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Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: LieB ()
Date: March 9, 2021 11:14

By the way, I have another idea for this thread. Why don't we add information about any previously releases for each songs, so we get a picture of what songs are previously unknown and what songs have been released before, either on boots or on official releases.

I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to contribute much, but some tracks I know of course, like Fiji Jim, Scarlet and Tell Her How It Is (Potted Shrimp with vocals).

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: March 9, 2021 17:48

Fyi Nico has removed all references to the soul classic "Heatwave" on his 1975 page, and he replaced them with "Built That Way".

And acc. to Nico also "Keep It Cool" III (the shortest one so far) is aka "So Smoothe".
Maybe we'll see a KIC IV which will have the standard radio-compatible duration of 03.30?) grinning smiley
Anyway it's very interesting to see the evolution of the song between vI and vIII.
Well done Mick... and Chuck! winking smiley



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-09 17:57 by dcba.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 10, 2021 23:38

Looks like the 50 tracks have now been "nailed", thanks to BlueTurns2grey for the summary topic and to all participants/sources !

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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: ProfessorWolf ()
Date: March 11, 2021 01:31

what confuses me is if this is some kind of list of songs slated for releases why would they overlook or leave off songs that we already know and are nearly finished like for instance

travilin man/highway child/still a fool/drift away/let's do it right/i love ladies/different kind/misty roads/heartache/my first plea/what gives you the right/keith toronto 77 stuff/all i have to do is dream/high school girl/talk is cheap/what am i supposed to do whith your love/ready yourself/honest man/zip mouth angel/you got it made/dreams/under the radar/we don't wanna go home

just to name a few with finished or near finished vocals not mention 2 dozen or so great instrumentals just begging to be finished is it maybe that these are already well known to fan maybe and they want to release something new to maximise sales

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: detroitken ()
Date: March 11, 2021 01:44

Quote
ProfessorWolf
what confuses me is if this is some kind of list of songs slated for releases why would they overlook or leave off songs that we already know and are nearly finished like for instance

travilin man/highway child/still a fool/drift away/let's do it right/i love ladies/different kind/misty roads/heartache/my first plea/what gives you the right/keith toronto 77 stuff/all i have to do is dream/high school girl/talk is cheap/what am i supposed to do whith your love/ready yourself/honest man/zip mouth angel/you got it made/dreams/under the radar/we don't wanna go home

just to name a few with finished or near finished vocals not mention 2 dozen or so great instrumentals just begging to be finished is it maybe that these are already well known to fan maybe and they want to release something new to maximise sales
maybe they will be on the NEXT set.....

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: ProfessorWolf ()
Date: March 11, 2021 02:43

god i hope

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: wiredallnight ()
Date: March 11, 2021 10:09

Quote
dcba
...

Nico gives a 1979 date for "Trouble's a Coming" (and we can forget the former "Break Away" title).
Same for "Dog Shit" from 83 which becomes "Big Truff".

Big Truff? Really? I don't hear that. It's rather "Big Love" or "Luck". Something with "L".

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 11, 2021 11:13

Yeah, what's a "Truff" anyway ? Here are the definitions I found : [definedictionarymeaning.com] ;-)
"The mafia way of saying true."
"A person with [skin] that is [rough], and or [tough]."
"when [tough] meets [rough]"
"The lower parts of [trousers] (or pants) that can be removed by unzipping them. A contraction of [Trouser] and [Cuff]."

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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: March 11, 2021 14:16

Quote
gotdablouse
Yeah, what's a "Truff" anyway ?

A deformation of the word "truth"?
As in "gimme shelter" for "give me shelter" winking smiley

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: BlueTurns2Grey ()
Date: March 11, 2021 15:16

Truff, whatever it is and I was thinking about mushrooms, it sounds a lot better than 'Dog Shit'... grinning smiley

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 11, 2021 18:10

Indeed !

As it turns out the "Big Truff" title has been around for decades, since 1985 to be precise as it appeared in the "Eat it (The well well book)" by Michael Kuhn (editor of the "Charlie is good tonight" fanzine) [mikiwiki.org] in the autumn of 1985.

No guarantee it's "Dog Shit" but the fact that it was embellished like that with horns points to the additional work that they put in it at the time and there's no other unknown song from the sessions like that.





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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-11 18:10 by gotdablouse.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: BlueTurns2Grey ()
Date: March 11, 2021 18:18

Quote
gotdablouse
Indeed !

As it turns out the "Big Truff" title has been around for decades, since 1985 to be precise as it appeared in the "Eat it (The well well book)" by Michael Kuhn (editor of the "Charlie is good tonight" fanzine) [mikiwiki.org] in the autumn of 1985.

No guarantee it's "Dog Shit" but the fact that it was embellished like that with horns points to the additional work that they put in it at the time and there's no other unknown song from the sessions like that.




Thank you for this piece of paper that has aged in honor. 'Big Truff' really seems to be the correct and better title.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: wiredallnight ()
Date: March 11, 2021 19:57

Quote
BlueTurns2Grey

Thank you for this piece of paper that has aged in honor. 'Big Truff' really seems to be the correct and better title.

Better than Dog Shit in any case, but I still think it is not "truff" what he sings. Never!

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: BlueTurns2Grey ()
Date: March 11, 2021 20:11

Quote
wiredallnight
Quote
BlueTurns2Grey

Thank you for this piece of paper that has aged in honor. 'Big Truff' really seems to be the correct and better title.

Better than Dog Shit in any case, but I still think it is not "truff" what he sings. Never!

I also can't identify what he is singing, that really sounds diffrent to 'truff'. But we have good reasons now, that this might be the working title. Anyway, I prefere this, compared to the old title. Hopefully someone asks MJ one day, what this was about.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: Elmo Lewis ()
Date: March 11, 2021 21:51

I always thought "Dogshit" was Keith's name for "Pretty Beat Up".

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 11, 2021 23:30

Not exactly -> [iorr.org]

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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: hj3009 ()
Date: March 12, 2021 19:13

Review:
[www.collectorsmusicreviews.com]
Don't know if this has already been posted.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: March 12, 2021 19:29

Thank you H.
This "review" is laden with mistakes though.

"I’ll preface this review in full by stating – BUY IT!"
He gets this right though.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: guezeg ()
Date: March 12, 2021 19:41

Theses 5 songs seem to have been overdubbed quite recently with the same piano player : Can't Find Love, Keep It Cool, Part of the Night, Still in Love, I Can't See No One Else.

Were they planned for an official release at some point?

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 13, 2021 14:58

What makes you think it wouldn't be the one and only Chuck Leavell who was at all these sessions who played the original parts ?

As for an official release, no one knows for sure but it's possible they were all considered for the "Memory Hotel" project that they considered between 1999 and 2001, the best summary about what could have happened is here [iorr.org] AFAIK, courtesy of "Rocky Dijon"

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IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: StoneZP ()
Date: March 13, 2021 17:57

Thanks BlueTurns2Grey for doing this and thanks to everyone who collaborated in making this list.
Now on dbboots:
[dbboots.com]

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 13, 2021 19:45

Quote
StoneZP
Thanks BlueTurns2Grey for doing this and thanks to everyone who collaborated in making this list.
Now on dbboots:
[dbboots.com]

Cool, a few things to fix if I may :
- "Fast Talking, Slow Walking" is now known as a 1974 track
- "Tell Her How It Is" should probably be shown as the vocal version of "Potted Shrimps"
- Same for "Hands Off" and "It's Alright", Voodoo Residue has the early version called "Get Your Hands Off"
- Heatwave, now known to be "Built That Way"
- It's "Prairie Love" not "Praire Love"

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: guezeg ()
Date: March 15, 2021 12:54

The piano has the same really modern sound on these 5 titles, it sounds more recent than the backing tracks of the songs.
It may be played by Chuck Leavell though.

And how do we know that Fast Talking was recorded in 1974, not 1972 ? Maybe it got the same treatement as Short and Curlies (recorded in 1972, reworked in 1974) ?

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 15, 2021 15:21

According to Martin Elliot some "studio logs" appeared last year (not publicly though AFAIK) that shed some light on the 73/75 period, that's how some assumed dates got modified.

As for the piano parts, it's possible they were redone at some point but on "Still in Love" it sounds exactly like the one in the instrumental version that was leaked 30+ years ago on "Goin'...Mad & Wild", so not too likely, not that it really matters ;-)

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: guezeg ()
Date: March 15, 2021 17:15

OK, thanks for the info !

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: StoneZP ()
Date: March 17, 2021 20:04

Quote
gotdablouse
Quote
StoneZP
Thanks BlueTurns2Grey for doing this and thanks to everyone who collaborated in making this list.
Now on dbboots:
[dbboots.com]

Cool, a few things to fix if I may :
- "Fast Talking, Slow Walking" is now known as a 1974 track
- "Tell Her How It Is" should probably be shown as the vocal version of "Potted Shrimps"
- Same for "Hands Off" and "It's Alright", Voodoo Residue has the early version called "Get Your Hands Off"
- Heatwave, now known to be "Built That Way"
- It's "Prairie Love" not "Praire Love"


Here i think we can hear the 72 version of "Fast Talking"
But dbboots put the same date on "Fully F.S.O."
Two versions on the same day or are they really wrong?

[www.filefactory.com]

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: March 18, 2021 19:31

"Deep Love II" :
Chuck played the drums on v1 (yeah don't laugh,it was probably one night Charlie was "tired" or awol) but who plays on v2?

It doesn't sound like Charlie to me, maybe Jordan then? The muscular drumming (evident at the beginning of the track) fits his style.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 19, 2021 16:01

Where did you read about Chuck playing the drums on the version with Keith's vocals ?

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Date: March 19, 2021 16:09

The first time I listened to Troubles a coming I hear Crazy Mama. Could it be an early working version of Crazy Mama?

Clearly not the beginning but when you get further in it is a dead ringer for crazy mama.

Re: Ideas about the sources of the new outtakes collection
Posted by: plusplusjames ()
Date: March 19, 2021 18:38

Quote
gotdablouse
Quote
StoneZP
Thanks BlueTurns2Grey for doing this and thanks to everyone who collaborated in making this list.
Now on dbboots:
[dbboots.com]

Cool, a few things to fix if I may :
- "Fast Talking, Slow Walking" is now known as a 1974 track
- "Tell Her How It Is" should probably be shown as the vocal version of "Potted Shrimps"
- Same for "Hands Off" and "It's Alright", Voodoo Residue has the early version called "Get Your Hands Off"
- Heatwave, now known to be "Built That Way"
- It's "Prairie Love" not "Praire Love"

Also, "WeNdy," not "WeMdy." (Obviously). (Before some Tik Tok watching girl rushes in to correct me). angry smiley

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