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Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Date: July 30, 2019 13:19

Quote
GetYerAngie
Quote
Doxa
An interesting thread and issue.

To me YA-YA'S always been an essential album, a part of the golden run of albums from BEGGARS to EXILE, like an artistic transformation from the band and sound of BEGGARS BANQUET/LET IT BLEED to the band and sound of STICKY FINGERS/EXILE. A 'bridge album' from the 60's to 70's if you like.

But I do get the criticism of how the album sounds today - compared to the Big Four studio albums, which are eternally wonderful sounding albums - perfect pieces in production, mix and sounds. No 'contextual' understanding is needed to get their greatness. They defy time. Like masterpieces should do.

But by contrast, I don't think YA-YA's has survived so well. At the time I got to know the album - 1982 - it sounded bloody incredible - as I played so loud I could (and my parents allow) through my lousy hifi system. It was through it I truely got convinced how majestic the riff of "Jumping Jack Flash" is, and what a killer the song altogether is. The same especially with "Street Fighting Man". I had the studio versions for sure by then, and I dug them a lot, but it was the YA-YA'S versions that totally blew my mind. If the originals sounded initially to my teenager ears a bit odd with their sixties experimental vibe (took some years to really get their magic), those live versions spoke to me in timeless language. It was simply best sounding rock music I ever had heard. I guess it thoe YA-YA'S versions, especially in regard to "Flash" and "Fighting Man" that are blueprinted in my mind, and I compare any other live versions unintentionally to them. And they always fail the test in making such a huge impression... (However, with iconic "Rambler", the Brussels version - which I get to knew from BEDSPRING SYMPHONY bootleg - actually later made the YA-YA'S one sound like an early sketch not yet fulfilling all of its potential).

But yeah, to my ears the album still sounds musically magnificiant, but at the same time I do recognize that - compared to recorded live music ever (Stones or not) - it sonically and production-wise needs a bit acquired taste to get its magic. There is a certain charm in its muddy, non-separated division of tracks, in which each instrument, including Jagger's voice, interestingly - and tightly, though a slightly out of tune sometimes - makes together one big wall of sound. But I do understand not every listener, even a Rolling Stones fan, gets or need to get it.

- Doxa

I was blown away, when I heard GYYYO the first time in the spring 1975, when I was eleven years old. The collage-like introduction, the false start and the the first chords of JJF - and Jagger's voice. That was timelessness incarnated - and still is and will, I guess, remain so - for me. GYYYO is the first of BIG FOUR LIVE ALBUMS - of which the last three wasn't properly officially released for decades: Ladies and gentlemen, Brussels affair and Live in Texas, The El Mocambo-part from LYL might be added to those BIG FOUR, but otherwise the later live-albums are somewhat disappointing, even though they might be better recorded.
44 years later I still ger goosbumps when I put GYYYO on.

A timeless classic live album indeed thumbs up

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: His Majesty ()
Date: July 30, 2019 19:41

Quite a bold move for "effectively a new band" (- Mick Taylor) to release a live album as it's true debut. grinning smiley

It's a glorious piece of rock history that does what it is supposed to do. Represent the new band and give listeners an amazing buzz.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: shadooby ()
Date: July 31, 2019 02:25

Get Yer Ya Yas Out is the greatest live album of all time...PERIOD!

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: bleedingman ()
Date: July 31, 2019 02:31

All accounts of that tour say that they had minimal rehearsal. I guess sometimes that's for the best. In some ways, the Altamont bootleg is even better.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: shadooby ()
Date: July 31, 2019 02:34

It's no hangin matter, it's no capital crime...

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: Redhotcarpet ()
Date: July 31, 2019 08:42

I loved it when I first bought it but then I heard the -72 boots.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: RobertJohnson ()
Date: July 31, 2019 10:33

Quote
frankotero
Think it's odd how the bonus tracks on the 40th anniversary edition sound modern. Wonder why the original album couldn't have the same quality. Maybe there's another "complete" edition somewhere in the plans?


I hope so. The difference between the "old" album and the new tracks from the anniversary edition is striking. Although MJ is out of tune sometimes (particularly on the Under My Thumb/I'm Free-Medley), his vocal performance is far better and more lively than on the Ya Ya-version from 1970. There was no need for overdubbing then (One recognize it, if one hear the original tunes on boots or YouTube). It resulted in "Verschlimmbesserung", to say it in German. So I hope, as I said, that the three performances in MSG 1969 will be released eventually in "modern shape".

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Date: July 31, 2019 12:47

One of the best ever recorded live electric guitars; no pedal boards, double boosters and distortion boxes, just straight into an Ampeg at 10 - is Keith on 'Stray Cat Blues", the choruses, and behind Taylor's solo. That is some of the finest sounDing guitaR and playing I know of.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: July 31, 2019 13:24

I just had a thought that is this a troll ? trolling us by disparaging the masterpiece that is Get Yer Ya Ya's out and Gimmie Shelter from the Mayles ? As an advisory we should not feed the trolls !

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: July 31, 2019 14:10

Quote
GetYerAngie


I was blown away, when I heard GYYYO the first time in the spring 1975, when I was eleven years old. The collage-like introduction, the false start and the the first chords of JJF - and Jagger's voice. That was timelessness incarnated - and still is and will, I guess, remain so - for me.

Yep. You remind me of having my first listening of YA-YA'S. It was the introduction and the start of "Flash" that hit me BIG, BIG time. Damn that riff is like a sledgehammer. So raw, so strong, so deep, so catchy. Dark, dark, dark... Add there the groove, backed up by the drums and the bass, and then Jagger's aggressive voice, just shouting the lines and words to go along the riff and groove. Rock and roll just can't be played any better.

I have heard that they skipped the intro of "Flash" since it reminded too much of "Street Fighting Man", but I don't quite buy it. I think they realized that the effect to start the song just by going straight to the 'point', a'la "Satisfaction", was just more effective. This is nothing to downplay the effectiviness of the original studio version (which is more than perfect by its own means), but their re-arrangement to make the song to work live is just another mark of their brilliance. It is almost like another song, making the monster riff in its total bad-ass glory a clear and distinct centerpiece of the song. In the studio version it is more buried to the wholeness, and the whole vibe and groove of the song is different. If in a studio version the riff and the whole swinging backing track giving a safe and sure template for Mick to sing melodies in a proper sense, in a live setting it is more like Jagger riding on the waves of it, trying to be in a sync with it (which he is). Forget the melodies there...

Going memoryline, I don't think any guitar riff (and intro) has had so huge effect on me by first listening than the YA-YA'S "Flash" and "Purple Haze" by JImi Hendrix (the opening cut of SMASH HITS). I guess it was 1982, and me thirteen, I get to hear both of those gems. Still today, everytime I get to hear "Flash" live in concert, it gives me goosebumps. That riff is a monster (did I say that already?smiling smiley).

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2019-07-31 14:15 by Doxa.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: His Majesty ()
Date: July 31, 2019 14:29

Quote
TheGreek
I just had a thought that is this a troll ? trolling us by disparaging the masterpiece that is Get Yer Ya Ya's out and Gimmie Shelter from the Mayles ? As an advisory we should not feed the trolls !

Perhaps, but looking at some of the comments it seems it is an opinion that is shared.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: bigmac7895 ()
Date: July 31, 2019 14:43

I’m in agreement with Torn and Frayed. One way to test is to get yourself some decent headphones and listen to the album through them. Once you hear how awesome the recording actually is even on cheap headphones, then you can go back and test your speakers. If you have some older speakers (even some nice ones) the outer edge of the material can become dry rotted and you will have the more muffled sound. I had to have my Infinity RSB-III woofers rewarded by the inventor of the woofer for Infinity Mr. Watkins.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: glimmertwin1 ()
Date: July 31, 2019 15:40

He is right:

-the Audio of the Gimme Shelter movie isn't very good (the DVD).
- Ya-Ya's bonus DVD sounds good.
- Ya-Ya's bonus CD is to compressed.
- Get Yer Ya-Ya's sounds stellar compared to the movies.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: nonfilter ()
Date: August 1, 2019 02:06

I’m definitely not a troll. I fell in love with The Stones sound when I heard JJF at 12 years old. I most recently saw them at Chicago opening night. even seem to be one of few here who genuinely loves Voodoo Lounge and BTB. The only albums that are subpar sound or mixing-wise to me are Between The Buttons (thin), GHS & IORR(muffled). But people seem to share my opinion occasionally on those three. I have tried since 1993 when I first got Gimmee Shelter on VHS to love the 1969 tour. It’s okay. Just not up to Stones standards in my book. Now 1972 on the other hand, wow. Ladies and Gentlemen even sounded great on my first VHS mono boot copy.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: bleedingman ()
Date: August 1, 2019 02:15

Much as I love Keith's current sound, I would love it if he went back to the Ampegs. Par for the course with that tour, Stu procured them at the last minute. They blew out on occasion but for me that is the quintessential Stones live guitar sound.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: JadedFaded ()
Date: August 1, 2019 05:30

1970. I was 13 years old and I was blown away by GYYYO. For me, listening to music is emotional. Whenever I listen to GYYYO, it takes me all the way back to those early formative music years. With the Stones especially, I don’t listen clinically. I don’t care what instruments are slightly out of tune, if the lyrics are flubbed, etc. I just care about how the music makes me feel. I love GYYYO!

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 1, 2019 08:12

I've not been a fan of JJF for eons, on live record anyway, going back to LOVE YOU LIVE.

Because the version on GYYYO! is supreme - but then the version in GIMME SHELTER is even better. Since then they've slaughtered it, but as Keith says, if that can't get you going...

When they opened with it in New Orleans recently, I liked it. It wasn't so overcooked as it has been in the past 20 some years - partially because they didn't play it for 15 minutes.

Nothing will ever come close to 1969, I know, and it's evolved quite a bit since then... and the opening song for 2019 is pretty good, so.. I forget my point.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Date: August 1, 2019 09:00

<I have heard that they skipped the intro of "Flash" since it reminded too much of "Street Fighting Man", but I don't quite buy it. I think they realized that the effect to start the song just by going straight to the 'point', a'la "Satisfaction", was just more effective>

There's a technical side to this as well. The original is in a different tuning. By using open G, like Keith chose in concert, you won't reach the dark notes in the intro (mainly the E-chord).

He tried to do it once in 1989, though, in that club show. But it didn't really work smiling smiley

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: filstan ()
Date: August 1, 2019 16:01

Quote
TheGreek
I just had a thought that is this a troll ? trolling us by disparaging the masterpiece that is Get Yer Ya Ya's out and Gimmie Shelter from the Mayles ? As an advisory we should not feed the trolls !

Funny you mentioned that. I thought exactly the same thing. When I first saw the post I just started laughing. Really, abuse the sound quality of GYYYO as well as the soundtrack on GS? The drum sound from Charlie is fantastic. Glyn did a great job with what he had to work with. The guitar sound on YaYa's is amazing IMO. Bill soars as well. We even get bits of Stew in there as well that take those songs to a different level. Having seen the Stones in 69 their sound was unique to anything I had ever heard by ANY band. I guess it was their rigs and certainly those Ampeg speakers had something big to do with it too. This is captured on GYYYO. SFM is the definitive live version on GYYO and gives the studio version a run for the money.That sound IS epitome of the 1969 Rolling Stones.

The argument can be made that certain pressings of this album sound a bit flat in comparison. My first pressing US London Waddell always sounded good to me, but like most people, we didn't know any better. We just went out and bought the damn records when they were released not knowing that there better quality pressings around, especially US London vs UK Decca. GYYYO is a classic example of this. Ironically enough I FINALLY secured a near mint stereo UK Decca GYYYO yesterday after all these years. Let me tell you, this LP explodes out of the speakers compared with the US LOndon releases. Night and day difference. All I can say is wow! My other comment with GYYYO is listen to the SACD. The SACD sound is also very, very good, and to my ears way better that the US vinyl. That said, a quality not heavily played US pressing turned up on a decent sound system will still curl your toes.

The pity of GYYYO is we didn't get a full show. The brilliant 40th Anniversary release fills in the blanks. That box is a must have for serious fans. The fidelity on the CD is very good, and the extra 5 tracks on the other CD are essential. I simply love that sound on those tracks. The drum sound is amazing in particular.

What's not to like about the sound on GS? First seen in the theater they had it cranked up and we were blown away. I have always loved that MSG JJF. Better than YaYa's imo. There is a purity to that rendition. They have it down. Satisfaction just rocks the house. The Altamont stuff is very good as well. Pity there wasn't more of it....Bottom line is, this is how the band sounded in 1969. To me that remains my favorite tour sound. Sure if you were there, the 72-73 tours were fantastic sound wise too, but YaYa's and GS show the band in terrific form. Thankfully we have those recordings. BTW, the Criterion DVD/Blu-ray edition is terrific. How anyone can bitch about the sound quality there simply doesn't get it.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Date: August 1, 2019 16:09

Quote
filstan
Quote
TheGreek
I just had a thought that is this a troll ? trolling us by disparaging the masterpiece that is Get Yer Ya Ya's out and Gimmie Shelter from the Mayles ? As an advisory we should not feed the trolls !

Funny you mentioned that. I thought exactly the same thing. When I first saw the post I just started laughing. Really, abuse the sound quality of GYYYO as well as the soundtrack on GS? The drum sound from Charlie is fantastic. Glyn did a great job with what he had to work with. The guitar sound on YaYa's is amazing IMO. Bill soars as well. We even get bits of Stew in there as well that take those songs to a different level. Having seen the Stones in 69 their sound was unique to anything I had ever heard by ANY band. I guess it was their rigs and certainly those Ampeg speakers had something big to do with it too. This is captured on GYYYO. SFM is the definitive live version on GYYO and gives the studio version a run for the money.That sound IS epitome of the 1969 Rolling Stones.

The argument can be made that certain pressings of this album sound a bit flat in comparison. My first pressing US London Waddell always sounded good to me, but like most people, we didn't know any better. We just went out and bought the damn records when they were released not knowing that there better quality pressings around, especially US London vs UK Decca. GYYYO is a classic example of this. Ironically enough I FINALLY secured a near mint stereo UK Decca GYYYO yesterday after all these years. Let me tell you, this LP explodes out of the speakers compared with the US LOndon releases. Night and day difference. All I can say is wow! My other comment with GYYYO is listen to the SACD. The SACD sound is also very, very good, and to my ears way better that the US vinyl. That said, a quality not heavily played US pressing turned up on a decent sound system will still curl your toes.

The pity of GYYYO is we didn't get a full show. The brilliant 40th Anniversary release fills in the blanks. That box is a must have for serious fans. The fidelity on the CD is very good, and the extra 5 tracks on the other CD are essential. I simply love that sound on those tracks. The drum sound is amazing in particular.

What's not to like about the sound on GS? First seen in the theater they had it cranked up and we were blown away. I have always loved that MSG JJF. Better than YaYa's imo. There is a purity to that rendition. They have it down. Satisfaction just rocks the house. The Altamont stuff is very good as well. Pity there wasn't more of it....Bottom line is, this is how the band sounded in 1969. To me that remains my favorite tour sound. Sure if you were there, the 72-73 tours were fantastic sound wise too, but YaYa's and GS show the band in terrific form. Thankfully we have those recordings. BTW, the Criterion DVD/Blu-ray edition is terrific. How anyone can bitch about the sound quality there simply doesn't get it.

Agreed. The reason they cut the middle section of set was obviously the vinyl restrictions for time; i.e.sound quality. And like Dandy says re JJF intro - the same can be said for the entire album: make it tight, and a hard charger. Right to the point. The acoustic set, and those few mid tempo electric songs temper a live album. also it seems like the Stones were a bit more flower early on in the tour; while in the West Coast. The set seemed a lot more mellow. Jagger "We didn't get it on until Detroit".

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: shortfatfanny ()
Date: August 1, 2019 23:33

Quote
nonfilter
I have a great surround system. I love the album and the film, but is the sound quality really considered good? Every other live recording they ever released sounds light years ahead of these two to me. It’s puzzled me for years!

Guess you never listened to voodoo lounge uncut Miami '94 or Havana moon...


Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: Single Malt ()
Date: August 2, 2019 21:34

I wouldn't mind listening GYYYO from old mono record player because it still sounds great through an old speaker compared to clean crap like Flashpoint. To me, it's the music, not the sound quality.

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Date: August 2, 2019 21:45

Maybe nonfilter only have a bad remaster? winking smiley

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: NICOS ()
Date: August 2, 2019 23:37

Quote
Single Malt
I wouldn't mind listening GYYYO from old mono record player because it still sounds great through an old speaker compared to clean crap like Flashpoint. To me, it's the music, not the sound quality.

thumbs up

__________________________

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: strat72 ()
Date: August 3, 2019 01:58

Quote
nonfilter
Can someone enlighten me? I always hear Get Your Ya Ya’s Out praised as being The Stones greatest live album. The musicianship, to me, is decent, but not noteworthy. What am I missing? Jagger sounds strained and slightly off key at best. Keith’s guitar sounds muffled and also slightly out of tune. Bill’s bass is great, but poorly recorded. Same for Charlie’s drums. Mick Taylor sounds like he’s a very talented 19 year old practicing his lead licks over the best band in the world’s worst recorded live performances. His guitar also sounds muffled to me. The Gimme Shelter film sounds like the same thing to me. And all the songs seem to be in slow motion. What am I missing?

What are you missing?

Could it be good taste? Are you a fan of Flashpoint?

Sorry Nonfilter, I couldn't resist.....

Re: Ya Ya’s and Gimme Shelter Film Sound Pretty Horrible
Posted by: sanQ ()
Date: August 26, 2019 04:03

I love to listen to this album on headphones and in the car where it sounds best. There are so many great things about this album. I listen to this album with a 1969 Sansui stereo with 1969 or early 1970's speakers...modern "audiophile" stuff makes the Stones sound like crap. It needs bass and lots of it. That's the best sound right there. Modern Stones live albums sound better on a modern system. But none of those albums from the 80's to the present are as good as Ya Yas, Ladies and Gentlemen or Love You Live. The guitar creativity and riffs of Keith Richards was at it's peak in those years, and that's why YaYas is awesome. Plus it has Mick Taylor. This albums sounds amazing still to me with amazing guitar tone from those Ampeg amps.

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