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Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Whale ()
Date: October 12, 2020 17:02

Quote
ironbelly
Quote
Whale
One more question.
I wanted to buy the japanese CD to have the two extra songs.
There was a german webshop I believe where you can do that.
Can somebody point me to the right item?
Same question for the San Jose CD.
Thanks!
Here is the link for San Jose DVD+2CD
[www.jpc.de]
as above + t-shirt
[www.jpc.de]
San Jose Bluray+2CD
[www.jpc.de]

They do not have Japanese version of Goats Head Soup with bonus tracks. For that you should go to cdjapan or amazon Japan
[www.amazon.co.jp]
[www.cdjapan.co.jp]

Thanks!

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Irix ()
Date: October 12, 2020 18:35

Quote
Whale

I wanted to buy the japanese CD to have the two extra songs.

You could also try it here: [www.Amazon.co.uk] .

Re: Criss Cross - out tomorrow
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: October 13, 2020 02:23

Quote
Nikkei
Quote
Sighunt
Quote
bitusa2012
I like it. But the video? Now, I’m a red blooded male. But that’s crass from a band pushing into their 80s. Do they really think in 2020, that’s appropriate?

I remember many of us squirmed with Keith’s “Bare your breasts And let me feel at home” line, at his age, from This Place is Empty in 2005. 15 years later we get this tawdry video...

After the refreshing Living in a ghost Town video, this one is dreadful.

But I like the song.

For me, it is not that I'm a prude, I just think that the video is pointless. Here you are the Rolling Stones who are showcasing (arguably) one of their better outtake/rarities for the world to hear for the first time, and you match it up with a T & A video coming from guys in their 70's...C'mon!

i went back all the way to page whatever of this thread just looking for opinions on that video. I guess it's not for everyone, just like the Stones themselves. Going out on a limb I assume there was A LOT of thought put into this one especially compared to the Ghost Town video. Not much appreciation from the superfans makes me appreciate it just that much more.

and btw we're calling them 80somethings now, just like that?

I see some have forgotten who the Stones are.

They never said they'd grow old gracefully.

Why does anyone give a shit if a skinny goofy hot young chick is in a video? Don't watch it then. Is there some rule that when one gets to a certain age they can't like sex anymore? Appropriate?

When have The Rolling Stones ever been "appropriate"? They may be old men but it seems they still "are not worried about petty morals".

There is no shocking anymore. The only people that have complained about the Stones video having some young hot chick in it are right here at iorr. Apparently everywhere else no one else gives a shit.

Re: Criss Cross - out tomorrow
Posted by: MadMax ()
Date: October 13, 2020 16:47

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Nikkei
Quote
Sighunt
Quote
bitusa2012
I like it. But the video? Now, I’m a red blooded male. But that’s crass from a band pushing into their 80s. Do they really think in 2020, that’s appropriate?

I remember many of us squirmed with Keith’s “Bare your breasts And let me feel at home” line, at his age, from This Place is Empty in 2005. 15 years later we get this tawdry video...

After the refreshing Living in a ghost Town video, this one is dreadful.

But I like the song.

For me, it is not that I'm a prude, I just think that the video is pointless. Here you are the Rolling Stones who are showcasing (arguably) one of their better outtake/rarities for the world to hear for the first time, and you match it up with a T & A video coming from guys in their 70's...C'mon!

i went back all the way to page whatever of this thread just looking for opinions on that video. I guess it's not for everyone, just like the Stones themselves. Going out on a limb I assume there was A LOT of thought put into this one especially compared to the Ghost Town video. Not much appreciation from the superfans makes me appreciate it just that much more.

and btw we're calling them 80somethings now, just like that?

I see some have forgotten who the Stones are.

They never said they'd grow old gracefully.

Why does anyone give a shit if a skinny goofy hot young chick is in a video? Don't watch it then. Is there some rule that when one gets to a certain age they can't like sex anymore? Appropriate?

When have The Rolling Stones ever been "appropriate"? They may be old men but it seems they still "are not worried about petty morals".

There is no shocking anymore. The only people that have complained about the Stones video having some young hot chick in it are right here at iorr. Apparently everywhere else no one else gives a shit.


AMEN

Re: Criss Cross - out tomorrow
Posted by: KRiffhard ()
Date: October 13, 2020 16:57

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Nikkei
Quote
Sighunt
Quote
bitusa2012
I like it. But the video? Now, I’m a red blooded male. But that’s crass from a band pushing into their 80s. Do they really think in 2020, that’s appropriate?

I remember many of us squirmed with Keith’s “Bare your breasts And let me feel at home” line, at his age, from This Place is Empty in 2005. 15 years later we get this tawdry video...

After the refreshing Living in a ghost Town video, this one is dreadful.

But I like the song.

For me, it is not that I'm a prude, I just think that the video is pointless. Here you are the Rolling Stones who are showcasing (arguably) one of their better outtake/rarities for the world to hear for the first time, and you match it up with a T & A video coming from guys in their 70's...C'mon!

i went back all the way to page whatever of this thread just looking for opinions on that video. I guess it's not for everyone, just like the Stones themselves. Going out on a limb I assume there was A LOT of thought put into this one especially compared to the Ghost Town video. Not much appreciation from the superfans makes me appreciate it just that much more.

and btw we're calling them 80somethings now, just like that?

I see some have forgotten who the Stones are.

They never said they'd grow old gracefully.

Why does anyone give a shit if a skinny goofy hot young chick is in a video? Don't watch it then. Is there some rule that when one gets to a certain age they can't like sex anymore? Appropriate?

When have The Rolling Stones ever been "appropriate"? They may be old men but it seems they still "are not worried about petty morals".

There is no shocking anymore. The only people that have complained about the Stones video having some young hot chick in it are right here at iorr. Apparently everywhere else no one else gives a shit.

thumbs up
It's the legendary negativity of this forum about all new Stones stuff...regardless!

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: 24FPS ()
Date: October 13, 2020 18:27

Ordered the GHS new stereo mix on SHM CD. I was going to wait until I could get a hold of the Blu Ray, but I've since heard it's not worth it.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: maumau ()
Date: October 13, 2020 18:40

i do like criss cross video very much, the explictness being part of it but it is not just that.
anyone can like anything or nothing about the stones, no big deal, though the negativity in a "fan website" is more evident.
facts are: the director is not a nobody, she has a made many videos that have gained attention in the industry. enough to get The Rolling Stones to push her video with her name in evidence on it and that is not frequent (in the past that was for the likes of Fincher, Gondry and a not many others, maybe Romanek for Keith)
so you may like it or not but still the difference is objective between instant video commercials made by the first advertising agency's hired director and a video like that. if you look at the director's website, you see it is a long term project turned into the criss cross video.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Date: October 13, 2020 18:47

Quote
24FPS
Ordered the GHS new stereo mix on SHM CD. I was going to wait until I could get a hold of the Blu Ray, but I've since heard it's not worth it.

The video quality is excellent (great to have those videos in this quality!). I only have two speakers in my stereo system, so I can't really judge the dolby atmos-sound. However, the stereo mix-option sounds great on the bluray.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-10-13 18:49 by DandelionPowderman.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: VoodooLounge13 ()
Date: October 13, 2020 21:32

Quote
Whale
Quote
ironbelly
Quote
Whale
One more question.
I wanted to buy the japanese CD to have the two extra songs.
There was a german webshop I believe where you can do that.
Can somebody point me to the right item?
Same question for the San Jose CD.
Thanks!
Here is the link for San Jose DVD+2CD
[www.jpc.de]
as above + t-shirt
[www.jpc.de]
San Jose Bluray+2CD
[www.jpc.de]

They do not have Japanese version of Goats Head Soup with bonus tracks. For that you should go to cdjapan or amazon Japan
[www.amazon.co.jp]
[www.cdjapan.co.jp]

Thanks!


This is why I always research the heck out of things before making a purchase! Is the only way to get the Japanese bonus tracks on the expensive version? Are they not available on a cheaper version? And I missed that San Jose had bonus tracks. Now I need to go back to get that version. Do any of the other Vault releases have bonus tracks in Japan? Not the separate Ward releases - those are a whole other animal!!!

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: kowalski ()
Date: October 14, 2020 08:14

While I totally like this reissue (the new mix, the new tracks...), I find that the bonus disc is a better listening experience without the first 2 tracks (Scarlet & All The Rage) and with 2 Japanese bonus tracks added. The 2 new tracks, to me, don't belong to the GHS era.
Without these 2 tracks you have a proper and geniune 10 tracks archival bonus disc with one outtake, a couple of alternate takes & instrumentals and the 5 Glyn Johns alternate mixes (like the wider stereo mix).

My home made CD (I still make some, don't you ?) goes like this :
(Side 1)
1.Criss Cross
2.100 Years Ago (Piano Demo)
3.Dancing With Mr. D. (Instrumental)
4.Heartbreaker (Instrumental)
5.Hide Your Love (Alternative Mix)
(Side 2)
6.Dancing With Mr. D. (Glyn Johns 1973 Mix)
7.100 Years Ago (Glyn Johns 1973 Mix)
8.Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker) (Glyn Johns 1973 Mix)
9.Silver Train (Glyn Johns 1973 Mix)
10. Can You Hear The Music (Glyn Johns 1973 Mix)

I'd put the 2 new tracks at the end of the 2020 mix of the main album.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: ironbelly ()
Date: October 14, 2020 13:15

Quote
VoodooLounge13
Is the only way to get the Japanese bonus tracks on the expensive version?
Yes.

Quote
VoodooLounge13
Are they not available on a cheaper version?
No.

Quote
VoodooLounge13
Do any of the other Vault releases have bonus tracks in Japan? Not the separate Ward releases - those are a whole other animal!!!
Yes.
Steel Wheels Live (3CD+Bluray+2DVD) has an extra track (Japanese interview 1990) on the 3rd bonus CD.
Bridges To Bremen (2CD+Bluray [UIXY-75009] or 2CD+DVD or stand alone Bluray or DVD) has an extra video Little Queenie (Exclusive Bonus Track) for Japan only. No extra audio, though.
Bridges to Buenos Aires (video portion only) has additional video of press conference 1997. No extra audio.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Irix ()
Date: October 14, 2020 21:20

Quote
ironbelly
Quote
VoodooLounge13

Is the only way to get the Japanese bonus tracks on the expensive version?

Yes.

No: [iorr.org] . winking smiley

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: 24FPS ()
Date: October 19, 2020 02:16

Wow! Last night I listened to the 2020 Stereo remix on a Japanese SHM CD. This is NOT the Goats Head Soup I remember from 1973. Back then I was disappointed at how uneven the sound was. How the songs weren't quite up to snuff. Hearing it 'improved' makes it a whole new album.

The SHM new stereo mix version creates a sonic aura that simply wasn't there before. You can hear all the instruments cleanly, and not muddied up like before. The biggest revelation from hearing it this way? This is Mick Taylor's finest album with the Stones. For the most part his bass on Dancing With Mr. D. is fantastic, as is just about everything else he plays on almost every song.

Another thing I've never heard gone into in much detail is the absence of Bill Wyman. Three cuts? That's it. He's an absolute artist on Angie, but there's precious little of him on the album. I thought he was there when they recorded the album. Did they wipe most of his stuff and replace it with Keith or Mick Taylor?

I used to find Silver Train annoying. It just didn't seem to go anywhere. In this version it's almost funky. The album has always been a bit controversial, but now I get it. The Stones created a soul album. They knew they had to move away from the harder rock sound, to be viable artistically. (Which they followed up with tongue in cheek, almost comical album in It's Only Rock and Roll).

Some songs just can be spruced up. 'Can You Hear The Music' still doesn't cut it, for me. And there's not a lot you do to 'Star Star'. But overall this is a great album. Much better than IORR, Black and Blue, or Emotional Rescue.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: October 19, 2020 15:15

Seems to me after perusing this thread that the GHS re-issue has been a success in one very real way.

Quite a lot of folks now seem to consider it a better album than they previously gave it credit for.

Result ,grinning smiley

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Date: October 19, 2020 15:22

Quote
24FPS
Wow! Last night I listened to the 2020 Stereo remix on a Japanese SHM CD. This is NOT the Goats Head Soup I remember from 1973. Back then I was disappointed at how uneven the sound was. How the songs weren't quite up to snuff. Hearing it 'improved' makes it a whole new album.

The SHM new stereo mix version creates a sonic aura that simply wasn't there before. You can hear all the instruments cleanly, and not muddied up like before. The biggest revelation from hearing it this way? This is Mick Taylor's finest album with the Stones. For the most part his bass on Dancing With Mr. D. is fantastic, as is just about everything else he plays on almost every song.

Another thing I've never heard gone into in much detail is the absence of Bill Wyman. Three cuts? That's it. He's an absolute artist on Angie, but there's precious little of him on the album. I thought he was there when they recorded the album. Did they wipe most of his stuff and replace it with Keith or Mick Taylor?

I used to find Silver Train annoying. It just didn't seem to go anywhere. In this version it's almost funky. The album has always been a bit controversial, but now I get it. The Stones created a soul album. They knew they had to move away from the harder rock sound, to be viable artistically. (Which they followed up with tongue in cheek, almost comical album in It's Only Rock and Roll).

Some songs just can be spruced up. 'Can You Hear The Music' still doesn't cut it, for me. And there's not a lot you do to 'Star Star'. But overall this is a great album. Much better than IORR, Black and Blue, or Emotional Rescue.

It's a new mix on all formats. Hence this huge thread smiling smiley

I like it, too. Good work by Martin!

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: October 19, 2020 16:13

I certainly dig the new mix. I like the differences. Like the scream in Mr D missing. Overall it has a little more bite to it.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: October 19, 2020 18:04

I could finally decipher part of what Jagger is saying at the beginning of Dancing With Mr D ,or at least some of the words.The last11words are “you better get out of here or he’ll kill ya”

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Bashlets ()
Date: October 19, 2020 18:49

The new mix to my ears perks it up a bit. Can you hear the music really shines. I used to view it as a throwaway track but really loving it now. I hope Martin would do IORR album

Re: Criss Cross - out tomorrow
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: October 19, 2020 19:10

Quote
MadMax
Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Nikkei
Quote
Sighunt
Quote
bitusa2012
I like it. But the video? Now, I’m a red blooded male. But that’s crass from a band pushing into their 80s. Do they really think in 2020, that’s appropriate?

I remember many of us squirmed with Keith’s “Bare your breasts And let me feel at home” line, at his age, from This Place is Empty in 2005. 15 years later we get this tawdry video...

After the refreshing Living in a ghost Town video, this one is dreadful.

But I like the song.

For me, it is not that I'm a prude, I just think that the video is pointless. Here you are the Rolling Stones who are showcasing (arguably) one of their better outtake/rarities for the world to hear for the first time, and you match it up with a T & A video coming from guys in their 70's...C'mon!

i went back all the way to page whatever of this thread just looking for opinions on that video. I guess it's not for everyone, just like the Stones themselves. Going out on a limb I assume there was A LOT of thought put into this one especially compared to the Ghost Town video. Not much appreciation from the superfans makes me appreciate it just that much more.

and btw we're calling them 80somethings now, just like that?

I see some have forgotten who the Stones are.

They never said they'd grow old gracefully.

Why does anyone give a shit if a skinny goofy hot young chick is in a video? Don't watch it then. Is there some rule that when one gets to a certain age they can't like sex anymore? Appropriate?

When have The Rolling Stones ever been "appropriate"? They may be old men but it seems they still "are not worried about petty morals".

There is no shocking anymore. The only people that have complained about the Stones video having some young hot chick in it are right here at iorr. Apparently everywhere else no one else gives a shit.


AMEN

giddy up!

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: October 20, 2020 00:06

>Can you hear the music really shines. I used to view it as a throwaway track

I edited my mp3 rip down to about 25 seconds...the intro chimes that are barely audible and then the Nepalese trailing off at the end. To me, totally the best and possibly only redeeming parts of the track. I call it You Can't Hear the Music. Maybe I will upload it to YouTube.

jb

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: October 20, 2020 00:34

HECK !!!!! ..... maybe best I just take Sally AND Sue



ROCKMAN

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: October 20, 2020 10:30

Quote
Bashlets
.... I hope Martin would do IORR album

Now there's a thought !

Not so much depth to reveal maybe...but it would certainly be interesting to hear it opened up a bit.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: October 21, 2020 00:30

Maybe Martin can get a better bass sound.The bass sound IMO is pretty bad

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: November 23, 2020 14:31

Quote
Doxa
GOATS HEAD SOUP Deluxe edition has been now out three weeks. Let's have a look how it is doing in Spotify. Thankfully, chartmasters - by the example of Spotify I guess - is treating the reissue as an individual relaese, so its streams are still seperated from the streams of the old release.

The whole brandnew GHS box has now gained 10,0 million streams (9,988,524 to be precise). Add there about 0,5m from a separate "Scarlet" Single Mix release.

The 'new' tracks are clearly the biggest 'hits'; here we are talking streams in millions.
"Scarlet": 3,9m (2,2 + 1,1 (WOD mix) + 0,1 (Killers mix) + 0,5 (single mix))
"Criss Cross": 1,9m
"All The Rage": 1,5m

Then - long, long way behind - comes the original remixed tracks. We better talk in thousands now. They rank from 121,1k ("Can You Hear The Music"?) to 231,4k streams ("Dancing With Mr. D").

The next 'category' in popularity is the alternative versions. The most popular is Piano Demo version of "100 Years Ago" with its 110,7k streams, followed by intrumental versions of "Mr. D" (89,4k) and "Heartbreaker" (88,9k). And then "Hide Your Love" (83,7k). Of the Johns mixes, "Mr. D" (119,5k) is the most popular, followed by "Silver Train" (88,5k) and "Heartbreaker" (86,4k).

The last category is clearly BRUSSELS AFFAIR. The live cuts are streamed between 83,1k ("Brown Sugar") and 40,5k ("Rip This Joint"). It could be that this legendary live gem is hidden in the GHS release. If it be an seperate, more profilic relaese, it would be discovered more easily. But I wouldn't be surprised that in the long run this category will be do much better in future.

So what we could say of its streaming popularity?

Surely we cannot with its 10,5m streams in three weeks talk about any big hit album if compared to contemporary acts, but still I would say it is doing rather okay. If we compare to what some other 'old farts' are doing in Spotify, The Who's brandnew studio album WHO from last year has been streamed by about equal amount (10,2m), its biggest 'hit' "Ball And Chain" having 2.2m streams, and only two other tracks over 1 million. Dylan's new ROUGH AND ROWDY WAYS has been streamed about twice as much by now (20,7m), each track over 1 million streams, biggest being "I Contain Multitudes" (3,6m).

Of course, The Stones themselves are a hard act to 'beat'. With its two versions "Living In A Ghost Town" has 19,7 million streams alone. Their last studio album BLUE & LONESOME has as huge as 72,2 million streams (tracks varying from 3,2m of "Just Like I Treat You" to 12,6m of "Hate To See You Go"). Even its little brother, the archives release ON AIR, with not much chart history, has now nice 22,5 million streams, with several tracks over 1 million.

Lastly an observation: as the streaming popularity of any 'new' track - "Ghost Town", "Scarlet", "Criss Cross", "All The Rage", all the B&L tracks - show, there is a clear interest, if not even demand, for brandnew Stones music, and not so much on re-mixes or alternative versions of old tracks... knock knock... (however, there is one big exception to a rule: Acoustic Version of "Wild Horses" from STICKY FINGERS Deluxe version has incredible 20,6 million streams!)

- Doxa

It's been roughly two months since I wrote the above. So it's time to reflect more what kind of success GOATS HEAD SOUP Reissue has been in Spotify world.

A quick answer: not much any kind of. Its point seemingly is, like generally is with catalogue artists, its physical sales (in all different kinds of packages die hard fans and completists seeking for). The money is there.

A long answer: two months ago, after three weeks its relaese, the album had 10,5 million streams, now 13,8 million streams (I include there 0,5 million of extra version of "Scarlet" not officially/technically included in the album).

Here are the numbers reflecting the categories I made above:

1. Scarlet: 4,8m (2,8 + 0,2 + 1,3 + 0,5)
2. Criss Cross: 2,2m
3. All The Rage: 2,1m

Normal tracks: from 400k (Angie) to 197k (Star Star)
Alternative versions: from 167k (100 Years Ago) to 130k (Heartbreaker)
Brussels Affair: from 119k (Brown Sugar) to 59k (Rip This Joint)

The new tracks gather some interest, but the rest - well, not even countable in streaming business really. Doesn't look like the album gather much interest outside Rolling Stones diehard fan circles (and occasional Zeppelin fans I guess in regard to "Scarlet"). And for them the only interest lies in new tracks - probably the 'old' album and BRUSSELS AFFAIR are just way too obvious and familiar stuff to get excited again.

Now, let us compare these numbers to their other reissues, of which STICKY FINGERS is the most comparable, since it was released during a proper streaming era (EXILE and SOME GIRLS quite not yet). The extra material of STICKY FINGERS didn't offer any new songs, but the alternative versions have done very well:

1. Wild Horses (Acoustic version): 20,9m
2. Brown Sugar (Clapton version): 4,6m
3. Can't You Hear Me Knocking (Alt. version): 2,5m
4. Dead Flowers (Alt. version): 1,7m
5. Bitch (Extended version): 1,6m

The Roundhouse live tracks: from 1,0m (Midnight Rambler) to 740k (Live With Me)
The Leeds live tracks: from 441k (Jumpin' Jack Flash) to 233k (Live With Me)

With Leeds stuff we can see the similar phenomenon as with Brussels material: probably way too familiar for diehards. But with Roundhouse it is different.

What goes for the other two releases, we have to remember that both EXILE and SOME GIRLS didn't gain much from the hype over a new product. But here are the rough numbers for them:

EXILE
1. Plundered My Soul: 1,9m
2. Pass the Wine: 1,1m
3. Following The River: 1,0m
The rest: from 915k (Dancing In The Light) to 650k (Soul Survivor - Alt. Take)

SOME GIRLS
1. No Spare Parts: 732k
2. Do You Think I Really Care: 506k
3. Claudine: 426k
The rest: from 390k (We Had It All) to 255k (Petrol Blues)

Although EXILE stuff clearly is more popular, both bonus albums are pretty forgotten deals in Spotify world.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-11-23 14:48 by Doxa.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: slewan ()
Date: November 23, 2020 16:17

Quote
Doxa
Quote
Doxa
GOATS HEAD SOUP Deluxe edition has been now out three weeks. Let's have a look how it is doing in Spotify. Thankfully, chartmasters - by the example of Spotify I guess - is treating the reissue as an individual relaese, so its streams are still seperated from the streams of the old release.

The whole brandnew GHS box has now gained 10,0 million streams (9,988,524 to be precise). Add there about 0,5m from a separate "Scarlet" Single Mix release.

The 'new' tracks are clearly the biggest 'hits'; here we are talking streams in millions.
"Scarlet": 3,9m (2,2 + 1,1 (WOD mix) + 0,1 (Killers mix) + 0,5 (single mix))
"Criss Cross": 1,9m
"All The Rage": 1,5m

Then - long, long way behind - comes the original remixed tracks. We better talk in thousands now. They rank from 121,1k ("Can You Hear The Music"?) to 231,4k streams ("Dancing With Mr. D").

The next 'category' in popularity is the alternative versions. The most popular is Piano Demo version of "100 Years Ago" with its 110,7k streams, followed by intrumental versions of "Mr. D" (89,4k) and "Heartbreaker" (88,9k). And then "Hide Your Love" (83,7k). Of the Johns mixes, "Mr. D" (119,5k) is the most popular, followed by "Silver Train" (88,5k) and "Heartbreaker" (86,4k).

The last category is clearly BRUSSELS AFFAIR. The live cuts are streamed between 83,1k ("Brown Sugar") and 40,5k ("Rip This Joint"). It could be that this legendary live gem is hidden in the GHS release. If it be an seperate, more profilic relaese, it would be discovered more easily. But I wouldn't be surprised that in the long run this category will be do much better in future.

So what we could say of its streaming popularity?

Surely we cannot with its 10,5m streams in three weeks talk about any big hit album if compared to contemporary acts, but still I would say it is doing rather okay. If we compare to what some other 'old farts' are doing in Spotify, The Who's brandnew studio album WHO from last year has been streamed by about equal amount (10,2m), its biggest 'hit' "Ball And Chain" having 2.2m streams, and only two other tracks over 1 million. Dylan's new ROUGH AND ROWDY WAYS has been streamed about twice as much by now (20,7m), each track over 1 million streams, biggest being "I Contain Multitudes" (3,6m).

Of course, The Stones themselves are a hard act to 'beat'. With its two versions "Living In A Ghost Town" has 19,7 million streams alone. Their last studio album BLUE & LONESOME has as huge as 72,2 million streams (tracks varying from 3,2m of "Just Like I Treat You" to 12,6m of "Hate To See You Go"). Even its little brother, the archives release ON AIR, with not much chart history, has now nice 22,5 million streams, with several tracks over 1 million.

Lastly an observation: as the streaming popularity of any 'new' track - "Ghost Town", "Scarlet", "Criss Cross", "All The Rage", all the B&L tracks - show, there is a clear interest, if not even demand, for brandnew Stones music, and not so much on re-mixes or alternative versions of old tracks... knock knock... (however, there is one big exception to a rule: Acoustic Version of "Wild Horses" from STICKY FINGERS Deluxe version has incredible 20,6 million streams!)

- Doxa

It's been roughly two months since I wrote the above. So it's time to reflect more what kind of success GOATS HEAD SOUP Reissue has been in Spotify world.

A quick answer: not much any kind of. Its point seemingly is, like generally is with catalogue artists, its physical sales (in all different kinds of packages die hard fans and completists seeking for). The money is there.

A long answer: two months ago, after three weeks its relaese, the album had 10,5 million streams, now 13,8 million streams (I include there 0,5 million of extra version of "Scarlet" not officially/technically included in the album).

Here are the numbers reflecting the categories I made above:

1. Scarlet: 4,8m (2,8 + 0,2 + 1,3 + 0,5)
2. Criss Cross: 2,2m
3. All The Rage: 2,1m

Normal tracks: from 400k (Angie) to 197k (Star Star)
Alternative versions: from 167k (100 Years Ago) to 130k (Heartbreaker)
Brussels Affair: from 119k (Brown Sugar) to 59k (Rip This Joint)

The new tracks gather some interest, but the rest - well, not even countable in streaming business really. Doesn't look like the album gather much interest outside Rolling Stones diehard fan circles (and occasional Zeppelin fans I guess in regard to "Scarlet"). And for them the only interest lies in new tracks - probably the 'old' album and BRUSSELS AFFAIR are just way too obvious and familiar stuff to get excited again.

Now, let us compare these numbers to their other reissues, of which STICKY FINGERS is the most comparable, since it was released during a proper streaming era (EXILE and SOME GIRLS quite not yet). The extra material of STICKY FINGERS didn't offer any new songs, but the alternative versions have done very well:

1. Wild Horses (Acoustic version): 20,9m
2. Brown Sugar (Clapton version): 4,6m
3. Can't You Hear Me Knocking (Alt. version): 2,5m
4. Dead Flowers (Alt. version): 1,7m
5. Bitch (Extended version): 1,6m

The Roundhouse live tracks: from 1,0m (Midnight Rambler) to 740k (Live With Me)
The Leeds live tracks: from 441k (Jumpin' Jack Flash) to 233k (Live With Me)

With Leeds stuff we can see the similar phenomenon as with Brussels material: probably way too familiar for diehards. But with Roundhouse it is different.

What goes for the other two releases, we have to remember that both EXILE and SOME GIRLS didn't gain much from the hype over a new product. But here are the rough numbers for them:

EXILE
1. Plundered My Soul: 1,9m
2. Pass the Wine: 1,1m
3. Following The River: 1,0m
The rest: from 915k (Dancing In The Light) to 650k (Soul Survivor - Alt. Take)

SOME GIRLS
1. No Spare Parts: 732k
2. Do You Think I Really Care: 506k
3. Claudine: 426k
The rest: from 390k (We Had It All) to 255k (Petrol Blues)

Although EXILE stuff clearly is more popular, both bonus albums are pretty forgotten deals in Spotify world.

- Doxa

interesting. Still there's at least one problem in comparing streaming numbers: GHS has been released just two month ago, the other re-issues a couple of years ago. Plus the numbers of people who use streaming has explodes ever since. Any meaningful comparison has to relate to these facts in one way or the other. For example: what were the numbers for streaming SF during the first two month of its release in relation to the people using spotify in those days…?

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: November 23, 2020 18:21

Quote
slewan


interesting. Still there's at least one problem in comparing streaming numbers: GHS has been released just two month ago, the other re-issues a couple of years ago. Plus the numbers of people who use streaming has explodes ever since. Any meaningful comparison has to relate to these facts in one way or the other. For example: what were the numbers for streaming SF during the first two month of its release in relation to the people using spotify in those days…?

Yes, indeed. That's the problem I tried to point out if trying to compare these numbers. The users of Spotify are increasing by number all the time. I think only STICKY FINGERS numbers can be somehow comparable to GHS by having the gain of novelty in reaching audience - even though five years is a long time in streaming business (so GHS needs to have a bigger potential audience). What I don't have are the streams of STICKY's first months - and how much of its current numbers derive after its first hot weeks (the case of 'Acoustic Version' of "Wild Horses" is especially interesting - does its big numbers to be explained by taking its share, by accident or something, of the continuing huge popularity of the song). However, what is noteworthy in any new releases - at least by the old guard - is that they gain very big numbers during the first week(s) or so - then quickly going down, and like achieving a 'normal', steady level. But there is nothing strange in those streaming numbers. Similarly I guess even if we buy a physical copy of the album, we most likely are first busy listening it all the time, but after some weeks we might not be that hungry any longer... Streaming numbers tell that story rather plainly...

But that leaves out the phenomenon that Spotify emphasizes cruely: hits are hits and, in the case of the old guard, classics are classics. Those are kind of singular songs that people just listen in rotation no matter what happens. For example, during the two last months when the whole new GHS package got together some three million streams, just one singular song from the album - the 'old' version of "Angie" - gained eight million streams. What is a challenge especially for the old guard is to achieve such a status for their new songs. With "Living In A Ghost Town" the Stones are doing a rather good job in trying that. During the same period of two months it achieved almost six million streams (after a half year of its release). It is numbers like that that asks clearly more than a hardcore fan interest.

But back to reissues: both EXILE and SOME GIRLS numbers derive after their heyday mostly - so they are easy to compare to each other. Like, say, BETWEEN THE BUTTONS or UNDERCOVER are. So, funnily all albums/songs are comparable had they released before 2010 or so (since then it gets difficult)... But it is the past history that mostly interests me in Spotify numbers: since it only covers some ten years or so that gives a rather good indication how, for example, such a huge catalogue as the Stones have, is viewed nowadays. What is remembered and what not, etc.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-11-23 18:32 by Doxa.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: November 24, 2020 00:25

Obviously having a band on Spotify (etc) that's been around a long time versus a new band that hasn't (I can personally attest to that) is going to generate interest no matter what.

Led Zeppelin and U2 each have a song with just under 500 million streams. AC/DC has 3 over 600 million.

If something is considered at hit is it generally Spotify that's looked at? That seems to be the one that most people wonder about. I haven't heard anyone say Apple Music outloud, yet alone Tidal or Amazon, it's always Spotify.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: November 24, 2020 11:04

Quote
GasLightStreet
Obviously having a band on Spotify (etc) that's been around a long time versus a new band that hasn't (I can personally attest to that) is going to generate interest no matter what.

Led Zeppelin and U2 each have a song with just under 500 million streams. AC/DC has 3 over 600 million.

If something is considered at hit is it generally Spotify that's looked at? That seems to be the one that most people wonder about. I haven't heard anyone say Apple Music outloud, yet alone Tidal or Amazon, it's always Spotify.

It looks like indeed that Spotify seems to have a some kind of monopoly over determining 'hit', which I think mostly due to their original/pioneering status in the streaming business and them actually telling those numbers. However, they cover - the last time I recall reading it some years ago - something like 40% of the market (could be less nowadays, though).

But what goes for rock bands making real hits nowadays that sounds like a mission impossible, be them old or young. The streaming market is dominated by someone else than rock bands as we know - so whatever they release doesn't have any chance against Eddie Shearan, Drake or anyone the kids listen to nowadays. In a couple of weeks the top singles get so many streams that rock bands can only dream of.

However, the old guard - the classic rock artists - have the advantage of having all those old anthems and evergreens that been promoted by classic rock stations, tv commercials, movies, parents and grandparents and whatever for ages. People seem to listen them by habit - like belonging to the household. They are steady streamers. So about every classic rock band/artist has a tune or two - some even more - that has pretty respectable streaming numbers (even though outside of Queen's "Bohemian Rhapsody", with its over billion streams, not in the class of today's pop stars). The Stones' biggest one is "Paint It Black" with its 496 million streams, funnily similar number as the peak songs by U2, Led Zeppelin and Pink Floyd. But what is typical to all of them, none of their new releases - if they happen have any - seem to have a chance to make any difference any longer. Those new releases come and go - gather a couple of millions streams during their first weeks, and that's it. Probably more than new rock bands due to their big name (having a bigger potential audience being curious of their latest offerings).

So the about 14 million streams of GOATS HEAD SOUP in two and a half months means about next to nothing in streaming business, but if compared to some of their contemporariers, it's not that bad. The Who's much hyped album from last year has gathered 11,5 million streams by now, while their peak singular song "Papa O'Riley" has 302m streams. Dylan's even more hyped 'number one album' 23m (the peak "Like A Rolling Stone", 197m), Bruce's latest 28,7m by now (the peak "Dancing In The Dark", 293m streams). Interesting to see how AC/DC and Macca will do. They most likely have a bit more commercial appeal.

Bruce's "Letter To You" with its 6 million streams can be seen as some kind of hit song. It was released September 10th - so it's been out for 2 and a half months. However, to see the context there surely are several Bruce's own evergreen songs that easily has outstreamed it during that time frame. I don't know that exactly, but, for example, of the artists I do know, "Paint It Black" has have over 20 million streams during that time, and even "Living In A Ghost Town" still briefly outstreaming it.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-11-24 11:27 by Doxa.

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Date: November 24, 2020 13:08

<and them actually telling those numbers>

That's the key here (and very smart of Spotify - since the accessability of those numbers attracts everyone to their services)

Re: Goats Head Soup Reissue - out September 4
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: November 24, 2020 16:17

I get that one song having 14 million streams doesn't mean 14 million people listened to it but there must be some element of interest to some of the old guard in the comparison of streams for a single vs sales of a 45 (I exclude CD singles because they never really did anything as far as I know) because no one sold 14 million copies of a single in 3 months (that's just an exaggerated example, I really don't know).

I've wondered about that, streaming vs sales, just for the sake of enough people streaming a new release by whoever, Drake vs the sales of Paperback Writer etc:

There is no realistic way to compare the success of a single based on streams because even though Paperback Writer sold a million plus copies in the US alone (and who knows if those certified numbers are actually true) there's no way to know how many times those million plus copies got played and for how long.

With Spotify that seems to be the only thing is how many times it got streamed. I understand "that's how it is" now but it's not realistic for who's actually listening versus just hearing/playing a song. In the 1960s-1990s the only way to spread the word about a single was

radio
various print ads in magazines, newspapers, record stores, etc
word of mouth

For some it took months to reach a selling status or if the were fortunate a high chart status.

The last 10 years plus the way to spread the word about a single has been

email
text message
social media post
Alexa
Pandora
YouTube
Spotify
iTunes
various commercials

all done within seconds of communication versus days. Singles, EPs and LPs can chart at number one immediately or within a week.

Maybe the ultimate change is the amount of people having a laptop, phone, tablet with access to music players vs people going to a record store to buy a single and having the proper record player for it. It's probably some kind of 4500 to 1 kind of difference. Maybe it's much higher, 1 million to 1.

In the Twenty Hundreds if you live in the country or the city with internet or data, you can listen any release available any time. At some point someone having a song streamed 400 million times will be considered weak.

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