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DandelionPowdermanQuote
DoxaQuote
DandelionPowderman
<even though there might be symptoms of that alraedy in the latter album>
Yep, on Winter and Hide Your Love in particular.
But PBU shows no signs of tiredness. On the contrary, it's full of energy, and Mick's vocals is spot on!
What I was referring to was the camp, vain-ish jadedness that came into Mick's vocals. The sniffing, the "new" pronounciation of words and the "I love myself, and I'm never gonna finish this phrase"-endings of his lines
They are cool to a point, but he steps over the line a few times, imo.
I know many people disagree with me here, but there is a difference between the high octan growling and the campy vocals. The growling is prominent on SG, and on PBU, while the campy thing evolved in the glam era (but it's of course evident on Miss You as well).
However, the growling went too far as well, and hit the nadir on She's The Boss as well as on Fight, imo.
Well, I think "Winter" is one of Jagger's strongest vocal performances ever, and actually one of the strongest vocal performances by anyone ever, and I was about to mention "Hide Your Love" as a counter example to "Pretty Beat Up" where he breathes the flow of the music convincingly and naturally, but I guess we have a huge taste difference here. I recall you once said that Jagger sings "Lies" as good as he does "Rip This Joint", which is for me a capital crime to claim...
I get the "campiness" point of the early 70's, but I think Jagger does a marvellous job there, using novel aspects of his natural and unique tone ("Let It Loose", "Angie", Winter", etc.), wheras the stuff he does from, say, PRIMITIVE COOL on, sounds more like vocal coached stuff, hiding losing some chords of his natural voice. I also think the growling/shouting of the early/mid 80's is partly hiding losing the powerfull sharpness and edge he naturally had in his younger age, especially in EXILE rockers (thinking of "Rocks Off", "Rip This Joint", "All Down The Line", "Soul Survivor").
- Doxa
Winter is not even junior league, compared to Angie and Let It Loose, imo.
You really find Mick's singing on Hide Your Love "natural"?
The bridge on CYHTM, however, THAT is great singing from Mick.
And what's wrong with Mick on Lies? You can't get more powerful than that
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treaclefingersQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
DoxaQuote
DandelionPowderman
<even though there might be symptoms of that alraedy in the latter album>
Yep, on Winter and Hide Your Love in particular.
But PBU shows no signs of tiredness. On the contrary, it's full of energy, and Mick's vocals is spot on!
What I was referring to was the camp, vain-ish jadedness that came into Mick's vocals. The sniffing, the "new" pronounciation of words and the "I love myself, and I'm never gonna finish this phrase"-endings of his lines
They are cool to a point, but he steps over the line a few times, imo.
I know many people disagree with me here, but there is a difference between the high octan growling and the campy vocals. The growling is prominent on SG, and on PBU, while the campy thing evolved in the glam era (but it's of course evident on Miss You as well).
However, the growling went too far as well, and hit the nadir on She's The Boss as well as on Fight, imo.
Well, I think "Winter" is one of Jagger's strongest vocal performances ever, and actually one of the strongest vocal performances by anyone ever, and I was about to mention "Hide Your Love" as a counter example to "Pretty Beat Up" where he breathes the flow of the music convincingly and naturally, but I guess we have a huge taste difference here. I recall you once said that Jagger sings "Lies" as good as he does "Rip This Joint", which is for me a capital crime to claim...
I get the "campiness" point of the early 70's, but I think Jagger does a marvellous job there, using novel aspects of his natural and unique tone ("Let It Loose", "Angie", Winter", etc.), wheras the stuff he does from, say, PRIMITIVE COOL on, sounds more like vocal coached stuff, hiding losing some chords of his natural voice. I also think the growling/shouting of the early/mid 80's is partly hiding losing the powerfull sharpness and edge he naturally had in his younger age, especially in EXILE rockers (thinking of "Rocks Off", "Rip This Joint", "All Down The Line", "Soul Survivor").
- Doxa
Winter is not even junior league, compared to Angie and Let It Loose, imo.
You really find Mick's singing on Hide Your Love "natural"?
The bridge on CYHTM, however, THAT is great singing from Mick.
And what's wrong with Mick on Lies? You can't get more powerful than that
I don't equate shouting to powerful singing. Lies is to Some Girls what Neighbours is to Tattoo You.
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Come On
Micks voice and singin in a studio has always been absolutely brilliant...his singing from live-stages after 1978 is another question...
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Rockman
his singing from live-stages after 1978 is another question...
Please what is the other question ??...
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24FPS
Not even a good B side really. And Keith's bass is all over the place.
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LeonidPQuote
24FPS
Not even a good B side really. And Keith's bass is all over the place.
It's not a b-side ... and the bass is the best part of the song, and which elevates it.
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andrewt
Still, just the sound of Keith & Ron harmonizing on the refrain make me tingle with nostalgia. Probably the last time you heard it like that on a Stones record.
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DandelionPowdermanQuote
treaclefingersQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
DoxaQuote
DandelionPowderman
<even though there might be symptoms of that alraedy in the latter album>
Yep, on Winter and Hide Your Love in particular.
But PBU shows no signs of tiredness. On the contrary, it's full of energy, and Mick's vocals is spot on!
What I was referring to was the camp, vain-ish jadedness that came into Mick's vocals. The sniffing, the "new" pronounciation of words and the "I love myself, and I'm never gonna finish this phrase"-endings of his lines
They are cool to a point, but he steps over the line a few times, imo.
I know many people disagree with me here, but there is a difference between the high octan growling and the campy vocals. The growling is prominent on SG, and on PBU, while the campy thing evolved in the glam era (but it's of course evident on Miss You as well).
However, the growling went too far as well, and hit the nadir on She's The Boss as well as on Fight, imo.
Well, I think "Winter" is one of Jagger's strongest vocal performances ever, and actually one of the strongest vocal performances by anyone ever, and I was about to mention "Hide Your Love" as a counter example to "Pretty Beat Up" where he breathes the flow of the music convincingly and naturally, but I guess we have a huge taste difference here. I recall you once said that Jagger sings "Lies" as good as he does "Rip This Joint", which is for me a capital crime to claim...
I get the "campiness" point of the early 70's, but I think Jagger does a marvellous job there, using novel aspects of his natural and unique tone ("Let It Loose", "Angie", Winter", etc.), wheras the stuff he does from, say, PRIMITIVE COOL on, sounds more like vocal coached stuff, hiding losing some chords of his natural voice. I also think the growling/shouting of the early/mid 80's is partly hiding losing the powerfull sharpness and edge he naturally had in his younger age, especially in EXILE rockers (thinking of "Rocks Off", "Rip This Joint", "All Down The Line", "Soul Survivor").
- Doxa
Winter is not even junior league, compared to Angie and Let It Loose, imo.
You really find Mick's singing on Hide Your Love "natural"?
The bridge on CYHTM, however, THAT is great singing from Mick.
And what's wrong with Mick on Lies? You can't get more powerful than that
I don't equate shouting to powerful singing. Lies is to Some Girls what Neighbours is to Tattoo You.
Sometimes, shouting is needed. What would you do if your friends lied to you...
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Edward Twining
The problem i have with 'Pretty Beat Up', is it just isn't very clearly defined with regards to what it presents, as a song. It is sort of like a jam session with a few random words/phrases thrown in for good measure. Having said that i am sure the Stones did have a pre-conceived notion of what they wanted to achieve, but it just isn't meticulously enough conceived, to achieve a result which can hold its own with the best of what the Stones have to offer. 'Pretty Beat Up' even struggles with many of the Stones lesser songs, certainly from the pre-UNDERCOVER days, but on the UNDERCOVER album, i'd say the song just about breaks even. I still think it has merit, mind, especially in light of what the Stones have released since. The Stones still display that raw element of spontaneity, and Jagger's vocals have yet to get irritating, and especially in the nasally and overaccentuated sense. However, i still don't see the song as anything really more than a throwaway. It's a broad sketch of a song, which desperately needs a few details filling in.
If anything, the Ronnie version does seem just that little more defined. However, to say it's better may actually be stretching things a little.