Tell Me :
Talk
It's awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
EXILE isn't Keith's album just as much as... EXILE wasn't (all) magically recorded in France just as DIRTY WORK isn't a good album.
That's a bit of a good honk: Mick worked very hard on shaping "One Hit" with Keith and was responsible for most or all of the lyrics to "Fight," "Hold Back," "Dirty Work," and "Had It With You."
HA! They were asleep at the desk for One Hit. One Hit sounds now no different than people recording songs that "sound like the Stones" and putting them on YouTube saying it's an unreleased demo...
The lyrics on DIRTY WORK are an atrocity!
The thing about people thinking an album is a Mick or Keith album... perhaps it can be viewed in that slanted way in terms of what gets put on the LP but we all know they record 300 songs for every album and there's no "Oh right, alright, Keith, I'll have me 8 songs, with 2 that sound like you wrote them, you can have 3, with only you singing on 2" when they're working on them.
Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
C
Cirkus Stockholm (2003) was pretty good....IMO.
And New Orleans '94 - I love that little triptych - Heartbreaker, I go wild and It's all over now......... larvly..........
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 18:51 by EddieByword.
What?
And that version from 1979-09-09 which is so good it has to be on the ghs reissue! I'll admit the 1994 resurrection wasn't all that exciting though.
The 1973 live versions weren't too bad, either, to put it mildly.
Chuck's "clavinet"-sound since 1994 is a joke, imo.
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Several takes by Taylor, not placed in the same channel and not really adjusted volum-wise. Have a ball and listen to it with headphones. A rather schizophrenic listen
Yep, there’s tape delay ALL over this track. I never really noticed the sax beginning at 2:12. Some strange things going on with the vocals as well like at 0:46.
As far as other takes, they could be bleeding from microphones on the piano track rather than dedicated tracks of their own. Taylor may have overdubbed his final guitar part, but some of his basic track is in the keeper piano part, for instance.
Thank God the Stones have never gone that route. I think I bought a Little Richard, and a Chuck Berry album years where they re-recorded their hits. Terrible.
Maybe I'll get kitchen plates thrown at my head, but the only time I've heard re-recording done well (and even actually better than some of the originals in many cases) was Gordon Lightfoot's "Gord's Gold". And by "done well" I mean fully finished songs that are re-recorded. I think some of the deluxe overdubs sound pretty good actually, especially the Some Girls stuff, not so much the Exile stuff...but yes, "Plundered My Soul" wouldn't have the same feel if done by current line-up.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 21:56 by floodonthepage.
Ronnie doesn't. Bill / Mick T. depends if they have sold their rights or not. I guess Bill still gets royalties.
The guitar track is wandering from left channel to right channel, and on one of the solos from center to left during the solo! The volume varies. That tells me there are more takes, splices and/or editing.
Great solos, but a weird listening experience.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 22:25 by DandelionPowderman.
Maybe Ronnie provides an alternate cover or throws in some painted '73 setlists...
Or the engineer went nuts with the pan pots. They were in Jamaica after all
I'm pretty sure Bill mentioned he was aware of these projects, because he gets paid from them. They probably have to negotiate with him. Maybe that's why some of them have very few pix of Bill in them.
Hehe
Which of the reissues/deluxe-releases have few pictures of Bill?
Imho it doesn't sound as strong as it should because the mix is bad : the horns are low in the mix and Keith's guitar is almost non-existant.
I guess you missed the release of Stripped!
In any case, you are comparing apples and oranges.
Take the 1995 new Wild Horses. When the point of reference is the the Sticky Fingers version - the song that you have listened and loved for decades, the song that the radio played when you gave the first kiss or your pet died - well, you can't win!
But what if that Sticky Finger version was never released and bootlegged?
All of us here would be celebrating a late masterpiece!
Plundered is a completely different situation.
What was used is a recording that nobody had ever heard before of the band playing a basic chord progression years ago. No song, no solos, no trademark guitar riffs, no hook, no nothing.
What "makes" Plundered is the melody line, the vocals, the vocals arrangements and Taylor opening riff. All of which are new.
In this context to use an old recording "protooled" to adapt it to the new song sounds fake.
C
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 11, 2020 16:20
Quote
abQuote
stickyfingers101Quote
abQuote
bamQuote
doitywoikQuote
jbwelda
Like McCartney needed Lennon to hold back the maudlin vaudevillian tendencies, Jagger needs Richards to rein in his worst instincts.
LOL!
I never fully warmed to GHS. I'd say it's an OK album but not a great one. (Today of course we would be happy if they came up with an album of similar quality...) But the outtakes I heard sound very interesting so I'm hoping there will be a bunch of good ones.
I totally agree.
Until Steel Wheels, I used to think GHS was their worst album, precisely because of the lack of high quality rock songs. Angie as the first single says it all.
Heartbreaker is the bomb.
There are few Stones social commentary songs that I like, and The Doo Doo Song isn't one of them. The opening riff is played on a Clavinet! How awful is that?
It's awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: February 11, 2020 16:30
Quote
Rocky DijonQuote
jbwelda
exactly the kind of quote I expect out of Sir Mick, Like a bunch of rock songs would be bad...instead lets give em Emotional Rescue and Indian Girl (later, I know). Although I like GHS, it pales to albums full of a bunch of rock songs, and its clear who the instigator is. Some times I really wonder about that guys taste in music. Like McCartney needed Lennon to hold back the maudlin vaudevillian tendencies, Jagger needs Richards to rein in his worst instincts.
jb
I used to feel that way, but the older I get the more I look at other facts like..."Angie" being primarily a Keith song or "Heartbreaker" starting out as a Keith song. "Coming Down Again" is also a ballad. "Dancing with Mr. D" and even "Can You Hear the Music?" in their earliest embryonic forms were Keith's ideas. So what did Mick bring to the table? "A Hundred Years Ago" (written in 1970 according to Mr. Taylor), "Silver Train" (out of the live arrangement of "All Down the Line"), "Hide Your Love" (because Ahmet asked for one of their improvised piano blues to be included), "Winter" (a work-in-progress since "Blood Red Wine") and "Star, Star" (all Mick according to Keith, but clearly inspired by the Chuck Berry covers they were playing in concert).
Over time, I've learned to pay less attention to either of their sweeping generalizations and more to the details. EXILE isn't really Keith's baby. If it was we wouldn't have "Shine a Light" or "Stop Breaking Down" or "Ventilator Blues," among others. DIRTY WORK isn't really all Keith either. Mick worked very hard on shaping "One Hit" with Keith and was responsible for most or all of the lyrics to "Fight," "Hold Back," "Dirty Work," and "Had It With You." While the final version of "Sleep Tonight" is all Keith, Mick took a stab at a pinch-hitter ballad of his own ("Your Love"). Popular opinion would say Mick's only contributions were "Winning Ugly" and "Back to Zero." Likewise, SOME GIRLS and EMOTIONAL RESCUE contain plenty of Keith songs despite the viewpoint they are Mick's albums. Keith was also very involved with UNDERCOVER including reshaping the musical direction of the title track. They obscure most of this in their generalizations to either hog credit for themselves or shift blame on the other. It's not a Mick issue or a Keith issue. They both do it. Among creative partners, it's typical to try to take the lion's share of the credit for success and to avoid sharing the blame for failure. Human nature.
EXILE isn't Keith's album just as much as... EXILE wasn't (all) magically recorded in France just as DIRTY WORK isn't a good album.
That's a bit of a good honk: Mick worked very hard on shaping "One Hit" with Keith and was responsible for most or all of the lyrics to "Fight," "Hold Back," "Dirty Work," and "Had It With You."
HA! They were asleep at the desk for One Hit. One Hit sounds now no different than people recording songs that "sound like the Stones" and putting them on YouTube saying it's an unreleased demo...
The lyrics on DIRTY WORK are an atrocity!
The thing about people thinking an album is a Mick or Keith album... perhaps it can be viewed in that slanted way in terms of what gets put on the LP but we all know they record 300 songs for every album and there's no "Oh right, alright, Keith, I'll have me 8 songs, with 2 that sound like you wrote them, you can have 3, with only you singing on 2" when they're working on them.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
liddas
()
Date: February 11, 2020 16:46
Quote
GasLightStreet
Plundered My Soul would be nowhere near as good as it is if the current Rolling Stones would've recorded it.
Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
C
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
stickyfingers101
()
Date: February 11, 2020 17:54
Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
abQuote
stickyfingers101Quote
abQuote
bamQuote
doitywoikQuote
jbwelda
Like McCartney needed Lennon to hold back the maudlin vaudevillian tendencies, Jagger needs Richards to rein in his worst instincts.
LOL!
I never fully warmed to GHS. I'd say it's an OK album but not a great one. (Today of course we would be happy if they came up with an album of similar quality...) But the outtakes I heard sound very interesting so I'm hoping there will be a bunch of good ones.
I totally agree.
Until Steel Wheels, I used to think GHS was their worst album, precisely because of the lack of high quality rock songs. Angie as the first single says it all.
Heartbreaker is the bomb.
There are few Stones social commentary songs that I like, and The Doo Doo Song isn't one of them. The opening riff is played on a Clavinet! How awful is that?
It's awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
Cirkus Stockholm (2003) was pretty good....IMO.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
EddieByword
()
Date: February 11, 2020 18:04
Quote
stickyfingers101Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
abQuote
stickyfingers101Quote
abQuote
bamQuote
doitywoikQuote
jbwelda
Like McCartney needed Lennon to hold back the maudlin vaudevillian tendencies, Jagger needs Richards to rein in his worst instincts.
LOL!
I never fully warmed to GHS. I'd say it's an OK album but not a great one. (Today of course we would be happy if they came up with an album of similar quality...) But the outtakes I heard sound very interesting so I'm hoping there will be a bunch of good ones.
I totally agree.
Until Steel Wheels, I used to think GHS was their worst album, precisely because of the lack of high quality rock songs. Angie as the first single says it all.
Heartbreaker is the bomb.
There are few Stones social commentary songs that I like, and The Doo Doo Song isn't one of them. The opening riff is played on a Clavinet! How awful is that?
It's awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
Cirkus Stockholm (2003) was pretty good....IMO.
And New Orleans '94 - I love that little triptych - Heartbreaker, I go wild and It's all over now......... larvly..........
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 18:51 by EddieByword.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
dcba
()
Date: February 11, 2020 18:39
Quote
GasLightStreet
[HB]'s awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
What?
And that version from 1979-09-09 which is so good it has to be on the ghs reissue! I'll admit the 1994 resurrection wasn't all that exciting though.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 11, 2020 18:47
Quote
stickyfingers101Quote
GasLightStreetQuote
abQuote
stickyfingers101Quote
abQuote
bamQuote
doitywoikQuote
jbwelda
Like McCartney needed Lennon to hold back the maudlin vaudevillian tendencies, Jagger needs Richards to rein in his worst instincts.
LOL!
I never fully warmed to GHS. I'd say it's an OK album but not a great one. (Today of course we would be happy if they came up with an album of similar quality...) But the outtakes I heard sound very interesting so I'm hoping there will be a bunch of good ones.
I totally agree.
Until Steel Wheels, I used to think GHS was their worst album, precisely because of the lack of high quality rock songs. Angie as the first single says it all.
Heartbreaker is the bomb.
There are few Stones social commentary songs that I like, and The Doo Doo Song isn't one of them. The opening riff is played on a Clavinet! How awful is that?
It's awful great, that's how awful it is. It's so good they've NEVER performed it live worth a goddamn.
Cirkus Stockholm (2003) was pretty good....IMO.
The 1973 live versions weren't too bad, either, to put it mildly.
Chuck's "clavinet"-sound since 1994 is a joke, imo.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
z
()
Date: February 11, 2020 19:05
<The guitar solos on Hide Your Love are coming in from all channels, and they're different in volume>
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
OpenG
()
Date: February 11, 2020 19:09
Always thought Hide Your Love with the guitar call back to jagger;s vocals was like John Mayall with the Mick Taylor years.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: February 11, 2020 19:16
Quote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 11, 2020 19:24
Quote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Several takes by Taylor, not placed in the same channel and not really adjusted volum-wise. Have a ball and listen to it with headphones. A rather schizophrenic listen
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
jbwelda
()
Date: February 11, 2020 19:30
GHS is mixed in Jamaican fashion and sounds like it. Don't know if it was truly mixed in Jamaica but it does sound like it. Bass and drums on top and guitars kind of buried in the mix. Didn't like it originally but now I think its the albums strength
jb
jb
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: February 11, 2020 20:36
Quote
TravelinManQuote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Yep, there’s tape delay ALL over this track. I never really noticed the sax beginning at 2:12. Some strange things going on with the vocals as well like at 0:46.
As far as other takes, they could be bleeding from microphones on the piano track rather than dedicated tracks of their own. Taylor may have overdubbed his final guitar part, but some of his basic track is in the keeper piano part, for instance.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: February 11, 2020 20:41
Sounds like Taylor plays rhythm at times like ~3:40 too. Never noticed that.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: February 11, 2020 21:23
Quote
liddasQuote
GasLightStreet
Plundered My Soul would be nowhere near as good as it is if the current Rolling Stones would've recorded it.
Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
C
Thank God the Stones have never gone that route. I think I bought a Little Richard, and a Chuck Berry album years where they re-recorded their hits. Terrible.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
floodonthepage
()
Date: February 11, 2020 21:29
Quote
24FPSQuote
liddasQuote
GasLightStreet
Plundered My Soul would be nowhere near as good as it is if the current Rolling Stones would've recorded it.
Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
C
Thank God the Stones have never gone that route. I think I bought a Little Richard, and a Chuck Berry album years where they re-recorded their hits. Terrible.
Maybe I'll get kitchen plates thrown at my head, but the only time I've heard re-recording done well (and even actually better than some of the originals in many cases) was Gordon Lightfoot's "Gord's Gold". And by "done well" I mean fully finished songs that are re-recorded. I think some of the deluxe overdubs sound pretty good actually, especially the Some Girls stuff, not so much the Exile stuff...but yes, "Plundered My Soul" wouldn't have the same feel if done by current line-up.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 21:56 by floodonthepage.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
FrogSugar
()
Date: February 11, 2020 21:38
Been slowwwwwwly perusing this thread, but don't remember seeing anything about a release date, is this for Xmas or for before the tour? Anyone? Anyone...?
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
Taylor1
()
Date: February 11, 2020 21:46
For the Goats Head reissue,do Wyman andTaylor get any money and does Wood
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: February 11, 2020 21:56
Quote
Taylor1
For the Goats Head reissue,do Wyman andTaylor get any money and does Wood
Ronnie doesn't. Bill / Mick T. depends if they have sold their rights or not. I guess Bill still gets royalties.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 11, 2020 22:24
Quote
TravelinManQuote
TravelinManQuote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Yep, there’s tape delay ALL over this track. I never really noticed the sax beginning at 2:12. Some strange things going on with the vocals as well like at 0:46.
As far as other takes, they could be bleeding from microphones on the piano track rather than dedicated tracks of their own. Taylor may have overdubbed his final guitar part, but some of his basic track is in the keeper piano part, for instance.
The guitar track is wandering from left channel to right channel, and on one of the solos from center to left during the solo! The volume varies. That tells me there are more takes, splices and/or editing.
Great solos, but a weird listening experience.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-11 22:25 by DandelionPowderman.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
shortfatfanny
()
Date: February 12, 2020 00:07
Quote
mtaylorQuote
Taylor1
For the Goats Head reissue,do Wyman andTaylor get any money and does Wood
Ronnie doesn't. Bill / Mick T. depends if they have sold their rights or not. I guess Bill still gets royalties.
Maybe Ronnie provides an alternate cover or throws in some painted '73 setlists...
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: February 12, 2020 04:03
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
TravelinManQuote
TravelinManQuote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Yep, there’s tape delay ALL over this track. I never really noticed the sax beginning at 2:12. Some strange things going on with the vocals as well like at 0:46.
As far as other takes, they could be bleeding from microphones on the piano track rather than dedicated tracks of their own. Taylor may have overdubbed his final guitar part, but some of his basic track is in the keeper piano part, for instance.
The guitar track is wandering from left channel to right channel, and on one of the solos from center to left during the solo! The volume varies. That tells me there are more takes, splices and/or editing.
Great solos, but a weird listening experience.
Or the engineer went nuts with the pan pots. They were in Jamaica after all
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: February 12, 2020 06:28
Quote
mtaylorQuote
Taylor1
For the Goats Head reissue,do Wyman andTaylor get any money and does Wood
Ronnie doesn't. Bill / Mick T. depends if they have sold their rights or not. I guess Bill still gets royalties.
I'm pretty sure Bill mentioned he was aware of these projects, because he gets paid from them. They probably have to negotiate with him. Maybe that's why some of them have very few pix of Bill in them.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 12, 2020 10:19
Quote
TravelinManQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
TravelinManQuote
TravelinManQuote
z
Coming in from all channels..? What do you mean, DP?
Without listening I’m going to guess a stereo tape delay.
Yep, there’s tape delay ALL over this track. I never really noticed the sax beginning at 2:12. Some strange things going on with the vocals as well like at 0:46.
As far as other takes, they could be bleeding from microphones on the piano track rather than dedicated tracks of their own. Taylor may have overdubbed his final guitar part, but some of his basic track is in the keeper piano part, for instance.
The guitar track is wandering from left channel to right channel, and on one of the solos from center to left during the solo! The volume varies. That tells me there are more takes, splices and/or editing.
Great solos, but a weird listening experience.
Or the engineer went nuts with the pan pots. They were in Jamaica after all
Hehe
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: February 12, 2020 10:31
Quote
24FPSQuote
mtaylorQuote
Taylor1
For the Goats Head reissue,do Wyman andTaylor get any money and does Wood
Ronnie doesn't. Bill / Mick T. depends if they have sold their rights or not. I guess Bill still gets royalties.
I'm pretty sure Bill mentioned he was aware of these projects, because he gets paid from them. They probably have to negotiate with him. Maybe that's why some of them have very few pix of Bill in them.
Which of the reissues/deluxe-releases have few pictures of Bill?
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
Brown Moses
()
Date: February 12, 2020 11:50
I like the version of Heartbreaker on Bedspring Symphony but it does sound like it's going to fall apart mid way through.
Just hope any GHS reissue is not another missed opportunity like most of the others.
Just hope any GHS reissue is not another missed opportunity like most of the others.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
dcba
()
Date: February 12, 2020 12:37
Quote
Brown Moses
I like the version of [1973-09-09] Heartbreaker on Bedspring Symphony but it does sound like it's going to fall apart mid way through.
Imho it doesn't sound as strong as it should because the mix is bad : the horns are low in the mix and Keith's guitar is almost non-existant.
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
liddas
()
Date: February 12, 2020 13:34
Quote
24FPSQuote
liddasQuote
GasLightStreet
Plundered My Soul would be nowhere near as good as it is if the current Rolling Stones would've recorded it.
Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
C
Thank God the Stones have never gone that route. I think I bought a Little Richard, and a Chuck Berry album years where they re-recorded their hits. Terrible.
I guess you missed the release of Stripped!
In any case, you are comparing apples and oranges.
Take the 1995 new Wild Horses. When the point of reference is the the Sticky Fingers version - the song that you have listened and loved for decades, the song that the radio played when you gave the first kiss or your pet died - well, you can't win!
But what if that Sticky Finger version was never released and bootlegged?
All of us here would be celebrating a late masterpiece!
Plundered is a completely different situation.
What was used is a recording that nobody had ever heard before of the band playing a basic chord progression years ago. No song, no solos, no trademark guitar riffs, no hook, no nothing.
What "makes" Plundered is the melody line, the vocals, the vocals arrangements and Taylor opening riff. All of which are new.
In this context to use an old recording "protooled" to adapt it to the new song sounds fake.
C
Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: February 12, 2020 13:57
Bitusa2012 wrote at new album thread that according to new Q magazine Mick is "finishing off some tracks for GHS Reissue".
That sounds like the formula of EXILE and SOME GIRLS is used there, instead that of STICKY FINGERS.
Altogether this whole GOATS HEAD SOUP reissue thing came out of blue for me. I thought they (Jagger) had alraedy rejected the whole reissue project. At least by the time they started put their effort (?) into new album project. Sounds like something is not going too well in that front if Mick suddenly (?) decides to do such a historical project. In the same article Mick said that he is also writing new songs for a Stones album - so instead of finishing off songs for a new Stones album, he is finishing off songs for GOATS HEAD SOUP while writing brandnew songs for the new album...
- Doxa
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-12 14:00 by Doxa.
That sounds like the formula of EXILE and SOME GIRLS is used there, instead that of STICKY FINGERS.
Altogether this whole GOATS HEAD SOUP reissue thing came out of blue for me. I thought they (Jagger) had alraedy rejected the whole reissue project. At least by the time they started put their effort (?) into new album project. Sounds like something is not going too well in that front if Mick suddenly (?) decides to do such a historical project. In the same article Mick said that he is also writing new songs for a Stones album - so instead of finishing off songs for a new Stones album, he is finishing off songs for GOATS HEAD SOUP while writing brandnew songs for the new album...
- Doxa
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-12 14:00 by Doxa.
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