The Kinks stuff, and touring behind Think Visual. I felt every song they did off of Think Visual was vastly superior than the studio album. The production again just seemed so flat and a lot of retreads from the last two albums. I loved Sleazy Town live! Fantastic and Ray played some great harp on it. Rock and Roll Cities always reminded me of that horrid Jefferson Starship Song We Built this City. I don't know why!? So perhaps I have a deep subliminal pathology against it.

A really solid live album came from that Think Visual tour, 1987's The Road, notable because it contains a track that was only played live but never included on a Kinks studio album (It).









And here's a UK TV show from 1987 where they perform Lost And Found and Think Visual.

Top 10:
1. Arthur-the proto punk Brainwashed is a great song, and Shangri-La is probably one of the best rock ballads
2. Village Green
3. Muswell Hillbillies
4. Schoolboys in Disgrace-love the song Education and No More Looking Back. Also some elements of the later Wall story line pop up here
5. Sleepwalker
6. Face to Face
7. Kink Kontroversy
8. Everybody's in showbiz
9. Somethin Else
10. State of Confusion-Young Conservatives is still one of the best political satire songs

I would make the argument that the Kinks "golden years" (1966-71) were every bit as good as the Stones or the Who of the same time. Face To Face, Somethin Else, Village Green, Arthur, Lola, Muswell Hillbillies are all great albums.

i think phobia was so long for 2 reasons. the band had not released a new full length album in a while before phobia was released the band was informed columbia wasn't going to make a big marketing push so maybe the band went ahead and put everything that was finished on it

"Lola vs. Powerman..." is criminally underrated...."This Time Tomorrow", "Long Way From Home", "Strangers"...theres some really good stuff on the LP with a slightly ragged murky feel I think most classic era Stones fans would dig...of course the Kinks followed that huge international success up by doing a series of theatrical musical concept LPs that became bargain bin mainstay for decades....if I had a dollar for every 1.99 copy of Preservation Act I'd passed by....great career move Ray!

I think Hatred was one of the best things the Kinks ever did. Talk about art imitating life.

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roryfaninva
"Lola vs. Powerman..." is criminally underrated...."This Time Tomorrow", "Long Way From Home", "Strangers"...theres some really good stuff on the LP with a slightly ragged murky feel I think most classic era Stones fans would dig...

I just listened to this yesterday for the first time in awhile. I totally agree. And its just as classic as Village Green or Something Else, but it had a huge hit with it. I mean, Lola is second or third to You Really Got Me and All Day and All Of The Night in terms of stuff everyone knows by the Kinks, but back then they were a singles band. By Lola, they were clearly doing regular albums like the Stones and the Beatles, etc, so I'm surprised that single didn't launch people towards hearing that album in full more like people did. If you like Lola, you'll like the rest of the album, it was actually one of the less "weird" Kinks album (aside from the absurdly long title which I love). Nearly all of the Kinks career is just a giant "thats so weird. People SHOULD be hearing this, yet for no logical reason they aren't". IMO, Lola should be their most popular album for a casual fan if one was to choose.

I agree! Lola is an amazing album, in my top ten for sure for The Kinks. Another beautiful song about the American Unions, Get Back in Line.





Love the live version, but couldn't find it on Youtube. And how do you get the youtube link to show with the player in the posting. So many times it is just a hyper-link to youtube?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-10-16 04:16 by whitem8.