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Amsterdamned
I think I have every bootleg from this era, and I love them all. But none of them, not even the versions on the excellent Rattlesnake STP 72 (where this one is from) beats the original.
PS: BTW, this is a very good example of Keith's coolest licks being drowned by Taylor's more boring licks, imo (right before the chorus) <DP>
The SF version is ok, but I prefer them as a live band. Imo Taylor was the less boring
guitar player the Stones ever had when it comes to guitar solos.
So in the end it's a matter of taste.
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kleermakerQuote
DandelionPowderman
I'm talking about the unbeatable original studio versions, of BS, and JJF for that matter.
imo, they have never been surpassed. That's why I was a bit surprised by kleermaker's take on it. BS studio version is perfection. You gotta be a very big Taylorite to describe that song as "boring", just because Taylor is inaudible on the studio take - or the song is lacking his melodic lines, well-known from the live versions.
I never complain about not hearing Keith's guitar (he only play bass) on the GHS-version of Heartbreaker, although I like the live versions w Keith.
Your last line just says it all! Think about it. As Taylor said in an interview: music consists of rhythm and melody. I miss the melody on BS studio, but I don't miss the rhythm (and melody of course) on Hearbreaker studio.
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
kleermakerQuote
DandelionPowderman
I'm talking about the unbeatable original studio versions, of BS, and JJF for that matter.
imo, they have never been surpassed. That's why I was a bit surprised by kleermaker's take on it. BS studio version is perfection. You gotta be a very big Taylorite to describe that song as "boring", just because Taylor is inaudible on the studio take - or the song is lacking his melodic lines, well-known from the live versions.
I never complain about not hearing Keith's guitar (he only play bass) on the GHS-version of Heartbreaker, although I like the live versions w Keith.
Your last line just says it all! Think about it. As Taylor said in an interview: music consists of rhythm and melody. I miss the melody on BS studio, but I don't miss the rhythm (and melody of course) on Hearbreaker studio.
No, my last line didn't say what you are implying at all. On the contrary, it said that I liked the versions with Keith, and that I never complained about the studio take.
You should go for a political career with these kind of twists...
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DandelionPowderman
I'm talking about the unbeatable original studio versions, of BS, and JJF for that matter.
imo, they have never been surpassed. That's why I was a bit surprised by kleermaker's take on it. BS studio version is perfection. You gotta be a very big Taylorite to describe that song as "boring", just because Taylor is inaudible on the studio take - or the song is lacking his melodic lines, well-known from the live versions.
I never complain about not hearing Keith's guitar (he only play bass) on the GHS-version of Heartbreaker, although I like the live versions w Keith.
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
Amsterdamned
I think I have every bootleg from this era, and I love them all. But none of them, not even the versions on the excellent Rattlesnake STP 72 (where this one is from) beats the original.
PS: BTW, this is a very good example of Keith's coolest licks being drowned by Taylor's more boring licks, imo (right before the chorus) <DP>
The SF version is ok, but I prefer them as a live band. Imo Taylor was the less boring
guitar player the Stones ever had when it comes to guitar solos.
So in the end it's a matter of taste.
Yeah, but I don't like guitar solos over fantastic licks or over Mick's vocals.
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Shawn20
I suppose it is a matter of taste, but I also love Taylor's solo on the 72 clip of Brown Sugar. That is my favorite live clip of the Stones. If anyone ever wanted to know what all the fuss was about - watching that will explain it. The ultimate Jagger.
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Rank Stranger
To me it sounds like classic Clapton!
Anyway, a great song! Live AND studio!!
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Tumblin_Dice_07Quote
Rank Stranger
To me it sounds like classic Clapton!
Anyway, a great song! Live AND studio!!
I'm a guitarist. You may be too, I dunno. I'm also a Clapton fanatic. Taylor plays the solo, Clapton plays slide on this version. Can't prove it but I know it's true. After studying both these players, I can tell which is which.
I don't mean that in a smart ass way at all. I respect your opinion, I just disagree. Have a good one.
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Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
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MathijsQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
Aha, send your paycheck to me please. Clapton's slide is in standard tuning, you can tell by the licks on the high B and E string. And, Taylor's not on the Clapton version. It's Richards in the left channel, Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right, then Al Kooper on rhythm guitar in the right channel. Stu on piano, Bobby Keys sax, and of course Watts and Wyman.
The Clapton version can not originate from 1969 -it's December 18, 1970. The lead and backup vocals have clearly defined harmony equal to the official version, which they didn't figure out and record until April 1970, and this is also true for the sax solo.
Taylor of course is clearly audible on the official version, it's the tremelo picked rhythm guitar. All 18 other guitars are Richards.
And to state that the official version is boring as it lacks melody, well, that's just wonky to say....
Mathijs
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MathijsQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
Aha, send your paycheck to me please. Clapton's slide is in standard tuning, you can tell by the licks on the high B and E string. And, Taylor's not on the Clapton version. It's Richards in the left channel, Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right, then Al Kooper on rhythm guitar in the right channel. Stu on piano, Bobby Keys sax, and of course Watts and Wyman.
The Clapton version can not originate from 1969 -it's December 18, 1970. The lead and backup vocals have clearly defined harmony equal to the official version, which they didn't figure out and record until April 1970, and this is also true for the sax solo.
Taylor of course is clearly audible on the official version, it's the tremelo picked rhythm guitar. All 18 other guitars are Richards.
And to state that the official version is boring as it lacks melody, well, that's just wonky to say....
Mathijs
Quote
MathijsQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
Aha, send your paycheck to me please. Clapton's slide is in standard tuning, you can tell by the licks on the high B and E string. And, Taylor's not on the Clapton version. It's Richards in the left channel, Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right, then Al Kooper on rhythm guitar in the right channel. Stu on piano, Bobby Keys sax, and of course Watts and Wyman.
The Clapton version can not originate from 1969 -it's December 18, 1970. The lead and backup vocals have clearly defined harmony equal to the official version, which they didn't figure out and record until April 1970, and this is also true for the sax solo.
Taylor of course is clearly audible on the official version, it's the tremelo picked rhythm guitar. All 18 other guitars are Richards.
And to state that the official version is boring as it lacks melody, well, that's just wonky to say....
Mathijs
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MathijsQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
Aha, send your paycheck to me please. Clapton's slide is in standard tuning, you can tell by the licks on the high B and E string. And, Taylor's not on the Clapton version. It's Richards in the left channel, Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right, then Al Kooper on rhythm guitar in the right channel. Stu on piano, Bobby Keys sax, and of course Watts and Wyman.
The Clapton version can not originate from 1969 -it's December 18, 1970. The lead and backup vocals have clearly defined harmony equal to the official version, which they didn't figure out and record until April 1970, and this is also true for the sax solo.
Taylor of course is clearly audible on the official version, it's the tremelo picked rhythm guitar. All 18 other guitars are Richards.
And to state that the official version is boring as it lacks melody, well, that's just wonky to say....
Mathijs
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Mathijs
Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right
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71Tele
If the version that Clapton played on was a birthday party, isn't it unlikely Clapton would have done a second guitar as an overdub?
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MathijsQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07
To chime in on the discussion about the Clapton version......Clapton and Taylor are both playing. Clapton is playing slide, and I'll bet my next pay check he's in open tuning, most likely open G although maybe D or E. Clapton usually uses open tuning for slide and you can tell by the "sliding chords" he's using at times that it's an open tuning. He might have played a Fender. He does have a cleaner sound than Taylor on this track for sure but it most likely wasn't Clapton's guitar but one belonging to the Stones. Taylor plays the solo on this version. It's classic Mick T.
Aha, send your paycheck to me please. Clapton's slide is in standard tuning, you can tell by the licks on the high B and E string. And, Taylor's not on the Clapton version. It's Richards in the left channel, Clapton slide in the middle and lead (overdubbed) slightly to the right, then Al Kooper on rhythm guitar in the right channel. Stu on piano, Bobby Keys sax, and of course Watts and Wyman.
The Clapton version can not originate from 1969 -it's December 18, 1970. The lead and backup vocals have clearly defined harmony equal to the official version, which they didn't figure out and record until April 1970, and this is also true for the sax solo.
Taylor of course is clearly audible on the official version, it's the tremelo picked rhythm guitar. All 18 other guitars are Richards.
And to state that the official version is boring as it lacks melody, well, that's just wonky to say....
Mathijs
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07Quote
Rank Stranger
To me it sounds like classic Clapton!
Anyway, a great song! Live AND studio!!
I'm a guitarist. You may be too, I dunno. I'm also a Clapton fanatic. Taylor plays the solo, Clapton plays slide on this version. Can't prove it but I know it's true. After studying both these players, I can tell which is which.
I don't mean that in a smart ass way at all. I respect your opinion, I just disagree. Have a good one.
So please name one other song where Taylor takes this many stops. I can't come up with any, and I know it's part of Clapton's playing style.
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71Tele
If the version that Clapton played on was a birthday party, isn't it unlikely Clapton would have done a second guitar as an overdub?
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Tumblin_Dice_07Quote
71Tele
If the version that Clapton played on was a birthday party, isn't it unlikely Clapton would have done a second guitar as an overdub?
I would agree with you here, but after listening to it again several times, the lead does sound overdubbed. Of course it could just be the way it's mixed. It still sounds like Mick Taylor to me though, overdubbed or not.
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71TeleQuote
Tumblin_Dice_07Quote
71Tele
If the version that Clapton played on was a birthday party, isn't it unlikely Clapton would have done a second guitar as an overdub?
I would agree with you here, but after listening to it again several times, the lead does sound overdubbed. Of course it could just be the way it's mixed. It still sounds like Mick Taylor to me though, overdubbed or not.
The probable lack of an overdub is why I agree it's probably Taylor.