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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-12-22 04:45 by cirrhosis.

DandelionPowderman Wrote:
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>> RJ: Stones back where I want them. Perfect back
> up-vocals from Jagger, hard and dirty guitars. I
> like Woody's solo, but it gets a bit boring when
> he plays the same thing 25 times - and: I don't
> like it when he takes the bootleneck too high on
> the fretboard. But: IMO, we can't complain when we
> get a song like this...
>
> >
> To sum it up, I think we're in for a surprise this
> time around. My guess is that the album will be
> surprisingly good


I totally agree! And IMO. Rock'n roll isn't about inventing something new anymore. It's my favorite genre, but I believe it's dead, and has been for some time. I love the sound of it, and in the last 25 years I think that the Stones hasn't delivered. They've become more of a pop/country band. With this in back of my mind, Rough Justice, the title of the record, and the cover art etc. Makes me happy...

Mathijs wrote;
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Now, the guitar playing is outdated, sloppy and uninteresting. Maybe the Stones have given everything they had in them. They are the greatest R&R band in the World by what they have done in the past. Now it's time to hand it over to other bands.

Are you gonna take the stick over Mathijs??
You know all the licks, so come on and plan a world tour and give us a couple of years more exiting, and a better stones concert that whe have seen in about 25 years, come on you can do it.

the albums not out yet and all the crap started..mathijs says there finished as recording artist..give us a break...lets give the album a chance.we all know an album takes time to sink in..lets see how these tracks fit in with the rest of the album, as ross says... i think mathijs talks in riddles..what i see and hear at the moment things are looking good.

Anyone who thinks the guitar playing on Rough Justice is "sloppy and uninteresting" should give up with rock n roll, because they don't know a @#$%& about guitar playing, Phil Collins should have a new album out soon,get in on the presales. Me i'll head down to the Brian Setzer after gig party now,but i guess he must be "sloppy and uninteresting"

>> come on you can do it. <<

:E


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

this thing is gonna KICK BUTT,,,NOW I KNOW WHY they called it" A BIGGER BANG "

---it will be a bing bang

Cant wait to hear Mick pronounce A Bigger Bang ... ya just know he'll kinda roll the words around and saliva coat them in sex before flicken 'em off the end of his tongue as one word...Eeerbiggarrrbang...!!

ROCKMAN

HMMM---the first time ever-----mathijs---you lost your feeling

IORRIMSS

"its only rock and roll if Mathijs says so"

The master has spoken .... the show is over ....the Stones have left the building

HEY the stones dont spend the time like they used too,,ive heard on a radio show once that from Beggers Banquet up until Somegirls the stones would go in the studio & do 20 takes of a song ,,next day they go in & do 20 more takes & so on,,,,all in all they would do about 100 takes of each song,, them produce & edit the hell out them for months,,,,hey from 89 til now these albums are done in weeks time.....

ANYBODY SEEN Mathijs??? I kinda of thought there would be a magical retort here??

Mathijs
I fail to see after the past 3 years on this board why you still hang around. I'm not interested in making this personal and won't be responding to you, but I just wanted to say that Rough Justice is the best single since Start Me Up. Ronnie's slide is great and I'm sure he will play it the same in concert, even though you will say he just stands there and doesn't play a note like you did throughout the Licks Tour! Back of My Hand is an incredibly beautiful blues number which is EXACTLY what the real fans have been clamouring for. Oh No, Not You Again is not a throwaway rock song. The video on the band's website proves it. While many don't appreciate Streets of Love I know at least two women (wife and daughter) who like it best of all! So it takes all kinds of songs to impress the various kinds of true fans.

Those of us who have been followers of this band since 1968 don't find your "reviews" interesting at all.

ron091 Wrote:
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> Those of us who have been followers of this band
> since 1968 don't find your "reviews" interesting
> at all.

Apperently interesting enough for you to reply.

Anyway, I get the impression that some of you think that I have a "I can do better" attitude. Well, that of course is complete bollocks. But, that isn't even the topic here. What I am saying is: Stones music for me is all about energy. Until 1983 they were the undisputed best band in the world, and to this day no band ever got close to the magic of the Stones in 1972, 1978 or 1981. But, in the studio they now seem to have lost this magic, and most of the times also live on stage. I hate Voodoo Lounge for one simple reason: it is fake. It is the Stones trying to come up with a vintage sounding Stones album. It sounds fake, the singing is fake, the lyrics are fake. B2B is much, much better. They didn't try to be classic Stones, they tried to be harder edged contemporary. Many songs succeeded (like FTS, Lowdown, Too Tight, SOM and OOC), but some didn't that well (Gunface, MAWGJ). With the 4 songs we have until now, I hear the same as with Voodoo Lounge. It's fake emotions. "Guys, if we do a blues, all the fans will go crazy again". And Jagger is right. But listen to it with your ears, not with hazy eyes. It is a 13-to-a-dozen blues, Can I do it better? Probably not, but I can come up with ten of these songs within a day. Lift some riffs from Robert Johnson, do a 12-bar blues, write some lyrics about how my girl is so mean to me, add some blues harp and your done. The same for Rough Justice: this isn't the Stones, its the Stones trying to sound like the Stones. Give me an open E guitar, and my slide solo will sound like Wood on RJ. That isn't meant as a comliment for Wood. Listen to Izzy Stradlin's albums, and you find this solo on about 16 songs.

Someone is this thread sums it up right: the Stones used to record 40 takes of a song, and then edit it down to one excellent song. In this way songs can be crafted to an higher standard. Of 40 takes, there's always that solo that stands out, so you use it. That guitar riff or bass line that stands out, you use it. It's a bit of trickery, but it works. The original Miss You features two rather boring guitars. Chris Kimsey edited the guitars down from 15 minutes boring to 3 minutes brilliant guitars. Voodoo Lounge was recorded quite live and was meant to sound organic. To me, it misses the mark completely. B2B was recorded in the tradional Stones way, and some of the songs are true classics to me (Low Down, Too Tight and especially How Can I Stop which I rate among the best 10 Stones songs).

It's the same as the difference between Wandering Spirit and Goddess: Wandering Spirit is made from the heart. Raw, dirty R&B in the old vein, straight form the heart. Goddess is a concept album: "what should I add in the mix to have a numer one hit again". Add some strings, some synth, use the same flute as Santana, use Wycleff Jean, use the guy from Bon Jovi as a producer. It's just awfull.

Anyway. Why am I still here? Because they will always and forever be the Greatest band in the World. With the press conference I was sitting behind the computer live online, and I had the same nervous feeling as at a live gig. They completely surprised me with how they looked, and how raw they sounded. Of course I will be the CD within 5 minutes when its out. Of course I go see them live. I will not go to big stadiums anymore. but an arena is o.k. with me. No, I don't think they play that well live anymore, but every gig I have seen there's always that 5 minutes of magic. There's always a moment that they become the Greates Band in the World again.

Mathijs

Mathijs' posts always have the most replies. Most of us find it very intresting what he thinks.
A fan since 1968 doesn't mean you know more about them.

This Mathijs seems to be The Best (God Almighty)....

Provide us here on the board with a website, where we can listen to your music....

And let us then come back with our thoughts....

Hoi Mathijs,

Er zijn op dit moment een heleboel IORR-members die gewoon geen respect hebben voor een mening die niet overeenkomt met het evangelie van StonISME. So be it. Als je alleen al die gefrustreerde reacties op U2 ziet; het is gewoon zielig. Ik waardeer je bijdragen on this board omdat je een echte Stones-fan bent en volgens mij weet je heel goed waarover je het hebt. Net zoals members als Gazza en StonesTod. Maar, daar komt het, ik ben het met betrekking tot de nieuwe nummers niet met je eens. Muziek blijft nou eenmaal emotie en daarbij speelt smaak en persoonlijke voorkeur bijna een hoodrol. Ik heb na de afgelopen 25 jaar elke hoop verloren dat mijn favoriete band en, inderdaad, the greatest rock 'n roll band forever, nog vernieuwend kan zijn. No way! Dat is gebaseerd op de geleverde prestaties van de afgelopen 20 jaar. Just the facts. Daarom ben ik blij met de nieuwe nummers, SOL uitgezonderd. Dat was het. Ik hoop dat je aanwezig blijft met je prikkelende en kritische observaties. En, troost je, er zullen fanatici zijn die blijven beweren dat Ron Wood erg op dreef was tijdens de Europese Licks-optredens. Tsja. Ik heb er acht gezien in stadions, theaters en arenas en helaas moest ik ook constateren dat hij tijdens de 2 optredens die ik in Toronto mocht zien, zoveel beter was. Hartelijke Stones-groet, DB44.

Translation. I think it's no good that some members at this board show no respect for the different opinons that's been shown on this board. I believe in different viewws on all sort of Stones-subjects because that's the strength of IORR. That's why I have respect for members like Mathijs, StonesTod and Gazza because they are huge Stones-fans and they know what they're talking about.
The last months I've got the feeling that trash-talk is the standard for some members on this board who've been brainwashed with some sort of Stones-religion. If you read the frustrated comments on U2, it's hilarious. All the members on this board are infected by The Stones-virus but at the end it's only rock 'n roll, you know. Enjoy the humour of Gazza for example.
I disagree with Mathijs on his opinion about the new numbers. I don't expect the Stones inventing, writing and playing new things. They can't bring that anymore. That's the way it is for the last 25 years. Just the facts. Nothing wrong with that if you look at their amazing 1964-1980 period. Those years were almost too good to be true. So I'm very happy with the new songs, except for SOL.
I hope that Mathijs will be writing his critical comments on this board. And, nevertheless, there always will be fans who disagree the fact that Ron Wood wasn't performing very well at the European Licks-tour. Well, I saw 8 concerts and Mick, the greatest rock 'n roll performer of all times, always delivers, Charlie does, Keith mostly but Ron doesn't always delivers.

really good post db44

country honk Wrote:
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> This Mathijs seems to be The Best (God
> Almighty)....

Apperently you really don't understand. It is my opinion, not fact.

> Provide us here on the board with a website, where
> we can listen to your music....

www.fliptheswitch.nl, and starting from february 2006 hopefully a full CD with own material of the new band.

Mathijs

db44 Wrote:
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> Hoi Mathijs,
>
> Er zijn op dit moment een heleboel IORR-members
> die gewoon geen respect hebben voor een mening die
> niet overeenkomt met het evangelie van StonISME.

Ach, ik loop nu een jaartje of 20 rond in dit Stones wereldje, en we kunnen vast stellen dat de gemiddelde Stones fan geen verlicht despoot is. Ik vind wel dat er op dit forum in ieder geval ruimte is voor discussie. Op andere fora met hoofdzakelijk Amerikanen is daar helemaal geen ruimte voor. Bedankt voor je reactie in ieder geval.


Mathijs

Ik heb wel respect voor Mathijs zijn mening, ik vind hem ook altijd goede reacties geven, maar waar ik me over verbaasd is dat ik juist van Mathijs niet had verwacht dat hij alles vergelijkt met zoals het vroeger was.
Mathijs ik ben wel benieuwd naar de nieuwe cd van de nieuwe band, en als er een tournee komt laat het me weten.

Do we have to learn dutch now to be able to follow the threads??
If so, I demand everybody learns swedish also

Vilhelm
Nordic Stones Vikings

Rik Wrote:
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> really good post db44


indeed. Especially the bit where he paid me a compliment.
Keep it up, db44!

ron091 Wrote:
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> Ronnie's
> slide is great and I'm sure he will play it the
> same in concert, even though you will say he just
> stands there and doesn't play a note like you did
> throughout the Licks Tour!

I don't see what's so special about Ron's slide. It's very predictable, and there's even a bum note at the end. Was this left in intentionally, or did Wood only do one take?

Ronnie's slide on RJ resembles MT's licks on All Down The Line...except lacking the fluidity, creativity and perfect timing that made MT so amazing. Like his attempts mimick MT with his CYHMK solos on the last tour, he just isn't quite in the same league.

That being said, it is great to hear the separate rhythm/lead configuration vs. the weaving thing. Ronnie's "clunkier" style kind of fits a track like RJ!

Ross

"The album will be released in september, but we already know that in december it will be rereleased with bonus material."

This is like saying to the fans - "we don't care what you feel, we just want your money". The Stones is the best band of all times, and should treat themselves and their fans with more dignity.

The album will be released in september, but we already know that in december it will be rereleased with bonus material."

Well that sound interesting from where do "we" know and what bonusmaterial will it be ???

I thought I've been just as funny as Gazza. Damn. Got some work to do.

Actually, I agree with most of what Mathijs says. They (the Stones) are the one that set the bar high...

I personally enjoy the give-and-take of opinions whether I agree or not. It makes this board more interesting than some of the others, IMO. Nobody owns any facts...every post is prefaced with an implied IMHFO. (except those that diss SOL - those are facts :-)

Just remember: when referring / criticizing a song:

It's always very easy AFTERWARDS to say - I could have written that, because it sounds very simple..... or I could play that much better.... lacking some licks here and there, a better solo, the singing should be better and so on....

Well, just as an example (not to make any comparisson) watching a more recent Picasso picture - everybody says: I could have drawn a line like Picasso - very simple.... his picture is nothing...... can't understand why it's so famous....

The same thing could be said about music, books, sculptures and so on...., but everybody knows - To write a great song, paint a good picture, write a good book - it's not AS SIMPLE AS IT MIGHT LOOK...... even if some on this board might think so...

To make Satisfaction, Brown Sugar, Start Me UP - very simple music - but you have to make it.... get the music it out of your head... play it and put it on a record... only the very few know how to do that with succes

If it was very easy - the world would be quite different than now.....