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mtaylor

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71Tele

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ChelseaGirls

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DandelionPowderman

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ChelseaGirls
You can talk about Bush or Clinton because this is not OT, I guess.

Now, I want a war.

The Taylorites versus The Woodists

(both are ridiculous names, we should admit it)

ALSO: The non-aligned movement

Dick or Mick?

That joke isn't funny anymore!

Dick Taylorites are properly referred to as Dickheads.

Dick or Tiny Todger - any connection....

Todgerites?

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kleermaker
What was on his mind while he played here?

[docs.google.com]

Thank you, kleerie! I haven't seen this for a while, and it (Taylor's solo) is better than I actually recalled. The whole instrumental part is a real joy for my old ears. It is this kind of a jammin groove, building up the tension, heartful musicianship that really works for me really good nowadays. Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful... Charlie, Bobby and Taylor are really swingin, man... Also a nice 'now something else' moment to make a Rolling show more interesting - probably their 'jazziest' moment ever played live. Besides who says that there should be no room in a Rolling Stones show for one great extended guitar solo?

The whole Glastonbury gig is a fascinating piece. It probably has the most ambitious set list of the whole 2012-2014 tour (well, the first 02s were challenging too). One could think that since they have a huge non-fan audience, they would play as safe set list as possible, like they normally do when they are playing to huge masses. But no - and I think that's interesting. Probably they knew that they are not going to play for their 'normal' audiences who had bought expensive tickets to hear what they thought they are going to get, or who would be disappointed if they are not going to get those (or that's at least the argument Jagger has given for war horses heavy set lists). But the audience in Glastonbury was different, and it looks like to me that the Stones felt being challenged - they needed to win that crowd by pure musical means. Of course, the familiar hits 'everybody knows' is a part of the attraction they have, but I think they knew that they needed to make some variance, try different, musically great 'hear and now' things, in order to win that crowd.. "Glastonbury Girl", "2000 Light Years From Home", "Can't You Hear Me Knocking?"... For example, to throw Taylor to play there that extended solo surely made an impression to many people who were not any Stones fans in the first place. I mean, just hearing a great guitar solo in a rock concert usually works very well....

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-05-07 12:23 by Doxa.

I too am surprised about the room Mick Taylor was given at Glastonbury, but I am not sure
if the experiment is to be considered succesful. The long solo on Can't you hear me knocking
is working well as an easy listening experience. It's some nice background music while
working. Not destracting too much. And I think it would work really well in a bar, while
having a conversation.

But at a concert in front of tens of thousands of people? I think it takes the momentum
out of the show too much. It would certainly have invited me to start a conversation with
a Glastonbury Girl, if I would have had the luck to be there.

Just as long as the guitar plays, let it steal your heart away

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Doxa

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kleermaker
What was on his mind while he played here?

[docs.google.com]

Thank you, kleerie! I haven't seen this for a while, and it (Taylor's solo) is better than I actually recalled. The whole instrumental part is a real joy for my old ears. It is this kind of a jammin groove, building up the tension, heartful musicianship that really works for me really good nowadays. Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful... Charlie, Bobby and Taylor are really swingin, man... Also a nice 'now something else' moment to make a Rolling show more interesting - probably their 'jazziest' moment ever played live. Besides who says that there should be no room in a Rolling Stones show for one great extended guitar solo?

The whole Glastonbury gig is a fascinating piece. It probably has the most ambitious set list of the whole 2012-2014 tour (well, the first 02s were challenging too). One could think that since they have a huge non-fan audience, they would play as safe set list as possible, like they normally do when they are playing to huge masses. But no - and I think that's interesting. Probably they knew that they are not going to play for their 'normal' audiences who had bought expensive tickets to hear what they thought they are going to get, or who would be disappointed if they are not going to get those (or that's at least the argument Jagger has given for war horses heavy set lists). But the audience in Glastonbury was different, and it looks like to me that the Stones felt being challenged - they needed to win that crowd by pure musical means. Of course, the familiar hits 'everybody knows' is a part of the attraction they have, but I think they knew that they needed to make some variance, try different, musically great 'hear and now' things, in order to win that crowd.. "Glastonbury Girl", "2000 Light Years From Home", "Can't You Hear Me Knocking?"... For example, to throw Taylor to play there that extended solo surely made an impression to many people who were not any Stones fans in the first place. I mean, just hearing a great guitar solo in a rock concert usually works very well....

- Doxa

I thought exactly the same Doxa, and this Knocking was very well accepted, as we can hear at the end of the video.

But as we have read above my post, there are many casual Stones fans who don't find this real music not interesting. I think the Glastonbury audience is a totally different kind of audience from the casual Stones audience these days. But there are of course also many Stones fans who still value good music, as we could see and especially hear during the 2nd LA show in 2013 and during other American shows where Knocking and Sway were performed.

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marcovandereijk
I too am surprised about the room Mick Taylor was given at Glastonbury, but I am not sure
if the experiment is to be considered succesful. The long solo on Can't you hear me knocking
is working well as an easy listening experience. It's some nice background music while
working. Not destracting too much. And I think it would work really well in a bar, while
having a conversation.

But at a concert in front of tens of thousands of people? I think it takes the momentum
out of the show too much. It would certainly have invited me to start a conversation with
a Glastonbury Girl, if I would have had the luck to be there.

Don't necessarily agree totally, and other reviews were favourable. But this underlines your point, Marco:

«After going in hard with surefire hits like Jumping Jack Flash and Gimme Shelter, they stretch out in the middle with fan-friendly showcases for Richards (You Got the Silver) and ex-guitarist Mick Taylor (Can't You Hear Me Knocking), which thin the crowd a little».

[www.theguardian.com]

Another one:

«But it was the musicality of the night - a long, intricate solo on Midnight Rambler, or the extended coda of Satisfaction - that really hit home».

[www.bbc.com]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-05-07 14:37 by DandelionPowderman.

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marcovandereijk
I too am surprised about the room Mick Taylor was given at Glastonbury, but I am not sure
if the experiment is to be considered succesful. The long solo on Can't you hear me knocking
is working well as an easy listening experience. It's some nice background music while
working. Not destracting too much. And I think it would work really well in a bar, while
having a conversation.

But at a concert in front of tens of thousands of people? I think it takes the momentum
out of the show too much. It would certainly have invited me to start a conversation with
a Glastonbury Girl, if I would have had the luck to be there.

You can have too much "Wam Bam thank you mam" over a 2hr set, it becomes formulaic and bland. This isnt easy listening either, its great. as a musician to watch a band be able to pull this song out of the bag and bring in subtle musical interplay, dynamics, musical ability & skill etc and all that CYHMK brings is far better all round than hearing a "Satisfaction" for me

I loved the Glastonbury CYHMK the first time I heard it, and still do. It's my favourite Taylor solo out of all the ones he played during his brief return to the band, with the possible exception of the Chicago Sway - it's just beautiful, heartfelt, fluid and brilliantly executed, MT at his best. His tone is fantastic too. But what's also great is that, like Doxa says, the band as a whole are just freewheeling. They totally nail the spontaneity of the studio version whilst making it work as a live number, and that's not easy to do. The other times they played CYHMK, I thought it meandered a bit, with Taylor having to rock up his solo with overdrive and feedback in order to drive the band forward. But at Glastonbury, the interaction between Taylor, Keith, Ronnie and Charlie was a joy to listen to.

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marcovandereijk
I too am surprised about the room Mick Taylor was given at Glastonbury, but I am not sure
if the experiment is to be considered succesful. The long solo on Can't you hear me knocking
is working well as an easy listening experience. It's some nice background music while
working. Not destracting too much. And I think it would work really well in a bar, while
having a conversation.

But at a concert in front of tens of thousands of people? I think it takes the momentum
out of the show too much. It would certainly have invited me to start a conversation with
a Glastonbury Girl, if I would have had the luck to be there.

It is hard to say how succesful the experiment was, since I wasn't there, and the clip doesn't tell much of the real crowd reaction. But to me it looks like you have pretty strongly defined the instrumnetal part of "Knocking" as such music that is doomed to fail in your preferred Rolling Stones concert. And it could be that it reflects largely the opinion and taste of Rolling Stones audiences. The deal of 400 bucks tickets has been for a long that a certain kind of musical experience is granted with that sum. Been there before, and be in future, and be certain what it will be and must be like.

But I think a non-Rolling Stones fan audience, especially a young one as in Glastonbury, is a different animal than the (aged and conservative) ones who are paying big bucks to see the legends, The non-fans (or not yet fans) do not have such fixed idea what to expect from these men. They probably know some of their hits - who does not? - but beside that they are most likely rather open for anything - let these old guys show what they can, and see if they are worth of their reputation or something. These non-trained ears might be even more open to hear just the music without being too 'prejudiced' yet. So who knows, how do they react. It could be very well it was 'wow, they can do also that kind of stuff, not just startmeups, jumpingjackflashes and satisfactions'.

Besides, I don't quite buy the claim stuff like "Knocking" could or even would kill the momentum. I think that sort of talk is also based on a kind of fixed idea (and experience) what a Rolling Stones show is and should be like musically, which leaves a damn small room for any actual musical surprises. Like having accepted that if they do something little out of the box that simply just can't work. Like music per se, when being great (without certain style, history, reputation, familarity, pre-knowledge) can not stand for itself, and you know, to charm people. Like there is no room for that kind of authentic experience when one hears something one is not familiar with, but suddenly realizes 'shit, that sounds good!'. This happens to me many times when I go to see acts I am not so familiar with, and it is always great when they surprise me positively, doing something I didn't expect. Why not with the Stones for someone else?

Sometimes I think the non-trained ears might even appreciate the musical greatness of the Rolling Stones better than those 'who know it all'.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2015-05-07 15:09 by Doxa.

Can anyone translate this-I like it.

[soundcloud.com]

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Stoneburst
I loved the Glastonbury CYHMK the first time I heard it, and still do. It's my favourite Taylor solo out of all the ones he played during his brief return to the band, with the possible exception of the Chicago Sway - it's just beautiful, heartfelt, fluid and brilliantly executed, MT at his best. His tone is fantastic too. But what's also great is that, like Doxa says, the band as a whole are just freewheeling. They totally nail the spontaneity of the studio version whilst making it work as a live number, and that's not easy to do. The other times they played CYHMK, I thought it meandered a bit, with Taylor having to rock up his solo with overdrive and feedback in order to drive the band forward. But at Glastonbury, the interaction between Taylor, Keith, Ronnie and Charlie was a joy to listen to.

Part of a concert experience has always been to move people, the Brits called it stopping time. Led Zep did it as do all the great English rock bands. I have no idea where the concept that people must be slammed over the head with bright happy tunes began but it is misquided and a disservice to those who want a musical experience for their money.

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LuxuryStones
Can anyone translate this-I like it.

[soundcloud.com]

Nice find, Luxury. It's simply Love In Vain. Search for the English lyrics and translate them with Google translation .

I speak Russian, not Ukrainian, but I'm pretty sure at least some of the lyrics are quite different than the version we know.

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kleermaker

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LuxuryStones
Can anyone translate this-I like it.

[soundcloud.com]

Nice find, Luxury. It's simply Love In Vain. Search for the English lyrics and translate them with Google translation .

Who needs a translation...music is a universal language. That was great! Taylor kicks butt on this one. Quick, someone send it to Ronnie for inspiration in case they attempt this one on the Zip Code tour.

peace

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Naturalust

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kleermaker

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LuxuryStones
Can anyone translate this-I like it.

[soundcloud.com]

Nice find, Luxury. It's simply Love In Vain. Search for the English lyrics and translate them with Google translation .

Who needs a translation...music is a universal language. That was great! Taylor kicks butt on this one. Quick, someone send it to Ronnie for inspiration in case they attempt this one on the Zip Code tour.

peace

hmmm

the Faces used to do Love In Vain...

Indeed, Duke. I reckon both have played LIV since 1969, and I love what both have been adding to it through the years.

yeah Ronnie's style on slide has something kind of like talking and laughing..all his own in that..

he could certainly emulate Taylor's style if the Stones played this, but likely he'd do his own thing..

That's a nice, artistic take on it. I agree, and I prefer Ronnie doing it his own way.

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DandelionPowderman
That's a nice, artistic take on it. I agree, and I prefer Ronnie doing it his own way.

Back to Taylor.

Here's the greatest Midnight Rambler ever. And it's not even the Brussels first show one.

I have this on a crystal clear boot - soundboard.

This version sounds a bit muddled

Thank you Doxa I have to listen to the Glaston knockin again. The best Rambler ever? 1972, the CS blues version (philly?) . Taylor is so good you could say he more or less composes a new vocal on the guitar. He moans and answers Jagger in the mid section after the uptempo. Taylor sounds like some companion of the Rambler or maybe it id the inner voice, the anxiety of that Ripper/Strangler character. Amazing.

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potus43
I have this on a crystal clear boot - soundboard.

This version sounds a bit muddled

There's no soundboard of the Berlin shown 1973. This is the best sounding version available. But if you think there's a better version, please post it and you'll be not only my hero. Anyway, I think you mix it up with Brussels.

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duke richardson


he could certainly emulate Taylor's style if the Stones played this, but likely he'd do his own thing..

I don't think so. Not by a 1000 light years from home. He tried to imitate some of Taylor's solos during especially the 1975 and I think also the 1976 tours but failed of course (who wouldn't?)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-05-08 01:26 by kleermaker.

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Redhotcarpet
Thank you Doxa I have to listen to the Glaston knockin again. The best Rambler ever? 1972, the CS blues version (philly?) . Taylor is so good you could say he more or less composes a new vocal on the guitar. He moans and answers Jagger in the mid section after the uptempo. Taylor sounds like some companion of the Rambler or maybe it id the inner voice, the anxiety of that Ripper/Strangler character. Amazing.

According to nzentgraf.de, the Rambler in CS Blues is "mix of Houston 25.6.72, 1st show (intro) & Fort Worth 24.6.72, 2st show"

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kleermaker

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duke richardson


he could certainly emulate Taylor's style if the Stones played this, but likely he'd do his own thing..

I don't think so. Not by a 1000 light years from home. He tried to imitate some of Taylor's solos during especially the 1975 and I think also the 1976 tours but failed of course (who wouldn't?)

They never played LIV in 75/76?

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kleermaker
Back to Taylor.

Here's the greatest Midnight Rambler ever. And it's not even the Brussels first show one.

This IS a great version of Rambler. Please enlighten me where (what release) this is from? I may have it and just might not have listened to it in a while.

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kleermaker

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duke richardson


he could certainly emulate Taylor's style if the Stones played this, but likely he'd do his own thing..

I don't think so. Not by a 1000 light years from home. He tried to imitate some of Taylor's solos during especially the 1975 and I think also the 1976 tours but failed of course (who wouldn't?)

Ronnie's a different player now don't you think?

he'd play something that fit the song. think Taylor owns it though, like Knockin..

I came across this thoughtful blog about a month ago. At least one man's opinion that Taylor was serving the Songs and The Stones and not just merely playing carelessly over the top of everything....


[www.soundandvision.com]

Why I Owe Mick Taylor an Apology
By Daniel Kumin • Posted: Jun 23, 2014

Mick Taylor, back in the day
Long, long ago, I was trained as a “serious” musician. Yet throughout a decade in the world of contemporary-classical music composition and theory, and then, later, even more yeas scrivening about audio, AV and technology, I’ve always led a double life, playing guitar in one or another blues, blues-rock, folk-rock, or some other compound-genre band.

And like a lot of guitar players, I always inwardly sneered, just a little bit, at Mick Taylor, the British wunderkind conscripted into the Rolling Stones in 1969 following Brian Jones’ watery death. Sure, his work on Exile on Main Street was exemplary, and his chops self-evident, but his oddly four-square, self-contained, almost fussy (and perhaps quite shy) playing never fully illuminated my bulb.

Then, a few years ago I discovered Wolfgang’s Vault (www.wolfgangsvault.com), that on-line wormhole into a vast archive of recorded live rock and roll. The site is a bottomless well of unreleased recordings (many but by no means all no-fi sound-board tapes) amassed by Bill Graham’s many enterprises over the years, all now available for on-line streaming for a nominal subscription. (If you care about the music, you need to sign up.)

The majority memorialize mediocre musical moments, monuments only to the grind of the touring-musician’s life, but plenty of others are valuable, and more than a few are genuine treasures. And amongst all this wealth, one evening, I found myself listening—mesmerized —to the Stones’ famous Forest National small-arena date (Brussels, Belgium, Aug 17, 1973): Keith’s on the right; Mick Taylor left-center. And Taylor’s playing is just about as I’d always heard it: careful, clean, contained, oddly un-swinging, un-shuffling, rhythmically unadventurous, almost academic.

But then, as I did, listen closer. He weaves, effortlessly, seamlessly, brilliantly, with Keith’s unwashed, raggedy-assed, lackadaisical vamps; with Mick’s caterwauling; with Charlie’n’Bill’s brickwall backbeat. Never “soloing”; almost-in-the-background, rarely soaring or stepping forward, Taylor contributes an amazing tapestry to almost every bar, a vibrating, breathing pattern that raises the music up. Up, until as the set reaches the incendiary, closing medley (“Rip This Joint”/Jumpin’ Jack Flash”/”Street Fighting Man”), it reaches a place that transcends the dumb, dope-fueled delivery of expected spectacle a typical Stones date would otherwise have been.

Now, I’m pretty sure Keith wasn’t putting much conscious effort into ensemble playing and sensitive musicianship—in those days the simple fact that he remained upright and played (mostly) in the correct keys was a small nightly miracle. And we can assume that Jagger had his hands full doing his thing; the Stones follow Jagger, period.

But Taylor is listening, really listening, and reacting, or more accurately, anticipating every note, every accent, every stop. Everything he plays, whether on slide or frets, elevates the proceedings, from the opening of “Brown Sugar” to the encore medley’s rave-up. It’s a miracle of rock’n’roll guitar (in an interview Taylor once said he recognizes no difference between “lead” and “rhythm” guitar playing, a view I strongly endorse), one that brings to mind the human dynamics of ensemble in the better sort of classical chamber-music playing. Better still, as song follows song you can clearly hear Keith raising his game, till by the time the band reaches the crazed medley that ends the set they are transcending their instruments, approaching that purity for which the best jazz players and—very, very rarely—the best rock players, strive.

(Historical note: Mick Taylor guested throughout much of “The Stones” tour last year. But if various Youtube clips are any measure, most or all of the magic, unsurprisingly, was gone.)

So, Mick T.: my apologies. You knew exactly what you were doing, all those years ago. And thanks to you, for a brief season the Rolling Stones really were The World’s Greatest Rock’n’Roll Band. And thanks to Wolfgang (Bill Graham’s born name), I can prove it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-05-08 05:32 by SweetThing.

Interesting blog. Thanks for the post SweetThing. I must say though that I disagree with his statement about the magic being gone from the last tour. His limited participation really didn't give him the chance to show what he really could have done to the entire Stones set. With Ronnie and Keith in their mostly typical roles of filling up the guitar space, it would take more than one song for Mick or any guitarist to find the magical space again. As it was he did add some great stuff, the most exciting new live musical stuff I've heard from the Stones in many years.
peace