Tell Me :
Talk
Great Snaps. Is there a photocredit here?
Just finished the book last night. Learned some stuff. I didn't realize Passaros lawyer finagled an all white jury for his client. Smooth move.
If he went down on a murder rap he may have faced the death penalty due to priors.
P.S. Anything on Jon Jaymes leaves me wanting more....sorry bemused. It reads like he had Mel Belli eating out of the palm of his hand. I sent away for his death certificate a number of years ago and he was only a Kid at the time.
P.P.S. Im dying for a review of this book by Stanley Booth.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 19:00 by slakka.
Before a Bronx jury?? In your dreams.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-29 05:31 by swiss.
Selvin makes it clear he did not attend. His sources are extensive.
I hate it too and this stuff happens more and more. Again if I ran the world it would stop. If you wrote a book you would have to write what you claim are facts in one color ( say blue ) and your opinions and speculation would be written in another color. If you write something in blue that is not true then you can be easily sued. This will help clear up all of the false information.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 21:03 by stanlove.
Oh, come on Ron. Why go through all that crap again. You know what happened, you know what went on, simply because you were there. About time for you to don't give a crap what others think or might think. Just concentrate on your own book. Looking forward to that one.
-------------------
Keep On Rolling
I totally agree with this, but it is nice for his fact checking of the book. Thank you dude!
thank you VERY MUCH-
We had a huge discussion on this board awhile back and i got alot of grief for sort of "defending" the Hells Angles.
i never really went into it but the reason for my viewpoint was that when i lived in San Diego i hung out at a bar near the Angels clubhouse.
Now what that says about me that i would hang at a bar filled with The 81 just for cheap beer ,i'm not sure.but nonetheless,they were pretty cool dudes.
It was,of course obvious that if you fckd with them they would kill you in a nanosecond but the unwritten rule was,[and everyone knew it]if you don't mess with them,they don't mess with you.
I never had a problem with them,even when i brought my girlfriend in the most i got was a look and a "allllright".
All things considered,they were put in a really messed up situation.when i first saw gimme shelter and heard Sonny Barger on the radio interview i just thought he was some jackass attacking my boy Mick.
But if you listen to what he says about how much they love their bikes and people knocking them over and smashing them and all those" stoned idiots jumping on people,when they jumped on angels they got hurt"
That crowd were not blameless-believe me,i've met these guys.if you are so stoned and/or stupid that you jump,fall or trip into a Hells Angels motorcycle you probably needed to be wacked in the head with a pool cue to knock some sense into you.
Good choice. Again, looking forward to it
-------------------
Keep On Rolling
Ok..must have been a different movie I've seen.
With your conclusion you can justify everything.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
2000 LYFH
()
Date: August 22, 2016 21:55
View from the stage - The Airplane
And the Hell's Angels
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 20:00 by 2000 LYFH.
And the Hell's Angels
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 20:00 by 2000 LYFH.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 22, 2016 22:03
what is amazing and i mean utterly amazing to me is that this isn't some sort of wacko writing this,it's the actual normal state of what is called "journalism" in todays society.
it used to be if you read something in a newspaper,a book or a magazine and you reapeated it and it turned out to be wrong,you were suprised.
now i wouldn't repeat anything i read without fact checking it 6 times and then i'd be sceptical.
i've read things that came from major american news outlets about a presidential candidate that,because of my job,i know for a fact are just untrue,i later saw these things repeated on the television news worldwide.
i showed the article to my uncle who is now retired from my same business and he said"was this written in crayon"?
i don't even want to waste alot of time on this idiot with the altamont book-you don't even have to be a Stones expert to chop it to ribbons,just watch Gimme Shelter once.
" Jagger watches in horror as man is murdered in front of the stage!!!."
Mick in Gimme Shelter- "i couldn't really see anything,it was just scuffles"
all i can say is "was this written in crayon?"
it used to be if you read something in a newspaper,a book or a magazine and you reapeated it and it turned out to be wrong,you were suprised.
now i wouldn't repeat anything i read without fact checking it 6 times and then i'd be sceptical.
i've read things that came from major american news outlets about a presidential candidate that,because of my job,i know for a fact are just untrue,i later saw these things repeated on the television news worldwide.
i showed the article to my uncle who is now retired from my same business and he said"was this written in crayon"?
i don't even want to waste alot of time on this idiot with the altamont book-you don't even have to be a Stones expert to chop it to ribbons,just watch Gimme Shelter once.
" Jagger watches in horror as man is murdered in front of the stage!!!."
Mick in Gimme Shelter- "i couldn't really see anything,it was just scuffles"
all i can say is "was this written in crayon?"
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
Deltics
()
Date: August 22, 2016 22:33
"The arrogant Stones soon took over planning duties from the smaller local band."
The Grateful Dead? The smaller local band? In California??
Really?
"stung at having missed Woodstock that summer"
"It would also provide the centrepiece of a film, hastily commissioned with just a week of the tour remaining, which Jagger hoped to sneak out before the big-budget Woodstock movie, stealing some of its thunder."
First I've ever heard that any of the Stones were "stung" about not having played Woodstock and the Woodstock movie came out in March 1970 whereas Gimme Shelter was released in December 1970.
So much BS in this article, I think I'll be giving his book a miss.
"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-22 22:34 by Deltics.
The Grateful Dead? The smaller local band? In California??
Really?
"stung at having missed Woodstock that summer"
"It would also provide the centrepiece of a film, hastily commissioned with just a week of the tour remaining, which Jagger hoped to sneak out before the big-budget Woodstock movie, stealing some of its thunder."
First I've ever heard that any of the Stones were "stung" about not having played Woodstock and the Woodstock movie came out in March 1970 whereas Gimme Shelter was released in December 1970.
So much BS in this article, I think I'll be giving his book a miss.
"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-22 22:34 by Deltics.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 23, 2016 00:00
Like I said... a lot of wrong things..
Quote
Deltics
"The arrogant Stones soon took over planning duties from the smaller local band."
The Grateful Dead? The smaller local band? In California??
Really?
"stung at having missed Woodstock that summer"
"It would also provide the centrepiece of a film, hastily commissioned with just a week of the tour remaining, which Jagger hoped to sneak out before the big-budget Woodstock movie, stealing some of its thunder."
First I've ever heard that any of the Stones were "stung" about not having played Woodstock and the Woodstock movie came out in March 1970 whereas Gimme Shelter was released in December 1970.
So much BS in this article, I think I'll be giving his book a miss.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 23, 2016 02:20
i've always wanted to ask swiss and bmused something-
Did the Angels park their bikes in front of the stage when they did security for other shows including the Greatful Dead?
if so,they were doing pretty much the same thing they always did and had no idea it was gonna turn into a mini riot.
couldn't someone have had the good sense to tell them to keep the bikes backstage and just stand there and keep people from jumping on the stage?
from everything i've seen that's when the head banging started,when the Harleys got knocked over.
Did the Angels park their bikes in front of the stage when they did security for other shows including the Greatful Dead?
if so,they were doing pretty much the same thing they always did and had no idea it was gonna turn into a mini riot.
couldn't someone have had the good sense to tell them to keep the bikes backstage and just stand there and keep people from jumping on the stage?
from everything i've seen that's when the head banging started,when the Harleys got knocked over.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
slakka
()
Date: August 23, 2016 02:21
Quote
2000 LYFH
View from the stage - The Airplane
And the Hell's Angels
Great Snaps. Is there a photocredit here?
Just finished the book last night. Learned some stuff. I didn't realize Passaros lawyer finagled an all white jury for his client. Smooth move.
If he went down on a murder rap he may have faced the death penalty due to priors.
P.S. Anything on Jon Jaymes leaves me wanting more....sorry bemused. It reads like he had Mel Belli eating out of the palm of his hand. I sent away for his death certificate a number of years ago and he was only a Kid at the time.
P.P.S. Im dying for a review of this book by Stanley Booth.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 19:00 by slakka.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 23, 2016 02:35
it's not that hard to get a jury to let you off from killing a guy who pulls a gun out in a crowd of people,a first year law student could do it.
is that really the kind of hard hitting information in this book? good lord
is that really the kind of hard hitting information in this book? good lord
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
slakka
()
Date: August 23, 2016 02:40
Quote
lem motlow
it's not that hard to get a jury to let you off from killing a guy who pulls a gun out in a crowd of people,a first year law student could do it.
is that really the kind of hard hitting information in this book? good lord
Before a Bronx jury?? In your dreams.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 23, 2016 02:58
he was tried in the Bronx? i didn't know that.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
slakka
()
Date: August 23, 2016 03:30
Quote
lem motlow
it's not that hard to get a jury to let you off from killing a guy who pulls a gun out in a crowd of people,a first year law student could do it.
Tell it to the Goldman family
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
Palace Revolution 2000
()
Date: August 23, 2016 04:00
I really hate when someone is giving an account of an infamous event e.g., and since so much time has passed, this writer knows that there are whole new generations who are going to read this, and take it in as gospel. There is no reason they should assume otherwise.AND then the writer implies that they were present for all these happenings.
Like Meredith Hunter had been bothering the Angels all day; or that his body was laid in front of Keith whose eys widened in shock. First I have heard of these events. Was Wyman really shopping?
Like Meredith Hunter had been bothering the Angels all day; or that his body was laid in front of Keith whose eys widened in shock. First I have heard of these events. Was Wyman really shopping?
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
marianna
()
Date: August 23, 2016 07:18
Selvin got his start hanging out at the concert places in San Francisco in the late '60s, and sometimes wrote articles for the Chronicle. He became their staff writer a few years after. I don't know if he attended or covered Altamont, or who his sources are now or back then. His Wikipedia article says he was known for making errors in his writing.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
DeanGoodman
()
Date: August 23, 2016 07:35
I met Joel, a good guy, and I enjoyed his Bert Berns book.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
swiss
()
Date: August 23, 2016 08:18
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-29 05:31 by swiss.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 23, 2016 17:59
the reason the bikes were put in front of the stage was because of a speaker fire we had when a speaker shorted out. The bikes were to keep the crowds from pressing against the speakers. When that failed, Chip put the speakers on the stage...and the Angels moved their bikes from the front...
Quote
lem motlow
i've always wanted to ask swiss and bmused something-
Did the Angels park their bikes in front of the stage when they did security for other shows including the Greatful Dead?
if so,they were doing pretty much the same thing they always did and had no idea it was gonna turn into a mini riot.
couldn't someone have had the good sense to tell them to keep the bikes backstage and just stand there and keep people from jumping on the stage?
from everything i've seen that's when the head banging started,when the Harleys got knocked over.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 23, 2016 18:14
I am on Part 2 of the book but so far....
First--a fact from the book that reads well but.... I had already left my uncle before the Stones contacted me...
Two--I hired Belli to sue Filmways and nothing else.
Three--I learned from the book, if true--John Jaymes conned them at the Sear Point meeting.. I wasn't there and until now, knew nothing about it..
Four--- and this is for all the IORR people as a heads up on info... there was NO FILM planned for the 1969 Rolling Stones tour!!!!
First--a fact from the book that reads well but.... I had already left my uncle before the Stones contacted me...
Two--I hired Belli to sue Filmways and nothing else.
Three--I learned from the book, if true--John Jaymes conned them at the Sear Point meeting.. I wasn't there and until now, knew nothing about it..
Four--- and this is for all the IORR people as a heads up on info... there was NO FILM planned for the 1969 Rolling Stones tour!!!!
Quote
slakka
Just finished the book last night. Learned some stuff. I didn't realize Passaros lawyer finagled an all white jury for his client. Smooth move.
If he went down on a murder rap he may have faced the death penalty due to priors.
P.S. Anything on Jon James leaves me wanting more....sorry bemused. It reads like he had Mel Belli eating out of the palm of his hand. I sent away for his death certificate a number of years ago and he was only a Kid at the time.
P.P.S. Im dying for a review of this book by Stanley Booth.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
slakka
()
Date: August 23, 2016 18:45
Quote
marianna
Selvin got his start hanging out at the concert places in San Francisco in the late '60s, and sometimes wrote articles for the Chronicle. He became their staff writer a few years after. I don't know if he attended or covered Altamont, or who his sources are now or back then. His Wikipedia article says he was known for making errors in his writing.
Selvin makes it clear he did not attend. His sources are extensive.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
stanlove
()
Date: August 23, 2016 18:52
Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
I really hate when someone is giving an account of an infamous event e.g., and since so much time has passed, this writer knows that there are whole new generations who are going to read this, and take it in as gospel. There is no reason they should assume otherwise.AND then the writer implies that they were present for all these happenings.
Like Meredith Hunter had been bothering the Angels all day; or that his body was laid in front of Keith whose eys widened in shock. First I have heard of these events. Was Wyman really shopping?
I hate it too and this stuff happens more and more. Again if I ran the world it would stop. If you wrote a book you would have to write what you claim are facts in one color ( say blue ) and your opinions and speculation would be written in another color. If you write something in blue that is not true then you can be easily sued. This will help clear up all of the false information.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-08-23 21:03 by stanlove.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
Rolling Hansie
()
Date: August 23, 2016 19:31
Quote
bmuseed
I am on Part 2 of the book but so far....
Oh, come on Ron. Why go through all that crap again. You know what happened, you know what went on, simply because you were there. About time for you to don't give a crap what others think or might think. Just concentrate on your own book. Looking forward to that one.
-------------------
Keep On Rolling
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
BILLPERKS
()
Date: August 23, 2016 19:40
47 years later.
Stanley wrote this story peeps.
What passes for journalism in this age is laughable.
Stanley wrote this story peeps.
What passes for journalism in this age is laughable.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
2000 LYFH
()
Date: August 23, 2016 20:15
Additional Altamont info and pictures at bmuseed (Ron Schneider) website: [meandtherollingstones.com]
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
MingSubu
()
Date: August 23, 2016 21:16
Quote
Rolling HansieQuote
bmuseed
I am on Part 2 of the book but so far....
Oh, come on Ron. Why go through all that crap again. You know what happened, you know what went on, simply because you were there. About time for you to don't give a crap what others think or might think. Just concentrate on your own book. Looking forward to that one.
I totally agree with this, but it is nice for his fact checking of the book. Thank you dude!
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 23, 2016 21:28
Rolling Hansie--You're right..actually, I never cared what others thought since I was there and knew and didn't bother to correct people....I am actually thinking of the fans, now. I did debate whether to comment but when I am quoted and the facts are wrong that relate to me..
For my book:
When I decided to write about my life, I chose to do it for the fans as well as my children. I was concerned that time might leave way for false memories and absent mindedness. Sure, I had a lot of great stories, but I wanted to make sure I showed that the stories were backed by facts! Anyone can have a story, but I still had boxes of papers that included contracts, agreements, correspondence, tour income and expense write ups, notes and receipts. I created a database by scanning most of my documents and found that not only was there a time line established by the scans but after review, I had the stories that coincided and enhanced the documents. It is with these facts on hand that I now have been able to give a more complete and accurate narrative of the events.
For those times when documents weren’t available, I have the memories that remained and stayed consistent throughout my life. I figured that if a memory prevailed, it was important and I recount the early memories to bring context to my behavior.
For my book:
When I decided to write about my life, I chose to do it for the fans as well as my children. I was concerned that time might leave way for false memories and absent mindedness. Sure, I had a lot of great stories, but I wanted to make sure I showed that the stories were backed by facts! Anyone can have a story, but I still had boxes of papers that included contracts, agreements, correspondence, tour income and expense write ups, notes and receipts. I created a database by scanning most of my documents and found that not only was there a time line established by the scans but after review, I had the stories that coincided and enhanced the documents. It is with these facts on hand that I now have been able to give a more complete and accurate narrative of the events.
For those times when documents weren’t available, I have the memories that remained and stayed consistent throughout my life. I figured that if a memory prevailed, it was important and I recount the early memories to bring context to my behavior.
Quote
Rolling HansieQuote
bmuseed
I am on Part 2 of the book but so far....
Oh, come on Ron. Why go through all that crap again. You know what happened, you know what went on, simply because you were there. About time for you to don't give a crap what others think or might think. Just concentrate on your own book. Looking forward to that one.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
MingSubu
()
Date: August 23, 2016 22:21
Bemused, start your book tonight. Don't put it off, God forbid, you never know what may happen. It would be a shame if the fans and more importantly your kids miss out on the tales of your life during this period.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 23, 2016 22:35
it's being proofread and is done.. somebody recently told me to get it out before I die....
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 24, 2016 01:54
Quote
bmuseed
the reason the bikes were put in front of the stage was because of a speaker fire we had when a speaker shorted out. The bikes were to keep the crowds from pressing against the speakers. When that failed, Chip put the speakers on the stage...and the Angels moved their bikes from the front...Quote
lem motlow
i've always wanted to ask swiss and bmused something-
Did the Angels park their bikes in front of the stage when they did security for other shows including the Greatful Dead?
if so,they were doing pretty much the same thing they always did and had no idea it was gonna turn into a mini riot.
couldn't someone have had the good sense to tell them to keep the bikes backstage and just stand there and keep people from jumping on the stage?
from everything i've seen that's when the head banging started,when the Harleys got knocked over.
thank you VERY MUCH-
We had a huge discussion on this board awhile back and i got alot of grief for sort of "defending" the Hells Angles.
i never really went into it but the reason for my viewpoint was that when i lived in San Diego i hung out at a bar near the Angels clubhouse.
Now what that says about me that i would hang at a bar filled with The 81 just for cheap beer ,i'm not sure.but nonetheless,they were pretty cool dudes.
It was,of course obvious that if you fckd with them they would kill you in a nanosecond but the unwritten rule was,[and everyone knew it]if you don't mess with them,they don't mess with you.
I never had a problem with them,even when i brought my girlfriend in the most i got was a look and a "allllright".
All things considered,they were put in a really messed up situation.when i first saw gimme shelter and heard Sonny Barger on the radio interview i just thought he was some jackass attacking my boy Mick.
But if you listen to what he says about how much they love their bikes and people knocking them over and smashing them and all those" stoned idiots jumping on people,when they jumped on angels they got hurt"
That crowd were not blameless-believe me,i've met these guys.if you are so stoned and/or stupid that you jump,fall or trip into a Hells Angels motorcycle you probably needed to be wacked in the head with a pool cue to knock some sense into you.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
Rolling Hansie
()
Date: August 24, 2016 02:02
Quote
bmuseed
When I decided to write about my life, I chose to do it for the fans as well as my children.
Good choice. Again, looking forward to it
-------------------
Keep On Rolling
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
shortfatfanny
()
Date: August 24, 2016 03:58
Quote
lem motlowQuote
bmuseed
the reason the bikes were put in front of the stage was because of a speaker fire we had when a speaker shorted out. The bikes were to keep the crowds from pressing against the speakers. When that failed, Chip put the speakers on the stage...and the Angels moved their bikes from the front...Quote
lem motlow
i've always wanted to ask swiss and bmused something-
Did the Angels park their bikes in front of the stage when they did security for other shows including the Greatful Dead?
if so,they were doing pretty much the same thing they always did and had no idea it was gonna turn into a mini riot.
couldn't someone have had the good sense to tell them to keep the bikes backstage and just stand there and keep people from jumping on the stage?
from everything i've seen that's when the head banging started,when the Harleys got knocked over.
thank you VERY MUCH-
We had a huge discussion on this board awhile back and i got alot of grief for sort of "defending" the Hells Angles.
i never really went into it but the reason for my viewpoint was that when i lived in San Diego i hung out at a bar near the Angels clubhouse.
Now what that says about me that i would hang at a bar filled with The 81 just for cheap beer ,i'm not sure.but nonetheless,they were pretty cool dudes.
It was,of course obvious that if you fckd with them they would kill you in a nanosecond but the unwritten rule was,[and everyone knew it]if you don't mess with them,they don't mess with you.
I never had a problem with them,even when i brought my girlfriend in the most i got was a look and a "allllright".
All things considered,they were put in a really messed up situation.when i first saw gimme shelter and heard Sonny Barger on the radio interview i just thought he was some jackass attacking my boy Mick.
But if you listen to what he says about how much they love their bikes and people knocking them over and smashing them and all those" stoned idiots jumping on people,when they jumped on angels they got hurt"
That crowd were not blameless-believe me,i've met these guys.if you are so stoned and/or stupid that you jump,fall or trip into a Hells Angels motorcycle you probably needed to be wacked in the head with a pool cue to knock some sense into you.
Ok..must have been a different movie I've seen.
With your conclusion you can justify everything.
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
bmuseed
()
Date: August 24, 2016 04:40
Let me quote Tony Funches:Tony Funches, our tour in house security, broke two bones in his hand when he punched out two Hells Angels. I recently asked Tony if it was true, and he replied: “Affirmative, AFTER the two Morons were put to sleep, I eventually found my way over to the "Leader of The Pack": let him know what had happened & said I pretty much expected to die because of it, but that it was ‘just business' ... He answered to me "Hey Man, you was just doin' your job; we got no problem with you." Tony was talking to Barger..
Re: New article on Altmont
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 24, 2016 20:40
Big Tony is the man..his stories of working for and hanging with Jim are epic.
knowing him I can easily picture the dude going up to Barger and saying "sorry,i just punched a couple of your guys lights out and i'm probably gonna be dead pretty quick here, but it was just business".truth be told, it seems totally in charactor for them to give him the respect he deserved- a naked fat guy who had randomly jumped on them..maybe not so much..
How the situation occured that the bands personal security was punching the concert site security in the face i can only imagine, but it says alot about the level of chaos involved.
it looks like those speakers were a big cause of concern.they are monitors right?in the pictures above,in the first one you can see the crowd hanging off them and the second shot the Angels are giving people some crap in that exact area.
knowing him I can easily picture the dude going up to Barger and saying "sorry,i just punched a couple of your guys lights out and i'm probably gonna be dead pretty quick here, but it was just business".truth be told, it seems totally in charactor for them to give him the respect he deserved- a naked fat guy who had randomly jumped on them..maybe not so much..
How the situation occured that the bands personal security was punching the concert site security in the face i can only imagine, but it says alot about the level of chaos involved.
it looks like those speakers were a big cause of concern.they are monitors right?in the pictures above,in the first one you can see the crowd hanging off them and the second shot the Angels are giving people some crap in that exact area.
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