I would gladly take Presence over ITTOD. Very different albums though. The latter had a few good things on it. I even liked Hot Dog,go figure. But Carouselambra? WTF

"It's just some friends of mine and they're busting down the door"

Hey, Gazza, I like ITTOD also. Listened to it last night.

I picture Plant wearing Devo glasses on that one.
Here's a challenge - try understanding the lyrics... I dare anyone w/o a transcript! They're sooooooooo buried.

"Carouselambra"

Sisters of the way-side bide their time in quiet peace,
Await their place within the ring of calm;
Still stand to turn in seconds of release,
Await the call they know may never come.
In times of lightness, no intruder dared upon
To jeopardize the course, upset the run;
And all was joy and hands were raised toward the sun
As love in the halls of plenty overrun.

Still in their bliss unchallenged mighty feast,
Unending dances shadowed on the day.
Within their walls, their daunting formless keep,
Preserved their joy and kept their doubts at bay.
Faceless legions stood in readiness to weep,
Just turn a coin, bring order to the fray;
And everything is soon no sooner thought than deed,
But no one seemed to question in anyway.

How keen the storied hunter's eye prevails upon the land
To seek the unsuspecting and the weak;
And powerless the fabled sat, too smug to lift a hand
Toward the foe that threatened from the deep.
Who cares to dry the cheeks of those who saddened stand
Adrift upon a sea of futile speech?
And to fall to fate and make the 'status plan'
Where was your word, where did you go?
Where was your helping, where was your bow? Bow.
Dull is the armour, cold is the day.
Hard was the journey, dark was the way. Way.
I heard the word; I couldn't stay. Oh.
I couldn't stand it another day, another day,
Another day, another day.

Touched by the timely coming,
Roused from the keeper's sleep,
Release the grip, throw down the key.

Held now within the knowing,
Rest now within the peace.
Take of the fruit, but guard the seed.

They had to stay!

Held now within the knowing,
Rest now within the beat.
Take of the fruit, but guard the seed...

sweetcharmedlife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would gladly take Presence over ITTOD. Very
> different albums though. The latter had a few good
> things on it. I even liked Hot Dog,go figure. But
> Carouselambra? WTF


Thats actually one of my favourites on it.

Thanks for posting the lyrics, svartmer. Could never figure them out.

Love ITTOD---fantastic record--amazing contributions from JPJ.
Carouselambra is one of the highlights--the band is really locked in
on that one.

I have no trouble believing that Presence is one of Page's faves--that record is really his baby---no keyboards on that one; all songs are very guitar driven, lots of overdubs, great solos.

It also seems that Page got into a bit of a Strat kick on that record and For Your Life in particular.

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Svartmer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It was a long time ago. The first Dylan album
> is
> > actually very good I think, very bluesy.
>
>
> It is, but the only problem is that he sounds
> about twelve years old, which doesnt really work
> for the 'dark' subject matter of many of the
> songs.
>
> If he'd recorded that album around the time he did
> those two albums of traditional songs in the early
> 90's, it would have worked better as his
> world-weary voice had 'grown' into the songs.
>
> Surprised to read how 'Presence' is held in such
> high regard by Zep fans, and also that Page
> considers it their best album. I've never got into
> it. The playing is superb but the songs are mostly
> forgettable. Then ain, I seem to one of the few
> people who loves 'In Through The Out Door'

Page is like a lot of rock stars, he has contradicted himself over the years. I know he's said on occasion that Presence is his favorite, but he's more often stated that Physical Graffiti is the pinacle of the band's recorded career. Which is much more accurate, of course.

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Svartmer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It was a long time ago. The first Dylan album
> is
> > actually very good I think, very bluesy.
>
>
> It is, but the only problem is that he sounds
> about twelve years old, which doesnt really work
> for the 'dark' subject matter of many of the
> songs.
>
> If he'd recorded that album around the time he did
> those two albums of traditional songs in the early
> 90's, it would have worked better as his
> world-weary voice had 'grown' into the songs.
>
> Surprised to read how 'Presence' is held in such
> high regard by Zep fans, and also that Page
> considers it their best album. I've never got into
> it. The playing is superb but the songs are mostly
> forgettable. Then ain, I seem to one of the few
> people who loves 'In Through The Out Door'

I think Achilles Last Stand, Nobody's Fault and For Your Life are pretty memorable. I'll agree that Candy Store Rock, Hots On For Nowhere, Royal Orleans and even Tea For One (good song and magnificent solos, but it is somewhat painfully long and slow) are fairly forgetable as individual songs, but as you said the playing is excellent and moreover I think they fit the overall mood of the album. The whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Then ain, I seem to one of the few
> people who loves 'In Through The Out Door'

Consider me a fan. I love it too and rank it higher than Presence. Neither of those two are better than their earlier albums, with the possible exception of Houses of the Holy, but hey, it's all good (ok, parts of Coda kind of sucked, but still).

In Through the Out Door holds a special place in my heart because it was the last Zep studio album I bought, since I bought them in chronlogical order, and thus to me it was for a long time the "new Zep album" even though I bought it in 1985 and it was released in 1979. It was like hey, this is only six years old, this is as close to "modern" Zeppelin as we'll ever get. I liked the direction they were moving in, it's a pity Bonham shuffled off this mortal coil when he did.

I dig "Candy Store Rock" and "Carouselambra" a lot. Long live Zep.

I'm playing Presence right now and feeling bad for calling Royal Orleans not memorable. And if you take your pick, be careful how you choose it ...

ITTOD is an excellent album, much better than Presence. Every song on it is great and I liked the direction they were going in, despite some Zep fans hate for it.

it's_all_wrong Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ITTOD is an excellent album, much better than
> Presence. Every song on it is great and I liked
> the direction they were going in, despite some Zep
> fans hate for it.

It's a different Zep album, with JPJ as the main musical force instead of Page, who was pretty out of it at the time. It was a great step forward for them, for sure. Look at the difference between Zep I in '69 and ITTOD in '79 - now that's growth. Both are sublime in completely different ways.

Bad luck struck when Plant's car plunged off a cliff on the Greek island of Rhodes. Plant's wife suffered a fractured skull, and a broken leg and pelvis. Plant fractured his elbow and broke his ankle. They were taken to a small local emergency ward. Just how pervasive was Zeppelin's popularity? "I was lying there in some pain," Plant says with understatement, "trying to get cockroaches off the bed and the guy next to me, this drunken soldier, started singing 'The Ocean' from Houses of the Holy."

Plant's accident would thrust the band into their darkest period. For 18 months, it wasn't known if he'd be able to use his leg again. Plant spent a lengthy period of time drinking beer and "tinkering on the village piano." Clearly, Zeppelin needed a new album, and needed to feel their ability to make a great one. The plan was to record fast, to push the limits, to paint themselves in a corner and dare themselves to escape.

Rehearsals for Presence began in Malibu, California. It was an odd sight - Led Zeppelin with Robert Plant in a wheelchair. The band soon moved to Munich for the sessions. Every waking hour was spent in the studio, located in the basement of their hotel.

In 1977, Page described the album with a real fervor. "The general urgency and the pent-up whoa was in all of us. The mechanism was perfectly oiled. We started steaming in rehearsals. We did a lot of old rock and roll numbers just to loosen up a bit. 'For Your Life' was made up in the studio, right on the spot. I particularly enjoyed the guitar playing on the blues things. The solos never had that coloring before. I was so happy about it... especially since I have to warm up to solo. I get nervous about that kind of guitar playing. Really, very insecure about it. But that's the way I can really concentrate. I'm usually at my best when I'm really exhausted or under pressure or both. When you're exhausted all you want to know about is what you have to do. The Golden question is why this was done so fast, and why the others take so long. The fact is that this one, we lived all the way through... under circumstances that were extremely frustrating. We weren't sure about Robert, weren't sure what was going to happen. Everyone managed to pull it all in...it was great."

If each Zeppelin album was, as Jimmy Page says, a concept album detailing the mental state of the band at the time... then this one was a story of anxiety and frenzy and blues and pain. Presence, he says, is the most important Zeppelin album. It's a snapshot of a time when the group was stripped of its legendary power. They were running on pure heart and soul.

Bingo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bad luck struck when Plant's car plunged off a
> cliff on the Greek island of Rhodes. Plant's wife
> suffered a fractured skull, and a broken leg and
> pelvis. Plant fractured his elbow and broke his
> ankle. They were taken to a small local emergency
> ward. Just how pervasive was Zeppelin's
> popularity? "I was lying there in some pain,"
> Plant says with understatement, "trying to get
> cockroaches off the bed and the guy next to me,
> this drunken soldier, started singing 'The Ocean'
> from Houses of the Holy."
>
> Plant's accident would thrust the band into their
> darkest period. For 18 months, it wasn't known if
> he'd be able to use his leg again. Plant spent a
> lengthy period of time drinking beer and
> "tinkering on the village piano." Clearly,
> Zeppelin needed a new album, and needed to feel
> their ability to make a great one. The plan was to
> record fast, to push the limits, to paint
> themselves in a corner and dare themselves to
> escape.
>
> Rehearsals for Presence began in Malibu,
> California. It was an odd sight - Led Zeppelin
> with Robert Plant in a wheelchair. The band soon
> moved to Munich for the sessions. Every waking
> hour was spent in the studio, located in the
> basement of their hotel.
>
> In 1977, Page described the album with a real
> fervor. "The general urgency and the pent-up whoa
> was in all of us. The mechanism was perfectly
> oiled. We started steaming in rehearsals. We did a
> lot of old rock and roll numbers just to loosen up
> a bit. 'For Your Life' was made up in the studio,
> right on the spot. I particularly enjoyed the
> guitar playing on the blues things. The solos
> never had that coloring before. I was so happy
> about it... especially since I have to warm up to
> solo. I get nervous about that kind of guitar
> playing. Really, very insecure about it. But
> that's the way I can really concentrate. I'm
> usually at my best when I'm really exhausted or
> under pressure or both. When you're exhausted all
> you want to know about is what you have to do. The
> Golden question is why this was done so fast, and
> why the others take so long. The fact is that this
> one, we lived all the way through... under
> circumstances that were extremely frustrating. We
> weren't sure about Robert, weren't sure what was
> going to happen. Everyone managed to pull it all
> in...it was great."
>
> If each Zeppelin album was, as Jimmy Page says, a
> concept album detailing the mental state of the
> band at the time... then this one was a story of
> anxiety and frenzy and blues and pain. Presence,
> he says, is the most important Zeppelin album.
> It's a snapshot of a time when the group was
> stripped of its legendary power. They were running
> on pure heart and soul.

Very eloquently put, and I agree totally. That's probably why Page has said Presence is "his favorite." Not really musically, but just the fact that it came at such a critical juncture for the band and really represented them carrying on in the face of nigh-impossible odds.

Desperate, frantic, rung-out, barely hanging on but improbably triumphant - if you know and care about the history of Zeppelin it is impossible not to hear the album in this context. It's stature greatly increases for those who know the history and hear it from that perspective. And Achilles Last Stand ... wow.

ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm playing Presence right now and feeling bad for
> calling Royal Orleans not memorable. And if you
> take your pick, be careful how you choose it ...
That one is supposedly a true story about a JPJ experience with a transvestite in New Orleans. Whiskers!

sweetcharmedlife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm playing Presence right now and feeling bad
> for
> > calling Royal Orleans not memorable. And if you
> > take your pick, be careful how you choose it
> ...
> That one is supposedly a true story about a JPJ
> experience with a transvestite in New Orleans.
> Whiskers!


Yeah, he picked up what he thought was a chick, then passed out while they were smoking a joint and set the hotel room on fire! They never let him forget that one!

Ever heard the famous "Red Snapper" story?

"It's just some friends of mine and they're busting down the door"

ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's a different Zep album, with JPJ as the main
> musical force instead of Page, who was pretty out
> of it at the time. It was a great step forward for
> them, for sure. Look at the difference between Zep
> I in '69 and ITTOD in '79 - now that's growth.
> Both are sublime in completely different ways.


Yeah, you can tell Page was out of it on ITTOD, he plays a bit sloppily on the first part of Carouselambra and on the solo of Hot Dog. And he doesn't do much on All My Love, apart from a simple riff. JPJ is who makes these songs great.

It seems kind of obvious, but I've never heard anybody else mention it, Presence was the name of an extra tone knob on Marshall guitar amps that showed up on the bigger Marshall amps around that same time...like Volume, Bass, Mid, Treble and Presence...I just always have this image in my mind of Jimmy Page, looking down at the front of the amp and going, "yeah...'presence,' what a great album title..." I have a theory that it might possibly be where it came from



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-12-10 06:50 by Turning To Gold.

Look for the new Zep box set "Reverb".

Elmo Lewis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Look for the new Zep box set "Reverb".

Tom Petty put out an album called Echo in 1999. Can it's companion album "Treble" be far behind. I for one am trebling in anticipation.

Blue Rodeo released Tremolo in '97.

I remember 1976 cutting class to run out to buy Presence. I came back to my dorm room, put on the LP and did not go to any classes that day. I was totally into the sound of Zep on that one. I listened to it over and over that day. Still, it's one of my fav Zep efforts.

Elmo Lewis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Look for the new Zep box set "Reverb".
X



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-12-11 18:50 by cbtaco19.

For Your Life, Royal Orleans, Hots On For Nowhere = boring, nothingish tracks.

jamesfdouglas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For Your Life, Royal Orleans, Hots On For Nowhere
> = boring, nothingish tracks.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I think those three songs rock!

Do you enjoy any Led Zeppelin, or are they not your cup of tea?

Give you a hint - If I didn't like Zeppelin, would I have even heard of the songs I listed?

I'll refrain from comment.

I saw Zep do Achilles and Nobody's Fault back in 1977....May 31 to be exact.....it was my second all time favorite rock concert, second only to The Who in 1975...whew, killer shows, absolutely killer....in spite of all the chemicals racing through my skull, I still remember the shows vividly, just like it was last year.