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Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: UrbanSteel ()
Date: January 22, 2010 21:57

X



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-08-06 21:33 by UrbanSteel.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: gripweed ()
Date: January 22, 2010 22:11

I prefer the London Version from Sept 8 1973 myself

YCAGWYW 1973-09-08



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-24 03:43 by gripweed.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: crumbling_mice ()
Date: January 22, 2010 22:23

It has to be said that Ron Wood was one of the most underrated slide guitarists...he can still play a mean slide, but at one time he was acknowledged in certain circles as in the top 10 of slide guitarists.


Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: HEILOOBAAS ()
Date: January 22, 2010 23:04

WAS good.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: bassplayer617 ()
Date: January 23, 2010 01:52

Quote
HEILOOBAAS
WAS good.

Gotta hand it to the conservatives -- your blind hatred is consistent. tongue sticking out smiley

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 03:28

Quote
bassplayer617
Quote
HEILOOBAAS
WAS good.

Gotta hand it to the conservatives -- your blind hatred is consistent. tongue sticking out smiley

It's not hatred. It's being willing to accept the truth.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: Bingo ()
Date: January 23, 2010 03:33

1976 was a long time ago. Keith and Mick realized he was good and decided to put the shackles on him. He's the best guitarist the never plays, but that's not important, he looks the part and that's what counts with mick and keith.


Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: J.J.Flash ()
Date: January 23, 2010 04:23

Some tours-mediocre
Some tours- like a cardboard cutout propped on stage

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: behroez ()
Date: January 23, 2010 04:33

Ofcourse he is damn good, now compare this





with this




Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 04:34

Quote
J.J.Flash
Some tours-mediocre
Some tours- like a cardboard cutout propped on stage

This would be my take on it. Mediocre or even competent: Occasionally. Interesting: hardly ever. Transcendent or moving? Never. Oh, sorry, that makes me a "conservative" (?)

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 04:40

Quote
behroez
Ofcourse he is damn good, now compare this





with this



The fair comparison would be same song, same band. How about YCAGWYW '73 vs. any year with Ronnie? Or even CYHMK clip above vs. the original studio version.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: ryanpow ()
Date: January 23, 2010 04:53

the 76 euro tour is widley seen as a low point, but those Les Abettoirs clips always sound mighty fine to me.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: ChrisM ()
Date: January 23, 2010 05:26

Quote
71Tele
Quote
bassplayer617
Quote
HEILOOBAAS
WAS good.

Gotta hand it to the conservatives -- your blind hatred is consistent. tongue sticking out smiley

It's not hatred. It's being willing to accept the truth.
I have to agree with 71Tele and Jonno. The stuff Ronnie has done with the Faces and his early work with the Stones ranks as some my favorite guitar work ever. However, the sheer reckless brilliance with which he played then is not much in evidence today. I hope he can find his chops again...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-23 09:23 by ChrisM.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: robertcharles ()
Date: January 23, 2010 05:35

I like that version from ==can,t you hear me kno==but when Ronnie comes in with his solo== it,s not MT but for me the the Spirit isn,s t the same as on the orinigal one,I.mean Ron does,nt make it better or worse but it had nothing to withthe original .Never saw the Stones performing live this song so good

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: January 23, 2010 06:12

I'm so sorry for Ron Wood that he had to join in after Taylor. What a diffence, Taylor playing so fluidly and full of feeling and emotion and Ron trying so hard but totally without effecting any emotion but dullness. It's so boring to hear him play. YCAGWYW has lost all its magic in this 'Ron Wood-performance'. The good sound quality doesn't help at all. Poor Wood, working so hard here, trying to sound virtuoso, but without any emotional result for the listener. Then Taylor, being a natural talent, not trying to play virtuoso, but singing during the whole song, catching the attention all the time. Constantly surprising. So much more creative musically. The difference between the two couldn't be showed more clearly than by these two clips of YCAGWYW. And then had Taylor to tolerate this horrible saxophone too! The versions without that squeaking thing are even better. After the squeaking, Taylor releases us from it brilliantly.

Let alone the bluessongs! Boy, all those wonderful versions of Love in vain, MR, Stray cat blues etc. Sorry Urban, you are unsurpassed as the greatest Rolling Stones uploader of the world (I can't image someone surpassing your achievements), but musically you are not an authority, at least not to me. With all well meant respect I have for you.

The performance of TWFNO is just good. Subtle and musical. But maybe too difficult to some ears. Taylor doesn't have to show off to create effect. His timing is still very good.

The CYHMK-clip lacks the jazzy mood of the song on SF. The sound quality is great but musically I don't like it. Again: boring, tedious and long-winded, without the fluid soul it needs. A poor Taylor-imitation. It does nothing to me. Image how Taylor it would have played live! So sorry they didn't do that during his time with the Stones. Ever heard the live version of Torn and frayed during the 1972 tour? Just a try-out, but Taylor makes it a fantastic piece of music, just by playing a few notes and despite the poor sound quality.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 07:40

Quote
robertcharles
I like that version from ==can,t you hear me kno==but when Ronnie comes in with his solo== it,s not MT but for me the the Spirit isn,s t the same as on the orinigal one,I.mean Ron does,nt make it better or worse but it had nothing to withthe original .Never saw the Stones performing live this song so good

Fair point. The spirit isn't the same.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 07:48

<< The CYHMK-clip lacks the jazzy mood of the song on SF. The sound quality is great but musically I don't like it. Again: boring, tedious and long-winded, without the fluid soul it needs. A poor Taylor-imitation. It does nothing to me. Image how Taylor it would have played live! So sorry they didn't do that during his time with the Stones. Ever heard the live version of Torn and frayed during the 1972 tour? Just a try-out, but Taylor makes it a fantastic piece of music, just by playing a few notes and despite the poor sound quality. >>

I can't emphasize enough how important I think this point by kleermaker is. Ronnie has brought a lot of unfavorable comparisons to Taylor because he tries to imitate his parts! This started in '75, and has never stopped (I am talking about the songs Taylor originally played on, of course). When Taylor joined, he didn't try to imitate Brian's parts. He just took the songs and interpreted them as he saw he should. Ronnie can never play like Taylor, so why try? he comes out the loser (to varying degrees) EVERY SINGLE TIME ( CYHMK, Sway, Shine A Light are great examples, but there are many others). Even performances I have seen of All Down The Line - where he plays pretty well - the best he has done is ALMOST AS GOOD AS TAYLOR. ...Ronnie didn't have this problem in Faces. He was confident and he was playing parts he created.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-23 07:49 by 71Tele.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: Honestman ()
Date: January 23, 2010 12:02

Quote
kleermaker
...It's so boring to hear him play...


Mick TAYLOR was the best guitarist ever they had, ok we all know that pôint, but what a boring guy!
Ronnie had fun and fit with Keith like a blood brother, he was made to be a Rolling STONE !!!

HMN

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: shortfatfanny ()
Date: January 23, 2010 12:09

Quote
71Tele
The fair comparison would be same song, same band. How about YCAGWYW '73 vs. any year with Ronnie? Or even CYHMK clip above vs. the original studio version.

That´s not fair,that´s below your standard,Tele...if you think about it...


Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: January 23, 2010 13:13

Quote
71Tele




with this





The fair comparison would be same song, same band. How about YCAGWYW '73 vs. any year with Ronnie? Or even CYHMK clip above vs. the original studio version.

Now it is, Taylor doing the song recently.

I remember first him playing the song - the jam part of it as he always does - once upon time early 00's here in Tampere with Finnish band Wentus Blues Band and it was a marvellous, stunning moment.

But then again, I saw Ronnie playing the solo in Glasgow 2003 and THAT was a striking performance - the best Ronnie moment I ever wittnessed and the audience also recognized it!

By the way, we have speculated about this earlier but seemingly the jam part of CYHMK? is Taylor's own - he is said to have played the theme even before his Stones days. So the original song is a kind copy and paste kind of thing even though they (Keith) love to talk about ex tempore extended jam. Maybe it was that for Keith, but Taylor seemed to know what he was doing...

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-23 13:19 by Doxa.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: January 23, 2010 17:22

Quote
Honestman
Quote
kleermaker
...It's so boring to hear him play...


Mick TAYLOR was the best guitarist ever they had, ok we all know that pôint, but what a boring guy!
Ronnie had fun and fit with Keith like a blood brother, he was made to be a Rolling STONE !!!

I always liked to see MT play with the Stones. See Ladies & Gentlemen when Jagger introduces Charlie and see how MT smiles. A fine moment. See his face during that short moment we see him play during Midnight rambler. Look how he's constantly focused on playing AND on the other members, especially on Keith, but also on the others. He's a musician not some comedian. Keith and Ronnie, two teenage boys having fun but far less concentrated on the music. I'm too old to appreciate that.

I guess one can say that Bill Wyman was utterly boring as well. But you won't say that he wasn't made to be a Rolling Stone. It's just fine to see all those different characters play so well together as they did during the MT-era. All different personalities and yet all Rolling Stones. Different people but one tight band, the best we've ever had.

Btw: do you know how Keith liked to go to MT's house when they lived in Soutern France? I think they had a very special relationship. Remember they worked together on Keith's solo album after MT's departure. Says enough to me. I really think that Keith has missed and still misses MT in the band almost as much as I do, maybe even more.

Well, it's an old discussion which never seems to end, but I'm very grateful to UrbanSteel and all those other very much appreciated uploaders at IORR, because they made it possible for me to compile the so called TAYLOR ERA SETLIST, which consists of 3 CD's, containing the best version of every song the Stones played live during those marvellous years 1969-1973 and which is available on bootleg. It's the best music I own (together with the very best of Mozart and Schubert) and I can listen to it every moment and more than x-million times without one boring moment!

Btw: I've read that the relationship between Ron and Keith isn't that good anymore. Or do they see each other frequently? I guess not.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: straycatblues73 ()
Date: January 23, 2010 18:33

ithink the fist time ronnie played (with the stones) as good as mick t was black limousine ,it is very nice, only one bum note.
also dance little sister el mocambo.
cant you hear me knocking? i can but i dont want to let you in, ronnie. it is more a jagger harp song nowadays.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: slew ()
Date: January 23, 2010 18:36

Mick T is a better player but what Urban Steel says is correct as well - ROnnie is good.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: stones_serb ()
Date: January 23, 2010 18:37

Back in the day Ronnie wasn't much worse than Mick T.Just listen to his first two solo albums or Rod's Gasoline Alley.That's some of the best guitar playing ever recorded.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: behroez ()
Date: January 23, 2010 18:56

Okay fair enough



And here is one with Taylor and very recent (hadn't seen it before) and the one that Doxa or Tele uploaded didn't have a year or footage attached to it so i couldn't know for sorten if it was recent or not, but this one under has. And yes ofcourse Taylor is technically very good, but i prefer the Stones version a million times over, a much more full and catching version which is full of excitement, to my taste at least.



It is interresting though to see suddenly these uploads on Tube of Taylor playing this after the Stones played them again, it is almost, just almost, as if Taylor is doing audition for a job isn't it?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-23 19:47 by behroez.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: January 23, 2010 19:09

Quote
slew
Mick T is a better player but what Urban Steel says is correct as well - ROnnie is good.

Urban says damn good. And if he still is good? Maybe he was. But Taylor was and is playing in the highest league, Ron Wood never did. After Taylor the Stones lost a great deal of musical quality. It is hard to bear, but we have to live with that fact, even the biggest hardcore fan.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: slew ()
Date: January 23, 2010 19:22

I like Some Girls better than some of Mick T's albums. As a matter of fact I like ER, TY and Undercover. The Stones have done some great shows and some not so great shows with Ronnie. Ronnie is fine leave him alone!! Again better with Taylor but let's not completely diss Ronnie!!

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: behroez ()
Date: January 23, 2010 19:53

Quote
slew
I like Some Girls better than some of Mick T's albums. As a matter of fact I like ER, TY and Undercover. The Stones have done some great shows and some not so great shows with Ronnie. Ronnie is fine leave him alone!!

I totally agree with you. Sticky and Exile and Bleed are defenitly not on my list of best Stones albums either, i prefer some girls and Voodoo Lounge over any of those to be honest.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: January 23, 2010 20:12

Quote
slew
I like Some Girls better than some of Mick T's albums. As a matter of fact I like ER, TY and Undercover. The Stones have done some great shows and some not so great shows with Ronnie. Ronnie is fine leave him alone!! Again better with Taylor but let's not completely diss Ronnie!!

It's not a question of dissing Ron Wood. That's not the point here. Keith isn't a great guitarist either. Those Chuck Berry way of playing is seldom interesting. But he has something special sometimes, in his kind of clumsy way of playing. But he's the master of the basic rhythm riffs. And he invented some very nice ones indeed! He was at his best when he played with Taylor.

Re: Ronnie is not that bad , in fact he is damn good !
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: January 23, 2010 20:40

Quote
Honestman
Quote
kleermaker
...It's so boring to hear him play...


Mick TAYLOR was the best guitarist ever they had, ok we all know that pôint, but what a boring guy!
Ronnie had fun and fit with Keith like a blood brother, he was made to be a Rolling STONE !!!

I would rather have brilliant music coming out of a "boring" guy (Bill Wyman, anyone?) than boring music coming out of a guy who runs around a lot, and lights cigarettes...People who think Mick Taylor was great but "boring" completely miss the point. And by your reasoning, Charlie and Bill were not "made to be Rolling Stones". I'll take musicianship over "personality" any day. The whole "blood brother" thing with Keith was detrimental to Keith, Ronnie and the band as a whole, IMO.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-01-23 20:42 by 71Tele.

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