I may be wrong but I just watched AUSTIN biggest bang for the 1st time completely tonight (I have been waiting my birthday this month to get the dvd) and I believe Mick made at least 2 overdubs : one during LSTNT and the second during Satisfaction. I have a 3 meters screen at home. it is easy to see the lack of synchro on lips for both and I have a ear : obviously Satisfaction is overdubed with a very devoted Jagg on it.

Also the chorus of Get Off of My Cloud.

It's full to the brim with overdubs

GOMC is the most blatant

ThatsWhatISay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's full to the brim with overdubs


I just don't hear that...Probably Under My Thumb. Probably some vocals here and there..

But if you (or anyone) can identify all of the non-vocal overdubs you think you hear, I'd be interested...

On the B stage, you have to remember, too, that Blondie, Bernard and Lisa are singing/playing, but they're still on the main stage. On Under My Thumb, Ronnie starts off but then another guitar (Blondie) kicks in but it's not Keith because he comes onto the stage shortly after and then he starts playing, too.

texas fan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ThatsWhatISay Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's full to the brim with overdubs
>
>
> I just don't hear that...Probably Under My Thumb.
> Probably some vocals here and there..
>
> But if you (or anyone) can identify all of the
> non-vocal overdubs you think you hear, I'd be
> interested...

Well I kind of skimmed the Austin disc as it just didn't do much for me. I thought Jagger's vocals sounded a bit thin as well but maybe that is how my sound system is set up.
As far as non-vocal overdubs I didn't notice any particular sloppiness in the guitar tracks (except for SFTD as I recall). This makes me think that there was probably some kind of rework (to varying degrees) on most of the guitar tracks.

You have a 3 metre screen! Wow. When's the party - I'll bring the beer.

i think the opener "you got me rocking" has got an vocal overdub..
you can see micks mouth only a few seconds during the wohle song...that´s unnormal i think!

Based on the stones history, it would be surprising if there weren't overdubs a plenty on the DVD.

What most people consider to be their greatest ever live album (Get Your Ya Yas) was plastered with overdubs and I can't think of any official live album or video without any overdubs on. The most blatent one wa on Got Live if you Want It where some of the songs were obviously studio recordings with OD'd crowd noise. Everything after that was an improvement, even the Rocks Off cut on Live Licks!

Hey sjs12! one of the irish lads from pilot inn here. take it u loved the show on thurs! can i just ask what does yr signature

"Thee's Got'n Where Thee Cassn't Back'n, Hassn't"

come from?! A stones roadie quote? twist on the 'ol bard?

agree totally w the overdubs on all their live releases. there has been little change since 65, puttin out a studio take w crowd noise dubbed on! that said the moments on austin where mick is clearly out of sync are a major glitch that surely could be tweaked for future releases. prob not, but they kind of take away instead of add imo.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-08-29 14:35 by gerrox.

I can't really tell you exactely which parts were overdubbed. I'd have to go all through it again. But the Austin show sounds fake to me in so many places. And yes it is missing the sloppiness which is always a good indicator to tell if there is any overdubbing.
The Rio show sounds a lot more authentic!

Clear overdubs, but at least the video appears to be honest. For the Saitama numbers that they used, they actually used the same audience shots on all of the cuts. So the same people are front row at the B-stage and the main stage. Actually, for all I know, they might be shots from Shanghai. For me, it is distracting and completely ruins those clips. The original Saitama vid is the only honest pro-shot presentation of a Stones show from this tour. All hand-held cameras from the audience or the stage side wings, which gives it the best "you are there" feeling that I have ever seen from a concert video. Absolutely essential.

Well, thanks everyone for weighing in, but still no one has identified a single non-vocal overdub. Hmmm...

I'm not saying they aren't there, I just want to know if we're certain or just speculating when we make these somewhat damning comments...

Texas Fan, the start of Under My Thumb seems to have some guitar overdubbing.
i'd love to hear your assessment of that part.

Silver Dagger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You have a 3 metre screen! Wow. When's the party -
> I'll bring the beer.


my pleasure ! I just changed the videoprojector lamp last night. And then I watched Austin with a clear vision

I noticed Brown sugar is perfectly sang by Mick, no overdub on it.

Let's not call it overdubbing. I prefer to call it sweetining the sound.

sssoul...it's difficult to address your comment because I can't tell exactly what you think you're hearing as an overdub...Here are my thoughts...

At the show, of course, I was trying to watch everything at once so I may have missed something, but my recollection is that Ronnie played the main riff on guitar at the start of the song (similar to the '81 arrangement, but maybe Keith played it in '81). I thought the DVD showed the same thing -- Ronnie playing the riff in the intro. However, at some point maybe mid-way through, I hear that riff continuing and do not see Ronnie playing it, so THAT's where I thought the overdub might be. Of course, it could be Blondie. Or, it might not be an overdub at all -- with digital recording it's possible to literally copy and paste the riff from earlier in the song. Or, as I've said before, I may be imagining it.

What is it you hear at the first? I'll re-watch it sometime in the next few days and keep your comment in mind.

Why not just sit back and enjoy it without the need to over analyze what was obviously a great show. ' Get your ya yas out ' has overdubs on it, so why do you expect things to be different 40 years later. I doubt if there are any officially released live albums, live DVD's out there that haven't been ' modified ' in some way. It is common knowledge that one of the supposed greatest ' live ' albums of all time ' Live and Dangerous ' by Thin Lizzy was totally re-recorded with only the audience reaction remaining from much of the original recording. If you want the 'real' thing the bootlegs are out there and even then they are often to subject studio trickery / re-mixing etc. There will only ever be one live performance and that's the one that you see and hear from the particular location of the venue that you are located in.

Junior...I get your point. I did enjoy the show live and I do enjoy the DVD. I'm not sure how to explain why I'm interested in what people think about the overdubs, or the music in general.

I think hearing what other people think and why is part of why I come here...I can enjoy the music by myself, but here I can share things (including disagreements) with others that are knowledgeable...

What about Love you Live? Any over-dubs? Wasn't it just a one-time show?

>> What about Love you Live? Any over-dubs? Wasn't it just a one-time show? <<

LYL is from a bunch of different 75 - 77 shows (and yeah there are overdubs on it).

Texas Fan, i'll have to watch Under My Thumb again as well to be sure what i mean, but
at the very start of it, before Keith reappears from backstage, there seem to be guitar lines going
that neither guitarist seems to be playing. i'll keep a closer eye on Ronnie next time i watch it, though :E

for the record: i don't fret about overdubs, except when they're clumsy/intrusive.
it's just interesting to notice what's going on & who's playing what - or not, as the case may occasionally be :E

YaYa's may have overdubs. BUT - it's not plastered and the Od's are not really that important!
The stories about YaYa's overdubs are highly exaggerated!

That's the difference to later gigs/albums.

If you listen to boots /acetates from those 69 dates, - the original stuff is still great. A bit OD here and there but nuthing to get upset about!
The original material smokes and they even erased some great guitar solos!

These days they HAVE to do OD's. But don't compare it with YaYa's times!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-08-30 02:32 by CousinC.

Take a look satisfaction with earphones(not really necessary but to make sure)...ronnies guitar is completly overdubbed...for me is the best example....is absolutely different to what his hands play,specially at the end...

Thanks for the input, Freddy...I'll have a look next time I watch it...

sssoul, for the record, although I accept them as a fact of life for most bands, I fret a little about overdubs, especially when the show is good anyway. In the case of Austin, I'd also like to have an accurate historical document of the evening, since I was there...

Anyway, I'm sure there probably are some overdubs and I think I've even noticed a couple. But, some of the overdubbing comments seem to be unsupported and somewhat overstated. I recall a couple of rough spots in the show, but they're still present in the DVD. In "Sway", for instance, there is noticeable confusion about when Ronnie's first solo would end -- Aside from the obvious reactions of the band members, listen to Charlie's drums. He clearly goes to the change a measure (or two?) before the vocals actually start. This could have been cleaned up with modern technology, but was not. What does this tell us, if anything?

sjs12 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Based on the stones history, it would be
> surprising if there weren't overdubs a plenty on
> the DVD.
>
> What most people consider to be their greatest
> ever live album (Get Your Ya Yas) was plastered
> with overdubs and I can't think of any official
> live album or video without any overdubs on.

Ya-Ya's only has vocal overdubs on about half the songs, and one strophe edited out from Sympathy. There are no instruments added what so ever. The same for LYL: sides 1, 2 and 4: only vcal overdubs were done, no instrumentation has been added. Side three has many guitar overdubs on all songs except for Around and Around, mostly done by Ron Wood. Still Life has clear vocal overdubs, but a very limited amount of guitar overdubs (I only recall a third guitar in the break of Shattered).

The Austin DVD is fairly live up to that Bob Wills song. From that point on all vocals are redone, and many, many guitar parts are redone. Most obvious is Under My Thumb, where they only kept the original solo by Keith, all else is Pierre de B.

Mathijs

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Austin DVD is fairly live up to that Bob Wills
> song. From that point on all vocals are redone,
> and many, many guitar parts are redone. Most
> obvious is Under My Thumb, where they only kept
> the original solo by Keith, all else is Pierre de
> B.
>
> Mathijs

The greatest live band in the world ;-)
Well, to me, it still is because I like their music

Overdubbing happens on everything the Stones release so no big deal. I love the way Under My Thumb came out. It's the best "live" version around. The vocals are an attempt at the studio version, close to the 1997 live performances, and the guitar is more raw, close to the 1981 performances.

As far as I know, there is no audience recording of Austin circulating, so it's hard to tell what is overdubbed. Even with an audience recording you have the mix to contend with as well as what is being said and played.

"make up your mind, 'cause I gotta go"

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sjs12 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Based on the stones history, it would be
> > surprising if there weren't overdubs a plenty
> on
> > the DVD.
> >
> > What most people consider to be their greatest
> > ever live album (Get Your Ya Yas) was plastered
> > with overdubs and I can't think of any official
> > live album or video without any overdubs on.
>
> Ya-Ya's only has vocal overdubs on about half the
> songs, and one strophe edited out from Sympathy.
> There are no instruments added what so ever. The
> same for LYL: sides 1, 2 and 4: only vcal overdubs
> were done, no instrumentation has been added. Side
> three has many guitar overdubs on all songs except
> for Around and Around, mostly done by Ron Wood.
> Still Life has clear vocal overdubs, but a very
> limited amount of guitar overdubs (I only recall a
> third guitar in the break of Shattered).
>
> The Austin DVD is fairly live up to that Bob Wills
> song. From that point on all vocals are redone,
> and many, many guitar parts are redone. Most
> obvious is Under My Thumb, where they only kept
> the original solo by Keith, all else is Pierre de
> B.
>
> Mathijs


And that's the real shame! A roadie has to do the od's these days!
You can see how much they care. And there was time enough!