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keithsman
Ok back to the thread discussion, been doing some research on this and it's sugested Mackenzie allegedly changed her story for the book, originally she was allegedly underage. Going back to Sept 2009 on iorr there were a few conflicting stories as to her age at the time being commented on by various posters, some implying she was underage when she lost her virginity. It gets very sad actuality, she was a drug user from the age of 13 , full on junkie by 18, and it's her father that allegedly groomed her using drugs etc. We would all rather believe her account in the book because otherwise we are getting near to that horrible word being thrown about here.
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keithsman
Yes but did you research Sept 09.' What was all that about, some well informed posters saying all kinds of shit, worse than this thread.
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Rocky DijonQuote
TheGreek
First off being that I am of Greek decent I certainly know and understand the meaning and definition of Pedophilia . Secondly I find it morally reprehensible . It is beyond disgusting that people cite ages of consent in various countries across the globe ! I am engaging in this topic and discussion and expressing myself the same as you and others are doing . So just because I disagree with some , as I do ,that I should take a hike ? Really ? Seriously ? You have got to be kidding me ?
Forgive me, I mean no disrespect to you or Doxa (whose posts are generally the most thoughtful and thought-provoking on this board). I believe his point was that pedophilia is limited to age 13 or younger and didn't apply to the alleged incident with Mick.
Greetings , I always enjoy reading your posts . Where I was coming from was that I did not personalize my comments towards anyone in particular least of all towards Mick Jagger , who any Stones fan who knows his history as many of us do here and that comment is not a judgment just a comment . Where my beliefs come from is that as a US citizen I believe that the age of consent and thusly adulthood comes from if you are old enough to serve in the Military in the US ,that is one thing . Next we have learned that peoples minds are still developing and it has been recognized that once someone in the US turns 18 that they are of legal age of consent to be an adult and thus make there own decisions and such . I know I could explain this better or in another way . I just feel that there are so many women in the world in general that you can throw a rock and hit so many of them and I apologize because I know I sound crude at this moment . What I am trying to convey is that there are so many fish in the sea of all different varieties in colors, shapes , sizes , ages , that Kids under the age of 18 should be off limits. What kind of rapport does an adult have with someone under the age of 18 that he or she wants to or does bed ? What are you going to talk about ? Where are you going to parade your Lolita around ( once again I apologize for being crude ) It is beyond disgusting to see all of this stuff in the news with disgraced Financier Jeffrey Epstein and his penchant/appetite for underage Girls , along with many people in the position of power and influence that were friends and associates of his conducting themselves in such lewd and crude and lascivious felonious ways ( once again I apologize , as who am I to judge others ? )
(I also apologize as I started writing my response in the middle of your post and so I would not mess up my train of thought I deleted several paragraphs of your response so my response would not get lost in the shuffle or misunderstood for which I am sorry for not paying attention to where I began my post ) I do not condone , nor do I accept people taking advantage of children for there own sexual gratification , regardless of they are or there position or station , or rank in life . Once again I apologize if I have come across as holier than thou as I am surely a sinner and not one to cast any rocks on any one else for there choices they make in life .
I believe the age of consent should be 18 years of age .Quote
keefriff99So your stance is that if 16 is the legal age of consent in a given state or country, and an adult acts on that, it's still morally wrong to you personally?Quote
TheGreekHere in the states 18 is pretty much the law . I am referring to the under 18 age group . I have no position on any age adult being with another consenting adult that is at least 18 years of age . That is exactly where I am coming from .Quote
keefriff99Why do you find that disgusting? Age of consent laws are the only concrete, objective guidelines that exist for governing this type of sexual behavior.Quote
TheGreekFirst off being that I am of Greek decent I certainly know and understand the meaning and definition of Pedophilia . Secondly I find it morally reprehensible . It is beyond disgusting that people cite ages of consent in various countries across the globe ! I am engaging in this topic and discussion and expressing myself the same as you and others are doing . So just because I disagree with some , as I do ,that I should take a hike ? Really ? Seriously ? You have got to be kidding me ?Quote
DoxaQuote
TheGreek
I cant believe how many apologists there are for Pedophilia . Shame !
Hmm... So you are basically claiming that Mick Jagger is a pedophile (since aren't we here talking about Jagger's doings)? Probably you should check what that term means. And if you after that still believe so, you probably should rethink if this site a right place for you.
- Doxa
The only other alternative is to leave it up to each individual's internal moral compass, or lack thereof.
So as weird as it might be to the majority of us if a 55-year old man is dating an 18-year old college freshman, it's legal and really none of our business provided no illegal abuse or coercion is going on.
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keithsman
Yes but did you research Sept 09.' What was all that about, some well informed posters saying all kinds of shit, worse than this thread.
No. I didn't read the posts from 10 years ago. I did my own research.
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keithsmanQuote
TornAndFriedQuote
keithsman
Yes but did you research Sept 09.' What was all that about, some well informed posters saying all kinds of shit, worse than this thread.
No. I didn't read the posts from 10 years ago. I did my own research.
Someone called cindyc ( well informed ) said the story was always that she was 14 but changed it for the book because she didn't want to get in trouble. Shit happens as you know. Look at Kevin Spacy, accusers dropping like flies. Powerfull forces at play here, wouldn't be surprised if one or two were on the payroll here to smooth things over. Carpenters, Metallica, do me a favour.
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keithsman
Powerful forces at play here, wouldn't be surprised if one or two were on the payroll here to smooth things over. Carpenters, Metallica, do me a favour.
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TheGreekFirst off being that I am of Greek decent I certainly know and understand the meaning and definition of Pedophilia . Secondly I find it morally reprehensible . It is beyond disgusting that people cite ages of consent in various countries across the globe ! I am engaging in this topic and discussion and expressing myself the same as you and others are doing . So just because I disagree with some , as I do ,that I should take a hike ? Really ? Seriously ? You have got to be kidding me ?Quote
DoxaQuote
TheGreek
I cant believe how many apologists there are for Pedophilia . Shame !
Hmm... So you are basically claiming that Mick Jagger is a pedophile (since aren't we here talking about Jagger's doings)? Probably you should check what that term means. And if you after that still believe so, you probably should rethink if this site a right place for you.
- Doxa
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Rocky Dijon
I do like the idea of Hairball being a paid operative of Mick.
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TheGreek
What kind of rapport does an adult have with someone under the age of 18 that he or she wants to or does bed ? What are you going to talk about ? Where are you going to parade your Lolita around ( once again I apologize for being crude )
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DoxaQuote
Rocky Dijon
I do like the idea of Hairball being a paid operative of Mick.
Haha, me too! That's a good one, Rocky!
- Doxa
Your really on a roll aren't you ? Please feel free to go back and re read my posts and please take not that I did not personalize my comments in any ones direction the least of all Mick Jagger . Google defines Pedophilia as -sexual feelings directed toward children . Merriam Webster as sexual perversion in which children are the preferred sexual object specifically: a psychiatric disorder in which an adult has sexual fantasies about or engages in sexual acts with a prepubescent child . So are you going to argue the technicality of the word "prepubescent" ? Doxa from Ancient Greek -"glory" , "praise" . Modern terms -common belief or popular opinion from which are derived the modern terms of Orthodoxy and heterodoxy . So how am I doing ? Please enlighten me as I must be in the dark ? on this topic or subject .Quote
DoxaQuote
TheGreekFirst off being that I am of Greek decent I certainly know and understand the meaning and definition of Pedophilia . Secondly I find it morally reprehensible . It is beyond disgusting that people cite ages of consent in various countries across the globe ! I am engaging in this topic and discussion and expressing myself the same as you and others are doing . So just because I disagree with some , as I do ,that I should take a hike ? Really ? Seriously ? You have got to be kidding me ?Quote
DoxaQuote
TheGreek
I cant believe how many apologists there are for Pedophilia . Shame !
Hmm... So you are basically claiming that Mick Jagger is a pedophile (since aren't we here talking about Jagger's doings)? Probably you should check what that term means. And if you after that still believe so, you probably should rethink if this site a right place for you.
- Doxa
Well, my intention was not to try you kick out of here or any way silent you. I was thinking this case more from your point of view. If you seriously believe that (a) the central figure this site is created around is a phedophile, and (b) there are many people who are "apologists for phedophilia", I think just for your own mental health it would be not good to be associated with such folks. If I were you, I would stay away.
But still I am not totally convinced that you are very familiar with the meaning of the term 'phedophilia'. Nor I don't quite grasp what being a Greek decent makes one an expert.
But let the discussion continue!
- Doxa (a Greek term, by the way)
quite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
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TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
Of course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
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TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
I see that and now I know .Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
No sorry Keith doesn't do teenager's, just drugs and alcohol, he doesn't see women as pieces of meat either like some on here. The guidelines on iorr are like this, below age 13 bad, anything above well that's just being a Rock star.
Are you being sarcastic??Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
No sorry Keith doesn't do teenager's, just drugs and alcohol, he doesn't see women as pieces of meat either like some on here. The guidelines on iorr are like this, below age 13 bad, anything above well that's just being a Rock star.
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keefriff99Are you being sarcastic??Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
No sorry Keith doesn't do teenager's, just drugs and alcohol, he doesn't see women as pieces of meat either like some on here. The guidelines on iorr are like this, below age 13 bad, anything above well that's just being a Rock star.
Keith was capable of being just as debauched as scummy as any rock star back in the day. While he may have had a different set of vices, his behavior towards women was hardly enlightened.
Opiates suppress sex drive, so he probably missed out on a lot of questionable sexual behavior by being a junkie for most of the '70s.
I'm not sure what your response has to do with what I posted.Quote
keithsmanQuote
keefriff99Are you being sarcastic??Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
No sorry Keith doesn't do teenager's, just drugs and alcohol, he doesn't see women as pieces of meat either like some on here. The guidelines on iorr are like this, below age 13 bad, anything above well that's just being a Rock star.
Keith was capable of being just as debauched as scummy as any rock star back in the day. While he may have had a different set of vices, his behavior towards women was hardly enlightened.
Opiates suppress sex drive, so he probably missed out on a lot of questionable sexual behavior by being a junkie for most of the '70s.
Well I've heard it all now, you guys have an angle for everything, and no i wasn't being sarcastic. And no I'm not an overly moral person myself, drink to excess on occasion and yeah look at girls that are 16 or whatever, but the difference is i haven't acted on it, what does a grown man have in common with a teenager. It's just not normal for mature men to pursue teenagers, that's my point in all this. Yeah sure look, but don't touch.
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keefriff99I'm not sure what your response has to do with what I posted.Quote
keithsmanQuote
keefriff99Are you being sarcastic??Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekOf course not and maybe miss out on some fun ?Quote
keithsmanQuote
TheGreekquite incredible for 1977 !Quote
MichaelLassen
I find the most unbelievable thing in all of this, is that Keith supposedly was up before Mick... In 77? really :-)
It's not that Keith was up before Mick, he just didn't bother going to bed
No sorry Keith doesn't do teenager's, just drugs and alcohol, he doesn't see women as pieces of meat either like some on here. The guidelines on iorr are like this, below age 13 bad, anything above well that's just being a Rock star.
Keith was capable of being just as debauched as scummy as any rock star back in the day. While he may have had a different set of vices, his behavior towards women was hardly enlightened.
Opiates suppress sex drive, so he probably missed out on a lot of questionable sexual behavior by being a junkie for most of the '70s.
Well I've heard it all now, you guys have an angle for everything, and no i wasn't being sarcastic. And no I'm not an overly moral person myself, drink to excess on occasion and yeah look at girls that are 16 or whatever, but the difference is i haven't acted on it, what does a grown man have in common with a teenager. It's just not normal for mature men to pursue teenagers, that's my point in all this. Yeah sure look, but don't touch.
All I meant was that I don't believe he was some sweet, chivalrous gentlemen towards women, especially in the '60s and '70s. He may not have run through women the way Mick did/does, but he's not a white knight either.