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Rocky Dijon
So back to "Think I'm Going Mad," can we settle on who's playing keyboards and saxophone?
I'd say 1983-overdubs by Sanborn and Chuck. And it's piano, not keyboards (semantics, I know ). As far as I know, Mac never played piano with the Stones.
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Rocky Dijon
Reasonable conclusion then:
The EMOTIONAL RESCUE outtake was edited/remixed by Clearmountain for TATTOO YOU and then during the UNDERCOVER sessions, overdubs of piano and saxophone were added. The omission of Kimsey's credit as an Associate Producer may have been done because he was a full co-producer by UNDERCOVER and they didn't want to credit or possibly compensate him as such for the B-side.
Anyone think differently regarding piano and saxophone? What about the circulating outtake from EMOTIONAL RESCUE? Is the piano and saxophone different from what is on the 45?
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Rocky Dijon
The possiblity of Mel Collins is why I suspect the track might actually originate from SOME GIRLS since there is no record of him attending an EMOTIONAL RESCUE session. If he had, he would have played the saxophone solo on "Emotional Rescue" and not Bobby. The circulating band outtake is likely Collins.
Then it's the remaining question, is the circulating band outtake a different saxophone than what is heard on the B-side in 1984? If it is different, then it is likely David Sanborn.
If the track originates from SOME GIRLS (as the inclusion of Mel Collins would suggest) and not EMOTIONAL RESCUE, who is on piano on the outtake? As Bard says it doesn't sound like Mac who was fired sometime after the blind concerts in April 1979 and before they reached Pathe-Marconi in the summer and brought Nicky Hopkins back. It is possible the circulating outtake is a SOME GIRLS outtake with Mac's contribution wiped and replaced with Nicky's piano as they did with the Compass Point sessions earlier that year. This would likely have been mixed by Clearmountain for TATTOO YOU and been refreshed during UNDERCOVER with possible overdubs by Chuck and Sanborn.
Anyone else? I believe Gaslight thinks the sax and piano on the b-side are the same as the circulating outtake, just mixed differently. That is also a possibility.
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Rocky Dijon
The possiblity of Mel Collins is why I suspect the track might actually originate from SOME GIRLS since there is no record of him attending an EMOTIONAL RESCUE session. If he had, he would have played the saxophone solo on "Emotional Rescue" and not Bobby. The circulating band outtake is likely Collins.
Then it's the remaining question, is the circulating band outtake a different saxophone than what is heard on the B-side in 1984? If it is different, then it is likely David Sanborn.
If the track originates from SOME GIRLS (as the inclusion of Mel Collins would suggest) and not EMOTIONAL RESCUE, who is on piano on the outtake? As Bard says it doesn't sound like Mac who was fired sometime after the blind concerts in April 1979 and before they reached Pathe-Marconi in the summer and brought Nicky Hopkins back. It is possible the circulating outtake is a SOME GIRLS outtake with Mac's contribution wiped and replaced with Nicky's piano as they did with the Compass Point sessions earlier that year. This would likely have been mixed by Clearmountain for TATTOO YOU and been refreshed during UNDERCOVER with possible overdubs by Chuck and Sanborn.
Anyone else? I believe Gaslight thinks the sax and piano on the b-side are the same as the circulating outtake, just mixed differently. That is also a possibility.
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MathijsQuote
Rocky Dijon
The possiblity of Mel Collins is why I suspect the track might actually originate from SOME GIRLS since there is no record of him attending an EMOTIONAL RESCUE session. If he had, he would have played the saxophone solo on "Emotional Rescue" and not Bobby. The circulating band outtake is likely Collins.
Then it's the remaining question, is the circulating band outtake a different saxophone than what is heard on the B-side in 1984? If it is different, then it is likely David Sanborn.
If the track originates from SOME GIRLS (as the inclusion of Mel Collins would suggest) and not EMOTIONAL RESCUE, who is on piano on the outtake? As Bard says it doesn't sound like Mac who was fired sometime after the blind concerts in April 1979 and before they reached Pathe-Marconi in the summer and brought Nicky Hopkins back. It is possible the circulating outtake is a SOME GIRLS outtake with Mac's contribution wiped and replaced with Nicky's piano as they did with the Compass Point sessions earlier that year. This would likely have been mixed by Clearmountain for TATTOO YOU and been refreshed during UNDERCOVER with possible overdubs by Chuck and Sanborn.
Anyone else? I believe Gaslight thinks the sax and piano on the b-side are the same as the circulating outtake, just mixed differently. That is also a possibility.
It doesn't sound like Some Girls at all, the drums have that snappy Emotional Rescue sound and the China crash.
That said, Jim Barber has stated he played bass one night with the Stones while recording Undercover, and that they played ITIGM for 12 hours in a row, and that they did multiple sessions on it for several days.
Mathijs
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DandelionPowdermanNot just a regular Fsus? I know Collins (or Sanborn?) extends that chord with notes from the maj-chord a few times, but does Keith really play a Fmaj there?Quote
z
I think it's based on a simple C and Fmaj7 in the 1st position. Index finger hammering the c note and the little finger adding the d note.
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GasLightStreet
Just by listening to the intro sax part, there are different mixes to listen to, and some are the unedited song, but from what I can tell they all have the same roll in them. If they did get someone else to replace the original sax they did a pretty damn good job of playing the swagger of the original.
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Mathijs
It doesn't sound like Some Girls at all, the drums have that snappy Emotional Rescue sound and the China crash.
That said, Jim Barber has stated he played bass one night with the Stones while recording Undercover, and that they played ITIGM for 12 hours in a row, and that they did multiple sessions on it for several days.
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Rocky Dijon
I would love to see the label or back sleeve. I believe you, but every copy I've seen, both Atlantic and EMI, list only The Glimmer Twins for producing "Think I'm Going Mad."
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Rocky Dijon
Thanks, SomeGuy. I missed the More Pics link the first time around. Interesting that Kimsey's name comes first as Producer before The Glimmer Twins. Unique until STEEL WHEELS. This would appear to be the only version that credits him. So much is fascinating about this oddly haunting little track.
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Rocky DijonQuote
GasLightStreet
Just by listening to the intro sax part, there are different mixes to listen to, and some are the unedited song, but from what I can tell they all have the same roll in them. If they did get someone else to replace the original sax they did a pretty damn good job of playing the swagger of the original.
I thought that's what you had previously said. So what about the piano on the unedited outtake? If we've ruled out Mac, is it Nicky or Chuck? I presume the question of placement is why Nico Zentgraf and Ian McPherson speculate it's Mick on piano, though it seems unlikely to me.
Is the piano on the unedited outtake different from the b-side to your ears or is the b-side simply the Clearmountain edit/remix for TATTOO YOU of the EMOTIONAL RESCUE outtake?
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Rocky Dijon
"Bard wrecks the internet."
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Rocky Dijon
In all fairness to Sea Level himself, his piano on "Fancy Man Blues" is not in Gaslight vernacular, "cheesy tinkly tinkle." I would put "Fancy Man Blues" up against anything Stu played and that's very high praise indeed.
Now the fake piano he plays late in "She Was Hot," that is "cheesy tinkly tinkle," but his organ work throughout UNDERCOVER and DIRTY WORK and even a bit of STEEL WHEELS is terrific.
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Rocky Dijon
So much is fascinating about this oddly haunting little track.
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GasLightStreetQuote
Rocky Dijon
In all fairness to Sea Level himself, his piano on "Fancy Man Blues" is not in Gaslight vernacular, "cheesy tinkly tinkle." I would put "Fancy Man Blues" up against anything Stu played and that's very high praise indeed.
Now the fake piano he plays late in "She Was Hot," that is "cheesy tinkly tinkle," but his organ work throughout UNDERCOVER and DIRTY WORK and even a bit of STEEL WHEELS is terrific.
Oh I see... drawing lines in the sand now. Any particular kind of sand? Don't be distracted by an element of someone putting the quash on the tinkle. Look at, and imbibe, on the overall hues of the picture.
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Rocky DijonQuote
Mathijs
It doesn't sound like Some Girls at all, the drums have that snappy Emotional Rescue sound and the China crash.
That said, Jim Barber has stated he played bass one night with the Stones while recording Undercover, and that they played ITIGM for 12 hours in a row, and that they did multiple sessions on it for several days.
That's a really good point about the China crash. So if it's definitely EMOTIONAL RESCUE, who is on sax and piano? I wouldn't think it's Bobby. If it's Mel Collins and we're unaware of his being present in 1979, why didn't he play on the actual album - particularly the title track? Is it Nicky on piano?
The track has fascinated me for a long time because it appears (unlikely as it is) to be a hybrid of SOME GIRLS, EMOTIONAL RESCUE, the TATTOO YOU overdubs, and UNDERCOVER remixing and possible overdubs.
As for Jim Barber, it could just be the long outtake we've heard with Keith on vocals (obviously a small part of the session). I certainly don't think the guitars on the b-side are Keith and Jim Barber during UNDERCOVER. They sound more like late seventies Pathe-Marconi sessions.
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drewmaster
How many different versions of this track (bootleg or otherwise) are circulating?
Drew