The Austin show (disc 1) clearly has many overdubs (many of you agreed on that already in previous threads). But what about the Rio show (disc 2)? To me it's obvious that they edited the video (the original TV broadcasts has many other shots), but what about the sound? Does it have many overdubs?

On Austin it is obvious. I didn't compare the Rio concert to the Rio bootleg yet, but I think there are no bigger overdubs. That's more a feeling than a fact, though.

if so this must be the first time they use overdubs on a video right? 4flicks got none and never seen one in a concertmovie before ... in liverecords sure but it's much harder if not impossible to do it nicely on film.

Theres considerable overdubbing in "At The Max". A considerable amount of footage seen in that film was recreated on the stage in the empty stadiums in London & Turin.

Not so sure about Four Flicks...maybe on some of the Olympia footage?

I would say that quite a few concert movies have overdubs. "The Last Waltz" certainly has, for one.

"The Last Waltz" is a great movie nonetheless! I'm curious where the overdubs are, any info to read on a fansite?

I don't think there are overdubs in the Rio DVD (you can hear it clearly during Ronnie's solo in "Start Me Up"!!!); on the other hand, the mix is much better than in the bootleg DVD I own, and the whole performance sounds really inspired and energic. I think is very very good!

barbabang Wrote:
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> "The Last Waltz" is a great movie nonetheless! I'm
> curious where the overdubs are, any info to read
> on a fansite?

Good article about the film on wikipedia [en.wikipedia.org]

I would imagine there'll be some overdubbing on "Shine A light" too.

barbabang Wrote:
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> "The Last Waltz" is a great movie nonetheless! I'm
> curious where the overdubs are, any info to read
> on a fansite?


Well, Robbie Robertson overdubbed all his guitar parts in the studio. There is an unmixed soundtrack version on bootleg where you can hear the difference (which has many songs which do not appear in the movie). And they cut one verse out of Dylan's 'Forever young'. But there are also perfromances which were not altered afterwards - like the Van Morrison songs.

Gazza Wrote:
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> Theres considerable overdubbing in "At The Max". A
> considerable amount of footage seen in that film
> was recreated on the stage in the empty stadiums
> in London & Turin.
>

I read this before. That is unbalievable if it's true. Are you really saying that they performed some of the songs in a empty stadium?

Cheers,
Wuudy

As I understand it overdubbing was rather essential on At the Max. Imax technology has oversized film with a very small number of frames per reel.
The Stones released a documentary of filming At the Max, and if memory serves they clearly alluded to the need to film after the fact. For example, the close ups of Keith at the start of Street Fighting Man are recreated. My guess is most of the up close shots are re-created.

As far as overdubbing in general, the Stones look at live releases as "productions", and they do what they need to do to get them to a point where in their minds they are appealing to the people who will buy them. They don't hesitate to overdub the audios, and they make no bones about it.

"make up your mind, 'cause I gotta go"

Satisfaction from Argentina is overdubbed. Keith p hu ck ed up the three-note-riff way too much in the original version.

What Bob says is correct, it was more to do with the technical limitations of the Imax format (such as large, weighty cameras only capable of shooting eight minutes of film on each reel). there was a documentary on this shown around the time the film came out, I think it was shown in the US on the ABC "in Concert" series.

The Turin footage was filmed the day after the concert there (29.7.90). The Stones' show scheduled to take place on that date was cancelled due to poor sales, so they did some filming in the empty stadium. The additional scenes from Wembley as I recall were filmed BEFORE the concerts which took place on August 24 & 25th. I think it was around the 22nd. The Stones had almost a week off as the last show before that had taken place on the 18th.

I really wonder who did the overdubs actually. I don't see Keith doing overdubs in a studio anymore the way he plays nowadays.

Mathijs

Mathijs Wrote:
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> I really wonder who did the overdubs actually. I
> don't see Keith doing overdubs in a studio anymore
> the way he plays nowadays.
>
> Mathijs


Could it be simple cut and paste form other shows?

C

Mathijs Wrote:
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> I really wonder who did the overdubs actually. I
> don't see Keith doing overdubs in a studio anymore
> the way he plays nowadays.
>
> Mathijs



The innersleeve states: additional playing by Pierre de B and Dave Rouze

And Blondie plays (electric) guitar on quite a lot of songs...

They made no secret of the Imax reshoots. In the States, there was an entire 1991 episode of the late night series IN CONCERT devoted to the making of AT THE MAX which showed them shooting in the empty stadium. If I recall correctly they were miming to playbacks of the show from the night before. While the Imax process may have dictated this move, the band had done the same thing the year before in Boston to shoot a "live" music video for "Rock and a Hard Place." As for Mathijs' comment...I can't imagine anyone else doing Keith's overdubs. Just listen to FLASHPOINT, NO SECURITY, and LIVE LICKS. Whether you like it or not, those guitar overdubs are definitely Keith. What has changed is the technology. Instead of spending a couple of months in the studio overdubbing and remixing live tracks as they did with YA-YA'S, LOVE YOU LIVE, and STILL LIFE; now the band drop in their parts piecemeal.They let the engineers prepare the live album's editing and mixing while the band is still on the road. Its no big deal if they're just waiting for Keith to feel up to working on his parts which can be done in a hotel room or his home studio. ProTools will only make things simpler still.

gosh

Rik Wrote:
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> Mathijs Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I really wonder who did the overdubs actually.
> I
> > don't see Keith doing overdubs in a studio
> anymore
> > the way he plays nowadays.
> >
> > Mathijs
>
>
>
> The innersleeve states: additional playing by
> Pierre de B and Dave Rouze

OUCH!!

Where does the inner sleeve state Pierre and Dave Rouze are playing? I've seen them listed as guitar tech's. That's a roadie as far as I know. Not saying you're wrong. Just want proof before I believe we're getting session players on live albums or DVD's.

it writes: additional recordings by... does´n´t sound good. Me, I´ve learned in school to fix my mistakes myself

i stated earlir listen to rio boot(rambler)then watch dvd,the whole everybody say wwwoooww,thing is not on the rio boot,i dont know why they changed it(over dub)

john scialfa

Additional recording credits would denote overdub engineering, wouldn't it? Pierre has had engineering credits before and I don't think the additional recording credit on DIRTY WORK implied Tim Crich and Mike Crowiak were adding overdubs themselves...unless someone knows otherwise, I'm still sticking with any Keith overdubs are by Keith himself. That's not a comment on quality of playing, but they sound like Keith to my ears. Besides while its certainly fair to say his live performances have been erratic since his surgery, the man is hardly finished as a musician.

maybe I´m right, and maybe you´re wrong it doesn´t matter....really, I don´t know, I only wrote what they printed in the booklet

Well, I have always thought Pierre did do overdubs on Four Flicks as well, and it's no surprise to me that he and Dave Rouze now even get credits for the BB DVD.

From the Olympia, Paris show I distinctly remember various mistakes that didn't end up on the DVD, and some guitar bits didn't sound like Wood or Richards to me. With this new DVD I just don't see Keith fixing any mistakes in a studio anymore. Not from a playing point of view, and i would really doubt if he'd be interested in it. It's much easier to let Pierre fix the mistakes in a couple of days. It's cheaper and much quicker.

Mathijs

much qicker....hihihi do´n´t be so bad

Nice Woody quote, bluesinc. I would be very interested if Keith let a roadie overdub his guitar parts for a live CD or DVD. I don't think the credits say it, but that doesn't necessarily prove anything. I think it sounds like Keith playing the overdubs, Mathijs doesn't. Anyone know anything definitively?

Rocky Dijon Wrote:
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> They made no secret of the Imax reshoots. In the
> States, there was an entire 1991 episode of the
> late night series IN CONCERT devoted to the making
> of AT THE MAX which showed them shooting in the
> empty stadium. If I recall correctly they were
> miming to playbacks of the show from the night
> before. While the Imax process may have dictated
> this move, the band had done the same thing the
> year before in Boston to shoot a "live" music
> video for "Rock and a Hard Place." As for Mathijs'
> comment...I can't imagine anyone else doing
> Keith's overdubs. Just listen to FLASHPOINT, NO
> SECURITY, and LIVE LICKS. Whether you like it or
> not, those guitar overdubs are definitely Keith.
> What has changed is the technology. Instead of
> spending a couple of months in the studio
> overdubbing and remixing live tracks as they did
> with YA-YA'S, LOVE YOU LIVE, and STILL LIFE; now
> the band drop in their parts piecemeal.They let
> the engineers prepare the live album's editing and
> mixing while the band is still on the road. Its no
> big deal if they're just waiting for Keith to feel
> up to working on his parts which can be done in a
> hotel room or his home studio. ProTools will only
> make things simpler still.


I remember distinctly being in Paris for the Stones show in 1998 and being told by someone obviously "in the know" that Keith had spent most of the 3-4 days the band had off prior to the gig in the studio overdubbing guitar parts for the live album I was even told for what shows (Nuremburg, St Louis, Amsterdam etc). When No Security came out 4 months later, the credits backed that information up 100%

You're correct about the advent of Pro Tools making all this cutting and pasting business a lot easier.

I'd be seriously shocked if Keith is not even able to do overdubs anymore. Seriously shocked...
The horrible thing - I even think Mathijs could be right.


Belgrade-Bucharest-Budapest-Brno

backstreetboy Wrote:
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> i stated earlir listen to rio boot(rambler)then
> watch dvd,the whole everybody say wwwoooww,thing
> is not on the rio boot,i dont know why they
> changed it(over dub)


I downloaded MR from Rio a long time ago, and it has that Part on it "everybody in copacabana say ....." just like on the DVD.