Happy Thanksgiving to all who celebrate, and just wondering what traditions you and your family observe on this day of feast and football.

I usually go to my brothers house for dinner and then stop by to see my mother. In between football games we usually have Turkey, Lasagna, Ham, mashed potatoes, homemade stuffing, yams, cornbread, Italian bread, salad, rice and beans (my wife's side, I hate it) corn, olives, pickles, gravy, and yes dessert.

Did I forget anything?

I hosted Thanksgiving for about 10 years. but as the extended family grows, that hat has been passed, however I still cook the turkey (at least one of them) for the occasion. My tradition is getting up at a certain time in the morning and starting my preparation, and quite honestly, since L.A. has not had a pro-football team, I sort of lost interest in the sport.

it's my least favorite holiday - i hate a day that focuses so much on killing turkeys. try a tofurkey.

Best wishes to all our american friends, on your special day.

enjoy and have fun.

Can someone explain ... what actually IS being celebrated on thanksgiving day ? Is it something to do with a harvest, and has its origins in days gone by ... ?

yeh basically it's nice cause familes get together and all that...
the Native Americans taught the Pilgrims agriculture and many other survival essentials and in the spirit of the these great feasts a holiday was born.

then the white man genocided hundreds of tribes and hundreds of thousands of men, women and children with small pox blankets, (sorta like that antrhax scare when they mailed it to media outlets and certain senators...nothing new under the sun, shakespeare would agree i'm sure)

...herding them up and destroying them; ridiculing and debasing these diverse and ancient and beautifully evolved cultures....
....the ancient terror tactics...still workin' great...terrorists!!! savages!!!! UNBELIEVERS!!! Godless savages!!! KILL KILL KILL...
sorta like the cheerleaders at the various football games today...
or the self righteous politicans in the parades...taking a morning off from sex crimes to walk up in the avenue in a two thousand dollar suit waving to the prolies...

domestic terrorism and sleight of hand; mix with patriotic fervor and you got yourself some potential bux and that's what's it's all about.

outright murders were encoureaged by the government in the name of homeland security or whatever marketing approach to justify creating businesses and development...how different things are today, what with gitmo here and habeous corpus dead as a doornail.

; 'manifest destiny' as declared by the government..."Free land" just take it bubba!!!!) all legal...

...white men scalping white men and creating an evil fear myth about the red man's savagery etc....u know, pretty much the same stuff that still goes on with 'foreign policy' (greed for the empowered who control 'reallity' in the name of heinous crimes against nature...) but let's call if 'foreign policy' and be polite.
or maybe it's man's nature to be greedy and savage and murderous and deceitful ...i dunno...not a philosopher.....i guess it's just the early stages of the 'real' estate business...build a trancontinental railroad...sucker people into 'towns' that were really literally facades...develop...sow the seeds for the industrial revolution...
where's the pistols when you need them?
aaah, right where they should be...sounds good i tell ya...

all that conquerer stuff that all warlords go thru in every country pretty much, somewhere in their history. let's face it, if you're connected, the money is FABULOUS...and that's what everybody really worships...i mean they literally run out of bullets these days...bullet factories very good business...especially if you can outsource the labor...anyway, that's all no bid entitlements to murder to insdier companies owned by the warlords, like blackwater and halliburton, (and other criminal enterprises where the board of directors reads like a 'who's who' of ex presidents and high placed politicans...
meanwhile, that's four years of UNMETERED stolen oil; hundreds of millions of dollars a day, thru dubai and kuwait and other yank finance satellites...into PRIVATE pockets of PRIVATE businesses and connected PRIVATE Citizens...
the rest; lies and bullshit 24 hours a day on the ridiculous commericial 'news' outlets they allow broadcast monopoly licenses to...

ah, happy days. happy days.

and secret mercenary armies and the such...ah, happy thanksiving everyone...
don't it bring you the warm fuzzies...

tho it's nice that people who love each other and familes do reach out in the spirit of harvest generosity and love, as hundred of butchered and destroyed and surprsigingly sophisticated cultures....who were systematcially destroyed, did reach out to the hopeless Europeans in the new land, loving them, teaching them, nurturing them, feeding them, caring for them...
broken treaties became de rigeur, and what a lovely tradition and alla that...

...but what a hideous murderous genocidal savage greed that killed the purveryors of all this love and harvest feasting, may God rest, and bless their souls.

i'm gonna go to the movies and see the "i'm not there" and celebrate that way, with a lot of dylan tunes and a most interesting conceptural approach and vision for a movie...

people will say happy thanksgiving and please come over and join my dysfunctional family and forced family dynamics let's get drunk and stupid and grossly over fed. aahhh, i love it. tho the retail outlets are salivating; as it's the official opening of the retail season to celebrate an ancient pagan holiday that they transmogrified the great healer's sermon on the mount into grand hopes of maerketing ephiphany. no i'm not bitter and farting in church. do your own research iffin u don't belive me...

i'll be at the movies...ah, love the holidays...happy holocaust day.
been looking forward to this dylan movie.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-11-22 14:36 by Beelyboy.

i bet you wished you hadn't asked now, Pauly

aww, Adrian, i'm sorry i didn't fall in the proper line with the proper exepected response. i'll try to do better...

i like this one of banquet; in the holiday spirit...

SALT OF THE EARTH
M. Jagger/K. Richards)

Let's drink to the hard working people
Let's drink to the lowly of birth
Raise your glass to the good and the evil
Let's drink to the salt of the earth

Say a prayer for the common foot soldier
Spare a thought for his back breaking work
Say a prayer for his wife and his children
Who burn the fires and who still till the earth

And when I search a faceless crowd
A swirling mass of gray and black and white
They don't look real to me
In fact, they look so strange

Raise your glass to the hard working people
Let's drink to the uncounted heads
Let's think of the wavering millions
Who need leaders but get gamblers instead

Spare a thought for the stay-at-home voter
His empty eyes gaze at strange beauty shows
And a parade of the gray suited grafters
A choice of cancer or polio

Let's drink to the hard working people
Let's think of the lowly of birth
Spare a thought for the rag taggy people
Let's drink to the salt of the earth

Let's drink to the hard working people
Let's drink to the salt of the earth
Let's drink to the two thousand million
Let's think of the humble of birth

Lets raise our drink
To the salt of the earth
Lets raise our drink
To the salt of the earth...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-11-22 14:27 by Beelyboy.

great song.
saw the 'boys' perform it live, in 2003

have a great time today.

The Sicilian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Happy Thanksgiving to all who celebrate, and just
> wondering what traditions you and your family
> observe on this day of feast and football.
>
> I usually go to my brothers house for dinner and
> then stop by to see my mother. In between
> football games we usually have Turkey, Lasagna,
> Ham, mashed potatoes, homemade stuffing, yams,
> cornbread, Italian bread, salad, rice and beans
> (my wife's side, I hate it) corn, olives, pickles,
> gravy, and yes dessert.
>
> Did I forget anything?


Wow sounds like 5 meals! you are making me hungry lol

I'm in Atlanta right now, going to have the traditional
meal with family a bit later today.

Anyone remember Mick's turkey day joke from a couple of years ago?
If the Pilgrims had killed a cat, we would be eating pussy today!

does sound great; and to mitigate some of what could be seen as cynicism in my above post, it is also quite nice to have a national holiday where some people get a four day weekend...and make extra efforts to get together with their loved ones and often there is a true spirit of charity and joyous giving that goes along with it; and it's an important family tradition for a lot of people...
and i think it's fair to say that the original spirit of the original feasts, before the instutionalized racism and land-grabs, and genocide and casual destruction of natural resources of many animal species...

uhhh, before that...i think the original Pilgrim familes in jeopardy were truly very grateful and the harvest celebration between them was probably quite profound...

the fashions were layered and cool; the stones were on the legendarly 1792 tour within a century or so...(only a few minutes in lestat, or keith, time.)

the airports and roads will be jammed etc...as people make extra effort, sort of like Christmas time, to get together with friends and family and so on...

but aside from my opines and observations this source is kinda fun in an explanatory way for my dear UK and Euro friends who were kind enough to inquire:
__________________________________________
by Bill Petro

HISTORY OF THANKSGIVING
The origin of Thanksgiving Day has been attributed to a harvest feast held by the Plymouth Colony, although such celebrations date from ancient times. In 1621, Governor William Bradford of the Plymouth Colony proclaimed a day of "thanksgiving" and prayer to celebrate the Pilgrims' first harvest in America. The picture you usually see of a few Native American men joining the Pilgrims at the feast is a bit inaccurate however. From original settler Edward Winslow in a letter to a friend in 1621 we know that some 90 men accompanied the Wampanoag Chief Massasoit to visit at Plymouth for three days of fish, foul, and venison. But of the roughly 100 English settlers who had spent their first year on the Massachusetts coast, about half had died by this time. This would have left about half the 52 survivors as English men. So the Native men outnumbered the Pilgrim men by over three to one!

The idea of a day set apart to celebrate the completion of the harvest and to render homage to the Spirit who caused the fruits and crops to grow is both ancient and universal. The practice of designating a day of thanksgiving for specific spiritual or secular benefits has been followed in many countries.

One of the first general proclamations was made in Charlestown, Massachusetts in 1676. President George Washington in 1789 issued the first presidential thanksgiving proclamation in honor of the new constitution. During the 19th century an increasing number of states observed the day annually, each appointing its own day. President Abraham Lincoln, on October 3, 1863, by presidential proclamation appointed the last Thursday of November as Thanksgiving Day, due to the unremitting efforts of Sarah J. Hale, editor of Godey's Lady's Book.

Each succeeding president made similar proclamations until Franklin D. Roosevelt, in 1939 appointed the third Thursday of November, primarily to allow a special holiday weekend for national public holiday. This was changed two years later by both congress and the President to the fourth Thursday of November. Thanksgiving Day remains a day when many express gratitude to God for blessings and celebrate material bounty.

Bill Petro, your friendly neighborhood historian
[www.billpetro.com]
__________________________________________________________

Thanksgiving Day, 1976. Marched in the Macy's Day parade (I was 16), went to the hotel room to watch OJ Simpson (yes, THAT OJ Simpson) break the NFL single game rushing record, then saw the Beach Boys (yes, THOSE Beach Boys) at Madison Square Garden in the evening.

Best stuffing recipe found here

www.whitecastle.com

Happy Turkey day all-

John

A follow-up to the excellent post by beelyboy (SOE):

Happy Thanksgiving to all.

And nice job with Salt of the Earth.

Thanksgiving has always been my favorite holiday because in my family it has been the opportunity for the family to get together without having to buy presents. It always felt more real.

rocks off ...


what makes this Thanksgiving even more interesting is the fact that Detroit actually has a good football team LOL!!!!!!! Led Zepplin, Bruce, and Stones touring the US in 2008 ..who would have thunk?

You're right...I am going to watch that game. It's the only good game of the day. Altho, I'm a Bears fan...the outcome doesn't matter much to me this year.

Chris Fountain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rocks off ...

> what makes this Thanksgiving even more interesting
> is the fact that Detroit actually has a good
> football team LOL!!!!!!!

allegedly!

Beelyboy,

I was hoping it was a feelgood thread but I see you have found redemption. We have decided to lighten your sentence to 2 days of guarding Plymouth Rock.

It was 31 years ago on Thanksgiving the 'The Last Waltz' (w/ Ronnie Wood) happened; boy am I getting old! Big turkey meal with all of the fixins (and Bob Dylan brought smoked salmon for all).

I am thankful for being in relative good health and friends. Okay, I'm just thank ful for getting up in the morning!!! A few friends are coming over and we'll drink great wine and eat way to much. Watch football and movies. Oh well, onto making the food! Happy Thanksgiving, or Have a good day day.

It is a belt loosener kind of day!

Beelyboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
...small pox blankets...

did you get the blanket idea from south park? or did south park get the blanket idea from your history source?

Hey, any Americans here going to wake up super early on "Black Friday"
and get your Christmas shopping done?

Happy thanksgiving folks



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-11-23 00:26 by Erik_Snow.

little queenie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Beelyboy Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> ...small pox blankets...
>
> did you get the blanket idea from south park? or
> did south park get the blanket idea from your
> history source?

well i like soutpark but didn't see that episode. i think it's rather common knowledge and i'm sure their writers' sharp satirical references were based on historical fact rather than just whimsey or fiction...

you hadn't heard of this before watching a cartoon show? and it's all just a cartoon show kinda joke is your feeling? wow.
but hey LQ, i don't mean to put words in your mouth, maybe that's not your position when you were askin'....
_______________________________
from straightdope.com

"Fact is, on at least one occasion a high-ranking European considered infecting the Indians with smallpox as a tactic of war. I'm talking about Lord Jeffrey Amherst, commander of British forces in North America during the French and Indian War (1756-'63). Amherst and a subordinate discussed, apparently seriously, sending infected blankets to hostile tribes. What's more, we've got the documents to prove it, thanks to the enterprising research of Peter d'Errico, legal studies professor at the University of Massachusetts at (fittingly) Amherst. D'Errico slogged through hundreds of reels of microfilmed correspondence looking for the smoking gun, and he found it.

The exchange took place during Pontiac's Rebellion, which broke out after the war, in 1763. Forces led by Pontiac, a chief of the Ottawa who had been allied with the French, laid siege to the English at Fort Pitt.

According to historian Francis Parkman, Amherst first raised the possibility of giving the Indians infected blankets in a letter to Colonel Henry Bouquet, who would lead reinforcements to Fort Pitt. No copy of this letter has come to light, but we do know that Bouquet discussed the matter in a postscript to a letter to Amherst on July 13, 1763:

P.S. I will try to inocculate the Indians by means of Blankets that may fall in their hands, taking care however not to get the disease myself. As it is pity to oppose good men against them, I wish we could make use of the Spaniard's Method, and hunt them with English Dogs. Supported by Rangers, and some Light Horse, who would I think effectively extirpate or remove that Vermine.

On July 16 Amherst replied, also in a postscript:

P.S. You will Do well to try to Innoculate the Indians by means of Blanketts, as well as to try Every other method that can serve to Extirpate this Execrable Race. I should be very glad your Scheme for Hunting them Down by Dogs could take Effect, but England is at too great a Distance to think of that at present.

On July 26 Bouquet wrote back:

I received yesterday your Excellency's letters of 16th with their Inclosures. The signal for Indian Messengers, and all your directions will be observed.

We don't know if Bouquet actually put the plan into effect, or if so with what result. We do know that a supply of smallpox-infected blankets was available, since the disease had broken out at Fort Pitt some weeks previously. We also know that the following spring smallpox was reported to be raging among the Indians in the vicinity.

To modern ears, this talk about infecting the natives with smallpox, hunting them down with dogs, etc., sounds over the top. But it's easy to believe Amherst and company were serious. D'Errico provides other quotes from Amherst's correspondence that suggest he considered Native Americans subhumans who ought to be exterminated. Check out his research for yourself at www.nativeweb.org/pages/l egal/amherst/lord_jeff.html. He not only includes transcriptions but also reproduces the relevant parts of the incriminating letters.
_______________________________

i'm neither an expert on this, nor a scholar, nor am i gonna put extensive research links into this on a fan site...but the info's out there and how...tho you can be many incidents were not recorded or spoken about or publicized in the 17th, 18th, 19th or 20th century. and this new century too...just different chemicals and means of dispersion...huge military history of germ warfare going back centuries; nothing really changes but the technology.

.... but it's not hard to find a lot of historical corroborating evidence of germ warfare and biological warfare introduced by europeans into the native american tribes, tho it will get harder as revisionist history wipes reality out thru the internets and hard copies will disappear....which won't matter to americans, any more than the other genocidal savagery polices, because people are watching cartoons. and because 'teachers' are told what to, and what not to, say, according to curriculum based on textbook sales by whichever warlord is in charge of reality during whatever decade or epoch. whoooo whoooooo....
it just lays your soul to waste.

i'm pretty 'the wizard of oz' was based on fantasy tho, so, take heart. no flying monkeys tonight.

Edith Grove Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey, any Americans here going to wake up super
> early on "Black Friday"
> and get your Christmas shopping done?

I'm not, but my wife is a retail store manager and has to be ready to open the store at 8am. Yuck!

The Sicilian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Chris Fountain Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > rocks off ...
>
> > what makes this Thanksgiving even more
> interesting
> > is the fact that Detroit actually has a good
> > football team LOL!!!!!!!
>
> allegedly!

Well, I'm a Green Bay fan. Sorry about your luck, Lions fans. It was 37-26. Favre delivered a stellar performance, and the Packers are now 10-1. I love it.

A good day for me, not only Thanksgiving but we celebrated my Mom's 97th birthday as well. Almost all of my remaining immediate family were together, first time in years, I feel very good tonight.
Happy Thanksgiving, Everyone !

gmanp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A good day for me, not only Thanksgiving but we
> celebrated my Mom's 97th birthday as well. Almost
> all of my remaining immediate family were
> together, first time in years, I feel very good
> tonight.
> Happy Thanksgiving, Everyone !

That's great, gmanp. I'm happy for you. Yeah, my family did the traditional gathering, too. That's what it's all about.

Same here . Went out for a nice meal . Ate more today than I usually eat in a week .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-11-23 03:03 by boston2006.