Tell Me :
Talk
I certainly wouldn't call Suzie Q, I Put A Spell On You & I Heard It Through The Grapevine their songs by any stretch of the imagination.
It's a bit like calling Wild Horses a Susan Boyle song.
if you're chicken , you miss out on sweet hitch hiker and someday never comes !
ramble tamble , my favourite
You are so right. I hate Kenny Arnoff's drumming with Fogerty. Totally wrong feel. That guy over plays.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-27 22:18 by 71Tele.
I've never heard that but to me it makes no difference -- IMO Fogerty's music was better served by the CCR rhythm section, however it was achieved. The had some swing -- as has been pointed out here and elsewhere, sometimes the musician with the better chops isn't necessarily the best choice.
I am a big CCR and Fogerty fan and there is no sense in discussing his prominence in the band or in popular music. The other guys needed him a hell of a lot more than he ever needed them. However, in my eyes (and others here it seems) there was a clear, positive contribution to Fogerty's songs with Cook, Clifford, and Brother Tom.
Yeah, I was there too. Fantastic show.
"No Anchovies, Please"
Fogerty said this in a long article in Musician magazine some years ago. He was incredibly dismissive of his bandmates contributions. He said he had to teach Stu Cook his bass parts in a way that Cook thought he was creating them himself, and that when he let those guys into a mixing session all they wanted to do was turn their parts up, so he banned them after that.
I care! I'd love to see them together!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-28 16:59 by NedKelly.
It's funny...I've always considered John's vocals in the last few years to mirror Mick's vocal troubles. You go back and listen to those CCR records, John's voice is deep and full....using his full vocal power to growl out those songs. Since the late 90's...John has taken a much more delicate approach to these songs...doing the same thing Mick is doing...a more back of the throat, more narrow passage way for singing. Not as nasally as Mick...but less throat power than we're used to hearing him. Most likely, this is something he's had to learn to do in his older age in order to save his voice from any more damage...but it's still something I noticed. I was listening to "Born ON the Bayou" from the "In Concert" disc (CCR live in Oakland), and then put on the same song from John's "Premonition" live album...and then the same cut from the "Long Road Home" Concert...and it's quite noticeable. Not a huge deal...but still worth noting.
Nice example with Al Jardine. We could add Paul Simon and Neil Young to that group where their voices have held up practically intact since the 70's. Paul has gone on record saying that he began to protect his voice by stopping smoking, no drinking any caffeine or alcohol.
Yup ... the girl on the left ain't bad!
Yes, he was not without a lawyer or 2 when he entered this agreement, so he made a call he ultimately has only himself to blame.
There was also the issue of JF losing a big chunk of money in an off shore banking gig that Zaentz suggested.
I think he did milk the rock star vs the corporate thug thing too far, I mean,
he was being very corporate in his own way, and did even worse to his band mates than what he feels Zaentz did to him, all due to bad decisions and a huge ego. I like CCR, but JF was a crybaby. "price of an education" much better.
No it's not, just because CCR aren't Susan Boyle.
If you listen to the 3-piece-CCR live recordings from '71 without Tom Fogerty,
they were still kicking ass. Not all the songs worked too well with only one guitar, but most surely did, and John Fogerty was on Top form. The real problem lay somewhere else: the other band members wanted writing credits, but the songs they came up with were clearly subpar...
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-29 03:07 by Greenblues.
He can accept awards, tho...
Talk about your favorite band.
For information about how to use this forum please check out forum help and policies.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Sleepy City
()
Date: October 27, 2011 14:05
Quote
Max'sKansasCity
My guess is young (old, all ) people have CCR songs are engrained in their DNA. Even if they might not know the names of the songs, they sure as heck know the song... at least these....
"Susie Q."
"I Put a Spell on You"
"Proud Mary"
"Bad Moon Rising"
"Green River"
"Down on the Corner"
"Travelin' Band"
"Up Around the Bend"
"Lookin' out My Back Door"
"Have You Ever Seen the Rain?"
"Sweet Hitch-Hiker"
"Someday Never Comes"
"I Heard It Through the Grapevine"
There are popular new groups out there that dont even have that many songs total(exageration), let alone that many super hits. That is like 12 war horses.
I certainly wouldn't call Suzie Q, I Put A Spell On You & I Heard It Through The Grapevine their songs by any stretch of the imagination.
It's a bit like calling Wild Horses a Susan Boyle song.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
straycatblues73
()
Date: October 27, 2011 20:11
Quote
71Tele
Let's face it, CCR was Fogerty. If you want to hear a CCR album where they shared the writing and decision-making responsibilities equally, listen to Mardi Gras - if you dare.
if you're chicken , you miss out on sweet hitch hiker and someday never comes !
Quote
NICOSQuote
StonesTod
oh, great. now that nobody (except Nicos) cares anymore....
Well I love to see this one performed on stage ....................and after that they can add it to their Re-Mastered, Expanded, Super-Super-Deluxe Edition
Forgot to add the picture...
ramble tamble , my favourite
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
TheDailyBuzzherd
()
Date: October 27, 2011 21:08
CCR + Buffalo Springfield. THAT's a bill.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Justin
()
Date: October 27, 2011 21:12
Fogerty does put on a strong show on his own but I think the music could really benefit if we had the original rhythm players back there. Kenny Arnoff, although a great drummer, really pounces on all the CCR songs beating the crap out of it--completely losing the groove. So besides a quick money-grabber for the band if they do decide to tour...fans could really enjoy hearing these songs being played by the guys who originally played them. That to me is worth the price of a ticket.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
sweetcharmedlife
()
Date: October 27, 2011 21:31
Heard him do Ramble Tamble when I saw him a few months ago. Really good.Quote
straycatblues73
ramble tamble , my favourite
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: October 27, 2011 22:18
Quote
Justin
Fogerty does put on a strong show on his own but I think the music could really benefit if we had the original rhythm players back there. Kenny Arnoff, although a great drummer, really pounces on all the CCR songs beating the crap out of it--completely losing the groove. So besides a quick money-grabber for the band if they do decide to tour...fans could really enjoy hearing these songs being played by the guys who originally played them. That to me is worth the price of a ticket.
You are so right. I hate Kenny Arnoff's drumming with Fogerty. Totally wrong feel. That guy over plays.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-27 22:18 by 71Tele.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
WilliamPatrickMaynard
()
Date: October 27, 2011 22:27
Doug and Stu are my second favorite rhythm section after Bill and Charlie, so I would welcome the reunion. That said, I don't know if John is actually talking about a proper CCR reunion or just saying he would let them play with him if they felt like it as a one-off. The rest of the interview where he likens them to ex-wives is telling, particularly the bit about once you spend time being cordial you are usually reminded why you split in the first place. Sure the hardness is melting maybe, but I don't know that a reunion is exactly imminent.
He's got a new album coming out next year mixing new songs and old CCR songs with guest stars (like his most recent Blue Ridge Rangers album), I'm sure it will be followed by a Fogerty solo tour, not a CCR reunion tour to overshadow the new album.
He's got a new album coming out next year mixing new songs and old CCR songs with guest stars (like his most recent Blue Ridge Rangers album), I'm sure it will be followed by a Fogerty solo tour, not a CCR reunion tour to overshadow the new album.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Wry Cooter
()
Date: October 28, 2011 00:27
Quote
71TeleQuote
Wry Cooter
Just to be fair, Cook and Clifford were an awesome rhythm section that had a lot to do with Creedence's sound.
Yes, but Fogerty has claimed that he had to teach them basically each and every note, and he had to bar them from the studio when he was mixing because they didn't know what they were doing.
I've never heard that but to me it makes no difference -- IMO Fogerty's music was better served by the CCR rhythm section, however it was achieved. The had some swing -- as has been pointed out here and elsewhere, sometimes the musician with the better chops isn't necessarily the best choice.
I am a big CCR and Fogerty fan and there is no sense in discussing his prominence in the band or in popular music. The other guys needed him a hell of a lot more than he ever needed them. However, in my eyes (and others here it seems) there was a clear, positive contribution to Fogerty's songs with Cook, Clifford, and Brother Tom.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
sweetcharmedlife
()
Date: October 28, 2011 00:35
Don't know how many tours John has left in him. He's got real problems hitting some high notes. Saw hima few months ago and his voice cracked several times when he tried to hit the high notes.Quote
WilliamPatrickMaynard
Doug and Stu are my second favorite rhythm section after Bill and Charlie, so I would welcome the reunion. That said, I don't know if John is actually talking about a proper CCR reunion or just saying he would let them play with him if they felt like it as a one-off. The rest of the interview where he likens them to ex-wives is telling, particularly the bit about once you spend time being cordial you are usually reminded why you split in the first place. Sure the hardness is melting maybe, but I don't know that a reunion is exactly imminent.
He's got a new album coming out next year mixing new songs and old CCR songs with guest stars (like his most recent Blue Ridge Rangers album), I'm sure it will be followed by a Fogerty solo tour, not a CCR reunion tour to overshadow the new album.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
TheDailyBuzzherd
()
Date: October 28, 2011 14:53
Weeell ... Fogerty ain't 25 no mo'.
Fact is, the last time he yowled through an entire album's worth of material was "Centerfield". He could still do it then, not now. Whereas Robert Plant's voice was destroyed by overuse and substances, Fogerty's battling The Old Man a Little Further Down the Road. The performances aren't the real problem ... the problem is the material. It's hit-and-miss.
Oh, and the Creedence rhythm section? One of the best in rock. Cue from Charlie Watts: Less is More. Kenny? Great drummer, does CCR well, but he's no Doug Clifford.
CCR back together? Don't hold yer breath.
Fact is, the last time he yowled through an entire album's worth of material was "Centerfield". He could still do it then, not now. Whereas Robert Plant's voice was destroyed by overuse and substances, Fogerty's battling The Old Man a Little Further Down the Road. The performances aren't the real problem ... the problem is the material. It's hit-and-miss.
Oh, and the Creedence rhythm section? One of the best in rock. Cue from Charlie Watts: Less is More. Kenny? Great drummer, does CCR well, but he's no Doug Clifford.
CCR back together? Don't hold yer breath.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Elmo Lewis
()
Date: October 28, 2011 15:50
Quote
Send It To me
I saw Fogerty in a very small place in Atlanta in 2004 and it was great. I wonder how many tickets the name CCR would sell?
Yeah, I was there too. Fantastic show.
"No Anchovies, Please"
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
kovach
()
Date: October 28, 2011 16:22
Best American Band of all time. Would love to see a reunion.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: October 28, 2011 16:51
Quote
Wry CooterQuote
71TeleQuote
Wry Cooter
Just to be fair, Cook and Clifford were an awesome rhythm section that had a lot to do with Creedence's sound.
Yes, but Fogerty has claimed that he had to teach them basically each and every note, and he had to bar them from the studio when he was mixing because they didn't know what they were doing.
I've never heard that but to me it makes no difference -- IMO Fogerty's music was better served by the CCR rhythm section, however it was achieved. The had some swing -- as has been pointed out here and elsewhere, sometimes the musician with the better chops isn't necessarily the best choice.
I am a big CCR and Fogerty fan and there is no sense in discussing his prominence in the band or in popular music. The other guys needed him a hell of a lot more than he ever needed them. However, in my eyes (and others here it seems) there was a clear, positive contribution to Fogerty's songs with Cook, Clifford, and Brother Tom.
Fogerty said this in a long article in Musician magazine some years ago. He was incredibly dismissive of his bandmates contributions. He said he had to teach Stu Cook his bass parts in a way that Cook thought he was creating them himself, and that when he let those guys into a mixing session all they wanted to do was turn their parts up, so he banned them after that.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
NedKelly
()
Date: October 28, 2011 16:59
Quote
StonesTod
oh, great. now that nobody (except Nicos) cares anymore....
I care! I'd love to see them together!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-28 16:59 by NedKelly.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
NedKelly
()
Date: October 28, 2011 17:23
JF no doubt has an ego bigger than a house. But he also was the creative one, and he knew what he wanted, and made CCR success with that.
But, just as The Beatles and The Stones, none of them are virtuosoes, they are just good musicians. But together, wow, they are dynamite! The chemistry between the band members is crutial in all bands. This fact is what made all three bands the worlds leading bands to this day. Mix members of the three, or even put Keith, Lennon, Fogerty, Paul and one of the drummers together and they wouldn't have been a smashing force like they are in their respecting bands. Lots of musicians have tried to put together a supergroup, but never made it this big. Best try was properbly Travelin' Wilburys, but they didn't get as far as they could have for obvious reasons.
So, let Stu and Doug back in to give us the real feel of the Creedence songs. The songs deserve that. :-)
But, just as The Beatles and The Stones, none of them are virtuosoes, they are just good musicians. But together, wow, they are dynamite! The chemistry between the band members is crutial in all bands. This fact is what made all three bands the worlds leading bands to this day. Mix members of the three, or even put Keith, Lennon, Fogerty, Paul and one of the drummers together and they wouldn't have been a smashing force like they are in their respecting bands. Lots of musicians have tried to put together a supergroup, but never made it this big. Best try was properbly Travelin' Wilburys, but they didn't get as far as they could have for obvious reasons.
So, let Stu and Doug back in to give us the real feel of the Creedence songs. The songs deserve that. :-)
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Justin
()
Date: October 28, 2011 20:01
Quote
sweetcharmedlifeDon't know how many tours John has left in him. He's got real problems hitting some high notes. Saw hima few months ago and his voice cracked several times when he tried to hit the high notes.Quote
WilliamPatrickMaynard
Doug and Stu are my second favorite rhythm section after Bill and Charlie, so I would welcome the reunion. That said, I don't know if John is actually talking about a proper CCR reunion or just saying he would let them play with him if they felt like it as a one-off. The rest of the interview where he likens them to ex-wives is telling, particularly the bit about once you spend time being cordial you are usually reminded why you split in the first place. Sure the hardness is melting maybe, but I don't know that a reunion is exactly imminent.
He's got a new album coming out next year mixing new songs and old CCR songs with guest stars (like his most recent Blue Ridge Rangers album), I'm sure it will be followed by a Fogerty solo tour, not a CCR reunion tour to overshadow the new album.
It's funny...I've always considered John's vocals in the last few years to mirror Mick's vocal troubles. You go back and listen to those CCR records, John's voice is deep and full....using his full vocal power to growl out those songs. Since the late 90's...John has taken a much more delicate approach to these songs...doing the same thing Mick is doing...a more back of the throat, more narrow passage way for singing. Not as nasally as Mick...but less throat power than we're used to hearing him. Most likely, this is something he's had to learn to do in his older age in order to save his voice from any more damage...but it's still something I noticed. I was listening to "Born ON the Bayou" from the "In Concert" disc (CCR live in Oakland), and then put on the same song from John's "Premonition" live album...and then the same cut from the "Long Road Home" Concert...and it's quite noticeable. Not a huge deal...but still worth noting.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: October 28, 2011 20:16
Quote
NedKellyQuote
StonesTod
oh, great. now that nobody (except Nicos & NedKelly) cares anymore....
I care! I'd love to see them together!
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Wry Cooter
()
Date: October 28, 2011 21:30
I'm no expert, but my understanding is that generally rock and roll singing is not "proper" singing -- one of the reasons we like it! But not good on the voice in the long haul. Years of oversinging over bad monitors, night after night gigs forcing yourself through strained vocal chords, plus whatever you were doing "wrong" in the first place will take their toll. Add to that bad health habits.... I don't know where age figures in but it must be a factor as well. Fogerty strikes me as likely a clean living guy, but that his voice has diminished is no surprise, especially considering his style. And he is certainly in good company -- most singers from that era have lost it to a large degree.
Interestingly, I saw Al Jardine touring with Brian Wilson and his band a few years ago. Brian's voice is notoriously a shadow of it's former glory, but when Al sang you could have closed your eyes and imagined him as a 25 year old -- he sounded great. Of course he looked 48 when he was 25!
Interestingly, I saw Al Jardine touring with Brian Wilson and his band a few years ago. Brian's voice is notoriously a shadow of it's former glory, but when Al sang you could have closed your eyes and imagined him as a 25 year old -- he sounded great. Of course he looked 48 when he was 25!
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Justin
()
Date: October 28, 2011 21:33
Quote
Wry Cooter
I'm no expert, but my understanding is that generally rock and roll singing is not "proper" singing -- one of the reasons we like it! But not good on the voice in the long haul. Years of oversinging over bad monitors, night after night gigs forcing yourself through strained vocal chords, plus whatever you were doing "wrong" in the first place will take their toll. Add to that bad health habits.... I don't know where age figures in but it must be a factor as well. Fogerty strikes me as likely a clean living guy, but that his voice has diminished is no surprise, especially considering his style. And he is certainly in good company -- most singers from that era have lost it to a large degree.
Interestingly, I saw Al Jardine touring with Brian Wilson and his band a few years ago. Brian's voice is notoriously a shadow of it's former glory, but when Al sang you could have closed your eyes and imagined him as a 25 year old -- he sounded great. Of course he looked 48 when he was 25!
Nice example with Al Jardine. We could add Paul Simon and Neil Young to that group where their voices have held up practically intact since the 70's. Paul has gone on record saying that he began to protect his voice by stopping smoking, no drinking any caffeine or alcohol.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Send It To me
()
Date: October 28, 2011 21:47
Fogerty really looked like an ass when he refused to play with Dough and Stu at the RRHOF induction ceremony.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Send It To me
()
Date: October 28, 2011 21:50
not bad...
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
sweetcharmedlife
()
Date: October 28, 2011 22:24
Those girls look a hell of a lot better and younger than the crowd I was with at the Fogerty show I went to in June.Quote
Send It To me
not bad...
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
TheDailyBuzzherd
()
Date: October 28, 2011 22:25
Quote
sweetcharmedlifeThose girls look a hell of a lot better and younger than the crowd I was with at the Fogerty show I went to in June.Quote
Send It To me
not bad...
Yup ... the girl on the left ain't bad!
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Send It To me
()
Date: October 28, 2011 23:52
Ha. Yeah, that lady is alright.
I was always struck by the Stones "grown up" reaction to getting taken advantage of by Alan Klein (Keith: "price of an education" ) as compared to Fogerty's crybaby reaction to his bad deal with Zaentz. I mean, you signed a sh*tty deal, but...you did sign it...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-28 23:53 by Send It To me.
I was always struck by the Stones "grown up" reaction to getting taken advantage of by Alan Klein (Keith: "price of an education" ) as compared to Fogerty's crybaby reaction to his bad deal with Zaentz. I mean, you signed a sh*tty deal, but...you did sign it...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-28 23:53 by Send It To me.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
MKjan
()
Date: October 29, 2011 00:52
Quote
Send It To me
Ha. Yeah, that lady is alright.
I was always struck by the Stones "grown up" reaction to getting taken advantage of by Alan Klein (Keith: "price of an education" ) as compared to Fogerty's crybaby reaction to his bad deal with Zaentz. I mean, you signed a sh*tty deal, but...you did sign it...
Yes, he was not without a lawyer or 2 when he entered this agreement, so he made a call he ultimately has only himself to blame.
There was also the issue of JF losing a big chunk of money in an off shore banking gig that Zaentz suggested.
I think he did milk the rock star vs the corporate thug thing too far, I mean,
he was being very corporate in his own way, and did even worse to his band mates than what he feels Zaentz did to him, all due to bad decisions and a huge ego. I like CCR, but JF was a crybaby. "price of an education" much better.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Max'sKansasCity
()
Date: October 29, 2011 01:08
my left foot...
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
retired_dog
()
Date: October 29, 2011 01:37
Quote
Sleepy City
It's a bit like calling Wild Horses a Susan Boyle song.
No it's not, just because CCR aren't Susan Boyle.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
sweetcharmedlife
()
Date: October 29, 2011 01:53
Quote
Send It To me
Ha. Yeah, that lady is alright.
I was always struck by the Stones "grown up" reaction to getting taken advantage of by Alan Klein (Keith: "price of an education" ) as compared to Fogerty's crybaby reaction to his bad deal with Zaentz. I mean, you signed a sh*tty deal, but...you did sign it...
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Greenblues
()
Date: October 29, 2011 02:43
Quote
Floorbird
It's not Creedence without brother Tom, who passed away years ago.
If you listen to the 3-piece-CCR live recordings from '71 without Tom Fogerty,
they were still kicking ass. Not all the songs worked too well with only one guitar, but most surely did, and John Fogerty was on Top form. The real problem lay somewhere else: the other band members wanted writing credits, but the songs they came up with were clearly subpar...
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2011-10-29 03:07 by Greenblues.
Re: OT-John Fogerty: My Anger Towards Creedence Bandmates Has Faded
Posted by:
Send It To me
()
Date: October 29, 2011 03:06
Quote
sweetcharmedlifeQuote
Send It To me
Ha. Yeah, that lady is alright.
I was always struck by the Stones "grown up" reaction to getting taken advantage of by Alan Klein (Keith: "price of an education" ) as compared to Fogerty's crybaby reaction to his bad deal with Zaentz. I mean, you signed a sh*tty deal, but...you did sign it...
He can accept awards, tho...
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
Online Users
armin944 , Bashlets , Blueranger , ChrisMahavishnu , DandelionPowderman , frankotero , goingmad , manu3121 , NeddieFlanders , Palace Revolution 2000 , spunky , Stonesfan2146 , stonesurvive , syrel , willprefecture , witterings
Guests:
1712
Record Number of Users:
206
on June 1, 2022 23:50
Record Number of Guests:
9627
on January 2, 2024 23:10