shidoobee, at 63 to 65 years old, NOTHING is for sure, ask George Harrison....

Micksbrain and Florinda! I suspect you're not aware of the problems with the logistics here. On Sept 1st, one stage is in Bergen, Norway. The roads are narrow and they have to ship the stage in from the UK by boat... On Sept 3rd, another stage is in Horsens, Denmark. It takes 2 days to take the stage construction down, six days to build and the trip from Bergen/Horsens takes at least two days. Now - start counting! How many days? How easy is it? It's actually impossible. It's not due to lack of will. But the Stones and their staff are pros. They've done this before. They know about the logistics, the lacking hotel capacity. So next summer is really the best option, isn't it?!

Does it really take 6 days to build the ABB stage?

_____________________________________________________

What's your favourite flavour?...........Cherry Red!!

Yes. It's a 5 storey building.

No shidoobee. If fans are the main concern, then they could do a free concert anywhere in the country. I'm sure any local authority would help with a location, accomodations etc. Forget about the big stage. Get out there in the field and play. It's not that difficult. Come on!

I heard it's constructed from the bones of setlist whiners. They keep getting more and more skeletons, so it's hard to transport it all.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-08-16 00:06 by Jumpin'JackFrash.

Who needs the giant stage ? (they ain't Madonna) No Big Stage in 1969 OR 1999 and the shows were fine, probably my favorite tours.....

Who needs instruments either?

I heard that Keith has a custom shoebox guitar that he's been waiting to use!

Jumping Jack. Are you opening up for the stones in Vegas or something?

I'm a little hurt, Florinda - if that is your real name. I made that shoebox guitar especially for keith.

Come on Jack! After all you have had a reaction to your splendid sense of humour. From here on, the list of your followers can only grow.....

florinda Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No shidoobee. If fans are the main concern, then
> they could do a free concert anywhere in the
> country. I'm sure any local authority would help
> with a location, accomodations etc. Forget about
> the big stage. Get out there in the field and
> play. It's not that difficult. Come on!


Still, there are a LOT of things to organize on a very short notice. Believe me, it's impossible. I've done festivals for just a few thousand people, and even that takes a lot of planning and hard work. Can't you just admit that, OK, you were wrong? Is that so hard?! A free concert? Is that what we're talking about, now?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-08-16 00:25 by shidoobee.

Shidoobe.No problem in admitting I'm wrong. What i'm trying to say is this: IF the fans were the main concern for the stones, the band would find a way to keep them satisfied. Don't you think? But no one will be happy with the promise of a futur tour next year.

for crying in the dust - if no one would be happy with a promise of a tour next year,
then why are you surprised that they don't offer such a promise?!
again: i feel bad for the people whose shows were cancelled, but they didn't do it to be spiteful.
and they will be back. good night and good health to Mick, and to all the Rolling Stones.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-08-16 00:34 by with sssoul.

with sssoul, I'm not surprised. I'm sure they are doing what they consider best for themselves, not for the fans. I also know they didn't want to be spiteful. I think they don't care about us. Sorry.

Some facts about how much they care for fans...Today, at the Hotel Royal Palace of Madrid. Some times there are many fans wating outside (100 as many), sometimes only 20 or so. Ronnie Wood arrives in one of those times were there are 20 or so, and only 5 try to get an autograph. He declines and, without saying even hello or a smile, he gets to the hotel. I must say the contrary about, for example, Chuck Leavell. A great guy!

Mr Jimmy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does it really take 6 days to build the ABB stage?


yep...around that. You'll generally find so far this summer that the stages are at the stadium around a week before the show takes place

As far as rescheduling and transporting stages go in order to reschedule the 2 Spanish shows after Horsens, it would work something like this :

Stage 1
Concert 29/8/06 - Cardiff, Wales
To get that stage taken down and then transported (by sea and road) to Spain would take 2-3 days minimum. Then 6 days or so to get it ready. Earliest possible date for a show would probably be 7th September

Stage 2
Concert 1/9/06 - Bergen, Norway
An even longer and more indirect route to get from Norway to Spain after dismantling the stage. earliest possible date for a show in Spain - 10-11th September at the very least

Stage 3
Concert 3/9/06 - Horsens, Denmark

To extend the tour by adding just two shows at the opposite end of Europe would probably take at least an extra week because of the travelling times involved for transporting the equipment.

> ... and they will come to Europe next summer

God beware!! Even more bigger shit and higher prices?! I'm still running after my refunds of some shows!

shidoobee Wrote:

> It takes 2 days to take the stage construction down, six days to build


This is why I question the November 23rd Honolulu Aloha Stadium rumour. Aloha Stadium has University of Hawaii football games scheduled on November 18th and 25th. It means that they would not be able to begin assmebling the stage until late on the night of the 18th and have a total of 4.5 days to assemble it. The game on the 25th would begin 36 hours after the concert on the 23rd would end. The stadium would need to be available for the teams to use earlier in the day on the 25th, so it really means the Stones crew would have to have everything out of the stadium in under 30 hours maximum. Also, though not listed on the Aloha Stadium website, I had read that there is a high school football game scheduled there on the 34th, though they could move that to another location.
It seems the stadium would not allow the concert to happen with so little time available until the next event.

It is easy to be the local personal Stones tour manager, demanding them to perform 15 or so cancelled shows in Europe this summer. But it does not work that way. This is the reason why they can't just add all these shows after Sept. 3:

- Keith will be busy recording Pirates
- A crew of 300 people have time off
- Football season start at stadiums in Europe
- Norh America tour start in 2 weeks time
- The fans can not show up on 4 weeks notice

Why not leave the tour planning to Michael Cohl. He is the best in the world when it comes to making Stones shows happening any place. He will probably add up 5-6 shows in Spain, Barcelona and Madrid too of course, plus many others in Europe 2007. No worries. And yes. This is the last and final world tour. Last chance in USA & Canada this fall. And last chance in Europe next summer. Instead of complaining about illness and accidents, which might happen to anybody, and especially if you are above 60 and climb trees or have a sensitive voice, we shold all be happy every day and year the Stones are still alive and touring + recording.

Bjornulf

Gazza Wrote:


> I'd have been less
> hopeful had it just been 3 or 4 shows
> cancellations as the temptation would have been to
> say "@#$%& it - its not worth our time for a
> couple of shows", but when it gets to, what 12-14
> shows now, its a tour in itself.

It's actually at 16 shows now, from 35 announced shows down to 19. Plus the rumors of Belgrade being added again after the date for Zagreb being changed seemed to be realistic. I think there were also rumors of at least 1 more show beyond that which seemed realistic. Europe probably would have been 36 or 37 shows, so almost exactly 1/2 are gone.

Bjornulf,

Are you at liberty to explain more about this being the last world tour? We have expected that it is, based on reports going back to last year, but the way you wrote last time in the US and Canada this fall and last time in Europe next summer sounds more final than the speculation of the Stones doing mini tours in the future in these locations.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-08-16 01:59 by Halup.

Halup Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gazza Wrote:
>
>
> > I'd have been less
> > hopeful had it just been 3 or 4 shows
> > cancellations as the temptation would have been
> to
> > say "@#$%& it - its not worth our time for a
> > couple of shows", but when it gets to, what
> 12-14
> > shows now, its a tour in itself.
>
> It's actually at 16 shows now, from 35 announced
> shows down to 19. Plus the rumors of Belgrade
> being added again after the date for Zagreb being
> changed seemed to be realistic. I think there were
> also rumors of at least 1 more show beyond that
> which seemed realistic. Europe probably would have
> been 36 or 37 shows, so almost exactly 1/2 are
> gone.



Yeah...I left out Nuremburg and Leipzig which were announced as 'cancelled' when the new schedule was announced on June 2nd.

x



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2006-12-06 07:30 by Beelyboy.

- Keith will be busy recording Pirates
- A crew of 300 people have time off
- Football season start at stadiums in Europe
- Norh America tour start in 2 weeks time
- The fans can not show up on 4 weeks notice

Bv. and others.- The rescheduling of this european tour has been a poor job from beginning to end as regards the fans. I admit that Cohl must have had a tough time dealing with the uncertainty about Keith's recovery. But there are other issues:
1- I guess some dates were cancelled due to "laryngitis at the box office"
2- So now, recording a Hollywwod movie is a priority for a Rock group?
3- The licks tour ended in October
4- North America should not have been booked before Europe tour was properly rescheduled
5- Who has told you that the fans can not show up on 4 weeks notice?

florinda Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> - Keith will be busy recording Pirates
> - A crew of 300 people have time off
> - Football season start at stadiums in Europe
> - Norh America tour start in 2 weeks time
> - The fans can not show up on 4 weeks notice
>
> Bv. and others.- The rescheduling of this european
> tour has been a poor job from beginning to end as
> regards the fans. I admit that Cohl must have had
> a tough time dealing with the uncertainty about
> Keith's recovery. But there are other issues:
> 1- I guess some dates were cancelled due to
> "laryngitis at the box office"
> 2- So now, recording a Hollywwod movie is a
> priority for a Rock group?
> 3- The licks tour ended in October
> 4- North America should not have been booked
> before Europe tour was properly rescheduled
> 5- Who has told you that the fans can not show up
> on 4 weeks notice?


Florindy... Excuse my language - but can't you just count days and see that there is NO possibility! It's impossible. They couldn't even though the would want to do the cancelled gigs after Horsens. Dammit! Are you both deaf, blind and have reading and counting problems? Or are you a seven year old demanding that everyone fullfill your wishes? I suspect the latter is the case.

Erik_Snow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, well put, mr Stones-viking. Not that I feel
> that strong about sticking up for my country, but
> that was a stupid sentence about north vs. south.
> (agreed with the rest too)


Being a 'cold' nordic man I took your statement as rather humourous. I mean, some stereotypes probably have some truth in them for a majority of a certain people but then that's what makes the world interesting. Being German, nobody can really offend me with stereotypes, apart from the ignorant view that the Nazis still dominate our country which is really nonsense.

We Germans of the younger generation are very happy that we can travel in countries like France or Great Britain where sixty years ago there was pure hostility between those countries - something we cannot really understand anymore. The Stones and other rock stars of their age have helped opening the world for us and understanding the culture of other countries. Here on this board I correspond with people from all over the world. That aspect of rock music should never be forgotten.

Shidoobee or BV or all also other arguments. There are all correct. Do not forget that fans may feel cheated by now. If it's correct to feel cheated? I do not know. Kind off perhaps.
There is one thing certain and Shidoobie as being American you should know that. Keith would have never even thought about climbing a palm tree during or before a North American tour, simply because of the liability and waivers and all the insurances reasons and the demands by sponsor which may not cover such an exess. Very easy. As European promoters and sponsors work differently and do not have such tremendous demands. I do not say that the Stones put less interest into Europe, but they are more relaxed about it. This can be good as we receive relaxed concerts and bad as we receive concerts which are to relaxed. If illness happens like with Mick now or with Keith in 99 it is clear to pull out a concert. But the money making machine in the US/CAD is very obvious and hurt a lot of fans in Europe. Though we still to not pay ticket prices like in the US, because our interest varies a bit we are close to those prices. Anyway the will go on, but with a slower pace. Just expect nothing and then you get everything. Honestly speaking I was surprised about the 4 shows I saw in Europe so far.

florinda Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
But there are other issues:
> 1- I guess some dates were cancelled due to
> "laryngitis at the box office"

What a bad joke, what a bad metaphore!

> 2- So now, recording a Hollywwod movie is a
> priority for a Rock group?

There are contracts signed baby! It is the signed contract that counts.

> 3- The licks tour ended in October

Yes it is true, but there was no US tour going on afterwards.

> 4- North America should not have been booked
> before Europe tour was properly rescheduled

I think that the US 2006 Fall leg was booked before Keef's accident. I am not a promoter but giga tours are organized sometimes a year before the tour start. As far as I remember we had infos about some European dates last December or so.

florinda Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> - Keith will be busy recording Pirates
> - A crew of 300 people have time off
> - Football season start at stadiums in Europe
> - Norh America tour start in 2 weeks time
> - The fans can not show up on 4 weeks notice
>
> Bv. and others.- The rescheduling of this european
> tour has been a poor job from beginning to end as
> regards the fans.


correct

I admit that Cohl must have had
> a tough time dealing with the uncertainty about
> Keith's recovery. But there are other issues:
> 1- I guess some dates were cancelled due to
> "laryngitis at the box office"

of course they were. But some shows that were sell outs (Barcelona, Madrid, Gothenburg etc) and others that sold very well werent rescheduled either. If you do a summer tour thats exclusively stadiums and shows get postponed, then your options for rescheduling those shows are seriously limited. Its made far more problematic when there are about 15 of them and you have only a few weeks to work out the logistics when the original tour schedule was planned 9 months or more in advance.


> 2- So now, recording a Hollywwod movie is a
> priority for a Rock group?

it shouldnt be, but unfortunately he's signed a contract before this happened. Even if only means a few days work, pulling out of it would cost the production millions and his part would probably have to be written out as he wouldnt be able to film it as he is committed to touring for the rest of the year. I would imagine he's legally bound to be there at a certain date


> 3- The licks tour ended in October

most of the Licks shows that took place in september/October took place in arenas, not stadiums. Of the stadium shows they used, only a couple were in football stadiums which could/would have been in use after the start of the season and which were obviously not needed for the home games of Ajax and Porto when the shows scheduled for the dates in question took place. Every football team in Europe knows their schedule for the new season by around July.

> 4- North America should not have been booked
> before Europe tour was properly rescheduled

North America was booked before Keith even fell out of a tree, let alone before any shows were rescheduled. If you think these things are booked and then the shows are announced a week or two later, you're mistaken.

> 5- Who has told you that the fans can not show up
> on 4 weeks notice?

Try getting thousands of hotel rooms in Spain in September at a few weeks notice and you'll see that there are more than just Stones fans using hotels at that time. Even better, try finding 4 or 5 star accommodation for a crew of 300 at 3 weeks notice. Impossible.