I have listened to Hampton 81 all the way through and aside from this newest mix which I like (very clear, brilliant, hear some musical nuances that I never heard before), the integrity of the show remains intact. However, I have listened to Time Is On My Side several times and compared it to the original taped broadcast version that I own and I could swear that the vocals have had a subtle work-over as Jagger sounds more on key. Do my ears deceive me? Am I finally losing it? Is it time for another hobby? You listen and compare and tell me what you think.

Just giving it a quick listen on the work computer speakers. With no comparison track handy, I'd say it sounds like a totally different vocal take -- until it gets to the more "spoken" section at last.

In my memory it was a really coke-ravaged vocal.

T@3

It's nose does look a little straighter

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Munichhilton
It's nose does look a little straighter

Isn't there Dristan Mist for that, or something?

Totally, just listened to it, keith vocals are much more clear as well, mick sounds much brighter

.....keep on rolling.....

Ha, wow, this is an interesting one! I'm a little confused by all of this, actually.

There are now at least three versions of this song out there that utilize the Hampton Dec. 18 instrumental track, but have 3 different vocals in the second verse (which begins at 1:19 in the new release if you want to compare):

1. this new release features the words "You're searchin' for good times, but just wait and see..."

2. The old familiar Hampton bootlegs from the broadcast feature the words "You're searchin' for real love, but just wait and see..."

3. The Still Life version features the words "Cause I got the real love, the kind that you need." (for Still Life they seemed to have taken this line from the end of the song and moved it up to the front. This line seems to appear at the 2:35 mark on the new release.)

Can someone help with this? The vocal on the new release certainly isn't some new vocal like Jagger attempted with Plundered My Soul, etc. It's from the '81 period, but I'm not sure it's from Hampton Dec. 18. Although...wow, it's darn close...just obviously different. I like it better than the old boot versions, for sure.

This is what I posted on my review. It seems Keith backing are much better. Maybe a mix with another Time version. A new listening this we.

"we know it's a bit late but we hope you don't mind if we stay"

I always thought what you call "Real Love" was "Rhythm."

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TeaAtThree
I always thought what you call "Real Love" was "Rhythm."

hmmmm...just took another listen. I don't think so. I think it's actually "real love." But I'd love to have others chime in about the various vocal sources for Time is on My Side that have made their way onto numerous versions of this Dec. 18, 1981 show. There's some variability here that warrants a research effort akin to the excellent Get Yer Ya Ya's Out overdub sourcing analysis that's been done by the likes of Chrism42. However, I don't have the energy to do such a comparison!

It could be an interestng project for someone who is motivated to track down and source the discrepencies, though. (does that sound like a challenge? Well, I hope so...)

I wasn't trying to be contradictory, "Real Love" certainly makes more sense. While we all need Rhythm, some are blessed with more than others, Real Love fits better.
T@3

So they've overdubbed the bootleg?

I didn't like the way Jagger sang this one anyway on the videos out there... "Ti--yi-ime.." or some such modern Mick affected nonsense.

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rocker1

1. this new release features the words "You're searchin' for good times, but just wait and see..."

2. The old familiar Hampton bootlegs from the broadcast feature the words "You're searchin' for real love, but just wait and see..."

3. The Still Life version features the words "Cause I got the real love, the kind that you need." (for Still Life they seemed to have taken this line from the end of the song and moved it up to the front. This line seems to appear at the 2:35 mark on the new release.)

This line may come from the 2nd Hampton show, at least he sings "searching for good times" there.

This is interesting. I suppose even the stamp collectors should pay attention here: the new release is not a replica of the old bootlegs. In the best case, they have used some different source from the same tour, such as the 2nd Hampton show (which still would make its name alright; they didn't specify anywhere which date is it, or did they?). Or then it is simply an overdub. An alternative version taken, say, from the sessions to STILL LIFE. In the worst scenario it is a "new" overdub, but fortunately this doesn't sound likely (firstly, it sounds totally 1981-like, and secondly, why should they really bother to take their time to that now?).

The question arises: are there any other such anomalities in the the new release? (I especially ask the bootleg besserwissers to to use their funded experience here; now it is the time to show what you know!)

- Doxa



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-04 13:25 by Doxa.

it's from the source that produced the version on still life...you can tell by keith's b/u vocals, which he butchered at times on this particular performance...whatever other enhancements were originally made for the still life album i presume were kept as well...

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StonesTod
it's from the source that produced the version on still life...you can tell by keith's b/u vocals, which he butchered at times on this particular performance...whatever other enhancements were originally made for the still life album i presume were kept as well...

yeah, that's my guess, too. I undestand Keith's decision to handle it a bit - his rough back vox has a charm of its own but in this case he goes such terribly out of tune that it not so funny anymore... (and its not either Mick's best interpretation in terms of staying in tune):





- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-04 15:02 by Doxa.

Am I the only one who thinks it's quite tacky to take a live recording and overdub vocal parts in a studio? Is MJ really that insecure that he can't let a single vocal track that is slightly imperfect get out?

This is SO against the ideals that the Stones were the best live rock band of the time. With all the doctoring who's to tell from listening to these supposed "live" releases.

Live tracks are different art form than studio produced music imho and I think that this sort of post production replacement of vocals really spoils the whole brew. Mick, if ya don't like what you played, mix it down, pick another track something. But don't sell your loyal fans a live perfomance record that obviously isn't. That's sleazy, like something Alan Klein would have done.

Whats next? Pre-recorded vocals playing from tape machines hidden under the stage? peace



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-04 15:20 by Naturalust.

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Naturalust
Am I the only one who thinks it's quite tacky to take a live recording and overdub vocal parts in a studio.

may i introduce you to:

the tackiest rock and roll band in the world, the rollllllling stones!!!!

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StonesTod
it's from the source that produced the version on still life...you can tell by keith's b/u vocals, which he butchered at times on this particular performance...whatever other enhancements were originally made for the still life album i presume were kept as well...

But to make one point clear: it is not the same background vocal performance as it is in STILL LIFE. What is particular in that STILL LIFE version is that Keith starts his part 'dramatically' a little moment after Mick has started the key phrase:
Mick: "Tiiiiiiiiiieeeeemmmmmme"
Keith: ".........TIIIimmmmmmmme"

That dramatic little gap seems to be an arrangemnt idea they made in the studio (and it sounds marvellous). In the original - the clip above - Mick and Keith seem to start singing the phrase together at the same moment. The new version sounds something like in the middle - like an early attempt or a sketch that would lead to the finished version to be heard in STILL LIFE.

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-04 15:18 by Doxa.

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Doxa

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StonesTod
it's from the source that produced the version on still life...you can tell by keith's b/u vocals, which he butchered at times on this particular performance...whatever other enhancements were originally made for the still life album i presume were kept as well...

But to make one point clear: it is not the same background vocal performance as it is in STILL LIFE. What is particular in that STILL LIFE version is that Keith starts his part 'dramatically' a little moment after Mick has started the key phrase:
Mick: "Tiiiiiiiiiieeeeemmmmmme"
Keith: ".........TIIIimmmmmmmme"

That dramatic little gap seems to be an arrangemnt idea they made in the studio (and it sounds marvellous). In the original - the clip above - Mick and Keith seem to start singing the phrase together at the same moment. The new version sounds something like in the middle - like an early attempt or a sketch that would lead to the finished version to be heard in STILL LIFE.

- Doxa

ok...this is the overdub from 1988 or 89...we know they did new vocals on an annual basis....

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StonesTod
ok...this is the overdub from 1988 or 89...we know they did new vocals on an annual basis....

you don't believe me, now do you?

But of course we all know 'time is on my side' is a key phrase. For example, when Brian Jones picked up the girl Dylan was interested in, with was easy for such a 'Rolling Stone' pop star, the damn jealous Zimmermann not just made him cry with words, he came and wrote a verse of the scene in "I Want You":

Now your dancing child with his Chinese suit
He spoke to me, I took his flute
No, I wasn’t very cute to him, was I?
But I did it, though, because he lied
Because he took you for a ride
And because time was on his side
And because I . . .

- Doxa

Certainly there are more differences than this...

For what it's worth it sounds like a hard edit at 0:43 on the 'Still Life" version.

I am getting confused with the different layouts.

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Doxa

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StonesTod
ok...this is the overdub from 1988 or 89...we know they did new vocals on an annual basis....

you don't believe me, now do you?

i'm agreeing with you and i don't believe you all at the same time? wow, i'm talented...

Thanks to all you detectives out there who followed up on my post and researched the great Time is On my Side conspiracy (LOL). As much as I think I know about the Stones, I am always intrigued by what I learn from the wealth of knowledge that everyone on this board possesses.

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Naturalust
Am I the only one who thinks it's quite tacky to take a live recording and overdub vocal parts in a studio? Is MJ really that insecure that he can't let a single vocal track that is slightly imperfect get out?

This is SO against the ideals that the Stones were the best live rock band of the time. With all the doctoring who's to tell from listening to these supposed "live" releases.

You're complaining about this release or all live releases that have overdubs? This release most likely does not have the overdubs, as Doxa pointed out. It's the Still Life version(s) that have been worked over in the studio. There's a picture I saw somewhere years ago of Keith recording guitar parts for Still Life in a studio of him sitting on the stairs outside (?) laughing. Knowing Keith he wasn't laughing at the reality of "ripping off" Stones fans by adding guitar tracks to live recordings. He seems to laugh at many things. But one never knows.

It's nothing against the 'best live band at the time' because live that is still what it is - live. This boot is the live version. A live album, unfortunately, is a representation of a live show. As you may be aware of there have been a plethora of acts that have release true live albums over the years. The only doctoring they had was artwork for the release.

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Naturalust
Live tracks are different art form than studio produced music imho and I think that this sort of post production replacement of vocals really spoils the whole brew. Mick, if ya don't like what you played, mix it down, pick another track something. But don't sell your loyal fans a live perfomance record that obviously isn't. That's sleazy, like something Alan Klein would have done.

You'd better throw away Get Yer Ya-Ya's Out!, Love You Live, Still Life, Flashpoint, No Security and Live Licks as well as whatever live video releases that they've worked on to fix the screw ups like The Biggest Bang since they all contain vocal and guitar overdubs.

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Naturalust
Whats next? Pre-recorded vocals playing from tape machines hidden under the stage?

Pre-recorded? ALL recordings are done BEFORE listening. In this case ALL albums are pre-recorded. Otherwise how would one hear a recording before it's recorded?

Some acts use RECORDED vocals (you do know, right, that the "ed" implies it's already been done?) - Britney Spears and Madonna, two examples of known lip syncers, who record everything in a studio for the live show months before they even start rehearsals. Besides, they don't use tape machines anymore. It's all digital.

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues
Pre-recorded? ALL recordings are done BEFORE listening. In this case ALL albums are pre-recorded.

... skipstone? is that you???

either way, i sure hope you'll have another try at the photo description you wanted to share with us:

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues
There's a picture I saw somewhere years ago of Keith recording guitar parts for Still Life
in a studio of him sitting on the stairs outside (?) laughing

the photo was of Keith recording in a studio and outside on the stairs at the same time?!
freakin wow - no wonder he was laughing!

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues
Knowing Keith he wasn't laughing at the reality of "ripping off" Stones fans
by adding guitar tracks to live recordings. He seems to laugh at many things. But one never knows.

quite :E
but anyway yeah, it's pretty late to get irked about overdubs on concert albums.

now i hope we can get back to our regularly-scheduled "what show is this rendition of TIOMS from?" investigation -
i'm intrigued

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues

You're complaining about this release or all live releases that have overdubs?.

.

Every single one, thanks for asking.

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Naturalust
Live tracks are different art form than studio produced music imho and I think that this sort of post production replacement of vocals really spoils the whole brew. Mick, if ya don't like what you played, mix it down, pick another track something. But don't sell your loyal fans a live perfomance record that obviously isn't. That's sleazy, like something Alan Klein would have done.

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Naturalust
Whats next? Pre-recorded vocals playing from tape machines hidden under the stage?

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues

Pre-recorded? ALL recordings are done BEFORE listening. In this case ALL albums are pre-recorded. Otherwise how would one hear a recording before it's recorded?

Obviously I meant recorded prior to the "live" performance. Your logic is better suited for juries and judges.

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WeLoveToPlayTheBlues

Besides, they don't use tape machines anymore. It's all digital.

Of course, digital tape machines possibly. Didn't you know all digital is not recorded to hard disks?
peace

new house rule: limit of one quote per post, per family. this will keep our overheard down and allow the same service we've all come to expect from iorr. we thank you.

I'm down with that if you are Tod. peace

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Naturalust
I'm down with that if you are Tod. peace

good. bv has his crack programming team working through the weekend to ensure a product to market by monday at the opening of business.