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Mathijs

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Roc

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Mathijs
If you have Keith in the studio -one of the tastiest bass players around, you have Ron Wood, you have Andrew Watt who's a fantastic bass player -why would you need to invite Darryl to the sessions? Especially since Darryl isn't a very good RnR player.

Mathijs

I also think the same thing though I’ve never heard how the bass sounds andrew watt

Well, listen to Hackney Diamonds. Andrew Watt is all over the album.

Mathijs

I still have to get hold of the disc and listen to it with a decent stereo because so far I have listened HD with my phone that as you know almost always excludes the sounds of the bass

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24FPS

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MrForeverMusicFan

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Blueranger
No one has ever claimed Darryl is the only bass player. He is a hired hand.

Even though Bill Wyman was a full-fledged member of The Rolling Stones for 30 years, he didn't play bass on every song on all the band's albums during that time period.

And Keith didn't play guitar on every track. And Mick didn't sing on every cut. And Charlie didn't play drums on every song. Bill played bass on almost every important song. They knew. He's not on a lot of Exile, but he certainly is on Rocks Off, maybe the best track of all. Yes, Keith played bass on JJF, but Bill provided that little organ riff at the end of the song. Keith played bass on SFTD, but Bill played the maracas. And marimba on Don't Be a Stranger. They were a band.

Exactly. This is how a band works. There are no dark motives or conspiracies why someone is not playing on a recording.

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Roc

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Mathijs

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Roc

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Mathijs
If you have Keith in the studio -one of the tastiest bass players around, you have Ron Wood, you have Andrew Watt who's a fantastic bass player -why would you need to invite Darryl to the sessions? Especially since Darryl isn't a very good RnR player.

Mathijs

I also think the same thing though I’ve never heard how the bass sounds andrew watt

Well, listen to Hackney Diamonds. Andrew Watt is all over the album.

Mathijs

I still have to get hold of the disc and listen to it with a decent stereo because so far I have listened HD with my phone that as you know almost always excludes the sounds of the bass

Or listen to the excellent Plastic Heart album of Miley Cyrus, Watt is on bass on just about all tracks.

Mathijs

There is no conspiracy here. When the Stones came to Los Angeles to record last November, Darryl Jones was on a tour in Europe with Niels Lan Doky and his jazz group. This was a commitment made long in advance and could not be changed. The Stones wanted Darryl to play on the record but it wasn't possible. This is why Keith, Ronnie, Paul, Bill and Andrew Watt ended up playing bass on different tracks. Darryl is obviously still a member of the Stones band, as he just played with them in New York last week.

Incidentally, Niels Lan Doky has recently released a live album from that tour. This is a sample track from the record...

video: [www.youtube.com]

Here's some video footage below that expands on what roundnround posted about.

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DandelionPowderman

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Taylor1
I am not really that big a fan of Keith, Taylor or even Wood as a bass player.On songs like Live With Me, the bass is more like a guitar.Bill is the bass player.His playing with Charlie was just great.It gave it the unique sound. Listening to live songs like from 1972 or Honky Tonk Women , he had a unique way of propelling the song.

Hm...





[www.youtube.com]

What is your point? Bill did it better live.Yeah , Keith plays nice bass , but he isn’t Bill

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FrogSugar
Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere, but what's the deal? He's been on every album since Bill bailed after Steel Wheels.

I'm a bit surprised that they let Watt take on the bass duties on the album, what does this mean? I'm sure that Darryl is the technically better player... Why are they letting the 30-something Ozzy producer take on the bass duties on HD? Something just doesn't add up, I'm sure Darryl would have been more than happy/available to play on it!

Because he's a musician and can play obviously suitable for the live studio recording and they wanted live bass? Bill wasn't on all of STEEL WHEELS. Jones was on tour...

It's just what it is.

Have you wondered the same thing about Chuck Leavell?

McCartney might be on the next album.

The Stones are not the only band recording a new album while missing usual memers.

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FrogSugar

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Irix

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FrogSugar

Why are they letting the 30-something Ozzy producer take on the bass duties on HD?

Darryl was not available for the recording sessions due to other commitments.

And Andrew Watt doesn't play Bass on all tracks - [iorr.org] .

I'm still pretty much amazed that Darryl wouldn't want to be a part of the (probably) last ever Stones album ever.

Yes, I know that Bill and Paul are guesting, but that still leaves a lot of tunes where Darryl was expected to play on.

And as TumblinDice76 said, I've no doubt that AW prefers to play the bass on the album, I just think that something's weird about all of this!

There's nothing weird about it.

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Taylor1

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DandelionPowderman

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Taylor1
I am not really that big a fan of Keith, Taylor or even Wood as a bass player.On songs like Live With Me, the bass is more like a guitar.Bill is the bass player.His playing with Charlie was just great.It gave it the unique sound. Listening to live songs like from 1972 or Honky Tonk Women , he had a unique way of propelling the song.

Hm...





[www.youtube.com]

What is your point? Bill did it better live.Yeah , Keith plays nice bass , but he isn’t Bill

It's hard to do this better than Keith did on the studio version. I haven't heard anyone do that.

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Irix

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MrForeverMusicFan

Hackney Diamonds has been many years in the making.

But the final recordings were end of 2022 / early 2023.

Right. Only "final" recordings.

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roundnround
There is no conspiracy here. When the Stones came to Los Angeles to record last November, Darryl Jones was on a tour in Europe with Niels Lan Doky and his jazz group. This was a commitment made long in advance and could not be changed. The Stones wanted Darryl to play on the record but it wasn't possible. This is why Keith, Ronnie, Paul, Bill and Andrew Watt ended up playing bass on different tracks. Darryl is obviously still a member of the Stones band, as he just played with them in New York last week.

Incidentally, Niels Lan Doky has recently released a live album from that tour. This is a sample track from the record...

video: [www.youtube.com]

That's really not how it works though...Even up to Ron Wood, if the band calls you drop everything and make sure you are ready and available. That's the deal of being with the Stones. Wood was planning some shows in October -all was scrapped because of the album release.

Mick has made various remarks on that earlier sessions with the full band did not work out, that they didn't get it rolling. It was Andrew Watt who lured Jagger into this 'Let's work together, just the three of us, and see if it works'. On the following sessions with Wood they simply did not need any other session man than Matt Clifford, a few horns and some friends helping out like Elton John.

Mathijs

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DandelionPowderman

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Taylor1

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DandelionPowderman

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Taylor1
I am not really that big a fan of Keith, Taylor or even Wood as a bass player.On songs like Live With Me, the bass is more like a guitar.Bill is the bass player.His playing with Charlie was just great.It gave it the unique sound. Listening to live songs like from 1972 or Honky Tonk Women , he had a unique way of propelling the song.

Hm...





[www.youtube.com]

What is your point? Bill did it better live.Yeah , Keith plays nice bass , but he isn’t Bill

It's hard to do this better than Keith did on the studio version. I haven't heard anyone do that.

Wyman did it better live .IMO.But yeah, you may be right.But on the other songs Bill played on no one could do it better than what Bill gave. Keith is the greatest rhythm guitarist in rock history, but he wasn’t the greatest bass player in his band



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-10-25 12:23 by Taylor1.

Keith certainly wasn't the best bass player in the band. However, he did some studio recordings on that instruments that are iconic, imo.

JJF and Little T+A, for instance.

Regarding JJF and Bill, in Bill's defense they never played JJF like the studio version, so he never got his chance to shine, imo (the intro, the groove etc). JJF became a different tune live (that goes for Mick's singing as well). Some like it best live. I prefer the studio version (and partly the Rock'n'Roll Circus-version).

I love the arrangement of RNR Circus version.

It's a good compromise to enable a reasonably faithful live performance of what was a technically complex recording.

I'd love to see them try that arrangement today with current personnel.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-10-26 13:01 by Spud.

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Mathijs

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roundnround
There is no conspiracy here. When the Stones came to Los Angeles to record last November, Darryl Jones was on a tour in Europe with Niels Lan Doky and his jazz group. This was a commitment made long in advance and could not be changed. The Stones wanted Darryl to play on the record but it wasn't possible. This is why Keith, Ronnie, Paul, Bill and Andrew Watt ended up playing bass on different tracks. Darryl is obviously still a member of the Stones band, as he just played with them in New York last week.

Incidentally, Niels Lan Doky has recently released a live album from that tour. This is a sample track from the record...

video: [www.youtube.com]

That's really not how it works though...Even up to Ron Wood, if the band calls you drop everything and make sure you are ready and available. That's the deal of being with the Stones. Wood was planning some shows in October -all was scrapped because of the album release.

Mick has made various remarks on that earlier sessions with the full band did not work out, that they didn't get it rolling. It was Andrew Watt who lured Jagger into this 'Let's work together, just the three of us, and see if it works'. On the following sessions with Wood they simply did not need any other session man than Matt Clifford, a few horns and some friends helping out like Elton John.

Mathijs

Well I'm not jumping on the conspiracy thing here, but even Chanel lost her Broadway job to sing ONE SHOW on a Stones tour. One would think that after 30 years Darryl would have prioritized this...and they would have included him early in the planning. But we'll never know what the actual deal was.

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treaclefingers

Well I'm not jumping on the conspiracy thing here, but even Chanel lost her Broadway job to sing ONE SHOW on a Stones tour.

She called in sick, the musical with 1200 paying attendance was cancelled, and she flew in to sing with the Stones. No wonder she was fired.

And she was by no means part of the Stones session musicians at the time.

Mathijs

24FPS hypothised that ''Maybe Andrew Watt flat out told them that they needed better bass'', and perhaps that is indeed the case.

The best Stones songs always have fantastic bass that really lift them - adding colour, groove, fattening up the riffs with a counter-melody. The last few Stones albums have really been lacking in that department - Love Is Strong is a prime example of a pretty cool song let down by a chugging root note bassline.

I much prefer Keith, Ronnie and (so it seems) Andrew Watt's basslines, and they really add life to these new tunes.