Tell Me :  Talk
Talk about your favorite band. 

Previous page Next page First page IORR home

For information about how to use this forum please check out forum help and policies.

Goto Page: PreviousFirst...23456789101112Next
Current Page: 10 of 12
Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:23

It would be interesting to hear what the band thinks of this album in hindsight. Or any other album. It's a bit sad that the only member who could express himself intelligible, Bill, is no longer with them.
I think from Bill we would get an honest assessment. Sir Michael would only bullshit us. As usual. And Keith would only come up with an inaudible one-liner...

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: keefriff99 ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:29

Quote
Stoneage
It would be interesting to hear what the band thinks of this album in hindsight. Or any other album. It's a bit sad that the only member who could express himself intelligible, Bill, is no longer with them.
I think from Bill we would get an honest assessment. Sir Michael would only bullshit us. As usual. And Keith would only come up with an inaudible one-liner...
Mick simply said in his epic 1995 Jann Wenner interview that Dirty Work was not a special album, and that it was a rough time for the band.

What about Undercover, your next album?
Not a very special record.

And Dirty Work? I think that was the last album the Stones made before you and Keith had a falling out. How was that record?
Not special.

I remember that when you made Dirty Work, you were about to tour and then changed your mind.
Touring Dirty Work would have been a nightmare. It was a terrible period. Everyone was hating each other so much; there were so many disagreements. It was very petty; everyone was so out of their brains, and Charlie was in seriously bad shape. When the idea of touring came up, I said, “I don’t think it’s gonna work.” In retrospect I was a hundred percent right. It would have been the worst Rolling Stones tour. Probably would have been the end of the band.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:46

That's Jagger's version of it, Keithsman. I think what really happened was that Jagger was eager to try his own wings during that period. He concentrated on that.
To go back to the Stones was a second option if his first intention failed. Which took him five years to figure out. Still, he kept his solo ambitions alive on the side.
He still does. Keith never had any solo ambitions. His solo projects came out of necessity.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: keefriff99 ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:48

Quote
Stoneage
That's Jagger's version of it, Keithsman. I think what really happened was that Jagger was eager to try his own wings during that period. He concentrated on that.
To go back to the Stones was a second option if his first intention failed. Which took him five years to figure out. Still, he kept his solo ambitions alive on the side.
He still does. Keith never had any solo ambitions. His solo projects came out of necessity.
I'm not Keithsman winking smiley

I posted that interview snippet because that's really the only time I've seen Mick even discuss the Dirty Work era in any depth.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:50

Sorry! Keefriff99 I meant of course...

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 15:52

Quote
Stoneage
It would be interesting to hear what the band thinks of this album in hindsight. Or any other album. It's a bit sad that the only member who could express himself intelligible, Bill, is no longer with them.
I think from Bill we would get an honest assessment. Sir Michael would only bullshit us. As usual. And Keith would only come up with an inaudible one-liner...

But Bill barely played on it. He would be biased smiling smiley

Here are some of the band members' thoughts, though (from tioos.com):


Dirty Work was the most troubled period of our entire voyage. You can tell that because I've got four songs on the record - which is a clear sign that Keith and Mick's songwriting engine was not functioning properly. Things were getting increasingly worse between them, especially around the recording sessions for the album... On Undercover I had been more or less in the hands of Mick, who would come in with his skeleton of a song, which we would then work with. On Dirty Work it was very different - Keith and I were very tight. Although this period was a bad one for the band, it turned out to be great for Keith and myself. It was a time when I got married to Jo, and Keith was one of my two best men - Charlie was the other one. I was renting a house in Chiswick, where I had a piano and guitars, and Keith and I spent a lot of time hanging out there, working on songs for Dirty Work, designing and planning and zeroing in on the riffs for the album.

- Ron Wood, 2003


We messed around for weeks because Mick was still buggering around with his solo album instead of working with us. He would fly back to London in the middle of it which, I might add, is a thing that nobody else has ever done, because when it's Stones work, everybody drops solo projects. It kind of caused a bit of resentment in the band.

- Bill Wyman, 1985


Steve Lillywhite, who had been working with Peter Gabriel, U2 and Simple Minds, came in on that album as the co-producer. That was essentially the result of some of Mick's investigations: he is always on the lookout for a new producer and a new angle to develop the band's sound for whichever decade we happen to be in. Using Steve was a Mick move and, as it happened, it turned out to be a good one... I think that Keith eventually took his hat off to Mick for bringing Steve into the frame, because he's still a good friend - although it's funny that we never actually worked with him again.

- Ron Wood, 2003


When we were mixing in New York, Steve Lillywhite changed the speed in one song, sped it up a little bit, and it was hardly anything. Keith walked in and he just went ballistic. He goes Nobody, @#$%& nobody, @#$%& with the Rolling Stones! That tempo was cut at that speed and it stays at that speed!

- Dave Jerden, engineer

Mick and I) hardly got the chance to @#$%& fall out, he was there so infrequently! It was just Charlie, Ronnie and me trying to make a Stones record. It was very unprofessional of Mick. Very stupid.

- Keith Richards, 1988


I think (Bobby Womack) gave Mick some advice on the vocals for a number of the other songs on Dirty Work - Back to Zero, Winning Ugly and One Hit, as well as Harlem Shuffle. Mick would ask me, Do you think Bobby would help me? and I'd say, He'd LOVE to.

- Ron Wood, 2003

Ian Stewart would) encourage me to carry on with Dirty Work, to get the record finished. He wasn't too happy with it, either. Making a Stones record had always been a breeze, a laugh. It had never been a hassle. But he was still there every night, never giving up.

- Keith Richards


Appreciation:

I wanted to put out a real STONES album, which we always manage to do in odd periods. This was a real concentrated effort. We left a lot of good stuff, interesting stuff, in the can because everyone wanted to - if we could, if it could be done again - make a classic Stones record with certain themes that have recurred over the years, both musically and lyrically... The fact that everyone has been active has given this record much more of an edge, more of a defined FEEL as the Rolling Stones, because we didn't have to go in there and start from ground zero. It has a sort of coherence about it, more than anything since maybe Some Girls, for me.

- Keith Richards, October 1985


In most respects I'm happy with the album but it's not my album. It's OUR album. So there's obviously things I see differently. So does everybody. Of course I haven't been involved in the final decisions. It's always been like that with this band. In the old days, we were all there and got too many opinions. I mean, I would've liked more bass on this album. I would've mixed it differently. But it's not my album and Mick and Keith are the coproducers. That's the way they want it, that's the way the get it. But I genuinely like it, I'm just picking hairs. All my work was done in Paris in 5 or 6 months. I did come to New York in August to do some tidying up - editing 10-minute songs into 4-minute songs to the point where my original bass line was gone, so I had to redo it. From then on, Mick might come up with better lyrics and a song I knew in Paris as Dirty Dog might be released as Back in the USA or something. My job is as bass player. That's what I do. Also some synths maybe. But I don't mix, master, or choose the LP covers. If someone PUSHED themselves in situations like that, this band wouldn't be around any longer. It would have folded up 15 years ago. You can't have too many egos in the same band. You gotta just swallow your pride. We know who's who in this band, and it works well that way. We're all trying to make the best record. Besides, the songs really choose themselves. Out of 30 songs we record, the best 7 will just rise to the top. Then there's the narrow gray area, so we'll start saying, Oh, let's save this slow one when we need a slow one, 'cause we have too many here.

- Bill Wyman, February 1986


This is the first album in a new contract. We'd be IDIOTS (not to tour). It'd be the dumbest move in the world not to get behind it. We've got a good album here! Spent a year making it and putting our backs to the wall. Why toss it away?

- Keith Richards, February 1986


I think Dirty Work is a great record but, I mean, there are other things to do in life (besides go on tour).

- Mick Jagger, March 1986


Does it sound good, then?

- Charlie Watts, April 1986, not knowing 
the album had been released

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:54

He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 15:57

Quote
Stoneage
He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

A great record, he said smiling smiley

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 15:58

Thanks, Dandy. That was comprehensive!

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: keefriff99 ()
Date: August 14, 2019 16:16

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
Stoneage
He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

A great record, he said smiling smiley
Yeah, AT THE TIME. Nine years later, he offered his true feelings.

And Stoneage, this is Mick we're talking about. You're not going to get very long exposition on albums from him, particularly from the '80s on.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: peoplewitheyes ()
Date: August 14, 2019 16:58

I think DW is absolutely fantastic. From the fashionable cover to the wonderful lyrics, not forgetting the timeless production. Back to Zero, for me, trumps Tumbling Dice every time. Love the drum sound, love Micks passionate vocalising. Such a great compilation of tracks....







(Ok, not really my opinion at all. But, in the absence of HMS I thought we could do with some delirious DW-love here)

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 17:04

I have heard Jagger call many of their albums not good, and not special. I wonder which of their albums he considers great, and special.
I wonder what songs and performances by the Stones (and I mean studio performances) he is really proud of. Unequivocally.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 14, 2019 17:05

Yes, People With Eyes. I miss him too. His last scheme with Tattoo You being a compilation was ingenious...

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 17:14

I don't get all the DW cover hate. I have always kind of liked it. Especially when it still had the red shrink-wrap on it.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 17:17

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
I don't get all the DW cover hate. I have always kind of liked it. Especially when it still had the red shrink-wrap on it.

Many lost that shrink-wrap, and then the colours are... maybe a wee bit too much 80s, I don't know smiling smiley

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Elmo Lewis ()
Date: August 14, 2019 17:31

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
I don't get all the DW cover hate. I have always kind of liked it. Especially when it still had the red shrink-wrap on it.

Keith kneeing Mick in the nuts....

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 14, 2019 17:57

Quote
Stoneage
He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

There are 2 things that say as much about the Stones liking DIRTY WORK more than any printed interview: they played One Hit for the first 15 shows in 1989 and dropped it, as far as I can recall, forever.

It was the weakest song of the set list and the worst played song of the set list.

They also played Harlem Shuffle that tour - and the next one. They've played Harlem Shuffle since on various tours, including NO FILTER, obviously. This may be the root of the reason why:

I've been trying to get Harlem Shuffle on an album, without actually telling Mick, for 5 or 6 years. I thought that was a natural number for him to sing - it was made for him. I've been giving him cassettes with Harlem Shuffle stuffed in the middle somewhere for a long time, but I never got any real response. One night we were in the studio and Woody and I started plunking away at it. We were amazed at how simple the song was - about 2 chords. The band was just warming up on it, jamming, when Mick walked in and started singing. We realized, YEAH. And we did it in 2 takes. So it paid off eventually, though it cost me a fortune in cassettes.

- Keith Richards, 1986

[timeisonourside.com]

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: keefriff99 ()
Date: August 14, 2019 18:13

One Hit is a excellent studio track in my opinion, but they couldn't play it live worth a damn. They just didn't have the conviction to do it justice.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: August 14, 2019 18:25

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Stoneage
He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

There are 2 things that say as much about the Stones liking DIRTY WORK more than any printed interview: they played One Hit for the first 15 shows in 1989 and dropped it, as far as I can recall, forever.

It was the weakest song of the set list and the worst played song of the set list.

They also played Harlem Shuffle that tour - and the next one. They've played Harlem Shuffle since on various tours, including NO FILTER, obviously. This may be the root of the reason why:

I've been trying to get Harlem Shuffle on an album, without actually telling Mick, for 5 or 6 years. I thought that was a natural number for him to sing - it was made for him. I've been giving him cassettes with Harlem Shuffle stuffed in the middle somewhere for a long time, but I never got any real response. One night we were in the studio and Woody and I started plunking away at it. We were amazed at how simple the song was - about 2 chords. The band was just warming up on it, jamming, when Mick walked in and started singing. We realized, YEAH. And we did it in 2 takes. So it paid off eventually, though it cost me a fortune in cassettes.

- Keith Richards, 1986

[timeisonourside.com]

Harlem Shuffle is definitely decent, not bad at all. Problem is that it doesn't come near ones like Just My Imagination or Ain't Too Proud To Beg, at least not for me. Couple that with it being on their worst album and it makes it more forgettable.

Similar for me w/ One Hit. As a standalone track, not bad but on the album of misfit toys, it becomes forgettable.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 14, 2019 18:46

Quote
LeonidP
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Stoneage
He didn't say much about the actual album though. "Not a very special record" isn't exactly a thorough response...

There are 2 things that say as much about the Stones liking DIRTY WORK more than any printed interview: they played One Hit for the first 15 shows in 1989 and dropped it, as far as I can recall, forever.

It was the weakest song of the set list and the worst played song of the set list.

They also played Harlem Shuffle that tour - and the next one. They've played Harlem Shuffle since on various tours, including NO FILTER, obviously. This may be the root of the reason why:

I've been trying to get Harlem Shuffle on an album, without actually telling Mick, for 5 or 6 years. I thought that was a natural number for him to sing - it was made for him. I've been giving him cassettes with Harlem Shuffle stuffed in the middle somewhere for a long time, but I never got any real response. One night we were in the studio and Woody and I started plunking away at it. We were amazed at how simple the song was - about 2 chords. The band was just warming up on it, jamming, when Mick walked in and started singing. We realized, YEAH. And we did it in 2 takes. So it paid off eventually, though it cost me a fortune in cassettes.

- Keith Richards, 1986

[timeisonourside.com]

Harlem Shuffle is definitely decent, not bad at all. Problem is that it doesn't come near ones like Just My Imagination or Ain't Too Proud To Beg, at least not for me. Couple that with it being on their worst album and it makes it more forgettable.

Similar for me w/ One Hit. As a standalone track, not bad but on the album of misfit toys, it becomes forgettable.

For STEEL WHEELS/URBAN JUNGLE they played one from recent albums, just as they did for the 1981-82 tours playing one from EMOTIONAL RESCUE, in 1989-90's case, from 2 previous albums.

Of the two, Harlem Shuffle was the better played, and obviously for the first 15 shows they played 2 off of DIRTY WORK and one of them proved to be terrible.

One Hit is a rather dull track and is downright pedestrian regarding their singles discography. In a guitar magazine in 1986 Woody went so far as to compare it to Street Fighting Man because of the acoustic.

They really made up some deep bullshit promoting that pathetic album: Keith saying they left off "a lot of good stuff" says enough.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 18:56

Quote
keefriff99
One Hit is a excellent studio track in my opinion, but they couldn't play it live worth a damn. They just didn't have the conviction to do it justice.

It's like trying to play BS without any grit and in standard tuning. They (Keith) didn't rehearse it right, seemingly.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 14, 2019 18:59

<just as they did for the 1981-82 tours playing one from EMOTIONAL RESCUE>

Let Me Go and She's So Cold. They planned to play Summer Romance as well, but skipped it.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 14, 2019 19:12

Quote
DandelionPowderman


Let Me Go and She's So Cold. They planned to play Summer Romance as well, but skipped it.

Oops. I guess the only reason I thought of one was because of STILL LIFE. Ha ha!

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: deardoctor ()
Date: August 14, 2019 22:36

Hey you "DIRTY WORK WHINERS",
Compare with every studio track after VL, you will realize how good DW was.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 14, 2019 23:17

Quote
deardoctor
Hey you "DIRTY WORK WHINERS",
Compare with every studio track after VL, you will realize how good DW was.

You mean how bad DW is - it never was good.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Rocky Dijon ()
Date: August 14, 2019 23:45

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
keefriff99
One Hit is a excellent studio track in my opinion, but they couldn't play it live worth a damn. They just didn't have the conviction to do it justice.

It's like trying to play BS without any grit and in standard tuning. They (Keith) didn't rehearse it right, seemingly.

To my ears, what they rehearsed was the Jimmy Rip arrangement from Mick's solo tour. Same with "Harlem Shuffle."

Both were lamentable errors in judgement.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: SomeGuy ()
Date: August 15, 2019 01:09

Someone posted a version of One Hit from Toronto '89 a few years ago, that's not such a bad version actually. Not as strong as the studio version of course, but still. And they kept it in their set for 15 shows even, I just read, imagine.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-08-15 01:11 by SomeGuy.

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 15, 2019 01:22

You mean this one?
[www.youtube.com]

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Posted by: SomeGuy ()
Date: August 15, 2019 01:33

Yep

Re: ALBUM TALK: Dirty Work
Date: August 15, 2019 09:25

It's an OK version, but Keith has the wrong sound and tuning. All the punch is gone.

Goto Page: PreviousFirst...23456789101112Next
Current Page: 10 of 12


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Online Users

Guests: 476
Record Number of Users: 184 on May 17, 2018 22:46
Record Number of Guests: 3948 on December 7, 2015 15:07

Previous page Next page First page IORR home