If any of our guitar experts could help me out, I would greatly appreciate it. I currently own three Strats, although I've probably owned ten or more over the years. I had a Classic Series '70's Strat which played nicely but the pickups weren't that great. I decided to either upgrade the pickups or trade the guitar in for another Strat with better pickups. In the end, I traded it for a Road Worn '50's Strat. Now I'll admit I'm not crazy about the whole "relic" idea. I'm not against it either, but the bottom line is that I bought the guitar because the Tex-Mex pickups that come in it were better than the stock pickups in my Classic Series '70's Strat.

Anyway, in the beginning I didn't like the smaller neck on the Road Worn '50's Strat. I considered getting rid of the guitar for awhile. But strangely enough, it's grown on me. I've been looking into buying another "'50's" Strat. Not a real one obviously but a reissue. The only one that I've been able to find with the 7.25 neck radius is the American Vintage '57 Reissue. Lovely guitar but it's also $1500.....

Well anyway, none of that is really material to my question....I was wondering if anybody knew exactly when Fender started using the larger neck radii on Strats? Most modern Strats have a 9.5 radius.

Even the Classic Player '50's Strat has a 9.5 radius. Infact, most of Fender's reissue's have the 9.5 radius, reguardless of the neck shape. Which makes me wonder if the smaller 7.25 radius is just extremely unpopular or if it was only used for a short period?

I don't think I have ever played a Strat with a 9.5 radius, only the 7.25s and these were either original '50s Strats or 50's reissues. You might try asking over on the Fender Forum: Fender Forum

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ChrisM
I don't think I have ever played a Strat with a 9.5 radius, only the 7.25s and these were either original '50s Strats or 50's reissues. You might try asking over on the Fender Forum: Fender Forum

Wow......so you've never played a modern Strat at all?

I'll check out the forum. I've looked online a couple of other places but haven't found out exactly when Fender make the neck radius bigger.

Well, I'm mostly I'm a Gibson guy. Although I have owned 3 Fenders, they have all been 50's reissues.

The 7.25 radius made it more difficult to bend a string before bottoming out before reaching the desired note. The 9.5 radious neck (flatter) is made for modern or post 50's style where beding a string is part of the rock style.

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Tumblin_Dice_07
I had a Classic Series '70's Strat which played nicely but the pickups weren't that great.

What don't you like about them?! I have a Mexican Classic '70's Strat and I think it sounds great.

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lsbz

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Tumblin_Dice_07
I had a Classic Series '70's Strat which played nicely but the pickups weren't that great.

What don't you like about them?! I have a Mexican Classic '70's Strat and I think it sounds great.

I don't think they sounded very good, particularly the bridge pickup. The neck and middle pickup were ok. It suffered in my opinion because I really wanted an American Special Strat with the Texas Special pickups. They were out of stock when I made the order and had to choose between a Classic '70's and Classic 50's (should have chose the later, don't care for the big headstock). So I ordered the '70's strat and before it came in, I found an American Special in a different store. So I bought the American Special and compared to the Texas Special pickups, the Classic '70's Strat pickups left something to be desired.

On top of that, I later bought an American Standard Strat and the pickups in the Classic '70's Strat didn't compare well.

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Tumblin_Dice_07

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lsbz

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Tumblin_Dice_07
I had a Classic Series '70's Strat which played nicely but the pickups weren't that great.

What don't you like about them?! I have a Mexican Classic '70's Strat and I think it sounds great.

I don't think they sounded very good, particularly the bridge pickup. The neck and middle pickup were ok.

Yes; I always keep it in between the neck and middle pickup. It's much a "one sound" guitar. But I think it has a great, heavy typical 70s rock sound. I can understand that you don't like bridge pickup

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lsbz


Yes; I always keep it in between the neck and middle pickup. It's much a "one sound" guitar. But I think it has a great, heavy typical 70s rock sound. I can understand that you don't like bridge pickup

Yeah it was mainly the bridge pickup that I didn't care for. The others were alright. I also read several reviews on Musician's Friend where other players had similar feelings about the bridge pickups. I did use the guitar to record some though before I got rid of it, mainly using the bridge and middle pickup in tandem.

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More Hot Rocks
The 7.25 radius made it more difficult to bend a string before bottoming out before reaching the desired note. The 9.5 radious neck (flatter) is made for modern or post 50's style where beding a string is part of the rock style.

Actually, I was just looking at Fender's website and all of their American Vintage guitars, from the '52 Tele on up to the 70's Strat all have the 7.25 radius. So apparently that wasn't changed until much later on.....

I got tired of supporting big business and just pieced together a tele to my specs... it was cheaper but won't have any resale value.

buy a neck from all parts or musikraft and just put it on the guitar you got...no need to be spending $1500

www.musikraft.com has a bunch of neck specs nut specs fret wire specs ect...


2 cents



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-06 07:46 by Damon.

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Damon
I got tired of supporting big business and just pieced together a tele to my specs... it was cheaper but won't have any resale value.

buy a neck from all parts or musikraft and just put it on the guitar you got...no need to be spending $1500

www.musikraft.com has a bunch of neck specs nut specs fret wire specs ect...


2 cents

Well I've thought about this myself. I've been looking through the Fender site more and all the American Vintage series and all the MIM Classic Series from the 50's through the 70's have 7.25 radii. But the Classic Player series, which are custom shop designed and have better pickups than the MIM Classic Series have larger, more modern radii. For example, the Classic Player 50's Strat has a 9.5 radius and the Classic Player 60's Strat has a '12 radius, both of which are obviously not accurate vintage specs.

I considered buying a neck from a separate vendor. I wanted to put a Strat neck on my Tele and I figured I would go this route for that project. But if a guitar came from the factory with a C-shaped neck with a 9.5 radius, is it possible to replace is with a V-shaped neck with a 7.25 radius?

yeah why not ? if you have all those guitars you could take the pups off the one you like and the neck and body ect...and make a frankenstrat



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-07 02:31 by Damon.

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Damon
yeah why not ? if you have all those guitars you could take the pups off the one you like and the neck and body ect...and make a frankenstrat

Right but I was just wondering if a guitar comes from the factory with a 9.5 radius neck and you want a 7.25 radius neck, will the smaller neck fit ok? It should as long as the flat part of the neck that joins the guitar is the same size on both necks.

I've switched necks on Strats before but never one with a different radius. As long as the end of the neck and the routed cavity in the body where the neck joins the body are all the same, then it shouldn't matter what the neck radius is, but I'm not sure if all those things are the same.

I don't know but good luck on it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-08 11:36 by Damon.

I did some research on this and it should work. The radius measurement is only referring to the fretboard anyway, not the neck. The neck's should all be about the same size. But as far as that goes, the 7.25 radius, although vintage correct, is actually a bit harder to play. I think it's the V-shape in the neck that feels so comfortable to me and you can find V-shape necks with larger radii.

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Tumblin_Dice_07

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Damon
yeah why not ? if you have all those guitars you could take the pups off the one you like and the neck and body ect...and make a frankenstrat

Right but I was just wondering if a guitar comes from the factory with a 9.5 radius neck and you want a 7.25 radius neck, will the smaller neck fit ok? It should as long as the flat part of the neck that joins the guitar is the same size on both necks.

I've switched necks on Strats before but never one with a different radius. As long as the end of the neck and the routed cavity in the body where the neck joins the body are all the same, then it shouldn't matter what the neck radius is, but I'm not sure if all those things are the same.

All neck butts are the same size, and switching necks on a body is no problem at all, as long as the neck is Fender licensed.

The size and shape of the neck is designated by the size, shape and radius. The size is A, B, C,or D, with A being pencil-like and D being boat-neck. The shape being C, D, or V, and then the radius, with ranges from 7.25" to 12". Then there's compund necks -starting with 7.25" or 9.5" radius at the nut to 12" at the 12th fret.

In general, C and D size, V-shaped 7.25" radius is vintage 50's, and has some inherent problems like fretting out and more difficult to play in-tune chords. 9.5" makes fretting chords a bit easier, and it won't fret out at fret positions higher than 12. 12" boards with C or D sized necks are vintage, but feel more solid and easier to play (Gibson Les Paul and ES), and 12", A-size, flat C-shaped necks are shredder boards, enabling encredible high speeds, but you need very good technique. To note: many players from the 80's doing these neck-breaking speed tricks now suffer from muscle and ligament problems due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck.

Any preference is purely personal, but most players seem to prefer a B-size, C-shaped, 9"/9.5" radius neck. These are, in general, the most comfortable to play for most players.

Wood prefers C- and D-shaped necks with 7.25" radius, Richards C-shaped necks with 12" radius for standard tuning, and with 7.25" radius for open G.

Mathijs

Cool...........thanks for the input Mathijs. I think what I prefer about the neck of the Road Worn 50's Strat is the shape and not the radius. I've had problems with the intonation, which my luthier blames on the 7.25 radius, and also it's tough to get much vibrato on either E string because they will slip off the fretboard if my vibrato is very wide.

But it's more of a question of what I'm used to playing. I had always played Strats that had the modern C-shape and a 9.5 radius until I bought that Road Worn and at first I didn't like the neck on the Road Worn very much. But after playing it awhile I started to get used to it. It just depends on what I play the most. I also have an American Standard and a MIM Standard that I upgraded with Vintage Noiseless pickups and if I get used to playing them and then go back to the Road Worn, I find it hard to play again.

I think next time I'll go for a Classic Player 50's Strat. It's got the V-shaped neck with a 9.5 radius.

<To note: flat C-shaped necks are shredder boards, enabling encredible high speeds, many players from the 80's doing these neck-breaking speed tricks now suffer from muscle and ligament problems due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck.> Mathijs


Players like Gambale, Shawn Lane (†) Vai or Satriani (not that I like V&S that much) even play
"Ferrari" on an old acoustic.

Playing the shred guitars is quite luxury, cause they are a relief to play. Injuries caused due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck is utter bullshit, cause fast shredding requires a great technique anyway in the first place,
regardless which guitar you play on.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-12 00:40 by Amsterdamned.

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Amsterdamned

Playing the shred guitars is quite luxury, cause they are a relief to play. Injuries caused due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck is utter bullshit, cause fast shredding requires a great technique anyway in the first place,
regardless which guitar you play on.

As usual you have no clue what you are talking about. Adrian Vandeburg, Eddie van Halen, Paul Gilbert, Chris Impellitteri, Joe Stump and john Petrucci all had to adjust playing technique and instrument specs after they experienced stress syndroms to the muscles and ligaments of the fretting hand and arm. Vandenburg is unable to play at all on a decent level these days. All these players changed from 80's necks to more standard specs, and adjusted fretting technique.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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Amsterdamned

Playing the shred guitars is quite luxury, cause they are a relief to play. Injuries caused due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck is utter bullshit, cause fast shredding requires a great technique anyway in the first place,
regardless which guitar you play on.

As usual you have no clue what you are talking about. Adrian Vandeburg, Eddie van Halen, Paul Gilbert, Chris Impellitteri, Joe Stump and john Petrucci all had to adjust playing technique and instrument specs after they experienced stress syndroms to the muscles and ligaments of the fretting hand and arm. Vandenburg is unable to play at all on a decent level these days. All these players changed from 80's necks to more standard specs, and adjusted fretting technique.

Mathijs

I do know what I'am talking about. 10000000000 of shred players don't have stress injuries,so the one that have are in the minority by far,or doing something wrong anyway..
.
For starters, Vandeburg, Petrucci and van Halen are no shred players,they are fast Rockers.

Second,when playing under stress situations, you can get stress syndromes,just like people doing computer work all day.That explains more imo.


Third,competent shred players like Gambale,Holdsworth and Lane never had any problems.
These people are also known as relaxed personalities btw.

Fourth:Vandenburg is unable to play at all on a decent level these days.<Mathijs>

Yes,a wrist injury,due to a car accident,somewhere at the end of the 8-tees.
Steve Vai did Vandeburg's job,he had never any problems as I told in my previous post.

With all respect for Patrucci,seeing his fingering type,I get pain in my wrist.




My guess is that you don't like shred guitars, but like Fenders and Gibsons more.
Get that chip off your shoulder.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-12 20:23 by Amsterdamned.

Amsterdamned:

<For starters, Vandeburg, Petrucci and van Halen are no shred players,they are fast Rockers.>

Eddie Van Halen is not a shred player??

He was one of the guys defining shred playing:

<GuitarPlayer.com's article "Blast Into Hyperspace With The Otherworldly Power Of Shred" reviews the book Shred! and states that the pioneers were "Eddie Van Halen, Al Di Meola, and Ritchie Blackmore; iconic ’80s players like Yngwie Malmsteen, Dave Mustaine, Marty Friedman, Kirk Hammett, Vernon Reid, Jason Becker, Steve Vai, Tony MacAlpine, Walter Giardino, George Lynch, and Randy Rhoads; and contemporary guitarists like Gaspar Muntwyler or Dimebag Darrell."

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DandelionPowderman
Amsterdamned:

<For starters, Vandeburg, Petrucci and van Halen are no shred players,they are fast Rockers.>

Eddie Van Halen is not a shred player??

He was one of the guys defining shred playing:

<GuitarPlayer.com's article "Blast Into Hyperspace With The Otherworldly Power Of Shred" reviews the book Shred! and states that the pioneers were "Eddie Van Halen, Al Di Meola, and Ritchie Blackmore; iconic ’80s players like Yngwie Malmsteen, Dave Mustaine, Marty Friedman, Kirk Hammett, Vernon Reid, Jason Becker, Steve Vai, Tony MacAlpine, Walter Giardino, George Lynch, and Randy Rhoads; and contemporary guitarists like Gaspar Muntwyler or Dimebag Darrell."

Yup,get your point. Shredders to me are players that go 240 KM an hour taking sharp edges,not just driving straight ahead.



It's not the amount of notes,but the story they tell at the same speed that makes the difference to me.There's a clip floating on youtube, van Halen jamming with Holdsworth.
If you can trace it, you know what I mean. I like van Halen btw,he's great.
Btw,Django was the pioneer to me. Try him..
.
The shred neck story seems garbage to me.
I'm curious about your opinion?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-12 21:23 by Amsterdamned.

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Amsterdamned

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Mathijs

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Amsterdamned

Playing the shred guitars is quite luxury, cause they are a relief to play. Injuries caused due to the flatness of the board and thinness of the neck is utter bullshit, cause fast shredding requires a great technique anyway in the first place,
regardless which guitar you play on.

As usual you have no clue what you are talking about. Adrian Vandeburg, Eddie van Halen, Paul Gilbert, Chris Impellitteri, Joe Stump and john Petrucci all had to adjust playing technique and instrument specs after they experienced stress syndroms to the muscles and ligaments of the fretting hand and arm. Vandenburg is unable to play at all on a decent level these days. All these players changed from 80's necks to more standard specs, and adjusted fretting technique.

Mathijs

I do know what I'am talking about. 10000000000 of shred players don't have stress injuries,so the one that have are in the minority by far,or doing something wrong anyway..
.
For starters, Vandeburg, Petrucci and van Halen are no shred players,they are fast Rockers.

Second,when playing under stress situations, you can get stress syndromes,just like people doing computer work all day.That explains more imo.


Third,competent shred players like Gambale,Holdsworth and Lane never had any problems.
These people are also known as relaxed personalities btw.

Fourth:Vandenburg is unable to play at all on a decent level these days.<Mathijs>

Yes,a wrist injury,due to a car accident,somewhere at the end of the 8-tees.
Steve Vai did Vandeburg's job,he had never any problems as I told in my previous post.

With all respect for Patrucci,seeing his fingering type,I get pain in my wrist.




My guess is that you don't like shred guitars, but like Fenders and Gibsons more.
Get that chip off your shoulder.

I don't care about your definition of a shredder. It is generally known, and much talked about in the world of electric guitar that rehearsing for 10 to 12 hours per day on a skinny neck with 12" boards does put too much strain on wrist, fingers and lower arm.

I am not a shredder, nor do I like the style. But my remark was factual, not my opinion.

Mathijs

Rehearsing for 10/12 hours a day on any instrument over a long period puts too much strain,on lips lungs,wrist and shoulders etc
Trumpet,Sax, Guitar,it's well known in music world.
Some get problems, most don't.

Your factual remark about the 12" boards adds nothing to this common knowledge.
Most 12" shredders have no problems.


That's factual too,not my opinion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-12-13 00:00 by Amsterdamned.

get one of those scalloped fret boards like that Yingy dude

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Damon
get one of those scalloped fret boards like that Yingy dude

No wrist injuries? That looks too flat mate.

Anyway, back to the Strats.......question for Mathijs or anybody else that has expirience with these instruments.....have you played or owned a Fender American Vintage '57 Strat or a Classic Player '50's Strat? Anybody that has, any feedback would be appreciated.


One of those two will be the next Strat I buy, just haven't decided which one yet. They have the same pickups. The Classic Player 50's is made in Mexico and has a V-shape neck with a 9.5 radius. The American Vintage '57 Strat is obviously made in America and has the V-shaped neck with a 7.25 radius. Of course the American Vintage costs about twice as much.......anyway, like I said, anybody with any expirience with either instrument, please chime in.

I played the mexican strat it was super light and spanky I loved it and it was cheaper than the American... there is nothing wrong with those mexican guitars
swap the pups if need be...I don't mind poly paint either.

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Amsterdamned

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DandelionPowderman
Amsterdamned:

<For starters, Vandeburg, Petrucci and van Halen are no shred players,they are fast Rockers.>

Eddie Van Halen is not a shred player??

He was one of the guys defining shred playing:

<GuitarPlayer.com's article "Blast Into Hyperspace With The Otherworldly Power Of Shred" reviews the book Shred! and states that the pioneers were "Eddie Van Halen, Al Di Meola, and Ritchie Blackmore; iconic ’80s players like Yngwie Malmsteen, Dave Mustaine, Marty Friedman, Kirk Hammett, Vernon Reid, Jason Becker, Steve Vai, Tony MacAlpine, Walter Giardino, George Lynch, and Randy Rhoads; and contemporary guitarists like Gaspar Muntwyler or Dimebag Darrell."

Yup,get your point. Shredders to me are players that go 240 KM an hour taking sharp edges,not just driving straight ahead.



It's not the amount of notes,but the story they tell at the same speed that makes the difference to me.There's a clip floating on youtube, van Halen jamming with Holdsworth.
If you can trace it, you know what I mean. I like van Halen btw,he's great.
Btw,Django was the pioneer to me. Try him..
.
The shred neck story seems garbage to me.
I'm curious about your opinion?

Ha ha, I "tried" Django 20 years ago His albums are still some of the dearest I possess. The rest of the "shreds" I generally steer clear of.

I'm not a very big fan of Eddie Van Halen, to put it mildly. He's got nothing to tell me. Still, he is regarded as one of the pioneers. Too bad what he pioneered, imo, started to ruin rock'n'roll and taste as far as guitar playing goes.