yeah, I agree, everyone wants to try and recapture the vibes and good times of youth. And no, it isn't going to be the same experience from 20 or 30 years ago because we're all older and the world's so homogenized now.....

However, the music is still amazing. And in the case of Zeppelin (or the Stones) who's creating anything nearly that good? Assuming the tickets wouldn't require my mortgaging my house -I'd definitely see the band if they tour (in Philly area).

He sounds really cool and full of uncompromised idealism with regard to the music, maaaaaaan--until you really think about it.

I mean, if you take Bob L. at his word, then the music doesn't really work outside of the very specific historical context in which it was created and originally performed. And isn't that a failure of the artist or of the listener or an indication of the limitations of the material?

For my own part, I think it takes a lot of work to carry popular songs for decades and to keep them fresh and vital as they and their audience age. But it can be so rewarding, too. It's so phenomenally rich to have people gather in large numbers to connect with music that has been with them for decades--and the crucial artistic choice is whether to embrace that history by choosing and adapting the material or to deny it by putting over obvious re-creations of the original records (which, by the way, is how you do a "warhorse" or "Vegas" set when you haven't played in 27 years.) Bob Dylan and Neil Young do an excellent job of working with their songs and shaking up their presentations in a way that seems to draw in the richness of the whole odyssey that they and their works have made with the audience. As hot as they are, Stones tend to be disappointing in this regard: the event and the atmosphere tends to only hint at the passage of time and the relationship between the band and audience. The rare exceptions--"Time Is On My Side" in '81, "Not Fade Away" and "Miss You" with footage of departed greats in '94--actually deepen the authenticity and relevance of the Stones in a way that would never have been possible, in, say, '73.

My understanding is that Plant and Page did a great job of drawing on Zep while taking great creative liberties during their duo tours of the 1990's. If I were Robert Plant, I would be very concerned about being able to preserve that vitality and latitude while using The Brand Name.

If they do it, though, they can prove that the music is as tough and durable and eternally vital as the blues on which it's based. And how cool would that be?

A lesson for our boys, perhaps?

This is all moot, same as saying The Stones are too old to strut the stage. No one says the same thing about the jazz legends still playing today - Ornette Coleman, Sonny Rollins, Cecil Taylor et al.

Secondly, I know two people who saw Zep yesterday - one 50 something, the other 20 something - and they both say it was beyond superb. So there. That's really all that counts: age is irrelevant as long as they can still deliver.

stonesfever Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> yeah, I agree, everyone wants to try and recapture
> the vibes and good times of youth. And no, it
> isn't going to be the same experience from 20 or
> 30 years ago because we're all older

What? I drank Vodka and had some cougheee just like 30 years ago at MSG...the only difference, instead of stumbling out of The O2, I nodded off to bed.

I guess I am getting older. LOL

Nikolai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is all moot, same as saying The Stones are
> too old to strut the stage. No one says the same
> thing about the jazz legends still playing today -
> Ornette Coleman, Sonny Rollins, Cecil Taylor et
> al.
>
> Secondly, I know two people who saw Zep yesterday
> - one 50 something, the other 20 something - and
> they both say it was beyond superb. So there.
> That's really all that counts: age is irrelevant
> as long as they can still deliver.


Well said!

Once again the Reverend Robert W steals the ideas right out of my brain and articulates them so succintly in ways that I never could.......thanks Rev....

= More pure blues & refined rock rootsy roots music in Stones future material!

Lukester Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Once again the Reverend Robert W steals the ideas
> right out of my brain and articulates them so
> succintly in ways that I never could.......thanks
> Rev....


Yeah...what he said.

are there any reviews of Bill's set anywhere? sorry if i've missed them in the LZ flurry

I share the blogger's feelings about not wanting to tarnish my view of certain artists and music. And I'm saying "view" -- not memories -- because I'm only 26 years old, and my relation to Led Zeppelin is based purely on their old material. And that legacy does get a bit tarnished when I watch them on youtube (or perhaps in concert, if I could afford it) sounding older + more modern than they used to in 1975.

That's why I think the biggest heroes in the business are those who never quit. Death or breakup is usually enhancing the legacy of a great artist (such as Hendrix, Joplin, Morrison, Cobain -- or the Beatles and Led Zeppelin) when it should be the opposite. Our biggest stars are really the ones who manages to keep it together (more or less) for decades -- like the Stones, Springsteen, Dylan, Neil Young, etc. And I think producing good new material is what preserves the legacy. Springsteen goes on tour and plays several songs from his last album and nobody is thinking about his legacy getting tarnished, that he should retire, or that he shouldn't have resumed his career at point X. In my view, the Stones are in-between Led Zep and Springsteen, because they rely a lot on merits, and they play worse than they used to, even though they never quit, they never really had anything to resurrect.

So the tactig is: either quit for ever or play for ever. If you fail, it's gonna get difficult the longer you wait.

Go through Bob L's archives and find the piece he did about Neil Young's ticket prices. His Celine Dion article is priceless too.

Lukester Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Once again the Reverend Robert W steals the ideas
> right out of my brain and articulates them so
> succintly in ways that I never could.......thanks
> Rev....

Luke my man, I had to look that one up (succintly) couldn't find it but its there with an additional "c" succinctly (an adverb meaning, briefly). Nice choice of words.

what an ass whoever wrote that blog entry! what an absolute ASS!

why should they not tour? its the three original members and the SON of the original drummer who was taught to drum by the drummer and as a kid used to hang out with the rest of the band anyways.

what is the friggin problem with them touring if people all over the world want to see them?

based on the youtubes i've seen they ROCKED last night.. why should they not tour? so that we have to see a bunch of no balls young @#$%& bands?

they are LED ZEPPELIN and if they want to tour and millions of people want to see them i see no problem.. its obvious they can still cut it.

Happy Jack Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Led Zeppelin Rebellious? Wow, are you kidding me?
> Ok so they only released one single (Immigrant
> Song/Hey Hey What Can I do) but it was the 70s and
> my understanding of rock music then was that it
> was more geared towards the album. Pink Floyd
> didnt release any singles that werent from an
> album either in the 70s (Money and Time were
> released as singles, against the bands wishes and
> Another Brick in the Wall Pt 2 comes from 1980).
>


I have heard and read many times that "Zeppelin never released singles". The fact is, Led Zeppelin released TEN singles that placed in the Billboard Hot 100. Whole Lotta Love reached #4. Black Dog, Immigrant Song, and D'yer Mak'er were all Top 20 hit singles. Fool In The Rain and Trampled Underfoot both cracked the Top 40.

They'll tour..and why not.
Apart from anything else, it's quite evident that, from what's leaked out,once they took the plunge they really enjoyed it, got on well and had a good time.

Rather different I suspect from the Cream "reunion", where mutual respect and maturity enabled it to happen but there wasn't much genuine warmth between them.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-12-12 15:31 by Spud.

Zep's always presented themselves as a mysterious and eretheral band, so why change now?

NumberOneStonesFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Zep's always presented themselves as a mysterious
> and eretheral band, so why change now?


They're still mysterious and ethereal. For example: What's Jimmy Page been doing since they split? Apart from coming off smack and suing bootleggers? He's been practically inactive compared to Plant and John Paul Jones, who've both done some great/VERY interesting work.

Nikolai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NumberOneStonesFan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Zep's always presented themselves as a
> mysterious
> > and eretheral band, so why change now?
>
>
> They're still mysterious and ethereal. For
> example: What's Jimmy Page been doing since they
> split? Apart from coming off smack and suing
> bootleggers? He's been practically inactive
> compared to Plant and John Paul Jones, who've both
> done some great/VERY interesting work.


In the mid-eighties he played with the Firm, 1988 he released a solo album, in the nineties he played live and recorded two albums with Robert Plant. He has also worked a lot with the Zeppelin catalouge: remastering all the albums, live CD:s, DVD:s etc.

From what I hear and read this was the best concert in a long time. Best live band in the world....
Aren't they forgetting someone?

Rev. Robert W. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> A lesson for our boys, perhaps?


I don't think so. Our boys don't take lessons from the Zeppelins: The Rolling Stones have been putting themselves on the line for over 40 years, and they've been passing through almost literally anything, and yet they still are on top of the game.

If there is a band giving lessons to others, that band has to be The Rolling Stones.

Harm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> From what I hear and read this was the best
> concert in a long time. Best live band in the
> world....
> Aren't they forgetting someone?

I won't start a new thread but will ask the question here:

Do those who attended the O2 LZ show believe it was a classic performance and one of the greatest rock concerts of all time?
If O2 was the 500th Zep show since 1979 then it would probably be known as another great Zep show. Their rarity is a huge factor of course.
Even from the youtube clips, they sounded great and their energy and fan synergy could be felt.
I think once last go-round the world (at least one) for LZ could break Stones box-office records depending on price range, markets and venues.

Before the show I thought perhaps LZ couldn't even come close to their prime days and could be self-mockery, but I still see and feel their mystique.
Plant's voice didn't sound nearly as trashed as some reports/opinions I've read/heard. Where Roger Daltrey's voice is completely shot now, but hisintensity and effort make up for it a little bit.

Svartmer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nikolai Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > NumberOneStonesFan Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Zep's always presented themselves as a
> > mysterious
> > > and eretheral band, so why change now?
> >
> >
> > They're still mysterious and ethereal. For
> > example: What's Jimmy Page been doing since
> they
> > split? Apart from coming off smack and suing
> > bootleggers? He's been practically inactive
> > compared to Plant and John Paul Jones, who've
> both
> > done some great/VERY interesting work.
>
>
> In the mid-eighties he played with the Firm, 1988
> he released a solo album, in the nineties he
> played live and recorded two albums with Robert
> Plant. He has also worked a lot with the Zeppelin
> catalouge: remastering all the albums, live CD:s,
> DVD:s etc.

Compared to Plant and Jones, he's done very little new stuff.

NumberOneStonesFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Harm Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > From what I hear and read this was the best
> > concert in a long time. Best live band in the
> > world....
> > Aren't they forgetting someone?
>
> I won't start a new thread but will ask the
> question here:
>
> Do those who attended the O2 LZ show believe it
> was a classic performance and one of the greatest
> rock concerts of all time?
> If O2 was the 500th Zep show since 1979 then it
> would probably be known as another great Zep show.
> Their rarity is a huge factor of course.
> Even from the youtube clips, they sounded great
> and their energy and fan synergy could be felt.
> I think once last go-round the world (at least
> one) for LZ could break Stones box-office records
> depending on price range, markets and venues.
>
> Before the show I thought perhaps LZ couldn't even
> come close to their prime days and could be
> self-mockery, but I still see and feel their
> mystique.
> Plant's voice didn't sound nearly as trashed as
> some reports/opinions I've read/heard. Where
> Roger Daltrey's voice is completely shot now, but
> hisintensity and effort make up for it a little
> bit.


Daltrey's voice is far from shot. He can't hit the notes he used to, but neother can most singers in their sixties. Plant certainly can't.

I don't think Plant's too keen to do a full-blown world tour. I expect there'll be a few residencies in massive venues next year - 3-4 nights in US and UK stadia to be precise.

NumberOneStonesFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Harm Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > From what I hear and read this was the best
> > concert in a long time. Best live band in the
> > world....
> > Aren't they forgetting someone?


>> Their rarity is a huge factor of course.

Very correct IMO

It must take a lot to do a 2/3 year world tour even with the breaks and pampering.

This is a point that is often forgotten by Stones bashers. A lot of other bands can't do it or be bothered to try or have not got the energy to sustain such a long excursion.

I don't think Plant's too keen to do a full-blown
> world tour. I expect there'll be a few
> residencies in massive venues next year - 3-4
> nights in US and UK stadia to be precise.



I think this may be the case. There's a lot of talk about a six-night stand at Giants Stadium in June. I'm sure they'll do something similar in London, and they'll no doubt INSIST on doing a whole bunch of shows in their favourite city of all, Los Angeles.

I saw a report in a British Tabloid Press that they already booked 3 nights at MSG.

[www.thesun.co.uk]

The Sicilian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lukester Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Once again the Reverend Robert W steals the
> ideas
> > right out of my brain and articulates them so
> > succintly in ways that I never
> could.......thanks
> > Rev....
>
> Luke my man, I had to look that one up (succintly)
> couldn't find it but its there with an additional
> "c" succinctly (an adverb meaning, briefly). Nice
> choice of words.

...oops, thanks Sicilian......I don't know what happened to that third "c"

Nikolai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Harm Wrote:

> Daltrey's voice is far from shot. He can't hit
> the notes he used to

Well RD's voice was pretty well shot in '04 & '06 when I saw them and on all the concert recordings I've heard from the last 3 years or so.

His voice has a very hoarse and froggy quality now and his voice cracks on a regular basis when performing, not so much like Peter Brady, but pretty darn close.
It doesn't matter though, I still love The Who and would see them in concert again. Pete's guitar drowns everything else out anyway.

Dates being held for Giants Stadium could be for Springsteen or Bon Jovi or maybe U2 who has been pondering the USA Stadium market after a 10 yr absence from US Stadiums.