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Mathijs
She's the Boss is the Jagger solo album with some hidden gems, and with some excellent vocals by Mick -all burried deep down in this 80's synth pop overproduced sound. Wandering Spirit just is a fantastic album -really the best Stones album since Tattoo You. All other Jagger solo outtings are simply horrendous. Bad song writing, the singing is barking and shouting, the guitar playing dreadfull, the drumming over the top, the production is awfull. There's no way around it.
Talk is Cheap is a mixed affair to me -Make No Mistake and You Don't Move Me are in the top ten of best songs ever written by Richards, Big Enough, Struggle, How I Wish and Whip it Up would be gems on any Stones album, but the rest indeed is a bit too loose, too much demo like to me.
Mathijs
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Mathijs
She's the Boss is the Jagger solo album with some hidden gems, and with some excellent vocals by Mick -all burried deep down in this 80's synth pop overproduced sound. Wandering Spirit just is a fantastic album -really the best Stones album since Tattoo You. All other Jagger solo outtings are simply horrendous. Bad song writing, the singing is barking and shouting, the guitar playing dreadfull, the drumming over the top, the production is awfull. There's no way around it.
Mathijs
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DoxaQuote
Mathijs
She's the Boss is the Jagger solo album with some hidden gems, and with some excellent vocals by Mick -all burried deep down in this 80's synth pop overproduced sound. Wandering Spirit just is a fantastic album -really the best Stones album since Tattoo You. All other Jagger solo outtings are simply horrendous. Bad song writing, the singing is barking and shouting, the guitar playing dreadfull, the drumming over the top, the production is awfull. There's no way around it.
Mathijs
Hmm... this is an interesting observation. I tend to think that "barking and shouting" is a special feature of the phase covering UNDERCOVER, SHE'S THE OSS and DIRTY WORK (including "State of Shock", "Dancing in the Street", "Ruthless People") of which Jagger found his way out in PRIMITIVE COOL. I think that in that album Jagger started paying more attention to the nuances of his voice and understood that the power is not the only quality. In that album Jagger created the voice he is very much used ever since (including the increasing use of nasal, for sure). But any way I find his vocals from UNDERCOVER to DIRTY WORK quite poor in the richness of interpretation - he sounds somehow out of focus or point in his delivery. Just mostly mindless use of loudness, which is some cases sound like he has not so much power in his voice as he wishes for (for example, "Lonely at The Top"). In PRIMITIVE COOL he sounded like he is once again in the control of his voice, and sounds like he knows how to use his fine instrument, the skill he somehow lost few years after masterpiece-like vocals of TATTOO YOU.
- Doxa
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Stoneage
You sometimes ask yourself: Why does he bother to do interviews at all when he almost never answers the questions?
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Glam Descendant
>Everyone can have a bad day.
I guess you mean the critics.
There are photos that include the artwork used for "One Hit" in an "Architectural Digest" spread on Mick & Jerry's NYC apt. from the 80s so maybe Mick decided to use artwork he already owned for commercial purposes after the fact (I suspect the UC apple painting may be another example of this methodology). The PC cover on the other hand must have been commissioned specifically for the cover; perhaps Jagger even had input on what he wanted. Clemente did the inner sleeve as well (the workers making the record).
The Yoda comment is ... telling; I always thought it was supposed to represent Pan. (Not Peter.)
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Doxa
Technically, this is one of Mick Jagger's most demanding singing performances ever. He needs to really sing properly in a wide range, and he nails it perfectly. Here one can also hear all the familiar voice tricks and nuances that are way too common ever since. But here they are brandnew:
- Doxa
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Glam Descendant
>Actually I meant the artist...just to clarify.
Actually I was being facetious...just to clarify.
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Glam Descendant
>sarcasm is SO much easier face to face!
*Sure* it is.
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Slimharpo
Not many people mention it, so I guess I'm in the minority, but doesn't a single Keith Richards song like "It Means A lot," blow the entire Mick Jagger solo catalogue out the water? There is more sincerity, sponteniety, emotion, class and sense of tasts and feel in the first few verses of that song than the entire Jagger catalogue put together imho.
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Slimharpo
Actually think the song has a lot of meaning to it. Probably an Anita things. It speaks to lies and betrayals or suspician in relationships. Those observations "tell by a movement, a flick of the hand, you know here you stand." Those are the major issues that rock many people's lives, there's the darkness and real sense of personal connection I'm hearing. But I guess I'm just wrong. Well I tried!
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Doxa
I think we need to notice that PRIMITIVE COOL - with its leading single/video -, was more radical and more far from the Stones comfort zone than SHE'S THE BOSS.
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Mathijs
I think it is one of the worst albums released in the 80's, by any band.
Mathijs
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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues
Throwaway ***1/2 - cool tune for the most part. Very up. The drums are so 1980s but aside from that it's alright.
Let's Work - as bad and some days worse than Streets Of Love, Sweet Neo Con, Rock And A Hard Place, Winning Ugly. Embarrassing beyond anything.
Radio Control *1/2 - this song would be better if it wasn't for Jeff Beck and the horrible arrangement of the 'rock' sections.
Say You Will *** - nice ballad but a bit placid because of the production
Primitive Cool 1/2 - almost as bad as Winning Ugly etc...
Kow Tow ***** - Best song on the album.
Shoot Off Your Mouth **
Peace For The Wicked **** - The other best song on the album.
Party Doll ** - a bit mushy. It sounds promising when it starts but it gets too...something. It's too affected.
War Baby * - awful.
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liddas
Occasionally good (not great) songwriting is not enough to save Jagger's solo albums. His albums are by far the worst if compared to what Keith, Ronnie, even Charlie and Taylor did (Bill, I do not know because I never bought one of his).
I think the difference of Jagger as a songwriter to the others mentioned is that he can make finished songs. With his lyrics and clear melody structures he glues the songs into compact units wheras especially Keith's solo stuff is from an song-writer point of view a bit half-baked/half-thought, just throwing some key phares and leading vocals to base of riffage and chord sequences (but sometimes that, of course, makes a wonderful listening experience, by capturing the feeling). Taylor and Wood do not qualify here - neither is actually any song-writer even though they can come up with some nice riffs, chord sequences and song sketches (even though with the case of Woodie any kind of originality is not his forte). As songwriters they belong clearly to another division than the the Twins. And Wyman belongs to the next one below.
- Doxa
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Palace Revolution 2000
I disagree strongly. This 'finished' song' syndrome is what hurts Jagger in the long run. Sure there will be times when those songs will flow with ease, but it's almost a crap-shoot. So often his songs feel labored.
I can see why some people see Keith's work as leaning to far towards the other extreme.
I guess this is why the best Stones work comes from both of them together" the combination of the two.
Seems the quality (IMO) of Jagger's solo albums goes hand in hand with his approach. With WS and a bit less with GITD he went for an overall ambience, feel and band first. THEN added new music.
With the other two albums musicians were non-issue. Might as well have been robots.
Keith went the organic way and started from ground up, with people. Living and socializing together. Getting to know and like each other. This will result in music and harmony. Keith is not selling the structure of music; he is selling the message of music.
And I can not agree that Ron Wood's solo work is in a lower class from Keith and Mick. Matter of fact his solo work is outstanding; all 10 albums.
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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues
Throwaway ***1/2 - cool tune for the most part. Very up. The drums are so 1980s but aside from that it's alright.
Let's Work - as bad and some days worse than Streets Of Love, Sweet Neo Con, Rock And A Hard Place, Winning Ugly. Embarrassing beyond anything.
Radio Control *1/2 - this song would be better if it wasn't for Jeff Beck and the horrible arrangement of the 'rock' sections.
Say You Will *** - nice ballad but a bit placid because of the production
Primitive Cool 1/2 - almost as bad as Winning Ugly etc...
Kow Tow ***** - Best song on the album.
Shoot Off Your Mouth **
Peace For The Wicked **** - The other best song on the album.
Party Doll ** - a bit mushy. It sounds promising when it starts but it gets too...something. It's too affected.
War Baby * - awful.
I agree with those ratings, apart from that I think Throwaway and Peace for The Wicked are to strainging to "enjoy" even though certain riffs here and there are OK.
If Jagger released a single "Kow Tow / Say You Will" in 1987 and kept the rest of f the whole Primitive Cool album unreleased, we would probably think that we had missed out on a great album; by 80s standards anyway
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Doxa
I take those songs - plus many from WANDERING SPIRIT - as a proof with which I could sue Jagger for not taking the Stones seriously.
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liddas
I spent the last couple of days listening to Jagger and Keith solo.
Cheap and Offender are true masterpieces. I mean it. Perfect (almost - still don't like Eileen) from start to finish. You hear the open G guitar, you hear Keith, but they are COMPLETELY different from a Stones record. The attention to the details is incredible. Not only the mix of guitars and amps and acoustics (Keith of course rules), but also the vocal harmonizations are stunning, the richness of grooves, the sophisticate little arrangements. The reason for this is very simple: the Winos are a great band and Keith - like it or not - is a genius.
Jagger.
His records sound as if they were recorded in minutes. I wonder how much time the band had to prepare the songs. Did they prepare them?
Let's be honest, from Jeff Becks point of view, would you rate Boss a milestone in his carreer? No way!
Alfie is no masterpiece, but at least you hear some form of cooperation there.
I hear some genuine effort of doing something worthy, in particular on the ballads. Woman is great. Also the two slow ones on Primitive.
I hear Jagger having fun trying new stuff. Actually a bunch of good songs.
I love Jagger, I don't want to over criticize him for his solo work. He doesn't deserve it. I think he is the first not to give his solo output much importance.
Actually, if you take for what it is, there are a bunch of enjoyable songs even on Goddes.
But there is no way that I can rate any of his works even close to what Keith released.
No way.
C