Recent threads touch on this album. So I played it.
The sound is so compressed. I noticed that in photos from the Munich sessions they are alwasy dressed for cold weather. I imagine that rainy Munich weather is not the setting where you write songs like "Sweet Virginia", "Loving Cup". "Till the next goodbye" really fits those settings. They must have used a lot of compression and buffers, separation for the IORR tracks. Only the title track sounds like vintage Stones recording a' la Exile. And we all know how that track came to be.
What I do not get is why the Stones had "Through the Lonely Nights" adnd "Drift Away" ready to go. Yet they chose filler like "Short and Curlies" for the album. SAC was born to be on a 45 Bside; if at all. "Luxury" could have stood some more work too. Charlie doesn't seem confortable with the Island reggae idea yet. Neither do the guitars. I never did get it why that track gets the Reggae header.
"Dance Little Sister" is a great great track. There is so much good: keith's guitar, Taylor's lead, the sound of the kick drum - but it goes on a bit too long. IMO the Stones coul;d have done more with it. Either shortened it or filled it up as it goes on with Sax or Horns or with more piano and organ, Bu vocals.
Side 1 is strong.
Luxury tempered down. Dance shortened with a Sax. Short and Curlies gone. It would have been even stronger.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

Couple observations/opinions:

- Big change in the production sound (as you mention). Sounds compressed to me also, very little "air" in the sound. I remember thinking at the time of release that it had a lot more bottom (kick-drum, bass) than any previous Stones disc.

- Just my humble opinion, but IORR always sounded like Keith had little input. This, of course, shapes the music quite a bit.

- Luxury is one of the best tunes on the album, methinks, but I also never understood the reggae designation.

- Dance sounds like a classic Stones tune, but I always felt it had an unfinished sound to it. Not sure I can really explain, but it seems like something you'd hear on one of those outtakes collections.

- Always tough to judge this release. In 74-75 it seemed disappointing, given its predecessors. Now, I'm still not big on it, but not sure if I'm being objective or not.

- The title track belongs among the all-time great Stones' songs although I've never cared for it live. The ambiance of the recording is just too tough to replicate.

- I like S&C. Some nice MT slide in there. My memory is always faulty, but I think it's the only slide he plays on the album.

Karl

I dig that album
SHort & Curlies is not a strong song. Could have been replaced by THrough The Lonely Nights. All the songs are terrific,
well OK, Luxury could have been worked on a bit more, but it's still great. WOrked A LOT better on the 75 tour...why did they stop playing it after Toronto? And why did they put Dance Little Sister to rest? Killer-solo by Ronnie in Baton Rouge and Kansas City !
The sound might be a bit compressed, it's still a lot better and open sound than Goats Head Soup.

Nothing to add to the previous post. Except that this album could not have been done without MickT who plays some of his finest works. One single criticism would be that it is lacking of a smash hit. A concept album with all what it means.

Musicland Studios, Nov 1973









Courtesy of Vancouver (Somebody know who to credit ?)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-16 23:00 by Erik_Snow.

Compared to Sticky and Exile: IORR (and Goats) has a drumsound I don´t like. Sounds like a cushion Charlie is drumming on.

Black&Blue (and Some Girls and Rescue) etc all have that "crack" again in the snare
sound I like very much.

Agree TooTough, except for that kick on "Dance Sister" and the Hihat on "Fingerprint File"

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

I like charlies drumming and sound on ATPTB.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-16 23:09 by ryanpow.

Funny no one has mentioned TWFNO yet.

i cant find the damn c.d anywhere, and all this talk has really made me want to listen to IORR again, an album i could never really listen to all the way through w/out skipping tracks. The order of songs seems a little disjointed to me, i dont know about you guys..

always found Short and Curlies to be a hilarious ditty- not one to be taken seriously...i remember i first listened to it the very day i split up with my then girlfriend...it seemed so apt! "She's got you by the balls..." brilliant!

Just out of interest...what songs do you think they wouldve also played from the album, if MT had never gone, and had they toured behind it with him



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-16 23:18 by casinoboogie.

Good question casino. Wgat are you getting at? That maybe "Time waits for no one"would have turned into a live staple? Where Taylor would shine night after night and take it higher and higher?

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

It's funny, KSIE, but I too love the studio version of IORR but don't care for it live. In fact, hearing it kinda diminishes my love for the song.

VoodooLounge13 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's funny, KSIE, but I too love the studio
> version of IORR but don't care for it live. In
> fact, hearing it kinda diminishes my love for the
> song.


the outro on the studio version (or the last couple of mins or so) is one of the band's most magical recorded moments IMO. It sounds like it could fall apart at any time, the guitars are slightly off the beat yet its absolutely flawless.

agree 100% Gaz!

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Good question casino. Wgat are you getting at?
> That maybe "Time waits for no one"would have
> turned into a live staple? Where Taylor would
> shine night after night and take it higher and
> higher?


Yeah! I guess we can only muse on the subject, but that would have been a stunner wouldnt it? Spotlight on Taylor for an improvised lead spot i guess (perhaps they would have allowed him that!) where he could work his magic all over it as he had done on Gimme Shelter, Doo Doo Doo, Sympathy... i can only imagine...indeed i can only imagine them live in 1974...would MT have taken on a bigger role as Keith slid into a pretty bad patch? Also, lets not forget Charlie on that track..if you can pick out his drumming amongst the frankly shocking mix, it is superb..and live, well it could have been his "solo" spot too (not like Bonham i promise!)

It's funny that someone mentioned the cold...

I usually only listen to this album int Winter.

It's kind of a sad album in a way...Til The Next Time, Time Waits, If You Really Want, and Luxury isn't exactly said but the theme is being broke...not fun topics.

People in this thread have panned SHORT and CURLIES...I love it and think that song and the ALMIGHTY FINGERPRINT FILE save the day. Short and Curlies has an EXILE feel to me more than any song on the album.

Never cared for DANCE LITTLE SISTER...probably one of the only Stones songs I never go out of my way to play.

That's what makes the Stones the Stones...something for everybody.

PECMAN

Erik_Snow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Musicland Studios, Nov 1973
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> -musicland.jpg
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> 73-musicland-nov73.jpghttp://i96.photobucket.com/a
> lbums/l176/erik_061/73-mj-november.jpg
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> -musicland-watts.jpg
>
>
>
> Courtesy of Vancouver (Somebody know who to credit
> ?)


These pictures sure do hammer it home to me...I had these on my wall in my childhood room!! *sniff* (And Keef looks fabulous!!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-17 00:04 by mofur.

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the outro on the studio version (or the last
> couple of mins or so) is one of the band's most
> magical recorded moments IMO. It sounds like it
> could fall apart at any time, the guitars are
> slightly off the beat yet its absolutely flawless.


Agree. If somebody from another planet landed in my back yard and asked "what is this Keith Richards' guitar thing?", I'd have to play the IORR solo (and the end of the song) and say "this, basically, is it".

In 74 the single came out before the album. I heard it (and the flip TTLN) and thought "another year, another classic Stones disc". After all they'd done just that since 68. That the ensuing album never quite lived-up to the promise of the single has always soured me a little bit on it.

Karl

Well I think "people" around here know what I think of: Time Waits For No One

MLC

its only rock and roll could have become a rock classic if it had been recorded better in the studio.

as it is, it has some great songs which are well written but just lacks that punch that exile or some girls have.

The studio itself is allright. IMO some of the tunes just have an unfinished feel to them. Side 1 and Fingerprint File are up there, but those others could have made the difference between a great album and a time-keeping album.
I lso LOVE the outro of IORR song. Keith traCKED two eletric guitars that play practically the same thing. But they are ever so slightly on a different timing pattern. The very last chords when it goes bap-bap-baam! 3 or 4 times around, the guitars are offset in the two speakers and it almost sounds like an echo.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-17 02:52 by ChelseaDrugstore.

Love IORR! Was my third Stones Disc (Some Girls, Exile, IORR) and thought it was great. Was a favorite headphone album for me as a teenager. Loved sitting at my desk pretending to do homework and listening to that on the headphones. I love the variety on the album, with some great power riffs and some great intricate acoustic work as well. The opening three songs just go for the throat and grab your attention. And Fingerprint File is an all time stones classic!
The remastered release really boosted the drum/bass sound and you can hear more textures in the mix...I have the album reproduction version which is cool.

I always had a problem with the spongey, lumpy sound of the record, and even though it has some good rockers (IYCRM, DLS) it seems somewhat forced overall, like they were trying to come back rocking after GHS. I do think "If You Really Want to Be My Friend" is great and a precursor of things to come (on B&. And S&C is salvaged for me by Stu's great piano. Time Waits, for me, has always been a bit banal - the ticking at the end makes it more obvious.

It's a very strong album. More my cup of tea compared to Soup. If You Can't Rock Me, IORR, Dance, Time and Fingerprint are absolute masterpieces. It's 5 in one album: a lot. I have no idea why only IORR made it to the status of warhorse. Dance is similar to you got me rocking but with an extra kick that the VL cut does not have. Rock Me was a highlight in 75 and 2003. Fingerpint is one of those traks that I would love to hear made by the Watts Jones r section.

I also agree that IORR studio has a subtle beauty that never made it on stage. Nobody ever mentions Ron wood's acoustic guitar part, but it is great and adds so much to the finale.

Curlies is not a masterpiece, but I love it. It has a happy vibe. When all the band joins in on the "she's got your name ... " is pure exile magic!

Till the next goodbye sets the mood perfectly for Time.

At the end of the day, Luxury is the weakest track, esp as opener of side 2. It ain't no Bitch, thats for sure! It's not bad either, borbably you are right, it needed more work on it.

C

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> VoodooLounge13 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's funny, KSIE, but I too love the studio
> > version of IORR but don't care for it live. In
> > fact, hearing it kinda diminishes my love for
> the
> > song.
>
>
> the outro on the studio version (or the last
> couple of mins or so) is one of the band's most
> magical recorded moments IMO. It sounds like it
> could fall apart at any time, the guitars are
> slightly off the beat yet its absolutely flawless.


Yes agree 100%.

liddas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's a very strong album. More my cup of tea
> compared to Soup. If You Can't Rock Me, IORR,
> Dance, Time and Fingerprint are absolute
> masterpieces. It's 5 in one album: a lot. I have
> no idea why only IORR made it to the status of
> warhorse. Dance is similar to you got me rocking
> but with an extra kick that the VL cut does not
> have. Rock Me was a highlight in 75 and 2003.
> Fingerpint is one of those traks that I would love
> to hear made by the Watts Jones r section.
>
> I also agree that IORR studio has a subtle beauty
> that never made it on stage. Nobody ever mentions
> Ron wood's acoustic guitar part, but it is great
> and adds so much to the finale.
>
> Curlies is not a masterpiece, but I love it. It
> has a happy vibe. When all the band joins in on
> the "she's got your name ... " is pure exile
> magic!
>
> Till the next goodbye sets the mood perfectly for
> Time.
>
> At the end of the day, Luxury is the weakest
> track, esp as opener of side 2. It ain't no Bitch,
> thats for sure! It's not bad either, borbably you
> are right, it needed more work on it.
>
> C



I think it's about the band being, maybe a bit too much, aware of the current trends that year and it show in the production. And, the Glimmers maybe werent as close as before (Exile sounds like a friendship production). I love the album. Also it's minimalistic in a way. The musicianship is the Stones at their best along with Let it bleed.

Love the album. There's many gems on it. I don't like IORR studio much. At least not until they play it low and then go for the outro. I think it's better live and that's probably the closest we'll get to see them doing a Berry cover (Along with @#$%& of course). Great songs all around except for Short and Hurlies.

Did anyone ever hear the interview where they listen to clips of the songs and comment on them? I think it's on some bootleg as an extra. Great stuff, though short.

JumpingKentFlash

one thing that struck me- and not as a criticism- is how they went from experimenting with horns, strings, exotic arrangements etc. on GHS to getting that basic rock n roll sound back on IORR. its almost as if Jagger said 'well, the fans probably didnt like all that weirdness lets just do what we do best' and they come out with a record of finely crafted power chord rock and ballads.

i mean, in 1973, after giving GHS a listen, i imagine it would have been difficult to predict where the Stones would go after it especially when Jagger said 'i for one wouldnt mind experimenting and i know mick t and charlie wouldnt (sic)' i must say that one standout is Fingerprint File, which comes at the end and definetly is a precursor to what they would later experiment with...its pretty much a masterpiece!

perhaps it was due to the inner conflict in the band, drug problems, disjointed sessions etc?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-17 15:30 by casinoboogie.