...I guess it was wise to put the buxom blondes up front....I see footage from the first night where it looked like there were less girls up front...but more regular people...dunno if they were fans even. But they stood there like @#$%& duds. Like bumps on a log. Not even moving, clapping or looking alive. Some guy just stood there and stuck out like a sore thumb.

WTF?

You're in a freakin' Rolling Stones concert...1st row...being filmed Scorcese and they barely can keep awake? You can even see people in the audience who are not up front and they're just standing there...hands in pockets. C'mon!

Scorcese, if anything, should have said....let's put up real..but HOT Stones fans up front but either way....dance and move like hell. It is always better to see a real fan enjoying themselves rather than a model.

Just watch it on IMAX ya can't even see 'em down the bottom....
But me fave is still the 5th in on Keeeeeeef's side....One smokin' doll



ROCKMAN

i know i'm totally in a minority here, but i do get why they hired actors for those spots -
a major part of the job was to get out of the freakin way of the cameras, pronto, whenever necessary,
and i don't know if many fans would be good at that part of it in a front-row theatre-show scenario.

they did of course hire some real fans, recruiting them through the shiboodbee site,
but in the heat of the fray being paid $75 wouldn't do much to keep me from getting lost in the rock & roll
and completely ignoring orders from camerapeople - i mean i'd probably deck anyone who tried to dislodge me.

anyway Scorsese films normally have hired actors in them, so this is no surprise.
the foolish part is the way the hired actors look, but i guess it's another deliberate touch of blatant fakeness
(there's a lot of that in the film.) the cool part is that normal fans were allowed to buy tickets and attend a film shoot.

Agreed. It may look fake, but it's nicer to watch scantily clad young women with trimmed bodies and Gucci bags up front rather than real fans with vintage Stones tee shirts and beer bellies shouting "whoo whoo, whoo whoo". Jaggger seems to like the idea of being surrounded by young and beautiful models/people. Don't forget about the hired Dutch models on the intro for the Twickenham show on Four Flicks.

I have to agree. I'd rather have "true" stones fans up front there but... alive and awake. Though we must remember it was mainly a set, it's not the bautiful ladies with gucci bags the problem at all, but the people on the back rows (dont know if they were fans or "fans", yet most of them (not all of them) were embarassingly still and deadlike if you consider the performance. Mick had to work his butt out even on the yeah yeah yeah whooo part of bs in the end...

and, to be honest, i dont think the problem is the extras not knowing the songs because, as we see, the pretty ladies at least claps and have their arms waving up in the air not in their pockets

dont get me wrong but i think is something about the american audience because i've seen same attitude in other footage

Imagine the same concert set in a theatre in italy or anywhere in europe... the roof would have blown off (not to mention buenos aires...)

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The Stones
Agreed. It may look fake, but it's nicer to watch scantily clad young women with trimmed bodies and Gucci bags up front rather than real fans with vintage Stones tee shirts and beer bellies shouting "whoo whoo, whoo whoo". Jaggger seems to like the idea of being surrounded by young and beautiful models/people. Don't forget about the hired Dutch models on the intro for the Twickenham show on Four Flicks.

amen. dont want to see the fat old ugly slobs that are always in the front lol

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Slick

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The Stones
Agreed. It may look fake, but it's nicer to watch scantily clad young women with trimmed bodies and Gucci bags up front rather than real fans with vintage Stones tee shirts and beer bellies shouting "whoo whoo, whoo whoo". Jaggger seems to like the idea of being surrounded by young and beautiful models/people. Don't forget about the hired Dutch models on the intro for the Twickenham show on Four Flicks.

amen. dont want to see the fat old ugly slobs that are always in the front lol

So you think that R'n'R is just for models (male/female) with trimmed bodies.
Poor girl/boy!!!!

Rock'n'Roll is first of all Music and that comes from and goes to your heart, no matter how you look or how old you are.
Performers aren't allways beauties either.
Just have a look at the beloved Mick Taylor.

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Roadster32
Just have a look at the beloved Mick Taylor.

Or the beloved Keith Richards.....

If we go by beautifull looking,young and in great shape,then The Stones should not be playing,l rather have a 50 or 60 yearl old person actually enjoying the music than those bimbos, whom probably hate the music ,("is not electronic enough for them)out front...But I guess i am in the minority here.
Anyway,it seems fake to me ,and yes I know is Martin S film,but compare to Gimme Shelter the MSG shots were of real fans and it rocked,

"No dope smoking no beer sold after 12 o'clock"

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The Stones

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Roadster32
Just have a look at the beloved Mick Taylor.

Or the beloved Keith Richards.....

or the beloved lisa fischer.....

what footage of first night ?

It's the same concept of the Super bowl halftime show. OK you're hired. now jump around and clap. You see it at every super bowl show. I agree with Justin. I remember being at the Hearshy park ABB show in the 11th row. There was a teenage girl with her Mom that sat on the side of me. She got up for the first two songs then sat down with her head in her hands for the rest of the show. Just missarable. never clapped never looked up, never moved. Her mother just wasted $400.

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with sssoul
i know i'm totally in a minority here, but i do get why they hired actors for those spots -
a major part of the job was to get out of the freakin way of the cameras, pronto, whenever necessary,
and i don't know if many fans would be good at that part of it in a front-row theatre-show scenario.

they did of course hire some real fans, recruiting them through the shiboodbee site,
but in the heat of the fray being paid $75 wouldn't do much to keep me from getting lost in the rock & roll
and completely ignoring orders from camerapeople - i mean i'd probably deck anyone who tried to dislodge me.

anyway Scorsese films normally have hired actors in them, so this is no surprise.
the foolish part is the way the hired actors look, but i guess it's another deliberate touch of blatant fakeness
(there's a lot of that in the film.) the cool part is that normal fans were allowed to buy tickets and attend a film shoot.

You cant compare a documentary to the likes of Mean Streets or GoodFellas. Its supposed to reflect reality, so 'hiring' actors defeats the purpose. Scorsese has directed other music films before - did he hire extras to stand in the crowd at The Last Waltz? I doubt it.

Don't care how attractive they were. It gave a false impression of what a Stones show is like. And as for their ability to 'act' like an audience - the impression I got was many of them knew about 2 or 3 songs and there's several moments in the film where the shot of the band onstage is partially blocked by a few airheads holding their cellphones above their heads to get a low-res pic that they can show to their friends. Its pretty hard to clap when youre doing that. Christ almighty, when giving them all these instructions on what to do and what not to do at whats supposed to be a rock concert, couldnt Scorsese's people have asked them to leave their phones in their handbags?

I think they should have filled the whole audience with eye candy, not just the front row. If we have to have audience shots they should be of people you want to see - not grissly old people who think they have a right to be there because they bought a Stones single in 1964.

speaking of this... I think on the Austin ABB show there are WAY to many audience shots. To the point where I feel like Im watching an infomercial for the Biggest Bang. Even though the audience for shine a light that is up in front may be hired at least they don't take up half of the footage.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-03 18:15 by ryanpow.

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Gazza
You cant compare a documentary to the likes of Mean Streets or GoodFellas. Its supposed to reflect reality . . .

That's a very simplistic view of the documentary genre. From Triumph of The Will to the latest Errol Morris documentary, you'll find that this genre is all about "the creative treatment of actuality" (John Grierson, First Principles of Documentary).

Do even the slightest bit of research into that great documentary, Nanook of the North, and you'll quickly see what I mean: "reality" has been staged since the genre came into being. In that regard, Marty is simply following in the tradition of those that came before him.

Take even an offensive and banal show like Cops, seemingly a reality-based documentary, but where they shoot 100 hours of tape to create a 22 minute episode. If anyone were to posit that this show or any other show that has a shooting ratio of that magnitude reflects reality, then I'd ask what reality it is that we're even talking about.

In brief, the notion that documentaries are "supposed" to reflect reality suggests more about a naive view of film than anything like a realizable film theory around documentary.

Besides, if you were a member of The Rolling Stones and you've lived a Some Girls existence for the last 40 years of your life, perhaps your reality is somewhat different than that of the average concertgoer and does involve only seeing babes in the first five rows.

As they say, perception is reality.

Babes in the front row. IT should be the law.

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camper88
Besides, if you were a member of The Rolling Stones and you've lived a Some Girls existence for the last 40 years of your life, perhaps your reality is somewhat different than that of the average concertgoer and does involve only seeing babes in the first five rows.

Wouldnt think so. These days its the richest fans in the front rows or else the sort of fans who follow them around the globe.

And they're generally NOT nubile blondes.

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Gazza

Wouldnt think so. These days its the richest fans in the front rows or else the sort of fans who follow them around the globe.

And they're generally NOT nubile blondes.

Gazza, I'm not asking what it is, I'm asking what you'd perceive (if you were close to the dog's tail of over 40 years of a Some Girls life).

and let's not forget, Gazza honey, that the concerts themselves were not "normal reality" -
they took place expressly for the purposes of making the film. it's only partly a documentary,
and what it's documenting isn't a Stones concert, it's documenting Scorsese making a movie of a Stones show.
it's full of fictionalized moments, and blatant signals that ceci n'est-pas une Stones concert,
and i regard the ultra-fake-looking actors decorating the front rows as part of that.

i personally think they overdid the fakey look, but filmmakers often overdo things, don't they.
still, it doesn't surprise me that they hired people. it's a movie. that's the way movies are made.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-03 19:47 by with sssoul.

I think it should have been taken a step further and if you are going to use gorgeous bimbos and create an artificial scenario, you might has well have them be completely nude and see how long Mick could have stayed focused! That would have been one hell of a extra feature on the DVD. Rocks Off indeed!

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Gazza
there's several moments in the film where the shot of the band onstage is partially blocked by a few airheads holding their cellphones above their heads to get a low-res pic that they can show to their friends. Its pretty hard to clap when youre doing that. Christ almighty, when giving them all these instructions on what to do and what not to do at whats supposed to be a rock concert, couldnt Scorsese's people have asked them to leave their phones in their handbags?

This did provide one of my favorite moments, though. I think it's during Shattered that someone holds up a cell, and Mick seems to stop and pose for a few additional seconds. It was probably staged, but still looked cool.

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More Hot Rocks
I remember being at the Hearshy park ABB show in the 11th row. There was a teenage girl with her Mom that sat on the side of me. She got up for the first two songs then sat down with her head in her hands for the rest of the show. Just missarable.

I'm always surprised by how many people have little to no reaction at the concerts- even in the first couple of rows. The reality of a Stones show is that most of the people only come alive when it's a song they know (ie. warhorse).

I love to see women wear Stones shirts!

Having been there in the theater the second night, and hanging out around it the first, and having heard a few accounts from the "extras", some of whom were real fans, I still think the audience scenes were mishandled. Okay, maybe sprinkle in a few of the models, if needed for eye-candy. But I still think they should have let the real fans sit in the front. From what I understand, there were the select number of real fans who were even attractive enough by movie-maker eyes to be placed near the front and more who were nice-looking but perhaps considered a bit "old" who were moved to other locations.

It's quite clear to me, especially watching at home, that these models did not know the songs, on the whole. Random arm-waving is better than nothing, sure.

with sssoul, I believe us fans could have been restrained to act however the directors and production people wanted. Some of them were. There were at least two "rehearsals", lengthy sheets of direction and strong control of the audience. Since there were more fans signed up for another night of filming that was canceled, and many more waiting around the theater in front and back with tickets and without, it was a situation where you could be thrown out quite easily wih hordes waiting to take your place if needed.

A few here know a lot more about the process because they are both real fans and extras in the film.

In a sad way, it's perfect. Fake fans,fake emotions, Marty fake when asking for setlist, fake guitar players. See the man behind the curtain.

I'm not in a happy Stones mood today. Their live shows are quite a bore.

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Sir Craven of Cottage
I think they should have filled the whole audience with eye candy, not just the front row. If we have to have audience shots they should be of people you want to see - not grissly old people who think they have a right to be there because they bought a Stones single in 1964.
Babes in the front row. IT should be the law.

Seems you like to provoke people here.
Not an adequate behaviour for a "Sir", honestly I doubt you are.

>> with sssoul, I believe us fans could have been restrained to act however the directors and production people wanted. <<

sure, i reckon some would (i wouldn't). i'm not saying i think it was a cool thing to do,
i'm simply saying i feel i understand it - it's the kind of thing i expect from filmmakers.
i also imagine they considered not having any tickets available to the public at all,
since it was a film shoot, not a concert, and i bet it was the band who vetoed that.

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Gazza

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camper88
Besides, if you were a member of The Rolling Stones and you've lived a Some Girls existence for the last 40 years of your life, perhaps your reality is somewhat different than that of the average concertgoer and does involve only seeing babes in the first five rows.

Wouldnt think so. These days its the richest fans in the front rows or else the sort of fans who follow them around the globe.

And they're generally NOT nubile blondes.

I wouldn't blame the rich, btw. what is rich?, to be in the first rows. The ones who set the ticket prices are to blame.

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with sssoul
and let's not forget, Gazza honey, that the concerts themselves were not "normal reality" -
they took place expressly for the purposes of making the film. it's only partly a documentary,
and what it's documenting isn't a Stones concert, it's documenting Scorsese making a movie of a Stones show.
it's full of fictionalized moments, and blatant signals that ceci n'est-pas une Stones concert,
and i regard the ultra-fake-looking actors decorating the front rows as part of that.

i personally think they overdid the fakey look, but filmmakers often overdo things, don't they.
still, it doesn't surprise me that they hired people. it's a movie. that's the way movies are made.

Its a combination of both a concert AND a documentary. If we're going to take the 'its not really a Stones concert' adage to that extreme, then they may as well have gone the whole hog and got actors to play the Stones as well.

Where was it full of 'fictionalised moments' ?

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camper88

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Gazza

Wouldnt think so. These days its the richest fans in the front rows or else the sort of fans who follow them around the globe.

And they're generally NOT nubile blondes.

Gazza, I'm not asking what it is, I'm asking what you'd perceive (if you were close to the dog's tail of over 40 years of a Some Girls life).

Im not so sure, camper. The Stones are definitely aware its the same people down front most nights - Mick even said so on the final night of the tour in London.

Good to see you back here again btw - you seem to have been AWOL for quite a while.