Ronnie slide from 2:32

never liked hearing Robbie Robertson talk about 'we've been on the road sixteen years...'

well thanks for your sacrifice Robbie, for so long...

hard to even watch him during the last waltz, and I love the Band

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TheGreek

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StonesCat
On the Levon/Garth DVD commentary, they laugh at how Robbie was always shown singing on a dead mic.

did you ever hear how robbie sings? listen to his solo albums and then you know why his mic was turned off .

Oh, I know, I just worded that badly. They were laughing because Scorcese/Robbie made it appear as if he was really doing alot of backups, I'm sure everybody knew it was off.

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StonesCat

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TheGreek

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StonesCat
On the Levon/Garth DVD commentary, they laugh at how Robbie was always shown singing on a dead mic.

did you ever hear how robbie sings? listen to his solo albums and then you know why his mic was turned off .

Oh, I know, I just worded that badly. They were laughing because Scorcese/Robbie made it appear as if he was really doing alot of backups, I'm sure everybody knew it was off.

Everybody but Robbie

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pepganzo
ronnie is here

I have never seen that one before. Great, thanks for posting!

In my house, the Neil Diamond segment has always been known as the intermission: get up, have a piss, and get another drink before the rest of the show starts.

If you haven't read it already I strongly advise you all to read 'Across the Great Divide' by Barney Hoskins. It's the story of The Band from start to finish and it is in my top 3 music books. It has quite a lot in about the Last Waltz and the build up, the reasons why certain people were in it and others couldn;t make it. A hilarious story about Van Morrison panicking pre gig about his outfit and having to be rushed back tot he hotel to change into that onesie. Another one about how Dylan was so into the gig he was the last one still dancing after the party ended the next morning. A thoroughly great read, by one of the best music writers. I'm not sure if it is still available but if it is, do yourself a favour and you won;t be disappointed.

Of course Ronnie is also here:





and here

I guess it's dog-pile on Robbie, as the old saying goes.

We all have our faults.

Robbie feels that The Band were on the road for 16 years: let's break it down.

1959/1964 - With Ronnie Hawkins. Even then, the aggregation that was later to be The Band was, initially, Levon, and then, as the years progressed, Robbie, Rick, Richard, and Garth were added to the unit. The first time they recorded as the backing band to Ronnie Hawkins was in 1963, with Who Do You Love

1964/65 - Levon & The Hawks

1965 - Bob Dylan & The Hawks

Late 1965: Levon goes off to work on an oil-rig, as he's fed up of the boos at the Dylan gigs.

1966: The Hawks, sans Levon, and with either Mickey Jones or Sandy Konikoff, back Dylan on his world tour.

1966 - 1968 - Basement Tapes, but The Hawks do no touring during this period. Ditto after they release Big Pink.

1969 - 01/01/1972 - Touring intermittently in USA and Europe.

1973 - Only one gig at Watkins Glen

1974 - Tour 74 with Dylan, and Wembley Stadium as support for CSNY

1975 - No gigs

1976 - Gigs to support Northern Lights, Southern Cross, plus Last Waltz.

When you tot it up, it's not exactly 16 years, and it does appear that Robbie was copping out. However, Richard Manuel, at this time, had some serious drug and alcohol problems, so you could have sympathy for Robbie. However, as evinced from his parties with Scorsese, Robbie wasn't an angel either.

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JimmyTheSaint
Neil Diamond didn't fit at all. His performance is probably the only low point of the film.

Turns out one of my favourite Dylan stories may not be true. From wiki

" In his autobiography, Levon Helm was critical of the inclusion of Diamond, not discerning any musical connection to The Band. A persistent rumor claims that when Diamond came off stage he remarked to Dylan, "Follow that," to which Dylan responded, "What do I have to do, go on stage and fall asleep?" However, Diamond claims that they were just joking around with each other before either of them performed, and Diamond never said anything like "follow that!" or "top that!"

Braincapers, I tend to think that if Bob said that, he was joking.
Neil and Bob were friends who could joke with each other. I remember a gathering at Neil's house where a group were playing word games. Someone came up with a word that Elton John. always super-competitive in games, didn't think much of.
"Who came up with that stupid word?" he demanded.

Master songwriter Dylan said casually, "That's MY word."

Robbie needed to escape the hard drug and booze lifestyle The Band led, back then it was very, very hard to keep it together. You have to respect a man that left on a high note, alive.. Personally I place them as America's Beatles, the top of the top, with 3 great lead vocalists. Robertson was full of adventure often dipping into different styles of Americana, utilizing producers such as Allen Toussaint. They are all great characters as Patti stated. As far as who's the bad guy, Levon had a more contemporary view of song-writing while Robbie was schooled by Dylan and believed it's the musician's and singer's job to do something great and their contributions no matter how important do not make them writers. Levon was forever on the hustle, "Levon likes his money." is not a lie, Robbie could have been more open to later reunions as his mates had gone through their smaller shares.

..... Ya gotta love Danko ... Man that cat was loose ...



ROCKMAN

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DoomandGloom
Robbie needed to escape the hard drug and booze lifestyle The Band led, back then it was very, very hard to keep it together. You have to respect a man that left on a high note, alive.. Personally I place them as America's Beatles, the top of the top, with 3 great lead vocalists. Robertson was full of adventure often dipping into different styles of Americana, utilizing producers such as Allen Toussaint. They are all great characters as Patti stated. As far as who's the bad guy, Levon had a more contemporary view of song-writing while Robbie was schooled by Dylan and believed it's the musician's and singer's job to do something great and their contributions no matter how important do not make them writers. Levon was forever on the hustle, "Levon likes his money." is not a lie, Robbie could have been more open to later reunions as his mates had gone through their smaller shares.

Agree with almost everything you said here but how can they be America's Beatles when four fifths of them were Canadian? I'm quite proud of the fact that Robertson/Danko/Manuel and Hudson accounted for one of Canada's greatest contributions to rock 'n' roll. And that is not to take anything at all away from Levon. Robbie wrote about the States a lot, obviously, but I believe it was his outsiders' romanticized view, particularly of the South, that gave those songs a unique voice.And vocally, Danko sounded exactly like rural Ontario to my ears, whereas Manuel just sounded...otherworldly.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-18 01:19 by andrewm.

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duke richardson
never liked hearing Robbie Robertson talk about 'we've been on the road sixteen years...'

well thanks for your sacrifice Robbie, for so long...

hard to even watch him during the last waltz, and I love the Band

\

The fact is that is a long time to be on the road. The stones were on the road for roughly 18 or 19 then there were long breaks. 16 is nothing to sneeze at.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-18 01:06 by ryanpow.

Personally I place them as America's Beatles



..................................Nope can't agree with ya on that one ....



ROCKMAN

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tomcasagranda
Robbie feels that The Band were on the road for 16 years: let's break it down.

Well, if we want to split hairs, a certain English act have just commemorated being 50 years as a band. The fact is that they all but ceased to exist between 1983 and 1989 but for a few months in 1985 (when relationships were at an all time low ebb), didnt play or record together at all for about five years after 2007 and routinely didnt work together for two or three years at a time in the 90s. Half of the shows in that 50 year career took place in their first five years as a band, and in the entire second half of that celebrated half century they've made four albums! :-)

I think Robbie's quote in The Last Waltz about quitting before 'the road' got to them was a subtle way of saying 'we've partied too much and one or two of these guys will probably croak if we keep going much longer'. A summary which he was hardly going to admit to on celluloid!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-18 01:26 by Gazza.

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andrewm

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DoomandGloom
Robbie needed to escape the hard drug and booze lifestyle The Band led, back then it was very, very hard to keep it together. You have to respect a man that left on a high note, alive.. Personally I place them as America's Beatles, the top of the top, with 3 great lead vocalists. Robertson was full of adventure often dipping into different styles of Americana, utilizing producers such as Allen Toussaint. They are all great characters as Patti stated. As far as who's the bad guy, Levon had a more contemporary view of song-writing while Robbie was schooled by Dylan and believed it's the musician's and singer's job to do something great and their contributions no matter how important do not make them writers. Levon was forever on the hustle, "Levon likes his money." is not a lie, Robbie could have been more open to later reunions as his mates had gone through their smaller shares.

Agree with almost everything you said here but how can they be America's Beatles when four fifths of them were Canadian? I'm quite proud of the fact that Robertson/Danko/Manuel and Hudson accounted for one of Canada's greatest contributions to rock 'n' roll. And that is not to take anything at all away from Levon. Robbie wrote about the States a lot, obviously, but I believe it was his outsiders' romanticized view, particularly of the South, that gave those songs a unique voice.And vocally, Danko sounded exactly like rural Ontario to my ears, whereas Manuel just sounded...otherworldly.

Canada is in America. Brazil is in America. Mexico is in America. It's the United States of America, not the United States are America. Be American, be proud, eh?

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stonehearted

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andrewm

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DoomandGloom
Robbie needed to escape the hard drug and booze lifestyle The Band led, back then it was very, very hard to keep it together. You have to respect a man that left on a high note, alive.. Personally I place them as America's Beatles, the top of the top, with 3 great lead vocalists. Robertson was full of adventure often dipping into different styles of Americana, utilizing producers such as Allen Toussaint. They are all great characters as Patti stated. As far as who's the bad guy, Levon had a more contemporary view of song-writing while Robbie was schooled by Dylan and believed it's the musician's and singer's job to do something great and their contributions no matter how important do not make them writers. Levon was forever on the hustle, "Levon likes his money." is not a lie, Robbie could have been more open to later reunions as his mates had gone through their smaller shares.

Agree with almost everything you said here but how can they be America's Beatles when four fifths of them were Canadian? I'm quite proud of the fact that Robertson/Danko/Manuel and Hudson accounted for one of Canada's greatest contributions to rock 'n' roll. And that is not to take anything at all away from Levon. Robbie wrote about the States a lot, obviously, but I believe it was his outsiders' romanticized view, particularly of the South, that gave those songs a unique voice.And vocally, Danko sounded exactly like rural Ontario to my ears, whereas Manuel just sounded...otherworldly.

Canada is in America. Brazil is in America. Mexico is in America. It's the United States of America, not the United States are America. Be American, be proud, eh?

Yup, Canada is America, they headquartered in Woodstock, still if you're Canadian there's much to prize. Big Pink knocked the music world on it's butt, I encourage everyone to follow The Band's history with their true releases. The pacing and hidden gems on their records give a better perspective of them as master recording artists. "THe Weight" and "Cripple Creek" are only a tiny part of their unique versatility. Also don't forget "Before The Flood" with Dylan for some of the best versions of Bob's songs ever. Planet Waves too...





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-18 02:07 by DoomandGloom.

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Gazza

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tomcasagranda
Robbie feels that The Band were on the road for 16 years: let's break it down.

I think Robbie's quote in The Last Waltz about quitting before 'the road' got to them was a subtle way of saying 'we've partied too much and one or two of these guys will probably croak if we keep going much longer'. A summary which he was hardly going to admit to on celluloid!

Bingo. Robertson is using "the Road" as metaphor; he could have also used "Rock and Roll." But anyone who has played the joints knows, it's a tough life. Packed into vans, cars for long hours, playing till 4am for idiots or no one, poisoning your body with booze, drugs, cigarettes, bad food -- probably not a lot of exercise either. Then there's the mind trips, false friends, sex without love (sure I know it sounds fun), rip-offs, and again booze and drugs that wear down your soul. Although I couldn't know, I imagine graduating to the upper level still had its stresses and strains.

And ultimately "the Road" did kill 3 amazing musicians in Helm, Manuel, and Danko well before their time. I post at a Beach Boys board where there is currently a Band thread as well, and sure enough there was a lot of "dog-piling on Robbie". My guess is they all had their truth and their warts and none of them were saints. But Robertson in this one regard was very correct if you ask me.

Finally, as pointed out, there is a weird vibe in the Last Waltz, sort of like a couple that is breaking up and makes a big show about being friends. But you know at least one of then ain't real happy about it. But that tension is part of what makes the movie great to me.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-18 06:05 by Wry Cooter.

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duke richardson
never liked hearing Robbie Robertson talk about 'we've been on the road sixteen years...'

well thanks for your sacrifice Robbie, for so long...

hard to even watch him during the last waltz, and I love the Band

Never liked him due to him screwing the others on song writing credits meaning residuals money coming in each month which Levon and Danko would have loved to have. The time I saw them live they played like brothers in arms and came off the same way. Switching intruments etc right after Big Pink came out. But this is not how the wealth sorted out so screw him

Yes, this sort of thing has happened in quite a several great bands where one or two members think mainly about themselves...and have delusions of grandeur.

Good article on the recording and technical side of The Last Waltz: [mixonline.com]

Lay Lady Lay....

Slightly off topic for this thread, but since there's so much talk here of Robbie Robertson....

The Band’s Robbie Robertson Fixes Music ‘Mistakes,’ Tells Kids What’s Good (Exclusive Video)



By Steve Pond on September 17, 2013 @ 5:15 pm

In a time of “disposable music,” rock icon Robertson revisits a 40-year-old album he never liked, and writes a children’s book about musical legends

We live in a time of disposable music when kids aren’t taught the difference between what’s good and what’s bad, singer-songwriter and rock ‘n’ roll legend Robbie Robertson told TheWrap – but, he added, we also live in a time when some of the mistakes of the past can be corrected, when technology and the market will allow for musicians to go back and get it right.

Robertson, the guitarist and principal songwriter in the iconic group the Band, is trying to take advantage of that second factor with the Band’s new box set “Live at the Academy of Music 1971.” And he’s trying to correct the former with a book aimed at teaching kids what they need to know about Little Richard, Billie Holiday and Johnny Cash, among others.

“Because of the times that we live in now, there’s a lot of disposable music,” said the writer of such classic songs as “The Weight,” “Up on Cripple Creek” and “The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down.” “Music isn’t necessarily made to last, and there’s always been disposable music.

“But there are always some people doing extraordinary work – work where you say, ‘Whoa, this could be around in a few years.’”



Robertson hopes that’s the case with the music on “Live at the Academy of Music,” which documents a four-night stand by the Band in New York City in December, 1971. At the time, highlights from that engagement were released on a double album called “Rock of Ages,” which was immediately acclaimed as one of the finest live albums in rock ‘n’ roll.

“It was really well received, and I completely appreciated that,” Robertson said. “But I had a secret that I kept to myself.”

The secret: He didn’t like the album, which he originally mixed in Miami with recording engineer Phil Ramone, then remixed in Woodstock when he, Ramone and the Band all agreed that the original version wasn’t good.

“I did the best I could under the circumstances, and I tried to tell myself that it was good,” he said. “But I knew deep down that I didn’t nail it.”

When Universal Music executives came to him several months ago, said they’d located the original master tapes and wanted to turn the recordings into a new box set, Robertson said he embraced the opportunity to accurately document the shows that he felt showed the Band playing at a peak it never again reached.

“There was a special thing that happened at this concert that was very different from any other show we ever did,” he said. “We were all playing for one another, to one another. When you go out and play, you’re trying to do good for the audience and you want to put on a show – but this was the five of us locked in a huddle, playing for one another.”

Pianist and singer Richard Manuel, he said, was “chilling” in his vocals on songs like “I Shall Be Released.” Bassist/singer Rick Danko sang powerful vocals, both lead and background, while playing fretless bass, an instrument that requires the player to listen closely to every note – “he was doing something that from my point of view is impossible,” said Robertson. Keyboardist Garth Hudson would “play things that no other keyboard player in the world every played before, and to this day there is nobody who has ever caught up with him.” And drummer/vocalist Levon Helm was, “of all of us, the person who just came out and nailed it every time.”



Helm, Danko and Manuel have all died, and relations between them and Robertson were occasionally strained in the years after the group stopped touring with the 1976 concert known as “The Last Waltz,” which was filmed by Martin Scorsese. But Robertson said he’s thrilled to go back and get it right after 40 years. “This is the complete fulfillment of what that was,” he said of the set, which includes two discs mixed by Robertson and Bob Clearmountain to “make it sound as beautiful as we could,” and another two discs mixed by Robertson’s son Sebastian to be a rougher, bootleg-style document of the complete New Year’s Eve show, which included four songs with special guest and longtime Band collaborator Bob Dylan. A fifth disc is a DVD, though largely with still photos and a 5.1 surround-sound audio mix.

Sebastian Robertson is also a partner on Robertson’s new book, “Legends, Icons & Rebels: Music That Changed the World,” which was also co-written by Jim Guerinot and Jared Levine. A collection of short essays and illustrations about 27 seminal musicians, including Louis Jordan, Aretha Franklin, Elvis Presley, Billie Holiday, Joni Mitchell, Ray Charles, Hank Williams, James Brown, the Beatles and Dylan, it is aimed at young readers and comes with a CD of music from the featured artists.



It was inspired by his son’s work at a children’s learning center – where, Sebastian reported, kids responded more enthusiastically to Marvin Gaye or Johnny Cash than to typical children’s music.

“He said we should do a thing aimed at kids, when they get to an age where they can absorb these kind of things, that sets them straight for the rest of their lives and gives them a taste factor,” said Robertson. “I love the idea of having a kid who says, ‘Yeah, of course I knew about Billie Holiday and Johnny Cash when I was nine years old.’

“Kids today are not tapped on the shoulder and told the difference between what’s really good and what’s not,” he said. “We need to have a taste factor in our life. It isn’t about what’s popular, it’s about what’s really good. And when you know about all the artists that are in this book, and have tasted that, you’re never the same – because you know what the real great stuff is, and that how everything grew out of that.”

“From that point on in life, you have a taste factor that shows you, ‘Oh, what this guy Jake Bugg is doing, that’s an offshoot of Bob Dylan.’ You can tell this guy has learned from a master, and because of that it’s kind of cool.”

Robertson said he’s currently working on music for Martin Scorsese’s “The Wolf of Wall Street,” and he’s about halfway through writing his autobiography. In addition to a rock ‘n’ roll career that began in roadhouses when he was a teenager and included several years with Bob Dylan during Dylan’s crazed ‘60s peak, Robertson was a legendary carouser during the years he hung out with Scorsese in the ‘70s and ‘80s.

About his autobiography, he simply teased, “Boy, do I got some stories to tell.”





From: [www.thewrap.com]

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Rockman
..... Ya gotta love Danko ... Man that cat was loose ...

Maybe for that reason, to me Rick Danko is the most poignant figure in that film. On stage, he's probably the bounciest bass player I'd ever seen at the time (thinking of comparisons to Wyman, Entwhistle, etc.), loving playing with all those people so much (especially Dylan), and, as mentioned, the most reluctant to let it all go. And then his sad death in the 90s, having all but disappeared from the scene (despite having ballooned to twice the size) . . . He makes me feel the saddest. But that film captures many of his glory moments, which is great.

Totally agree. And that vocal on It Makes No Difference would be one of his glory moments.

Robbie Robertson doesn't seem to be very popular around here. I don't know why. I have always liked the guy and his solo albums in the late 80s blows away any solo album from any Stones member.
Although he can't sing! "Carny" was a decent film by the way and Robertson a decent actor. Cool may be, sometimes, a misused adjective but I have always considered Robbie a very cool guy.