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Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: August 9, 2022 20:58

Lots of interesting vignettes in various articles and interviews, many of which didnt make it into Johns book "Sound Man". Im sure most folks here know Glyn was Stu's roommate out of college and was involved with The Stones in their earliest days. Like Stu, Glyn was decidedly not star struck and totally unimpressed by any rock star pretensions. Push came to shove after completing Black and Blue when the always punctual and professional Johns melted down over the always tardy and generally intoxicated Keith Richards. He didnt work with them again until the "Grrr" compilation.
Interestingly, Glyn was introduced to Ronnie Wood while producing "Ooh La La" for The Faces and was "terribly impressed" with the guitarist. Not so with Rod Stewart, who Johns pointedly told he was "just the singer". Johns said he thought Woody joining the Stones was "a tragedy" because he felt Wood was selling his talent short to become a "mascot" in the Stones. (Ouch)
Then there was the famous confrontation with post- Exile Mick Taylor.“He turned from from being a quiet, softly spoken, charming young man into a raving egomaniac junkie. I was mixing the record… and said to Mick Jagger, ‘Either he goes or I go.’” (Jagger told Taylor to get lost)
Johns was equally blunt when initially retained as producer for the underwhelming "Red Rose Speedway". McCartney was not used to Johns no bullshit approach. McCartney dispatched Dennys Laine and Seiwell to confront Johns. 'One evening they said, “We’re not happy with you as a producer. You’re not taking any interest in what we are doing”. I said, “If you think that everything you do is a gem of marvelous music, you’re wrong. And if you want to sit and play shit and get stoned for a few hours […] don’t expect me to record everything you’re doing, because frankly it’s a waste of tape and it’s a waste of my energy." That was the end of that gig. Sounds like an interesting guy.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: August 9, 2022 21:06

I can't really figure out which album he is talking about regarding Taylor. Goats Head where he did a handful of mixes that weren't used? He didn't mix anything on Exile, Goats, or IORR.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: August 9, 2022 21:07

Glyn Johns has some cahoones

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: loog droog ()
Date: August 10, 2022 18:58

Quote
roryfaninva

Interestingly, Glyn was introduced to Ronnie Wood while producing "Ooh La La" for The Faces


What??

So he didn't speak to Ronnie during the sessions for A Nod Is As Good As A Wink?

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: August 10, 2022 22:15

D'Oh! Of course youre right. Obvious - now I cant find where I cut and pasted that from. Point Loog Droog.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: CindyC ()
Date: August 11, 2022 16:32

Couple of questions after reading this...

"McCartney was not used to Johns no bullshit approach".

- so did Glyn change his ways after the Let It Be album? Glyn was in the studio the whole time as far as I can see from the Get Back documentary. If this is true, maybe Glyn is the one who turned into the egomanic.

and what is this? "and said to Mick Jagger, ‘Either he goes or I go.’” (Jagger told Taylor to get lost)"

- Is he talking about just one night or are they implying that MJ told MT to leave the band? We all know that MT quit, so it's just a bit confusing.

Wasn't looking too good, but I was feeling real well.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: August 11, 2022 17:18

He pissed off Glen Frey and told the Eagles they couldnt rock. (Agreed although I have some appreciation for the original Leadon- Meisner lineup these days)

Initially unimpressed by The Eagles, Johns was later won over by their harmonies and musicianship but says he had to lay down the law during the recording of their first three albums.

'The minute that I had the opportunity to call the shots as a producer, I made the request that they leave their drugs outside of the studio and operate in a more sensible and professional way,' Johns says, recalling a particularly angry Glenn Frey.

As an engineer, Johns says it wasn't always easy being the only sober person in the room, particularly in the 1960s.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: August 11, 2022 17:32

Quote
TravelinMan
I can't really figure out which album he is talking about regarding Taylor. Goats Head where he did a handful of mixes that weren't used? He didn't mix anything on Exile, Goats, or IORR.

Glyn had made a similar remark about Taylor during IORR sessions in London, where Taylor wanted to add drums, bass, piano and vocals to a track. He ended the statement with a 'either he goes or I go'.

Mathijs

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:00

Wasn't it in 72?

"The flush of Mick Taylor joining the band had subsided somewhat. Substance abuse had changed him almost beyond recognition from the quiet fresh-faced genius I met when he joined the band.

In fact, the last time I had worked for the Stones was in 1972, recording and mixing some of Exile on Main St. My brother Andy did most of the album at Keith’s house in the South of France, where, sadly, he fell under the spell of Keith and heroin. Things had not gone particularly well as a result of a massive amount of drug taking by everyone except Mick, Charlie, and Bill.

So Mick invited me down to visit, and not long after, he asked if I would go in with him on his own to help him finish a couple of vocals and do some mixing. My one condition was that it would only be him and me, with no interference from any other member of the band, after what I had witnessed in France.

We started back in London at Basing Street Studios and were getting on really well, slipping straight back right where we left off. Until, on the second day, the control room door opened and much to my surprise in walked Mick Taylor.

We had been working on a mix for about half an hour and had discovered that Mick Taylor had overdubbed himself on drums and bass and was singing background parts, all of which I had decided not to use, as The Rolling Stones already had the best rhythm section that I knew of and I would not insult them by using what he had played as a substitute in the mix. As for the singing, I felt it would be best if he stuck to playing the guitar.

On realizing that I was only using his guitar part, Mr. Taylor became quite upset and demanded to know where his bass, drums, and singing were. I politely explained that they would be remaining on the multitrack tape and that I would not be using them in the mix, as I felt they added nothing of value to the track. This was a changed man. He had become an insufferable egomaniac.

I reminded Mick Jagger of our agreement, and he asked Mick Taylor to leave, agreeing with me that having him there was not going to work"

(from the 2014 book "Sound man").

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: roryfaninva ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:06

Thats it. Seems like he cleaned things up a little when he did the book. Recalling the incident in Mojo, he was a little more ..condescending.

Johns descibes working on a track at Basing Street Studios on which Taylor had overdubbed backing vocals, drums and a bass. When Taylor asked the famously no-nonsense producer why he had removed them, he replied, “The Rolling Stones have a f**king great drummer and a really great bass player. You, sunshine, play the guitar and you’ll hear it rather nicely when I’ve finished this.”

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: Big Al ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:17

I wonder what track Taylor had overdubbed?

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: loog droog ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:18

Glyn Johns has been around since the very beginning and personally knows the Stones as people. He was right there working and sweating with them as they made their classics, so it's not like he's awe-struck by these "legends" the way I imagine someone like Don Was would be.

For that very reason (and the great sound he gets in the studio) I wish he would work with them again.

He once did an interview with Musician magazine where he recalled that Jimmy Page asked him to produce and engineer the first Led Zeppelin album. He did just that, but when the album came out Page screwed him out of the credit, listing Johns as the engineer and himself as producer.

The interviewer also asked him about the Rod Stewart song "True Blue" from the Never A Dull Moment album which features all the Faces and which Johns is listed as the engineer of. Glyn said it was a leftover track from a Faces session that he produced (Not Rod, who is credited as the album's producer) and that Stewart owed him money for it!

"True Blue" ought to be included in any future Faces collections, as it is a product of them as a unit.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:22

Since Johns never took drugs his memories should be 100% reliable, but...

"There is another story showing my total incompetence during the making of Let It Bleed. Jimmy Miller and I were mixing “You Got the Silver” and he had the idea of putting reverse echo on the lead guitar. This is achieved by turning the tape upside down and playing it backwards while putting echo on the guitar and recording the return from the chamber on an empty track.

I had never done it before and I miscalculated which was the empty track to record on and succeeded in erasing Mick’s vocal. Unfortunately, Mick was ten thousand miles away in Australia, making the movie Ned Kelly. I was mortified, but fortunately there was a positive result to my mistake. We asked Keith to sing it. I think I am right in saying it is his first lead vocal on a Stones album and he did a really fine job".

Well we know a version of YGTS with Mick’s vocal has been released on countless boots. And that track was recorded in Feb.69 while "Ned Kelly" was shot in June'69.

So not everything Johns "remembers" should be taken for solid gold... therefore the MT incident might have happened in 72 or 73 or 74.
73 or 74 are more logical... Keith was starting to fall apart and consequently MT might have seen a possibility to advance his ideas within the band.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: Meryl03 ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:29

Andy Johns said this about Mick Taylor which I find more believable than what Glyn said. There are some comments from Glyn from 1974 that to me show he just had a problem with Mick T for some reason.

Is it true that the solo on "Winter" was done live?
"Yes. Amazing, isn't it? He would quite often play solos on the track, and they came out that good quite regularly. It's not like that was a coincidence - you know, he'll do it every time."

Did he seem particularly happy with that solo?
"He never mentioned anything about it. I used to flip out about it and tell him how great it was, but he never responded in any way. He's very humble in some ways, and not at all in others. He'll do things like want to overdub bass on something that Bill has already played on - which isn't terribly humble and then on the other hand, you'll tell him what an amazing guitar player he is and he won't say anything at all."

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: loog droog ()
Date: August 11, 2022 18:41

Quote
dcba
Since Johns never took drugs his memories should be 100% reliable, but...

"There is another story showing my total incompetence during the making of Let It Bleed. Jimmy Miller and I were mixing “You Got the Silver” and he had the idea of putting reverse echo on the lead guitar. This is achieved by turning the tape upside down and playing it backwards while putting echo on the guitar and recording the return from the chamber on an empty track.

I had never done it before and I miscalculated which was the empty track to record on and succeeded in erasing Mick’s vocal. Unfortunately, Mick was ten thousand miles away in Australia, making the movie Ned Kelly. I was mortified, but fortunately there was a positive result to my mistake. We asked Keith to sing it. I think I am right in saying it is his first lead vocal on a Stones album and he did a really fine job".

Well we know a version of YGTS with Mick’s vocal has been released on countless boots. And that track was recorded in Feb.69 while "Ned Kelly" was shot in June'69.


If the song was mixed in June and he erased Mick from the master tape the timeline makes sense. I don't hear the backwards guitar effect on the version with Mick's vocal, so the boot was taken from a safety copy, not the master tape.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Date: August 11, 2022 18:52

Quote
dcba
Since Johns never took drugs his memories should be 100% reliable, but...

"There is another story showing my total incompetence during the making of Let It Bleed. Jimmy Miller and I were mixing “You Got the Silver” and he had the idea of putting reverse echo on the lead guitar. This is achieved by turning the tape upside down and playing it backwards while putting echo on the guitar and recording the return from the chamber on an empty track.

I had never done it before and I miscalculated which was the empty track to record on and succeeded in erasing Mick’s vocal. Unfortunately, Mick was ten thousand miles away in Australia, making the movie Ned Kelly. I was mortified, but fortunately there was a positive result to my mistake. We asked Keith to sing it. I think I am right in saying it is his first lead vocal on a Stones album and he did a really fine job".

Well we know a version of YGTS with Mick’s vocal has been released on countless boots. And that track was recorded in Feb.69 while "Ned Kelly" was shot in June'69.

So not everything Johns "remembers" should be taken for solid gold... therefore the MT incident might have happened in 72 or 73 or 74.
73 or 74 are more logical... Keith was starting to fall apart and consequently MT might have seen a possibility to advance his ideas within the band.

The version with Mick on vocals could be from a unmixed tape, for listening, not the master tape.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: DGA35 ()
Date: August 11, 2022 20:55

Was there any comments Glyn made about Brian, either good or bad? Glyn recorded the first Stones session, the Bright Lights, Big City sessions.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: August 11, 2022 21:38

While he obviously knows what he's doing, tact doesn't appear to be one of his strengths...maybe he's a bit hot-headed?

Interesting nonetheless.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: NashvilleBlues ()
Date: August 11, 2022 21:58

Keeping it real. Love his energy and lack of tolerating b.s.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: August 12, 2022 15:19

A great producer will always stand up to artists who aren't delivering the goods they ought to be...

..But maybe Mr Johns sometimes forgot who was paying who winking smiley

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: August 12, 2022 15:28

Quote
dcba
Wasn't it in 72?

"The flush of Mick Taylor joining the band had subsided somewhat. Substance abuse had changed him almost beyond recognition from the quiet fresh-faced genius I met when he joined the band.

In fact, the last time I had worked for the Stones was in 1972, recording and mixing some of Exile on Main St. My brother Andy did most of the album at Keith’s house in the South of France, where, sadly, he fell under the spell of Keith and heroin. Things had not gone particularly well as a result of a massive amount of drug taking by everyone except Mick, Charlie, and Bill.

So Mick invited me down to visit, and not long after, he asked if I would go in with him on his own to help him finish a couple of vocals and do some mixing. My one condition was that it would only be him and me, with no interference from any other member of the band, after what I had witnessed in France.

We started back in London at Basing Street Studios and were getting on really well, slipping straight back right where we left off. Until, on the second day, the control room door opened and much to my surprise in walked Mick Taylor.

We had been working on a mix for about half an hour and had discovered that Mick Taylor had overdubbed himself on drums and bass and was singing background parts, all of which I had decided not to use, as The Rolling Stones already had the best rhythm section that I knew of and I would not insult them by using what he had played as a substitute in the mix. As for the singing, I felt it would be best if he stuck to playing the guitar.

On realizing that I was only using his guitar part, Mr. Taylor became quite upset and demanded to know where his bass, drums, and singing were. I politely explained that they would be remaining on the multitrack tape and that I would not be using them in the mix, as I felt they added nothing of value to the track. This was a changed man. He had become an insufferable egomaniac.

I reminded Mick Jagger of our agreement, and he asked Mick Taylor to leave, agreeing with me that having him there was not going to work"

(from the 2014 book "Sound man").

Problem is that as far as is known they didn't do any overdub or mixing sessions in London in 1972 -they did for GHS in 1973 and IORR in 1974.

Mathijs

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: August 12, 2022 15:44

Quote
CindyC
Couple of questions after reading this...

"McCartney was not used to Johns no bullshit approach".

- so did Glyn change his ways after the Let It Be album? Glyn was in the studio the whole time as far as I can see from the Get Back documentary. If this is true, maybe Glyn is the one who turned into the egomanic.

and what is this? "and said to Mick Jagger, ‘Either he goes or I go.’” (Jagger told Taylor to get lost)"

- Is he talking about just one night or are they implying that MJ told MT to leave the band? We all know that MT quit, so it's just a bit confusing.

Yeah, he’s talking about getting him out of the mixing sessions.

Since Glyn didn’t work on those albums I guess we know what Jagger chose.

Taylor said he helped Jagger quite a bit finishing IORR.

Re: Semi-OT: Glyn Johns Calls 'Em Like He Sees 'Em
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: August 15, 2022 14:58

Quote
CindyC
Couple of questions after reading this...

"McCartney was not used to Johns no bullshit approach".

- so did Glyn change his ways after the Let It Be album? Glyn was in the studio the whole time as far as I can see from the Get Back documentary. If this is true, maybe Glyn is the one who turned into the egomanic.

and what is this? "and said to Mick Jagger, ‘Either he goes or I go.’” (Jagger told Taylor to get lost)"

- Is he talking about just one night or are they implying that MJ told MT to leave the band? We all know that MT quit, so it's just a bit confusing.
I think you are right , as Glyn was like a wallflower during the Get Back documentary . What was priceless to me was how John Lennon addresses Glyn by calling him Glynis .



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