Tell Me :
Talk
Yes, the first true arena tour by a major band with PA, lighting and all that stuff. They even had an officially authorised hardback 32 page program by Visual Thing on sale at the concerts.
[www.angelfire.com]
The essentials of the arena rock tour template was already being developed and put to use by other bands in 1968 and 1969 during the stones absence from touring, The Blind Faith tour, which was on same level as the stones later tour, is proof of that. Also to say the stones 69 tour was some highly organised precision military invasion like affair is far from how it was. Even though they travelled with their own set up, they ran in to various problems and needed, amongst other things, the help of the Grateful Dead's crew to beef up the stones own sound system, then there's the problems with ampeg amps, late arrivals and so on. Plenty of scrambling going on.
I used Led Zeppelin as an example earlier because their live career ties in nicely with the development of the rock tour. During 1969 they quickly and clearly developed a very well planned and organised way of touring and presenting their shows following their first US tour as support band. They did their homework, worked hard and learned fast, it's no mistake that they managed to conquer the the world and reach the same level as the stones by 1970.
The 69 tour is the stones learning what to them is a new game of touring with PA's, lighting etc. Sure the stones added their own business minded ideas to it and obviously had some influence on what followed in 70's, but there wasn't that much new things set up wise on the 69 tour. The influence for what followed in 70's was already there and influencing bands before the stones started their 69 tour.
All said and done, the influence for how bands toured arena's in the 70's came from many different places.
so you're saying we've wasted another 4 pages of posting? again?? sigh...man, this place sucks....
Maybe it would better to just say that the '69 Tour broke and created important rules for the Stones themselves. They may not have been the very first band to tour arenas with their own staging, PA and moniters but the tour is very important historically for the Stones. Keith once said that due to the new PA systems, it was the first tour where the fans could actually hear well and really LISTEN to the music. This made the Stones much more aware of the need to have their stuff down pat and they rehearsed harder than ever before. Also, playing with stage monitors for the first time allowed the Stones to listen to themselves for the first time which greatly enhanced their ability to play well. So maybe they didn't INVENT the arena tour concept, but they were certainly prominent among others in leading the way for that type of tour for many bands that followed in their steps. At least for the Stones themselves, the '69 tour was of great importance.
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
nah - just go by this
What were they? What was the industry standard at the time?
A selective, revisionist premise.
I think the Stones were charging about $7 for a ticket, which was significantly higher than what anyone else was charging at the same time. They got a lot of flak for it.
I wouldn't know. I didn't start going to concerts until the mid-70s. I do remember paying $9.50 for Wings tickets and thinking that seemed like a lot of money because, at the time, the going rate was $8.50.
................................ Jerry Hopkins - Rolling Stone Magazine
ROCKMAN
that's a nice video, isn't it? it's hard to be wrong...but you get used to it.
Great video. Nice to see Mick Taylor playing strictly rhythm and letting Keith sell Chuck Berry back to us clueless Americans. peace
spoken like one who knows
Dig Bill's ace, nice and fat bouncing bass lines below it all.
nothing gets by you
I DID TOO - NOW I KNOW WHY! Man, amazing how things leave the brain after a few scant years - that said, I think the timing is better today - there has been some good debate here and some great photos posted - may it continue!
ROCKMAN
interesting too, how it was sort of birthed at Hyde Park - what a year for the band -
Interesting that Blind Faith allowed them to forsee how it might work out. I have to wonder if Blind Faith's Summer '69 Arena tour didn't act as something similar too.
Ok, cool, I'm done debating whether it's the yadda yadda arena tour or not, but the strive for better sound quality at gigs, travelling with your own PA etc is of course relevant to the thread and that's why i'm posting this link.
Tis a great blog, so much interesting stuff...
[rockprosopography101.blogspot.com]
"Thus the Grateful Dead were among the very first rock bands to actually travel with a full size public address system, louder than anyone else's at the time."
"Nonetheless, the San Francisco ballrooms established the blueprint for the rock concert experience up to this very day. No rock concert goer today would expect any less than exceptional sound, loud as can be but clear as a bell, where any distortion is intended and not just an unfortunate byproduct. That's not to say we always get what we want as listeners, of course, but we know what we are supposed to get. So if I'm right, August 17, 1966 at the Fillmore marked the night that rock's most famous auditorium got a state of the art sound system and kept it that way, setting the standard for rock concert sound forever after."
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 06:27 by His Majesty.
Funny how The Beatles' last public show ever was in San Francisco (at Candlestick) a mere 12 days later.
Talk about your favorite band.
For information about how to use this forum please check out forum help and policies.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 13, 2012 17:09
Quote
tatters
Blind Faith?
Yes, the first true arena tour by a major band with PA, lighting and all that stuff. They even had an officially authorised hardback 32 page program by Visual Thing on sale at the concerts.
[www.angelfire.com]
Quote
tatters
Yes, but was it a ramshackle, rinky dink affair, or was it conducted with the precision of a military invasion? For starters, did they travel with their own lights and PA, or did they have to scramble to throw something together at each stop on the tour? I think what hbwriter was trying to say in his original post, was that it was the way in which the Stones toured America in the fall of 1969 that set the template for all other arena tours by all other bands to follow.
The essentials of the arena rock tour template was already being developed and put to use by other bands in 1968 and 1969 during the stones absence from touring, The Blind Faith tour, which was on same level as the stones later tour, is proof of that. Also to say the stones 69 tour was some highly organised precision military invasion like affair is far from how it was. Even though they travelled with their own set up, they ran in to various problems and needed, amongst other things, the help of the Grateful Dead's crew to beef up the stones own sound system, then there's the problems with ampeg amps, late arrivals and so on. Plenty of scrambling going on.
I used Led Zeppelin as an example earlier because their live career ties in nicely with the development of the rock tour. During 1969 they quickly and clearly developed a very well planned and organised way of touring and presenting their shows following their first US tour as support band. They did their homework, worked hard and learned fast, it's no mistake that they managed to conquer the the world and reach the same level as the stones by 1970.
The 69 tour is the stones learning what to them is a new game of touring with PA's, lighting etc. Sure the stones added their own business minded ideas to it and obviously had some influence on what followed in 70's, but there wasn't that much new things set up wise on the 69 tour. The influence for what followed in 70's was already there and influencing bands before the stones started their 69 tour.
All said and done, the influence for how bands toured arena's in the 70's came from many different places.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: February 13, 2012 17:14
Quote
His Majesty
All said and done, the influence for how bands toured arena's in the 70's came from many different places.
so you're saying we've wasted another 4 pages of posting? again?? sigh...man, this place sucks....
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 13, 2012 17:18
Quote
StonesTodQuote
His Majesty
All said and done, the influence for how bands toured arena's in the 70's came from many different places.
so you're saying we've wasted another 4 pages of posting? again?? sigh...man, this place sucks....
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
stonesdan60
()
Date: February 13, 2012 19:20
Quote
His MajestyQuote
tatters
Blind Faith?
Yes, the first true arena tour by a major band with PA, lighting and all that stuff. They even had an officially authorised hardback 32 page program by Visual Thing on sale at the concerts.
[www.angelfire.com]Quote
tatters
Yes, but was it a ramshackle, rinky dink affair, or was it conducted with the precision of a military invasion? For starters, did they travel with their own lights and PA, or did they have to scramble to throw something together at each stop on the tour? I think what hbwriter was trying to say in his original post, was that it was the way in which the Stones toured America in the fall of 1969 that set the template for all other arena tours by all other bands to follow.
The essentials of the arena rock tour template was already being developed and put to use by other bands in 1968 and 1969 during the stones absence from touring, The Blind Faith tour, which was on same level as the stones later tour, is proof of that. Also to say the stones 69 tour was some highly organised precision military invasion like affair is far from how it was. Even though they travelled with their own set up, they ran in to various problems and needed, amongst other things, the help of the Grateful Dead's crew to beef up the stones own sound system, then there's the problems with ampeg amps, late arrivals and so on. Plenty of scrambling going on.
I used Led Zeppelin as an example earlier because their live career ties in nicely with the development of the rock tour. During 1969 they quickly and clearly developed a very well planned and organised way of touring and presenting their shows following their first US tour as support band. They did their homework, worked hard and learned fast, it's no mistake that they managed to conquer the the world and reach the same level as the stones by 1970.
The 69 tour is the stones learning what to them is a new game of touring with PA's, lighting etc. Sure the stones added their own business minded ideas to it and obviously had some influence on what followed in 70's, but there wasn't that much new things set up wise on the 69 tour. The influence for what followed in 70's was already there and influencing bands before the stones started their 69 tour.
All said and done, the influence for how bands toured arena's in the 70's came from many different places.
Maybe it would better to just say that the '69 Tour broke and created important rules for the Stones themselves. They may not have been the very first band to tour arenas with their own staging, PA and moniters but the tour is very important historically for the Stones. Keith once said that due to the new PA systems, it was the first tour where the fans could actually hear well and really LISTEN to the music. This made the Stones much more aware of the need to have their stuff down pat and they rehearsed harder than ever before. Also, playing with stage monitors for the first time allowed the Stones to listen to themselves for the first time which greatly enhanced their ability to play well. So maybe they didn't INVENT the arena tour concept, but they were certainly prominent among others in leading the way for that type of tour for many bands that followed in their steps. At least for the Stones themselves, the '69 tour was of great importance.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 13, 2012 19:26
Yes. ^
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
stonesdan60
()
Date: February 13, 2012 19:33
Quote
His Majesty
Yes. ^
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 13, 2012 20:09
i'm sticking to my premise
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: February 14, 2012 01:07
Quote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 14, 2012 01:32
Quote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
nah - just go by this
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
NICOS
()
Date: February 14, 2012 01:40
Yeah.......great and what an incredible progress compare to '67 tour
__________________________
__________________________
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
tatters
()
Date: February 14, 2012 01:57
Quote
The GR
And the first Stones tour to feature high ticket prices.
What were they? What was the industry standard at the time?
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 02:07
Quote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
A selective, revisionist premise.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
Gazza
()
Date: February 14, 2012 02:14
Quote
tattersQuote
The GR
And the first Stones tour to feature high ticket prices.
What were they? What was the industry standard at the time?
I think the Stones were charging about $7 for a ticket, which was significantly higher than what anyone else was charging at the same time. They got a lot of flak for it.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
tatters
()
Date: February 14, 2012 02:32
Quote
GazzaQuote
tattersQuote
The GR
And the first Stones tour to feature high ticket prices.
What were they? What was the industry standard at the time?
I think the Stones were charging about $7 for a ticket, which was significantly higher than what anyone else was charging at the same time. They got a lot of flak for it.
I wouldn't know. I didn't start going to concerts until the mid-70s. I do remember paying $9.50 for Wings tickets and thinking that seemed like a lot of money because, at the time, the going rate was $8.50.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: February 14, 2012 02:34
................................ Jerry Hopkins - Rolling Stone Magazine
ROCKMAN
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: February 14, 2012 03:31
Quote
hbwriterQuote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
nah - just go by this
that's a nice video, isn't it? it's hard to be wrong...but you get used to it.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 03:51
lol.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
Naturalust
()
Date: February 14, 2012 04:30
Quote
hbwriter
1:45 - charlie mouthing the words- magic
Great video. Nice to see Mick Taylor playing strictly rhythm and letting Keith sell Chuck Berry back to us clueless Americans. peace
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 14, 2012 04:33
Quote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriterQuote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
nah - just go by this
that's a nice video, isn't it? it's hard to be wrong...but you get used to it.
spoken like one who knows
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
tomk
()
Date: February 14, 2012 04:36
The Beatles 1964 Summer Tour is the blueprint for all this nonsense.
So give blame/credit to Brian Epstein.
So give blame/credit to Brian Epstein.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 04:36
Quote
NaturalustQuote
hbwriter
1:45 - charlie mouthing the words- magic
Great video. Nice to see Mick Taylor playing strictly rhythm and letting Keith sell Chuck Berry back to us clueless Americans. peace
Dig Bill's ace, nice and fat bouncing bass lines below it all.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: February 14, 2012 05:18
Quote
hbwriterQuote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriterQuote
StonesTodQuote
hbwriter
i'm sticking to my premise
we need documented proof and numbers or this case will be thrown out of my courtroom.
nah - just go by this
that's a nice video, isn't it? it's hard to be wrong...but you get used to it.
spoken like one who knows
nothing gets by you
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 14, 2012 05:23
Some more background - wikipedia actually has a nice, succinct, fact-based account of the tour
"The tour sold over $1 million worth of tickets,with ticket prices ranging from $4.50 to $8.00. This tour represented a new financial model for rock acts pioneered by Ronnie Schneider, the sole producer and financial manager of the tour. Schneider was the nephew of Allen Klein, who had been recently fired by Keith Richards and tour manager Sam Cutler.
Neither Schneider nor the Stones had any money at the time to fund this endeavor so Schneider had to come up with a new business model and that meant the band getting a piece of the gross box office and demanding a 50% advance, which funded the shows.
Schneider’s role involved securing box office receipts on behalf of the band. In this way, the band itself (and Schneider, whose interests were aligned with those of the band) was in control of all the money related to a tour. On behalf of the Rolling Stones, Schneider centralized the control, ownership and management of ancillary rights, licensing and the marketing of posters, T shirts, programs and other concert related materials—-vastly improving the group’s revenue base while touring. Many other bands followed suit throughout the 1970s."
Isn't Schneider on this board?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 06:48 by hbwriter.
"The tour sold over $1 million worth of tickets,with ticket prices ranging from $4.50 to $8.00. This tour represented a new financial model for rock acts pioneered by Ronnie Schneider, the sole producer and financial manager of the tour. Schneider was the nephew of Allen Klein, who had been recently fired by Keith Richards and tour manager Sam Cutler.
Neither Schneider nor the Stones had any money at the time to fund this endeavor so Schneider had to come up with a new business model and that meant the band getting a piece of the gross box office and demanding a 50% advance, which funded the shows.
Schneider’s role involved securing box office receipts on behalf of the band. In this way, the band itself (and Schneider, whose interests were aligned with those of the band) was in control of all the money related to a tour. On behalf of the Rolling Stones, Schneider centralized the control, ownership and management of ancillary rights, licensing and the marketing of posters, T shirts, programs and other concert related materials—-vastly improving the group’s revenue base while touring. Many other bands followed suit throughout the 1970s."
Isn't Schneider on this board?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 06:48 by hbwriter.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 05:50
Copy and pasting from wikipedia? Such fun. 
Some blurb about Peter Grant and Led Zeppelin...
"Led Zeppelin's particular success in the United States can partly be credited to Grant's keen sense of US audiences and the vast underground movement that was sweeping the country.[10] It was his sound knowledge of the American touring scene that thrust Led Zeppelin into the forefront of the burgeoning American rock market, and under his stewardship the great majority of Led Zeppelin concerts were performed in the United States, resulting in massive profits for the group.[2] He ensured that the vast bulk of ticket profits wound up in the hands of the band rather than in the hands of promoters and booking agents.,[11] and is reported to have secured 90% of gate money from concerts performed by the band,[1] an unprecedented feat. By taking this approach he set a new standard for artist management, "single-handedly pioneer[ing] the shift of power from the agents and promoters to the artists and management themselves."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 05:56 by His Majesty.
Some blurb about Peter Grant and Led Zeppelin...
"Led Zeppelin's particular success in the United States can partly be credited to Grant's keen sense of US audiences and the vast underground movement that was sweeping the country.[10] It was his sound knowledge of the American touring scene that thrust Led Zeppelin into the forefront of the burgeoning American rock market, and under his stewardship the great majority of Led Zeppelin concerts were performed in the United States, resulting in massive profits for the group.[2] He ensured that the vast bulk of ticket profits wound up in the hands of the band rather than in the hands of promoters and booking agents.,[11] and is reported to have secured 90% of gate money from concerts performed by the band,[1] an unprecedented feat. By taking this approach he set a new standard for artist management, "single-handedly pioneer[ing] the shift of power from the agents and promoters to the artists and management themselves."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 05:56 by His Majesty.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 05:58
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 14, 2012 06:00
I DID TOO - NOW I KNOW WHY! Man, amazing how things leave the brain after a few scant years - that said, I think the timing is better today - there has been some good debate here and some great photos posted - may it continue!
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: February 14, 2012 06:12
ROCKMAN
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
hbwriter
()
Date: February 14, 2012 06:17
interesting too, how it was sort of birthed at Hyde Park - what a year for the band -
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: February 14, 2012 06:19
Quote
hbwriter
interesting too, how it was sort of birthed at Hyde Park - what a year for the band -
Interesting that Blind Faith allowed them to forsee how it might work out. I have to wonder if Blind Faith's Summer '69 Arena tour didn't act as something similar too.
Ok, cool, I'm done debating whether it's the yadda yadda arena tour or not, but the strive for better sound quality at gigs, travelling with your own PA etc is of course relevant to the thread and that's why i'm posting this link.
Tis a great blog, so much interesting stuff...
[rockprosopography101.blogspot.com]
"Thus the Grateful Dead were among the very first rock bands to actually travel with a full size public address system, louder than anyone else's at the time."
"Nonetheless, the San Francisco ballrooms established the blueprint for the rock concert experience up to this very day. No rock concert goer today would expect any less than exceptional sound, loud as can be but clear as a bell, where any distortion is intended and not just an unfortunate byproduct. That's not to say we always get what we want as listeners, of course, but we know what we are supposed to get. So if I'm right, August 17, 1966 at the Fillmore marked the night that rock's most famous auditorium got a state of the art sound system and kept it that way, setting the standard for rock concert sound forever after."
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2012-02-14 06:27 by His Majesty.
Re: The tour that broke more rules and created more new rules than any other in history...
Posted by:
Jah Paul
()
Date: February 14, 2012 06:26
Quote
His Majesty
Ok, cool, I'm done debating whether it's the yadda yadda arena tour or not, but the strive for better sound quality at gigs, travelling with your own PA etc is of course relevant to the thread and that's why i'm posting this link.
Tis a great blog, so much interesting stuff in there.
[rockprosopography101.blogspot.com]
"Nonetheless, the San Francisco ballrooms established the blueprint for the rock concert experience up to this very day. No rock concert goer today would expect any less than exceptional sound, loud as can be but clear as a bell, where any distortion is intended and not just an unfortunate byproduct. That's not to say we always get what we want as listeners, of course, but we know what we are supposed to get. So if I'm right, August 17, 1966 at the Fillmore marked the night that rock's most famous auditorium got a state of the art sound system and kept it that way, setting the standard for rock concert sound forever after."
Funny how The Beatles' last public show ever was in San Francisco (at Candlestick) a mere 12 days later.
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
Online Users
DEmerson , FloresMuertas , gaizoku , HopeYouGuessMyName , keefmick , kovach , RollingStonesRob , TumblinDice76 , voodoodrew
Guests:
1958
Record Number of Users:
206
on June 1, 2022 23:50
Record Number of Guests:
9627
on January 2, 2024 23:10